Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

Status
Not open for further replies.
RooneyLegend said:
A manager who recognises that and goes into the market to find those players. Some of you lot need to stop acting like our managers dont contribute to our squad.
Click to expand...

Of course they contribute, but its a bit of give and take with the board.

There are other external circumstances as well to factor in, like LCFC dragging out the Maguire transfer which I'm absolutely certain Ole demanded get done (There were plenty of articles stating this).

What about the fact Maguire refuse to report to training to force the move?

We can't be held accountable for other clubs stubbornness.

If your going to fire back its us (Ed / Judge) delaying or being useless at transfers, we got the DJ & AWB transfers done once the former had funeral bereavement done and AWB returning from the summer tournament.

We also fecked out a tonne of deadwood rapidly.

The evidence suggests our board acted effectively in many instances.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
I took the tweets as saying that. We had a strong team so it was hard for them to get in. He got rid of Hughes, Ince and Kanchelskis to pave the way for them. However they were still coming into a very strong team. Like the lad at Barcelona. We need to strengthen this team even more and then bring those kids in.
Click to expand...

We need to strengthen the team I agree, however at no point should you play an inferior player due to age. That is not me saying they are inferior, however if they are then it isn't correct. Just playing the likes of Mata and Pereira because they are older makes zero sense. Continuing to play them after poor performances makes even less sense, if Gomes comes in and has poor performances too at least then they should be sharing the minutes.

Otherwise we should have send the lad on loan
 
Cassidy said:
We need to strengthen the team I agree, however at no point should you play an inferior player due to age. That is not me saying they are inferior, however if they are then it isn't correct. Just playing the likes of Mata and Pereira because they are older makes zero sense.
Click to expand...
I think we need to look at where we loan our youngsters to. It would do them good to go to clubs abroad who play technical football, rather than sending them to lower division sides to man up.
 
I think its obvious that whatever you think of Woody, whether its financial or not, that Ole will be given at least 2 and maybe the full 3 seasons to rebuild the squad, before he is judged by him. Ole is at the wheel and will have a lot of bumps along the road, but eventually the squad will be at least full of young good players, with the dross gone. The 3 players he bought in are the best we have done in a transfer window since Fergie. If he can bring in the same quality next summer, and maybe even in January, we will look a much better team and squad.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
I think we need to look at where we loan our youngsters to. It would do them good to go to clubs abroad who play technical football, rather than sending them to lower division sides to man up.
Click to expand...

Like Pereira? That worked out well. It really depends on why we don't play them.
Is it due to their lack of technical ability, or due to their lack of physicality?
 
wolvored said:
I think its obvious that whatever you think of Woody, whether its financial or not, that Ole will be given at least 2 and maybe the full 3 seasons to rebuild the squad, before he is judged by him. Ole is at the wheel and will have a lot of bumps along the road, but will eventually we will be at least full of young good players, with the dross gone. The 3 players he bought in are the best we have done in a transfer window. If he can bring in the same quality next summer, and maybe even in January, we will look a much better team and squad.
Click to expand...

I see no evidence to suggest this is obvious at all
 
Cassidy said:
They didn't play because they had quality players in front of them... It is a silly tweet
Yes we know it is preferable to play young players in a good team structure. However it doesn't make sense to play inferior players (if they indeed are inferior) ahead of someone due to age
Click to expand...

In fairness, if you read the top tweet he states similar for Barca and the kid Fati.

Folks want / expect us to drop in 4 / 5 youths into a starting line up and don't stop to think of the ramifications of doing so.

I have to say I LOVE the double standards when discussing our youth, I mean when LVG just "dumped" in Rashford he was "clueless, got lucky, didn't prepare the young lads" etc etc...now that Ole is actually slowly integrating them with a plan, guess what... Ole too is "clueless, scared, a yes man" etc etc...

Our supporters might just want to possibly stop b*tchin', moaning and simply show some maturity and patience.

Guess what, just like ALL the whinging about his post Everton statements and "some players won't be here" it eventually rang true didn't it?

So, for anyone reading this... CHILL!

Give the man time and I'm absolutely certain all your moaning now about the youth players will prove to be pointless also cause they will definitely get tonnes of playing time between now and May.
 
Di Maria's angel said:
For those who say we have style, what is it? It's like a half committed press, where we'd rather the opposing team keep the ball to aid in countering them; but we're not actually that good at playing on the counter. And there's the fact that we're incapable of breaking teams down who sit behind the ball.
Click to expand...
What was the style of Leicester yesterday?
 
Cassidy said:
Like Pereira? That worked out well. It really depends on why we don't play them.
Is it due to their lack of technical ability, or due to their lack of physicality?
Click to expand...
That might be down to him. I get the impression that he has more confidence than talent. It would do the English lads good to learn a different culture and more technical training.
 
Keefy18 said:
In fairness, if you read the top tweet he states similar for Barca and the kid Fati.

Folks want / expect us to drop in 4 / 5 youths into a starting line up and don't stop to think of the ramifications of doing so.

I have to say I LOVE the double standards when discussing our youth, I mean when LVG just "dumped" in Rashford he was "clueless, got lucky, didn't prepare the young lads" etc etc...now that Ole is actually slowly integrating them with a plan, guess what... Ole too is "clueless, scared, a yes man" etc etc...

Our supporters might just want to possibly stop b*tchin', moaning and simply show some maturity and patience.

Guess what, just like ALL the whinging about his post Everton statements and "some players won't be here" it eventually rang true didn't it?

So, for anyone reading this... CHILL!

Give the man time and I'm absolutely certain all your moaning now about the youth players will prove to be pointless also cause they will definitely get tonnes of playing time between now and May.
Click to expand...

You missed the point I was making.
It is better to introduce players into a stable side, but it is not the only way as we have seen with Rashford, Martial, McTominnay etc

What is worse is constantly playing underperforming players since it breeds lack of competition in the squad. Anyway I do believe they will get plenty of game time.
I also believe we may have an issue with Gomes but I hope we do not
 
Cassidy said:
You missed the point I was making.
It is better to introduce players into a stable side, but it is not the only way as we have seen with Rashford, Martial, McTominnay etc

What is worse is constantly playing underperforming players since it breeds lack of competition in the squad. Anyway I do believe they will get plenty of game time.
I also believe we may have an issue with Gomes but I hope we do not
Click to expand...
Cassidy said:
You missed the point I was making.
It is better to introduce players into a stable side, but it is not the only way as we have seen with Rashford, Martial, McTominnay etc

What is worse is constantly playing underperforming players since it breeds lack of competition in the squad. Anyway I do believe they will get plenty of game time.
I also believe we may have an issue with Gomes but I hope we do not
Click to expand...
I hope the same as you where Angel is concerned. Funny enough he is one I really do think would have benefited from a loan abroad. Knowing us we would send him to Rotherham instead.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
That might be down to him. I get the impression that he has more confidence than talent. It would do the English lads good to learn a different culture and more technical training.
Click to expand...

I would agree if again they had quality players keeping them from getting the minutes here. If not then as we have seen loans are pot luck, sometimes the club doesn't even bother playing them, or in the correct position etc.

What is true though as was the case with Pereira is that there is little point keeping them playing u23 football or staying in our squad if they are not going to get significant playing time.

That is the mistake we made with Pereira IMO, who had enough talent but didn't play a lot of football at key points in his development process
 
Leftback99 said:
What was the style of Leicester yesterday?
Click to expand...
Wondering the same thing, Seen them 3 times this season and not sure why people think Rodgers has them playing "great" football. We didn't even play that well without the ball and they were crap.
 
Cassidy said:
You missed the point I was making.
It is better to introduce players into a stable side, but it is not the only way as we have seen with Rashford, Martial, McTominnay etc

What is worse is constantly playing underperforming players since it breeds lack of competition in the squad. Anyway I do believe they will get plenty of game time.
I also believe we may have an issue with Gomes but I hope we do not
Click to expand...

That's a luxury he sadly hasn't got.

He inherited a mess due to poor board decisions and also poor managerial decisions and the team has suffered.

He's had to completely strip the squad back and slowly integrate the young players.

See that depends on your outlook, would you prefer he handed everything to the kids immediately and told them they are stars instantly?

That breeds ego and bad attitude. Regardless of their poor form he is still telling the young lads the likes of Matic, Mata and Young are ahead of you because of their careers, winning leagues / trophies.

They'll get their games, we are going to be playing approx 50 games of football this year, we're on game number 5.
 
Cassidy said:
I would agree if again they had quality players keeping them from getting the minutes here. If not then as we have seen loans are pot luck, sometimes the club doesn't even bother playing them, or in the correct position etc.

What is true though as was the case with Pereira is that there is little point keeping them playing u23 football or staying in our squad if they are not going to get significant playing time.

That is the mistake we made with Pereira IMO, who had enough talent but didn't play a lot of football at key points in his development process
Click to expand...
Who has the quality in our team to teach these kids anything though? They will still need a guiding hand. It will be sink or swim for them and I am not sure that is healthy at such a big club as United.
 
One of the biggest mistakes we have made is not getting an experienced striker in. We have three strikers who are all relatively inexperienced and are bits of kids. An experienced head in with them could have been invaluable. Which is likely why we were linked with the likes of Mandzukic and Llorente, players who would not get in their way, but could give them invaluable advice.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Who has the quality in our team to teach these kids anything though? They will still need a guiding hand. It will be sink or swim for them and I am not sure that is healthy at such a big club as United.
Click to expand...


If only Rashford, Greenwood and James had someone at the club who is a great goal scorer and has trained attackers at United before....
 
Keefy18 said:
That's a luxury he sadly hasn't got.

He inherited a mess due to poor board decisions and also poor managerial decisions and the team has suffered.

He's had to completely strip the squad back and slowly integrate the young players.

See that depends on your outlook, would you prefer he handed everything to the kids immediately and told them they are stars instantly?

That breeds ego and bad attitude. Regardless of their poor form he is still telling the young lads the likes of Matic, Mata and Young are ahead of you because of their careers, winning leagues / trophies.

They'll get their games, we are going to be playing approx 50 games of football this year, we're on game number 5.
Click to expand...

The main issue is people thinking this is binary.
No I am not advocating for dropping kids in and telling them to start games.
What I am saying is Ole persists with playing a no10 even though we know every single one of the senior players are not good enough to play there.

We have a young talented player who is an excellent prospect for the position who hasn't got a sniff even from the bench. I expect him to get minutes in Europa/ League cup etc so I think in the long run its ok.

The main issue I have is that Ole is clearly selecting players he already knows are not good enough and not giving a potential talent a chance to put pressure on them (we saw the lack of minutes from Gomes since pre season)

Also I am not sure what ego or bad attitude it breeds to show players that your on the pitch performances count if you play poorly you can lose your place. I think the reverse is true, where the likes of Mata Matic (who has been mouthing off) and Pereira are complacent because they know they can turn in mediocre performances and still get in side. All 3 of these players have been utter crap for at least 2 years

When Lampard brought on Billy Gilmour vs Sheffield, do you think he was waiting for the side to be stable or to have a set of world class players before doing so?
 
DomesticTadpole said:
Who has the quality in our team to teach these kids anything though? They will still need a guiding hand. It will be sink or swim for them and I am not sure that is healthy at such a big club as United.
Click to expand...

It won't be sink or swim. That's exactly what Ole is avoiding by bedding them in. He starts playing them every game and guess what, there is intense scrutiny of their quality just because we fail to win or are inconsistent. That's not good for the club in the long term.

He is doing the right thing. Giving them confidence and keeping them around the squad to come in slowly. They'll play the easier Europa league and Carabao cup games, and hopefully build some momentum. They'll be in and out of the squad for this season, and if someone has a breakaway season then so be it. Our results this season won't be defined by how the youngsters perform every game, but by how well the bed into the overall setup.
 
Wumminator said:
If only Rashford, Greenwood and James had someone at the club who is a great goal scorer and has trained attackers at United before....
Click to expand...
You mean Ole? Then either he is not getting it across to them or they don't bother listening, because they are not ripping trees up. Michael Carrick was a class midfielder, yet our midfield is still terrible. Also Ole can do his best on the training pitch, but he cannot help them once they are on the pitch. Would be interesting to know if these lads go back after training to practice finishing or freekicks, or is it spent doing promotional work for the powers that be.
 
Shiva87 said:
It won't be sink or swim. That's exactly what Ole is doing by bedding them in. He starts playing them every game and guess what, there is intense scrutiny of their quality just because we fail to win or are inconsistent. That's not good for the club in the long term.

He is doing the right thing. Giving them confidence and keeping them around the squad to come in slowly. They'll play the easier Europa league and Carabao cup games, and hopefully build some momentum. They'll be in and out of the squad for this season, and if someone has a breakaway season then so be it. Our results this season won't be defined by how the youngsters perform every game, but by how well the bed into the overall setup.
Click to expand...
I'm agreeing with you. I cannot see the point of just throwing them into the league yet, unless our form picks up and he feels it is safe to do it. The team on Thursday will say a lot. If he still uses the same old faces then I will despair for them.
 
AJ10 said:
Wondering the same thing, Seen them 3 times this season and not sure why people think Rodgers has them playing "great" football. We didn't even play that well without the ball and they were crap.
Click to expand...
This is the thing. Loads of posters mention 'style' like they know what they are talking about. Most could point out the difference between City and Burnley but not be able to really explain any teams in between. Their opinions are based on results (the table) and highlights on match of the day.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
You mean Ole? Then either he is not getting it across to them or they don't bother listening, because they are not ripping trees up. Michael Carrick was a class midfielder, yet our midfield is still terrible. Also Ole can do his best on the training pitch, but he cannot help them once they are on the pitch. Would be interesting to know if these lads go back after training to practice finishing or freekicks, or is it spent doing promotional work for the powers that be.
Click to expand...

James has been doing ok and Greenwood has hardly played. Also our finishing hasn't exactly been the issue thus far, more so lack of creating goal scoring opportunities. Martial has also been quite clinical with what he has had this season
 
noodlehair said:
Who would you have got? Pochettino?

Spurs have about 10 less points than us since Ole took over, and Pochettino has better players to pick from than Ole does and has had 4 years to build a team there.

I doubt you'd be happy with him if you're so disgusted by how we're doing under Ole. Although the stupidest thing is that even if we had him and were doing worse, you probably would be on here claiming things were going well.
Click to expand...

Imagine thinking Ole is anywhere near as good a manager as Poch. Deary me.

Unbelievable - we are the laughing stock of the premier league right now as it’s clear we’re going nowhere with a nothing manager yet you’re lapping it up.
 
noodlehair said:
Who would you have got? Pochettino?

Spurs have about 10 less points than us since Ole took over, and Pochettino has better players to pick from than Ole does and has had 4 years to build a team there.

I doubt you'd be happy with him if you're so disgusted by how we're doing under Ole. Although the stupidest thing is that even if we had him and were doing worse, you probably would be on here claiming things were going well.
Click to expand...

He also got to a UCL final and went into last season with zero new signings...
 
Cassidy said:
James has been doing ok and Greenwood has hardly played. Also our finishing hasn't exactly been the issue thus far, more so lack of creating goal scoring opportunities. Martial has also been quite clinical with what he has had this season
Click to expand...
That is the problem, Martial is not bad as the striker, but as soon as he is out Rashford goes in there and he is nowhere near as clinical. I feel a bit sorry for Greenwood, yes it is good for him being in the senior squad, but he is getting absolutely no football at all, not even U-23's. That is why I am hoping Thursday and the cups will change that. He might not be entirely ready for the league, but no football at all is not going to help that situation. The cups will show if he is ready to step up or not. A lot of being successful is mentality.
 
Mike Phelan's Former Tash said:
Not accurate, for me at least. Of all the managers we've had post SAF, Ole seems to be the only one brave enough to plan for the medium to long term.

Most of the sh*t has been moved on, the squad is young and they look hungry to me. I like what he's doing, it won't happen overnight but we're heading in the right direction for the first time in years.

Ole may not be the world's greatest manager, he may be a little nieve at times with his comments and decisions but he's the right man for United right now.
Click to expand...

I can’t see anything that shows good football so we aren’t heading in the right direction. Players once again are getting worse and squad selection once again is poor. But we shall see.
 
Cassidy said:
The main issue is people thinking this is binary.
No I am not advocating for dropping kids in and telling them to start games.
What I am saying is Ole persists with playing a no10 even though we know every single one of the senior players are not good enough to play there.

We have a young talented player who is an excellent prospect for the position who hasn't got a sniff even from the bench. I expect him to get minutes in Europa/ League cup etc so I think in the long run its ok.

The main issue I have is that Ole is clearly selecting players he already knows are not good enough and not giving a potential talent a chance to put pressure on them (we saw the lack of minutes from Gomes since pre season)

Also I am not sure what ego or bad attitude it breeds to show players that your on the pitch performances count if you play poorly you can lose your place. I think the reverse is true, where the likes of Mata Matic (who has been mouthing off) and Pereira are complacent because they know they can turn in mediocre performances and still get in side. All 3 of these players have been utter crap for at least 2 years

When Lampard brought on Billy Gilmour vs Sheffield, do you think he was waiting for the side to be stable or to have a set of world class players before doing so?
Click to expand...

Well you answer your own complaint really.

It's game 5 and the busy period is only starting this week with Europa and league cup games ahead so lets see where we are then.

They are putting pressure on the senior players by being in the match day squads, they are in the shadows sort of speak and will play as you've just admitted you think they will anyway.

The highlighted part isn't true at all. Many of the senior players have been fecked out, but he can't get rid of every single one of them in a single window either, he still needs some experience in there and he felt these lads were the lesser of the evils if you will.

Matic started his first game in 5 this season, no idea what your on about. He only played because Pogba was injured. Mata has played 2 games and Ole no doubt had it in mind with EL & LC matches coming up Gomes starts both or Chong. I'd also remind you yesterday Chong replaced Mata, so again to say they are keeping their place regardless of performance now is factually untrue.

As for Gilmour he's the same as Chong, Gomes and Greenwood. He's made a single app, Chong and Gomes just the 3 for us so far.

Sadly for us, Chelsea's loaning system has paid dividends it seems with Abraham and Mount for example benefiting from it.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
That is the problem, Martial is not bad as the striker, but as soon as he is out Rashford goes in there and he is nowhere near as clinical. I feel a bit sorry for Greenwood, yes it is good for him being in the senior squad, but he is getting absolutely no football at all, not even U-23's. That is why I am hoping Thursday and the cups will change that. He might not be entirely ready for the league, but no football at all is not going to help that situation. The cups will show if he is ready to step up or not. A lot of being successful is mentality.
Click to expand...

Agree it is big problem. Even the minutes he has played has not been as a no9 apart from last season vs Cardiff
 
Keefy18 said:
Well you answer your own complaint really.

It's game 5 and the busy period is only starting this week with Europa and league cup games ahead so lets see where we are then.

They are putting pressure on the senior players by being in the match day squads, they are in the shadows sort of speak and will play as you've just admitted you think they will anyway.

The highlighted part isn't true at all. Many of the senior players have been fecked out, but he can't get rid of every single one of them in a single window either, he still needs some experience in there and he felt these lads were the lesser of the evils if you will.

Matic started his first game in 5 this season, no idea what your on about. He only played because Pogba was injured. Mata has played 2 games and Ole no doubt had it in mind with EL & LC matches coming up Gomes starts both or Chong. I'd also remind you yesterday Chong replaced Mata, so again to say they are keeping their place regardless of performance now is factually untrue.

As for Gilmour he's the same as Chong, Gomes and Greenwood. He's made a single app, Chong and Gomes just the 3 for us so far.

Sadly for us, Chelsea's loaning system has paid dividends it seems with Abraham and Mount for example benefiting from it.
Click to expand...

Nothing but mediocre players who we know are not good enough have played the no10 role this season thus far was the point I was making. So Ole needs to rectify this if he insists on playing with a no10
 
RooneyLegend said:
That depends on the team we're trying to build which im not sure of. You are not suggesting there is no quality in world football are you?
Click to expand...

It wouldn't have made sense to let Rashford go since we already let Lukaku and Sanchez go
 
Weird rants.

Cassidy said:
Also I am not sure what ego or bad attitude it breeds to show players that your on the pitch performances count if you play poorly you can lose your place. I think the reverse is true, where the likes of Mata Matic (who has been mouthing off) and Pereira are complacent because they know they can turn in mediocre performances and still get in side. All 3 of these players have been utter crap for at least 2 years
Click to expand...

Matic has been involved in 2 out of 5 matches, 20mins against Southampton and almost 70 against Leiceister. Mata and Pereira have been far more involved, but that's down to lack of alternatives. As soon as our injured first team players return both Mata and Pereira will be on the bench (one of them will struggle to make the bench)

Whats more important, immediate punishment of poor performances or the long term success of our youngsters ? There's a bit more to take into account here, not to mention that we need to win as well. What would the lesson learned be if we played two of Gomes/Greenwood/Chong ahead of Mata and Pereira, but instead of winning we ended up losing ? Or maybe a draw ? Since Brendan was appointed manager of Leicester, only Liverpool and City have won more matches.
 
noodlehair said:
He signed 3 players who all look pretty good, and made it fairly clear there were other targets but that he didn't want the wrong players or players that didn't want to be here.

Again what exactly are you expecting? You're just moaning about nothing.
Click to expand...
You'd expect 2 of them to look pretty considering we've spend a fortune getting them here. Very few players in the world dont want to be here. All of them play at clubs doing better.
 
RooneyLegend said:
That depends on the team we're trying to build which im not sure of. You are not suggesting there is no quality in world football are you?
Click to expand...

I’m saying there’s no one obtainable as of right now who is going to automatically better than Rashford. Because rashford (for his age) is probably the best striker in the world under 23.
 
Rafaeldagold said:
Imagine thinking Ole is anywhere near as good a manager as Poch. Deary me.

Unbelievable - we are the laughing stock of the premier league right now as it’s clear we’re going nowhere with a nothing manager yet you’re lapping it up.
Click to expand...
And the funny thing is without the penalty these same people will all would be on Ole back.

At least if the penalty was something that was conceded because one of our players was through on goal or something, then at least there is some merit. The penalty was a silly mistake from the defender from a non-threatening situation. It's not going to happen every time.

I cannot see what Ole is building with the team.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.