Ole Gunnar Solskjær | Managerial Watch

[SecondFig]

Uncomfortable truth: at their peak, Solksjaer's United played the best football United have since Fergie left.

I'd agree with this. I also agree that he wasn't a great tactician, but football is more than just tactics.

I'd also add that not only was Ole's peak the best football Utd have played since SAF, but also that most (not the last few months) of Ole's tenure was the closest I've felt to the club since SAF retired.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

, but also that most (not the last few months) of Ole's tenure was the closest I've felt to the club since SAF retired.

that’s not even slightly surprising though is it? A bunch of complete strangers to United and it’s traditions have managed us post Moyes.
LVG never felt like a proper United man, and he bought an incredibly boring brand of Dutch football that no-one thought United should play, Mourinho was detested by many from the off and always seen as a Chelsea man so despite him bettering Ole at every metric, it never really felt right for many having a Chelsea legend as boss.

Of course you felt closest to the Manchester United legend who managed us, it was nostalgic, it had some lovely soundbites, but in the end, it was shite.

 

[anant]

It was an article from Sam Luckhurst.

Ole was intending to adopt a 433 and they trained for it all preseason but remained in 4231. Then when we were bleeding goals Carrick and Mckenna suggested a back 3 (so I suppose not proactive but definitely more solid to get us back into form).

Ole vetoed it, and the fans at the time had distain for Mckenna as the players briefed he was too school master like. But the players were generally dickheads and Mckenna has gone on to prove his worth.

Lesson for everyone, but point being, Ole didn't have a tactical clue. Various facets of evidence pointing to it and when all else fails, you can look at his own words.

It's Luckhurst!

And the team literally switched the formations 3 or 4 times based on the game state in the 2-1 win vs PSG. It's easy to say that he was clueless tactically, but there is no way a team can get this far with a manager who doesn't value tactics.

I can understand if you said that he wasn't a Pep or a Klopp tactically, but his sides were more than capable of holding their own against the best opposition.

 

[VP89]

It's Luckhurst!

And the team literally switched the formations 3 or 4 times based on the game state in the 2-1 win vs PSG. It's easy to say that he was clueless tactically, but there is no way a team can get this far with a manager who doesn't value tactics.

I can understand if you said that he wasn't a Pep or a Klopp tactically, but his sides were more than capable of holding their own against the best opposition.

What do you mean by it's Luckhurst? He's a credible tier. You add that report to the video of Ole pawning off the importance of tactics, to poor implementations of press and playing the wrong formation at the wrong times makes my point.

 

[anant]

What do you mean by it's Luckhurst? He's a credible tier. You add that report to the video of Ole pawning off the importance of tactics, to poor implementations of press and playing the wrong formation at the wrong times makes my point.

Luckhurst is a shit stirrer.

Himm not disclosing his tactics in a PC and him not having any tactical nuance are 2 very different things. Let's have it this way - let's assume he had 0 tactics. Do you think the side will be able to get these many results, his team will have the best GD/game among literally every manager in Utd's history? They'll have the longest away unbeaten run in PL history? (And even if you like to bring up no crowds argument, he went unbeaten for longer than every other manager in the league at that time).

The wrong formation thing happened to him at times, just like how it happened to every other manager at some points in time.

 

[VP89]

Luckhurst is a shit stirrer.

Himm not disclosing his tactics in a PC and him not having any tactical nuance are 2 very different things. Let's have it this way - let's assume he had 0 tactics. Do you think the side will be able to get these many results, his team will have the best GD/game among literally every manager in Utd's history? They'll have the longest away unbeaten run in PL history? (And even if you like to bring up no crowds argument, he went unbeaten for longer than every other manager in the league at that time).

The wrong formation thing happened to him at times, just like how it happened to every other manager at some points in time.

Luckhurst is a thundercnut but his credibility is generally solid. Also regarding it only about not talking tactics, what are you on about? It's one thing not disclosing tactics and it's another outright dismissing their value. Many astute managers have no problem talking tactics to some degree, the fact Ole can't coupled with his unwillingness to move us away from a counter attacking side who's scoreline flattered our XG over 3.5 years, together with him being on a different wavelength to two coaches with better ideas TOGETHER with him being tactically naieve as time went by shows that this isn't even a debate anymore.

 

[Grande]

Luckhurst is a thundercnut but his credibility is generally solid. Also regarding it only about not talking tactics, what are you on about? It's one thing not disclosing tactics and it's another outright dismissing their value. Many astute managers have no problem talking tactics to some degree, the fact Ole can't coupled with his unwillingness to move us away from a counter attacking side who's scoreline flattered our XG over 3.5 years, together with him being on a different wavelength to two coaches with better ideas TOGETHER with him being tactically naieve as time went by shows that this isn't even a debate anymore.

I have to object when you say that Luckhurst’s credibility is generally solid. True, sometimes he writes things that are not incorrect (generally when MEN is told officially by the club), but there’s nothing general about that.

 

[Rooney in Paris]

I mean of course he had a "tactical clue", it's silly to suggest otherwise. It's ok to say there's nuances of grey and not everything is absolutes - he wasn't the greatest tactical mind of our time, but he obviously had some grasp of tactics. Ultimately he made mistakes, certainly, but there's a lot of revisionism about him.

Also Luckhurst is a massive shit stirrer and everything he writes should be taken with a massive pinch of salt. Like massive massive. Like salt-desert in Bolivia amount pinch of salt.

 

[Tom Cato]

Imagine Pep getting beaten by someone that doesnt have a clue. Several times

 

[Robbie Boy]

Imagine Pep getting beaten by someone that doesnt have a clue. Several times

Of course he had tactics. Plenty didn't like them, but he had them.

But, it's ridiculously small-time to keep going on about the beating Pep trophy. Gary O'Neill has also beaten Pep this season, for example.

 

[Tom Cato]

Of course he had tactics. Plenty didn't like them, but he had them.

But, it's ridiculously small-time to keep going on about the beating Pep trophy. Gary O'Neill has also beaten Pep this season, for example.

Can also go "2nd and 3rd in the league". Those are actual achievements.

I just think the conversation becomes incredibly disingenious when we go to absolutes, like labeling someone that got to sit ringside with Sir Alex for years a "PE teacher", while when its Ten Hag in charge the problem is not him, then its suddenly the club owners, that were not a problem previously.

It didnt end in success but at least the team was a lot of fun to watch for 2 seasons.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Can also go "2nd and 3rd in the league". Those are actual achievements.

I just think the conversation becomes incredibly disingenious when we go to absolutes, like labeling someone that got to sit ringside with Sir Alex for years a "PE teacher", while when its Ten Hag in charge the problem is not him, then its suddenly the club owners, that were not a problem previously.

It didnt end in success but at least the team was a lot of fun to watch for 2 seasons.

Well, yes, terms like PE teacher were obviously idiotic. Saying second and third place sounds a hell of a-lot better than the 'beating Pep trophy' which is ridiculously small-time.

Each to their own, I guess. For me anyway, it was fun at times, but overall it was meh and it never really felt like we were actually going anywhere. Some seemed to love his tenure and some detested it. I guess the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

 

[anant]

Luckhurst is a thundercnut but his credibility is generally solid. Also regarding it only about not talking tactics, what are you on about? It's one thing not disclosing tactics and it's another outright dismissing their value. Many astute managers have no problem talking tactics to some degree, the fact Ole can't coupled with his unwillingness to move us away from a counter attacking side who's scoreline flattered our XG over 3.5 years, together with him being on a different wavelength to two coaches with better ideas TOGETHER with him being tactically naieve as time went by shows that this isn't even a debate anymore.

Even if you account for the overperformance in xG (and thanks for bringing this up), there have been just 3 seasons post SAF where we have been in top 4 in terms of xGD. 2 of them happened under Ole!

I'm fine if you don't rate him, and no one is saying he was SAF or Pep. But there's a whole lot of grey in the middle that you're ignoring.

 

[VP89]

Even if you account for the overperformance in xG (and thanks for bringing this up), there have been just 3 seasons post SAF where we have been in top 4 in terms of xGD. 2 of them happened under Ole!

I'm fine if you don't rate him, and no one is saying he was SAF or Pep. But there's a whole lot of grey in the middle that you're ignoring.

There is no grey area in my evaluation of his tactics. Whether you take his own dismissal of their importance, his own mistakes or his own failure to transcend us from counter attacking football it points to the same answer.

 

[anant]

There is no grey area in my evaluation of his tactics. Whether you take his own dismissal of their importance, his own mistakes or his own failure to transcend us from counter attacking football it points to the same answer.

See this is the issue when it comes to evaluating Ole. Everything is extreme.

In that case, just answer me how the hell did the team finish in top 4 twice? Individual brilliance? In that case, surely the side needs to be winning the title under a manager who knows atleast a bit of tactics

 

[VP89]

See this is the issue when it comes to evaluating Ole. Everything is extreme.

In that case, just answer me how the hell did the team finish in top 4 twice? Individual brilliance? In that case, surely the side needs to be winning the title under a manager who knows atleast a bit of tactics

He had a team capable of it and in one particular season he had a purple patch. He deserves credit for lifting the mood of the dressing room and have them fighting for him but it's ultimately not sustainable if you're someone who doesn't know tactics very well.

Moreover in the other season he finished top 4 he was also one game away from finishing 5th, behind Leicester. With a very good squad it's not the most convincing of finishes, so yes you can put a lot of his highs down to individual brilliance but also give some credit too. However that's mutually exclusive to what I referred to his tactics about.

Its outstanding, the man was literally dismissing tactical importance in an interview and you still have a problem with my evaluation. I've been called a cultist of ten hag for so much less, it makes me wonder what you would be to Ole

 

[Rooney in Paris]

See this is the issue when it comes to evaluating Ole. Everything is extreme.

In that case, just answer me how the hell did the team finish in top 4 twice? Individual brilliance? In that case, surely the side needs to be winning the title under a manager who knows atleast a bit of tactics

I mean it is for that poster, who doesn't particularly seem capable of nuance. No point engaging with them I feel.

 

[Tinúviel]

Dude Sweden are barely page 1 on the coefficients. You're not relevant at this stage. No idea why you're comparing yourself to England

I'm talking about history. Now and then. And about future. I understand Norway like to stick it in to Sweden atm. This wont last of course. One good batch wont change that.
Remember, it was only 100 years ago you came cap in hands and begged to govern yourself.

 

[Lay]

Did he get the job?

 

[horsechoker]

Did he get the job?

The Liverpool one? Hopefully

 

[Max_United]

See this is the issue when it comes to evaluating Ole. Everything is extreme.

In that case, just answer me how the hell did the team finish in top 4 twice? Individual brilliance? In that case, surely the side needs to be winning the title under a manager who knows atleast a bit of tactics

In hindsight he did not do too badly especially given his CV. The caliber of jobs he is being linked to after leaving United suggests that he is not particularly rated as a manger in footballing world though. You would think he should be able to get at least top half/CL places competitive club job at top5/top7-8 league

 

[Ballache]

Did he get the job?

No he rejected us.

 

[Scandi Red]

No he rejected us.

Does this feel like that Seinfeld episode where Jerry finds out that his GF used to date Newman and that he was the one who broke up?

 

[Ballache]

Does this feel like that Seinfeld episode where Jerry finds out that his GF used to date Newman and that he was the one who broke up?

I haven't seen enough of Seinfeld to answer that.
I was disappointed though because his style of play would be perfect for Sweden right now with the attacking players we have.
Many people were happy because they didn't want to have a Norwegian manager. I personally don't care about that.

 

[BristolMick]

Best manager post SAF era for me. Unfortunately we were consistently inconsistent in the sense it felt we had some amazing runs (like when he first joined) followed by some of our poorest streaks too.

I found the football entertaining and exciting and much more appetising than anyone else post SAF. Believe we scored more goals per game under OGS than any other post SAF manager? Was the first to score 5 in a league game since SAF too. There were times when we were dominating teams and competing against the bigger sides too. The PSG away game remains a favourite for me under Ole.

Only other manager who compares post SAF is Jose but he became tiresome with his negative tactics and attitude.

How much of Oles success was down to Carrick and McKenna I don't know. But he's a much better manager than he gets credit for on here.

 

[anant]

Best manager post SAF era for me. Unfortunately we were consistently inconsistent in the sense it felt we had some amazing runs (like when he first joined) followed by some of our poorest streaks too.

I found the football entertaining and exciting and much more appetising than anyone else post SAF. Believe we scored more goals per game under OGS than any other post SAF manager? Was the first to score 5 in a league game since SAF too. There were times when we were dominating teams and competing against the bigger sides too. The PSG away game remains a favourite for me under Ole.

Only other manager who compares post SAF is Jose but he became tiresome with his negative tactics and attitude.

How much of Oles success was down to Carrick and McKenna I don't know. But he's a much better manager than he gets credit for on here.

More than any other post-Busby manager*

 

[sugar_kane]

His tenure was horrendous by the end (what sacked manager's isn't?) but he was criminally under-rated by the media and a lot of our own fans because he wasn't a trendy name.

I'm partly convinced a lot of the early savaging of him by the press (when we were actually doing well) was because they resented the fact that we had a club legend doing well for us at the helm and wanted to prick the feel good bubble and see some chaos at United again.

The only thing that really pissed me off about him was his lack of rotation and molly coddling of the dressing room. It bred indiscipline and resentment and we're still picking up the pieces. The football was often enjoyable.

 

[Wednesday at Stoke]

Some great memories too, the 9-0 against Southampton. Six against Bielsa’s Leeds, Mctominay scoring the second against City in front of a packed old trafford right before the corona shutdowns, the night in Paris etc. Wish he had won the UEFA cup. He bloody deserved it and we lost that so cruelly.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Is he joining Sweden?

 

[troylocker]

Ole's administration was a shining beacon of the chasm that exist within the football structure. First of all Ole should have never been made manager of Manchester United. United are a sleeping giant, there are plenty of departments that are failing (ex fitness, leaks etc) and we expect too many things from a manager (he needs to cover the role of coach, manager, sporting director and head of recruitment). Thus I struggle how one whose only previous experience at top level was tanking at Cardiff could succeed in that job. Anyway many of the issues we've seen during Ole were present before and after still present now. For example we sign the wrong players we spend too much on them and we give them silly contracts, our fitness is not up to scratch and we leak like a sieve.

So what went wrong? Ole inherited a Mourinho's team ie a team built around a deep line and playing counter attack football. It was apparent even from that time that such tactic was in the way out. Unfortunately due to a list of inexperience and incompetence at both managerial level and DOF level we noticed that far too late. Thus we ended up bringing players like Maguire and AWB whom while good for that style of football were unsuited for modern football. Add that to our inability to negotiate advantageous deals and our inability to do adequate research on whether players have the right talent/character to succeed at United (ex Sancho and VDB) then no wonder why things degenerated the way they did.

What I do blame Ole for are
a- his lack of discipline
b- the fact that we signed a RW who wanted to play LW
c- the fact that he left for a holiday to Norway when the ship was actually sinking.
d- he seem to have promised everything to everyone (Hendo, Lingard) when he knew very well that it couldn't be done

There also reports of him refusing to implementing new ideas from McKenna and Carrick that could add to that list as well. All of that are damning irrespective of the manager's experience and/or character. Its undeniable that United have far more problems during Ole's reign that prior. Again, mostly not his fault.

That doesn't take the shine from him as a person and as a United legend player wise and I wish him all the best in his future endeavors.

I just want to comment on the bolded part.
Ole had 10 years of 1st team experience with Man United and had won everything with the club as a player. He was taken in under Sir Alex' wing directly after retiring to manage the reserves and they worked very close together in the period between 08-10. He had 8 years of success with Molde on both sides of the failed Cardiff stint (Which I think he learned a lot from). He didn't put a foot wrong during his interrim period and knew the club better than anyone. When his interrim period went that well and with Fergie lurking around backstage there was no chance he wouldn't be offered the job permanently.

One thing is 100% certain, and that is that he is a lot better than ETH with man management and in the dressing room. The players worked their ass off for him and our numbers for 2019-2021 were better than for this season in every parameter.
He should have put his foot down when Ronaldo was brought in on deadline day. Would be very interesting to see how long he'd lasted if that didn't happen.
I don't understand the DvB transfer either, but the Sancho transfer was huge. Sancho failing here is on ETH/us as much as it is on Sancho.

 

[Gordon Godot]

His tenure was horrendous by the end (what sacked manager's isn't?) but he was criminally under-rated by the media and a lot of our own fans because he wasn't a trendy name.

I'm partly convinced a lot of the early savaging of him by the press (when we were actually doing well) was because they resented the fact that we had a club legend doing well for us at the helm and wanted to prick the feel good bubble and see some chaos at United again.

The only thing that really pissed me off about him was his lack of rotation and molly coddling of the dressing room. It bred indiscipline and resentment and we're still picking up the pieces. The football was often enjoyable.

I think this persecution complex is silly. He had a good run and initial bounce, then a ludicrously flukey win in Paris meant he got the job. Then the results went to sh@t. if Woodward had waited to end of season no way he got the job. Then we only could play on break, we struggled against the low blocks. Its been reported recently he pushed back on Carrick and McKenna who wanted to play more expansive football. lets not forget he also had a very good squad at his disposal, far better IMO than what we have

 

[miked99]

By far my favourite manager post SAF. After the utterly numbing one-two of LVG and Jose it was so good to experience a period of time where watching United didn't make me want to cry tears of boredom.

Those two great runs of form we had, where we were winning game after game and scoring plenty of goals are the only time I've been excited to watch United play in a decade or more.

 

[devilish]

I just want to comment on the bolded part.
Ole had 10 years of 1st team experience with Man United and had won everything with the club as a player. He was taken in under Sir Alex' wing directly after retiring to manage the reserves and they worked very close together in the period between 08-10. He had 8 years of success with Molde on both sides of the failed Cardiff stint (Which I think he learned a lot from). He didn't put a foot wrong during his interrim period and knew the club better than anyone. When his interrim period went that well and with Fergie lurking around backstage there was no chance he wouldn't be offered the job permanently.

One thing is 100% certain, and that is that he is a lot better than ETH with man management and in the dressing room. The players worked their ass off for him and our numbers for 2019-2021 were better than for this season in every parameter.
He should have put his foot down when Ronaldo was brought in on deadline day. Would be very interesting to see how long he'd lasted if that didn't happen.
I don't understand the DvB transfer either, but the Sancho transfer was huge. Sancho failing here is on ETH/us as much as it is on Sancho.

Ole was a squad striker who would probably be treated at par to the likes of Saha (actually Saha was, at one point, a first teamer but I digress) if it wasn't for that goal. His only managerial experience at a level that can be compared to United was that with Cardiff were he tanked massively. I am being very generous here because managing Everton (ex Moyes) let alone Cardiff is a whole different cup of tea then United.

And its very evident why Ole handled the dressing room better then ETH and its because discipline was non existent during Ole's time. In fact we reached a point were Matic had to police things around and force players who came late to be pay some sort of fine. The squad left by Ole ended up backstabbing the man, it was labelled by Rangnick as in need of an open heart surgery and ETH himself said that he had to create some sort of disciplinary standards as it was non existent.

Sancho was a collective mess ETH had little to do with since he wasn't manager when we signed him. The club (including Ole) ignored his attitude at Dortmund and they never bothered asking if the guy was happy playing as RW (:spoiler alert: he wasn't). Sancho wasn't really used by Ole ie the guy who brought him in the first place. So let's not kid ourselves that issues with Sancho started when ETH appeared. Its not the case.

We speak of lack of professionalism with Rashford partying and calling sick for training, Sancho not giving a toss etc. After our humiliating defeat against Liverpool our previous manager could have fought for his career tooth and nail and drill some sense into the team in a desperate bid to safe his United's career and our season. He chose to go on a family holiday in Norway instead.

 

[DJ_21]

Say what you want about Ole. But we played our best football under him by a mile since fergie.

 

[Hakara]

if it wasn't for that goal

I followed quite a bit of english football back in those days, and I distinctly remember at least his red card vs Newcastle that also stands out to me. Think that was towards the end of the season even.

 

[troylocker]

Ole was a squad striker who would probably be treated at par to the likes of Saha (actually Saha was, at one point, a first teamer but I digress) if it wasn't for that goal. His only managerial experience at a level that can be compared to United was that with Cardiff were he tanked massively. I am being very generous here because managing Everton (ex Moyes) let alone Cardiff is a whole different cup of tea then United.

And its very evident why Ole handled the dressing room better then ETH and its because discipline was non existent during Ole's time. In fact we reached a point were Matic had to police things around and force players who came late to be pay some sort of fine. The squad left by Ole ended up backstabbing the man, it was labelled by Rangnick as in need of an open heart surgery and ETH himself said that he had to create some sort of disciplinary standards as it was non existent.

Finally Sancho was a collective mess ETH had little to do with since he wasn't manager when we signed him. The club (including Ole) ignored his attitude at Dortmund and they never bothered asking if the guy was happy playing as RW (:spoiler alert: he wasn't). Sancho wasn't really used by Ole ie the guy who brought him in the first place. So let's not kid ourselves that issues with Sancho started when ETH appeared. Its not the case.

Seriously?
Four players has scored more goals for us the last 50 years than Ole...(Giggs, RVN, Rooney and Ronaldo)
Saha never scored 10 league goals for us in a single season and he was here 5 seasons.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

Say what you want about Ole. But we played our best football under him by a mile since fergie.

That doesn't mean it wasn't still shit. It just wasn't as shit as ETH, Moyes.

 

[devilish]

Seriously?
Four players has scored more goals for us the last 50 years than Ole...(Giggs, RVN, Rooney and Ronaldo)
Saha never scored 10 league goals for us in a single season and he was here 5 seasons.

Ole had an excellent eye for goal especially coming off the bench but he was a squad player, an excellent one but a squad player nevertheless. Some people seem to forget that SAF wanted to sell him to Spurs in 1998. The fee was agreed as well and the deal collapsed because he wanted to stay here.

 

[erikcred]

Ole had an excellent eye for goal especially coming off the bench but he was a squad player, an excellent one but a squad player nevertheless. Some people seem to forget that SAF wanted to sell him to Spurs in 1998. The fee was agreed as well and the deal collapsed because he wanted to stay here.

Something about some unfinished business.

 

[devilish]

Something about some unfinished business.

For the record I didn't want him to leave at the time. He was an old school type of goal poacher who gave us a different dimension to our game as compared to the strikers we had at the time. Cole was the prototype of the modern striker ie someone who could do everything at a decent level (ie dropping deep, help midfield, score goals, play the counter etc) without really excelling in anything in particular. However if the team is 0-0, we're desperate for a win and we're heading towards the last half an hour of the game then, I felt, that the chances of Ole putting the ball in the net was higher then Cole did. In my opinion, the best striker we had during the treble side was Yorke. I thought that he was a tad overrated at Villa but that season with us he proved all critics (including myself) wrong. He was simply electric and the complete striker.

However there's no denying that Ole was a squad player same as Teddy was. TBF they'll both walk in our current first team