Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

[acnumber9]

Recently he was picked over James Maddison. By England. What's the reason because I'm lost?

Well it’s obviously not because Gareth Southgate likes his personality more. Managers job is to pick a team not individuals. Not that I’m saying Lingard doesn’t deserve to be dropped but there’s obviously something to his game they see that makes them pick them. People won’t like what the answer is but movement will be one of those reasons.

 

[Stookie]

United just aren’t having that bit of luck at the moment. They were the better team against palace and wolves, just a story of two missed penalties.

 

[Foxbatt]

Playing regularly for a big club( United is a big club) has more chance of a mediocre player being chosen than a mediocre player from a smaller club

 

[RedDevil-85]

Well since we are a full 3 games into the season i say back him..

 

[rocks12]

He should definitely go. It was a mistake to keep him permanently and there's no point in continuing with him.

No other top club would have OGS as manager.

 

[Amarsdd]

If Chelsea could easily have gone the other way, so could the Palace game. You can say it about most PL games, Arsenal had chances to go ahead against Liverpool on Saturday (who were also very fortunate to come away with a win at Southampton).

Exactly. Not only this season, when we lost 2-0 vs Arsenal, De Gea made a blunder and then a penalty that wasn't a penalty. On the other hand, we missed shit loads of chances, Fred hit the outside of the post.

Against Wolves away, we created shit loads of chances and game should have been over in the first 30 mins.

Against Chelsea, we completely blew them away and then De Gea blunder conceded the goal.

I think 'maybe' 'if' 'but' should be only used to play down ManUtd, when we are at the receiving end then we played it to opponent hands.

Yeah its all out there, but the poster will just ignore it and go on saying the same things in the other threads. Its the same as political discourse these days, you just cherry-pick the points that support you and completely disregard and ignore the points that don't support your agenda or your already fixed mindset. I really don't know if they consciously or subconsciously ignore to see the full picture sometimes. It's so rampant in the caf, it's sometimes embarrassing.

 

[Bastian]

I can forgive him for this because ultimately we've had nothing but negative stories for the past 5/6 years. It's probably good to hide that negativity behind closed doors rather than providing the media with the ammunition to spread more negativity.

The planning is an interesting point because if we believe what we've been told then it seems that Ole is more of a stubborn Manager who identifies the player he wants with lots of research and then will not accept failure. As @Wednesday at Stoke puts it, he seems pretty decisive in his squad building which is probably why he's pretty good at it (although we'll see how well Maguire, AWB and James do in 6 months before assessing them properly).

I don't think to counter negativity one needs to go out and present an over the top glorified view of what is without doubt one of the most clueless bunch to ever run a top football club.

With regards to the planning, Ole has said that he has final say on players, which is not the same as him identifying every single target. For that we presumably have the 50 scouts or however many they are. Then there is the "recruitment team", whoever they are. I don't think Ole would be as comprehensive as Mourinho who would maybe give out a list of 3-4 players for 3-4 positions, in order of preference. Could be wrong, but if we don't have more targets than Longstaff for midfield and an unattainable Sancho for right wing then that's of course inexcusable.

Again, no problem with those he brought in. But our midfield is a bit of a disaster and one injury and we are truly fecked.

If we were really serious about putting together a proper team and rebuilding we'd have a pre-season in Europe. We'd shift 6-7 players and cut our losses. And plan ahead.

I don't think Ole is to blame for this, but the best political game is to never gush about the hierarchy. Like I said, he doesn't have to go full Jose on them, but no need whatsoever to praise them.

 

[TheRedHearted]

Ole came into a broken system and things look better. We are a thin squad at the moment but it’s a transition year and we all know even how the first year of Pep and Klopp looked like- but they made improvements from the year before in terms of long term goals.
It may be possible we but someone in the winter, and if the team keeps going this way in terms of potential (and even starts to gel together even more than we have seen) I do think we will be winning more games than we have so far.

That being the case, with the youth in the team and the longer term potential a DOF will more likely be more intrigued in the rebuilding of Manchester United.

After a couple more years perhaps someone like Edwin van Der Sar might take on the role. Linking us with younger Dutch talent as well.

 

[matt10000]

No. But i see no patterns of play when we play against an organized defence which is concerning.
We look totally clueless when not allowed to counter. 75 % possession against Palace and only 3 shots on target is abysmal.

I agree that we look very good on the counter and look and lack creativity when opposition sit back bit I don’t believe that it is not being worked on. Rome wasn’t built in a day but we are looking good on the counter and being able to convert possession into more chances will come with confidence and maybe a signing either a creative attacking
midfielder or a more defensive one to allow Pogba to move higher up in these scenarios

 

[Stacks]

You can say that about any managerial situation, though.

- Jose paid the price for the board appointing an almost-retired relic manager in LVG and allowing him to spend a fortune on mediocre players. This meant Jose needed to try and clear out at least some of what was left for him, and gave him slightly less to work with in terms of spending. Plus he had to re-train them in a different style of play.

- LVG paid the price for the board hiring Moyes. He inherited an aging squad with many key players needing to be replaced and the board had hired Moyes thinking he'd be able to eke out decent results/standings with this aging squad. The squad lacked direction and LVG needed to implement a visible style of play on them as a result.

Jose bought 11 players and only 2 have been successes. Jose has done more damage than LVG as Ole is having to clear out 3 seasons worth of deadwood

 

[RG 11]

Nothing should be decided before December anyway. I think if we are within touching distance of 4th by Christmas, the board needs to back him in the transfer market in January. It's pointless to keep changing managers every season for the next one to come in and change everything.

Especially considering we have no structure for continuity.

 

[AFC NimbleThumb]

He’s seen multiple first teasers leave & had his attack/midfield obliterated but yea let’s sack him.

Fergie would struggle with this squad. We’ve had 2 injuries & we’re threadbare.

 

[JK-27]

Isn't it obvious the board haven't backed Ole (when did they last truly back a manager?). Herrera gone - not replaced. Lukaku gone - not replaced. Sanchez gone - not replaced.

32 points behind City last season and we only sign 3 players, one of whom had never played in the Prem, one of whom had only played in the Prem for one season. Obvious the board haven't backed him, so if they don't why should we?

On top of that, after 32 games in charge his win % is 53.1. Moyes had a win rate of 56.3% after 32 games. He wasn't backed and ended up being sacked. LVG had a win rate also of 53.1%. He wasn't backed and ended up being sacked. Jose had a win rate of 65.6% (way above Moyes, LVG, and Ole). He was sacked.

 

[snowkarl]

we had 3rd place form under him last year. chelsea are significantly weaker since then.

reminds me of when everyone said 4th place was impossible when he took over last year. If you are so sure we can't make top 4 you should get down the bookies and make some money

Mate, honestly. For 10 games. After that initial bunch of games (where we looked terrible and shaky mostly but scored a few late goals out of sheer will) Ole managed to win, what, 4 in 20?

 

[Foxbatt]

Trust me he would get sacked soon. He does not have the expertise or the tactical know-how to compete with the top managers. You can't have it both ways. If he sell players then he has to get new players too and better players than he sold. I do not think United would sack him but say parted company with mutual understanding.

 

[Sterling Archer]

Solskjaer:
If we lose a forward like Lukaku or Sanchez, we will replace them.

Woodward:
Sells Lukaku and loans Sanchez after our transfer window closes.

How can you possibly blame Ole for this without first taking a look at the executive that's fecked over every other manager he's overseen?

 

[zenith]

I won't blame ole for whatever happens this season. In his limited means he has conducted good transfers of high quality players and is at least trying to play attractive football. I'm certain he'll learn from his mistakes such as Mata and especially lingard but given the depth of the squad, what options did he truly have.

He has no control over the fact that rashford and pogba missed penalties and de gea made another howler. Had those things happened as they should have, we could very well have had a perfect start.

 

[Wumminator]

Now first of all yes, this thread title is overly emotive, but I think some balance is needed here to address how well Ole is doing after inheriting the absolute shitshow that is Manchester United.

When Jose Mourinho arrived at Manchester United, most of the fanbase was over the moon. Seen as a 'serial winner' despite having Chelsea hovering near the relegation zone in his last stint as a manager, Jose was seen as a 'guarantee' of success after the tenure of LVG and Moyes. Almost 90% of this forum said they were happy with his hiring. He arrived at the club who had just finished fifth in the league and won the FA Cup. Fans weren't happy with LVG's style of play and his downturn in results.

At the time Mourinho was given unprecedented funds that he would spend turning Manchester United into a worse team. Far from not being backed, Mourinho would take United to the highest wage bill in world football and spend hundreds of millions.

In his first tranfer window, United fans celebrated having the best transfer widow in the prem. Jose broke the world transfer record, signed Eric Bailly and Mikhytaryan. The next year he would take his net spend to 250 million. In his first two years at the club Mourinho spent 325 million pounds. Of those players, only two have played any minutes in the Premier League this season. The next year he spent another 75 million. If a manager spends 400 million and only has Lindelof and Pogba to show for it, the next manager is not going to turn it around overnight.

During this time, Mourinho also increased our wage massively. Fans may complain about the fact that Darmian and Rojo are taking up wages, however Mourinho's own desire to 'complete our attack' with Sanchez remains one of the worst bits of business ever done in the Premier League. From 2015 to 2018 (not just Mourinho's tenure, but the vast majority of this money would be Mourinho's) our wagebill increased by 93 million (or 46%). Mourinho almost doubled our wage bill and left the club further away from the title/top four and in a lower position than where he took over.

Enter Solskjaer. United fans are currently complaining that Ole Gunnar has not been backed, despite spending over 150 million pounds since his arrival at the club. Many United fans feel this way because our squad on paper in thin in so many areas. However, if the club is going to get back to the top, it is a necessary part of the rebuilding process. United have drastically lowered their wage bill, with the departures of Fellaini, Valencia, Lukaku, Sanchez and Herrera. This had to happen, we can not continue spending so much money on players who are not good enough.

If Mourinho hadn't have messed up so badly, we wouldn't be in this position. However, the signs are positive. Maguire, AWB and Daniel James have started their careers well. We are signing players for the long term in Hannibal Mejbri. Our Under 23s have been completely redesigned and are currently bossing the league. Recent work for the Athletic has shown how meticulous Solskjaer has been in redeveloping the club. Our style of football has improved.

Ole needs time. He can not possibly rectify this club in a season. People will point to other clubs who have rebuilt in a quicker time throughout recent seasons, however no club has ever ended up with such a horrendous financial position. With the money flowing through the game nowadays, every signing has to be successful and unfortunately we have been massively far off.

 

[SteveW]

I like what I see. It will take time but he's definitely moving us in the right direction. I trust him.

 

[Tarrou]

good post

and I think Ole is doing the right things and has done a good job, so far...

I'm more than happy to support him and give him time

*hides behind sofa*

 

[Foxtrot]

I’ve seen plenty of such threads post SAF era. It took Moyes, Van Gaal to make this mess. When Ole gets fired, there will be a similar thread like this “It took Ole a year to create this mess...need to give the new manager time.”

 

[Wumminator]

I’ve seen plenty of such threads post SAF era. It took Moyes, Van Gaal to make this mess. When Ole gets fired, there will be a similar thread like this “It took Ole a year to create this mess...need to give the new manager time.”

Moyes was not here long enough to do lasting damage.

LVG took us forward as a club and won our first silverware post Ferguson.

In a time when money in football absolutely exploded, we trusted it to Mourinho who wasted more money than any other football manager. He has left us worse off.

If you include transfers and wage bill, we spent roughly 600 million for Mourinho’s tenure and ended up with Lindelof and Pogba as first team players. Lindelof was at fault for the goal this weekend so I’m not sure how long he will last.

 

[Ban]

I'm positive as you get but turning it around by having paper thin midfield and attack? Not so sure.
I don't think there some, any plan behind all this. We lowered our wage bill yes but seriously weakened the team in the same time.

It's like when a new government g comes into power, it blames the ex government for everything but after a while that blaming game doesn't really work.

It's popular to blame Jose for everything I get it and it makes people feel better.

 

[Ban]

Moyes was not here long enough to do lasting damage.

LVG took us forward as a club and won our first silverware post Ferguson.

In a time when money in football absolutely exploded, we trusted it to Mourinho who wasted more money than any other football manager. He has left us worse off.

If you include transfers and wage bill, we spent roughly 600 million for Mourinho’s tenure and ended up with Lindelof and Pogba as first team players. Lindelof was at fault for the goal this weekend so I’m not sure how long he will last.

LVG bought some absolute dross which we can't get rid of. Excluding him from blame for the mess we're in is just silly. Oh and Lindelof is to blame for one goal. We might as well give up on him.

 

[Wumminator]

I'm positive as you get but turning it around by having paper thin midfield and attack? Not so sure.
I don't think there some, any plan behind all this. We lowered our wage bill yes but seriously weakened the team in the same time.

It's like when a new government g comes into power, it blames the ex government for everything but after a while that blaming game doesn't really work.

It's popular to blame Jose for everything I get it and it makes people feel better.

We can’t have more players in our squad when we have players on massive wages taking up our wage budget and squad space. Sanchez, Lukaku and Mikhi were Mourinho’s top attacking signings from other clubs. Over 100 million in transfer fees and a vast sum in wages. We couldn’t do anything this transfer window till we’ve cleared Sanchez and Lukaku.

 

[Ban]

We can’t have more players in our squad when we have players on massive wages taking up our wage budget and squad space. Sanchez, Lukaku and Mikhi were Mourinho’s top attacking signings from other clubs. Over 100 million in transfer fees and a vast sum in wages. We couldn’t do anything this transfer window till we’ve cleared Sanchez and Lukaku.

So tell me why didn't we get rid of Alexis and Lukaku earlier so we have time to get at least one replacement?

 

[Eric7C]

Enter Solskjaer. United fans are currently complaining that Ole Gunnar has not been backed, despite spending over 150 million pounds since his arrival at the club. Many United fans feel this way because our squad on paper in thin in so many areas. However, if the club is going to get back to the top, it is a necessary part of the rebuilding process. United have drastically lowered their wage bill, with the departures of Fellaini, Valencia, Lukaku, Sanchez and Herrera. This had to happen, we can not continue spending so much money on players who are not good enough.

Herrera didn't have much of an impact on our wage bill. He was a very good player who gave everything for the club and it is fair to say that it was negligent to let him go, especially considering that he was not replaced in the summer. I agree with your overall point that Ole needs time, but Ole is not working in a vacuum; he is working in a structure that seems to lack a coherent strategy when it comes to contracts and transfers.

Getting rid of players on high wages is well and good, but if they are not replaced then you are asking for trouble. How is the team going to cope if there is an injury to either Pogba or McT? Matic is not getting any minutes and Fred hasn't even made the squad. Shaw is injured and is to be replaced by a 34 year old. Martial has no replacement. Sorry, this is not how a club like United should operate.

 

[Wumminator]

LVG bought some absolute dross which we can't get rid of. Excluding him from blame for the mess we're in is just silly. Oh and Lindelof is to blame for one goal. We might as well give up on him.

LVG did buy dross. However, his net spend and overall spend was less than half of Mourinho's (obviously in less time) and many of his failed signings were replaced quickly.

Because he signed players in the prime of their careers, he was able to shift them. Depay/Schniderlin/Di Maria/Blind were all shipped out and we hardly lost any money on them. What is interesting is that LVG/Mourinho have both had two signings play for us this year. Shaw/Martial for LVG and Pogba/Lindelof for Mourinho. That is despite Mourinho being here three years after LVG.

 

[Lemansky]

I agree with most of your opinions on this and I am certainly backing Ole. He loves this clubs and works no doubt extremely hard to turn this around. His visions for the club is pretty much what I want also.

That being said it angers me that Woodward is hiding behind Ole. There need to be some kind of communication from the top of this club as to what their ambitions is in the long run. The Glazers and Woodward has made so many bad decisions and their tenure has been nothing short of a disaster (after Saf left). They need to back Ole going forward especially when we have such a thin squad and are in dire need of improvements in many positions.

 

[Wumminator]

So tell me why didn't we get rid of Alexis and Lukaku earlier so we have time to get at least one replacement?

That's what I'm trying to say. Sanchez's transfer was so catastrophically bad that it is a massively detailed operation to get anyone to sign him. He's past his prime, on the biggest wages in the squad and league and hasn't played well for a year. Hence it is not as easy as just saying, 'we'll find a buyer.' Some may see that as incompetence, but the fact we're getting rid of him at all is amazing to me.

 

[Ban]

That's what I'm trying to say. Sanchez's transfer was so catastrophically bad that it is a massively detailed operation to get anyone to sign him. He's past his prime, on the biggest wages in the squad and league and hasn't played well for a year. Hence it is not as easy as just saying, 'we'll find a buyer.' Some may see that as incompetence, but the fact we're getting rid of him at all is amazing to me.

Selling him now agree PL window is closed is downright daft.

 

[dev1l]

So tell me why didn't we get rid of Alexis and Lukaku earlier so we have time to get at least one replacement?

Because Woody and Co are more interested in financial rather than footballing stuff.
In order to get a few millions more from transfers they don't mind ruin footballing strategies.
That's why we renew the contracts of deadwood - signing a new player is more expensive, hence we choose the cheaper option.

 

[Wumminator]

Selling him now agree PL window is closed is downright daft.

So we continue to pay tens of millions in wages for the year? To have a player who is not good enough and decreasing in ability?

I mean, neither sounds like a great decision to me. But, I'd rather we save the money now and give time to a talented youngster who might shine.

 

[Ban]

LVG did buy dross. However, his net spend and overall spend was less than half of Mourinho's (obviously in less time) and many of his failed signings were replaced quickly.

Because he signed players in the prime of their careers, he was able to shift them. Depay/Schniderlin/Di Maria/Blind were all shipped out and we hardly lost any money on them. What is interesting is that LVG/Mourinho have both had two signings play for us this year. Shaw/Martial for LVG and Pogba/Lindelof for Mourinho. That is despite Mourinho being here three years after LVG.

All of those players were not shifted by him. He didn't take us forward, he's to blame for the mess as much as Moyes and Mourinho. Rojo and Darmian are still here. He basically squandered money. Bought over the hill Falcao and Schweini.

 

[Wumminator]

Because Woody and Co are more interested in financial rather than footballing stuff.
In order to get a few millions more from transfers they don't mind ruin footballing strategies.
That's why we renew the contracts of deadwood - signing a new player is more expensive, hence we choose the cheaper option.

But that makes no sense whatsoever. This is what annoys me, this shortsighted nonsense.

If 'Woody and Co' are interested in the financial side, they will obviously need to see United near the top of the league. You get so much money from CL and merchandise when you're at the top table in the footballing world. I've just shown that we have doubled our wage bill in four years and also spent over 500 million in four years. That is not just a 'cheaper option.' Nothing we have done at all has been 'the cheaper option.' What we've done is go for expensive options that have gone drastically wrong.

 

[Ban]

So we continue to pay tens of millions in wages for the year? To have a player who is not good enough and decreasing in ability?

I mean, neither sounds like a great decision to me. But, I'd rather we save the money now and give time to a talented youngster who might shine.

Might or might not. We have problems with scoring goals as it is and what do we do, cut our striker force even more.

 

[M Bison]

Good post and I agree.

I said elsewhere, there’s going to be some ups and downs this year, we’ll get some good results followed by some horrors (dreading the likes of Norwich at home for example), but I’m positive we’re on the right path.

It would be nice to have a bit more quality in midfield and attack but I’d sooner play the youth than lads who are only here for the salary. If that means our league position slips then fine, I’d rather have a group of players who are here because they want to be, rather than here just because we pay a bit more.

As with every other thread, this will turn into how awful Ed and the Glazers are, or how bad Jesse is however.

 

[Kush]

Moyes, LvG, Ole good. Jose bad.

Yeah, we get it. You don't need to shove it down our throats with a new thread every week claiming how everything is gonna be fine. There's no master plan or strategy at work here, you'll see it for yourself in coming weeks and months. But I'm sure if things don't work out for Ole, it'll somehow still be all Joses' fault.

 

[Wumminator]

All of those players were not shifted by him. He didn't take us forward, he's to blame for the mess as much as Moyes and Mourinho. Rojo and Darmian are still here. He basically squandered money. Bought over the hill Falcao and Schweini.

Mourinho bought Falcao after LVG did!

And they weren't shifted by him because he was gone. Rojo and Darmian signed for roughly 30 million. They haven't done well, but there wage and transfer fee combined is something that a club of our size can swallow up. Matic/Bailly signing for 80 million for example is a much bigger problem.

 

[dev1l]

But that makes no sense whatsoever. This is what annoys me, this shortsighted nonsense.

If 'Woody and Co' are interested in the financial side, they will obviously need to see United near the top of the league. You get so much money from CL and merchandise when you're at the top table in the footballing world. I've just shown that we have doubled our wage bill in four years and also spent over 500 million in four years. That is not just a 'cheaper option.' Nothing we have done at all has been 'the cheaper option.' What we've done is go for expensive options that have gone drastically wrong.

Not really... We have been shit since Fergie left and turnover was up year after year.