Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

[Rusholme Ruffian]

Not bothered. If people are going to make massive assumptions it leaves us all open to do the same.

There is a big difference between making assumptions about a football manager (based largely on known factors such as career to date, and the 6 months he has been at United) on a FOOTBALL forum where we are all supposed to be debating our different points of view, and making assumptions about posters life experience, knowledge and social station just cos we happen to disagree with them.

Bit pathetic to be honest.

 

[7even]

This is not a assessment of his role as a coach but it’s not good when a manager don’t live up to expectations of earlier statements. You can’t go on record criticizing your players motivation and fitness, act like you’re ruthless and then continue like nothing has happened.

Giving contracts to Ashley Young and Phil Jones is bad enough. Then continue to offering new deals to underachievers where they earn a fortune just being squad members sends the wrong message. We act and look like amateurs.

Ole Gunnar must stamp his authority on his squad by being ruthless against players who don’t live up to expectations. I love Juan Mata as a person but he’s part of the problem that we don’t perform good enough. Not the solution.

 

[Pace Abuser]

Have people seen this grade A idiots transfer wish list after giving contracts and captaincy to Young and Jones?

He's clueless and completely out of his depth. Club's a joke.

 

[crossy1686]

Easy chief

I could have sworn you turned up on this forum in the last 3months, full of energy, mass postings and plenty of arguments.

Yet your record says 2010 and 10,000+ posts

Did you not post for years, or have you changed your style.

It's easy to keep your mouth shut when things are going well but I've been doing a lot of arguing in the last few months.

We all want the same things, we all want United to be successful but some people don't know how to handle their emotions and just start shit posting at the easiest targets, not to mention the negativity around here...

So yeah, I apologise if I'm boring some but I refuse to get dragged into the doom and gloom that some want to permanently live in.

 

[Celoti23-81]

Ok

No no you need to understand that when it goes well it’s Ole & when it goes badly it’s the players.

Also despite what your eyes tell you we’ve been playing great stuff with a definite vision in place

Ok, so what happened after the new manager bounce? Everton had more ambition in getting Marco Silva and getting rid of Allardyce. Let's all face it, Ole was a knee-jerk appointment after PSG.
And in essence, had woodward waited until the end of the season before giving him a contract, that pressure might not have been there, and ole may well have secured us champions league football. But I guess we have seen a little glimpse of Ole under pressure now!
Why does De Gea, Pogba, our 2 best players want to leave all of a sudden! Are they mercenaries? Or do they see something else that they don't like! Is De Gea demanding excessive amounts of money to price him out of staying and can then blame the board? Herrera even!
It's a mess. It's exactly what Liverpool did when the got back Dalglish and a damn transfer committee.

 

[NWRed]

This is not a assessment of his role as a coach but it’s not good when a manager don’t live up to expectations of earlier statements. You can’t go on record criticizing your players motivation and fitness, act like you’re ruthless and then continue like nothing has happened.

Giving contracts to Ashley Young and Phil Jones is bad enough. Then continue to offering new deals to underachievers where they earn a fortune just being squad members sends the wrong message. We act and look like amateurs.

Ole Gunnar must stamp his authority on his squad by being ruthless against players who don’t live up to expectations. I love Juan Mata as a person but he’s part of the problem that we don’t perform good enough. Not the solution.

These two are perfectly consistent with each other, as it is with offering a contract to Mata. You can question their consistency, concentration or quality, but not their commitment to United, motivation or fitness (Jones has had injury problems but that isn't the same as fitness).

The idea behind keeping Young and Mata around is obviously to provide the youngsters with good role models and advice day in day out on the training pitch, as for Jones, he must rate him higher than the fans do.

 

[Sandikan]

It's easy to keep your mouth shut when things are going well but I've been doing a lot of arguing in the last few months.

We all want the same things, we all want United to be successful but some people don't know how to handle their emotions and just start shit posting at the easiest targets, not to mention the negativity around here...

So yeah, I apologise if I'm boring some but I refuse to get dragged into the doom and gloom that some want to permanently live in.

Nah not boring, I just found you intriguing, as even though I've been on here since 2011, there's probably less than 10 posters I could namecheck as standing out (for good or bad reasons).
So to suddenly notice you from nowhere is quite something.

But I have to say, arguing with the negative people is a real fool's errand.
It's the easiest thing in the world to do to moan about stuff. Much harder to be balanced. ie - things are never disastrous - there's 92 league teams, we finished 6th - despite basically giving up on the first half of the season. That's not to say we don't have a long way to go to get back to the top. That's balance.

 

[crossy1686]

There is a big difference between making assumptions about a football manager (based largely on known factors such as career to date, and the 6 months he has been at United) on a FOOTBALL forum where we are all supposed to be debating our different points of view, and making assumptions about posters life experience, knowledge and social station just cos we happen to disagree with them.

Bit pathetic to be honest.

Then we'll disagree.

Never intended to cause any offence and I will apologise to @Rafaeldagold if necessary but my point stands. You would have a very different perspective on just how difficult management at this level can be if you have any management experience to fall back on. I understand that people are upset and angry about the way things currently but the manager isn't the issue, not today anyway.

 

[crossy1686]

Nah not boring, I just found you intriguing, as even though I've been on here since 2011, there's probably less than 10 posters I could namecheck as standing out (for good or bad reasons).
So to suddenly notice you from nowhere is quite something.

But I have to say, arguing with the negative people is a real fool's errand.
It's the easiest thing in the world to do to moan about stuff. Much harder to be balanced. ie - things are never disastrous - there's 92 league teams, we finished 6th - despite basically giving up on the first half of the season. That's not to say we don't have a long way to go to get back to the top. That's balance.

Agree with all this, and you're right, I should really just exercise my right to use the ignore button.

 

[Sandikan]

Agree with all this, and you're right, I should really just exercise my right to use the ignore button.

It's a shame all these other "Fans" don't also support a lower league team.
I have Wycombe Wanderers to help this balance.

That Moyes season? Disaster right, 7th place, oh no!

No, Wycombe started the last day of the season in 23rd place in league 2 - and relegation would most likely have seen us go bust.
Now that was almost a disaster.

United will always come back with their money - I never worry "too much" about United, versus my other boys.

A bit of course, as it's hard to see us overhauling City anytime soon for instance (I really don't think we're miles off Arse n Chelsea even now)

But I then think back to 2003 or 04, when Chelsea looked an absolute animal. They never seemed to concede a goal, let alone not win. Yet that era passed.

 

[JustAGuest]

Equally there were a number of games in the losing run where we were the better team but didn't get results due to poor finishing and a ridiculous run of goalkeeping mistakes. Perhaps it evened out.

My god you’re delusional

Strange way to put it as the stats back up @SteveW's comment.

 

[7even]

Then we'll disagree.

Never intended to cause any offence and I will apologise to @Rafaeldagold if necessary but my point stands. You would have a very different perspective on just how difficult management at this level can be if you have any management experience to fall back on. I understand that people are upset and angry about the way things currently but the manager isn't the issue, not today anyway.

Our squad isn’t good enough. We’re unbalanced, lack quality and have to many underachievers but to say the manager isn’t part of the problem is naive. We didn’t improve in the last part of the season. In fact the opposite. Many of our players regressed. Our line ups were inconsistent and it was hard to see a game plan or a vision.

So far Ole Gunnar don’t send the right signals to his doubters. His actions is not in line with his talks. That’s a problem that will affect our chances to attract better players on the transfer market.

 

[crossy1686]

Our squad isn’t good enough. We’re unbalanced, lack quality and have to many underachievers but to say the manager isn’t part of the problem is naive. We didn’t improve in the last part of the season. In fact the opposite. Many of our players regressed. Our line ups were inconsistent and it was hard to see a game plan or a vision.

So far Ole Gunnar don’t send the right signals to his doubters. His actions is not in line with his talks. That’s a problem that will affect our chances to attract better players on the transfer market.

He was interim manager for 4 of the 6 months in charge. How much of his talk could he have baked up with actions with he didn't have the authority to do so?
Woodward is the only one will affect our ability to sign top players.

 

[crossy1686]

It's a shame all these other "Fans" don't also support a lower league team.
I have Wycombe Wanderers to help this balance.

That Moyes season? Disaster right, 7th place, oh no!

No, Wycombe started the last day of the season in 23rd place in league 2 - and relegation would most likely have seen us go bust.
Now that was almost a disaster.

United will always come back with their money - I never worry "too much" about United, versus my other boys.

A bit of course, as it's hard to see us overhauling City anytime soon for instance (I really don't think we're miles off Arse n Chelsea even now)

But I then think back to 2003 or 04, when Chelsea looked an absolute animal. They never seemed to concede a goal, let alone not win. Yet that era passed.

It's all relative I guess. I started following a Swedish team when I moved out here, they're the only team in the league to rely solely on youth players so as you can imagine, they're shit relegation fodder most of the time.

Agree though, United, as long as they have the money available will always be able to stay relevant, which is our only saving grace at the moment. It could be worse, we could be Milan...

I think we'll get top 4 next year, Chelsea have a ban, Arsenal have £50m to spend and I can see Tottenham having to sell players to buy new ones. As long as United recruit well this summer we should be in good stead for the coming season.

As soon as the football starts again people will calm down, until we lose again that is...

 

[Sandikan]

It's all relative I guess. I started following a Swedish team when I moved out here, they're the only team in the league to rely solely on youth players so as you can imagine, they're shit relegation fodder most of the time.

Agree though, United, as long as they have the money available will always be able to stay relevant, which is our only saving grace at the moment. It could be worse, we could be Milan...

I think we'll get top 4 next year, Chelsea have a ban, Arsenal have £50m to spend and I can see Tottenham having to sell players to buy new ones. As long as United recruit well this summer we should be in good stead for the coming season.

As soon as the football starts again people will calm down, until we lose again that is...

City and Pool look hard to get ahead of, but the rest, yes, no reason we can't get ahead of them.
Then that's something to build from.

The media always likes to depict us as struggling for targets for some reason. That fuels all of our paranoia.

 

[fergiesarmy1]

Our squad isn’t good enough. We’re unbalanced, lack quality and have to many underachievers but to say the manager isn’t part of the problem is naive. We didn’t improve in the last part of the season. In fact the opposite. Many of our players regressed. Our line ups were inconsistent and it was hard to see a game plan or a vision.

So far Ole Gunnar don’t send the right signals to his doubters. His actions is not in line with his talks. That’s a problem that will affect our chances to attract better players on the transfer market.

I may be wrong but my hope is he let most of them dig their own graves.

 

[Rusholme Ruffian]

Then we'll disagree.

Never intended to cause any offence and I will apologise to @Rafaeldagold if necessary but my point stands. You would have a very different perspective on just how difficult management at this level can be if you have any management experience to fall back on. I understand that people are upset and angry about the way things currently but the manager isn't the issue, not today anyway.

You seem more upset and angry than anyone else!

 

[dove]

It's a shame all these other "Fans" don't also support a lower league team.
I have Wycombe Wanderers to help this balance.

That Moyes season? Disaster right, 7th place, oh no!

No, Wycombe started the last day of the season in 23rd place in league 2 - and relegation would most likely have seen us go bust.
Now that was almost a disaster.

United will always come back with their money - I never worry "too much" about United, versus my other boys.

A bit of course, as it's hard to see us overhauling City anytime soon for instance (I really don't think we're miles off Arse n Chelsea even now)

But I then think back to 2003 or 04, when Chelsea looked an absolute animal. They never seemed to concede a goal, let alone not win. Yet that era passed.

I support a lower league club but you must understand that we should have different expectations for Manchester United. We call ourselves as one of the biggest club in the world, some of our fans even dare to call us the biggest club in the world but we sure as hell do not act like one. We let mediocrity be completely acceptable if someone is "trying hard" or "giving a crack at it". Our ultimate goal is a top 4 with a decent cup run. We invented excuses why managers we hired were shite (infamous "give him at least 3 years"). If you dare to call out a player who has been shite for years you instantly get slated by top reds with nonsense like "loyal servant of the club" as if we should be thankful for them to be here. Sorry for wanting the club to be successful, I guess we should all bury our heads in the sand.

 

[SteveW]

Agree with all this, and you're right, I should really just exercise my right to use the ignore button.

I've spent much less time on the cafe recently and it's done me good. I'm generally just keeping an eye on transfers and leaving it at that. So many people just seem to want to vent right now and have no interest in being sensible, balanced or fair.

When the vibe is like that there's no real value in coming on here. I can assure you that while it may seem the cafe has lost its mind there are still plenty of sane supporters out there who just can't be bothered arguing with entitled brats on the internet.

 

[7even]

He was interim manager for 4 of the 6 months in charge. How much of his talk could he have baked up with actions with he didn't have the authority to do so?
Woodward is the only one will affect our ability to sign top players.

We can all agree that Ed Woodward is our biggest problem regarding moving forward.

Whenever you become a permanent manager you own the future. It’s your job to present a plan for this club to move forward. Ole should ASAP pitch a vision to all involved, including supporters and media, to install positivism around the club and show that he has a plan for the future. Right now nobody knows his future intentions.

Offer Juan Mata a new contract is maybe from his perspective the right thing to do but then he needs to explain his long term plan in order to avoid confusions among supporters and criticism from the media. That’s how a good leader create his own narrative and dictate the storyline.

This contract offer to Mata creates more questions then answers.

 

[Rhyme Animal]

You seem more upset and angry than anyone else!

Poster 1 - "I'm not sure OGS is the right manager for this job..."

Crossy - "You IDIOT, you childish moron. Stop complaining! NOW! AAARRRRGGGHHH"

Poster 2 - "Yeah I really think the club could've done better than Ole as a manager and his form really concerns me"

Crossy - "Grrrraaaggghhh, you KNOW NOTHING ABOUT LIFE. You're not a real fan. CALM DOWN!!!"

Poster 1 - "I'm just not seeing a good pattern in Ole's football that inspires me, and his favouring of Young, Rashford and Jones doesn't fill me with confidence"

Crossy - "CALM DOWN!!! I HATE YOU!!!

Poster 2 - "Yeah, this rebuild is a massive job... we should be looking at a top manager to conduct it"

Crossy - *existential wailing*

 

[Rusholme Ruffian]

Poster 1 - "I'm not sure OGS is the right manager for this job..."

Crossy - "You IDIOT, you childish moron. Stop complaining! NOW! AAARRRRGGGHHH"

Poster 2 - "Yeah I really think the club could've done better than Ole as a manager and his form really concerns me"

Crossy - "Grrrraaaggghhh, you KNOW NOTHING ABOUT LIFE. You're not a real fan. CALM DOWN!!!"

Poster 1 - "I'm just not seeing a good pattern in Ole's football that inspires me, and his favouring of Young, Rashford and Jones doesn't fill me with confidence"

Crossy - "CALM DOWN!!! I HATE YOU!!!

Poster 2 - "Yeah, this rebuild is a massive job... we should be looking at a top manager to conduct it"

Crossy - *existential wailing*

Once somebody starts talking about their own 'management experience' as evidence of why they know more than somebody else who they've never even met it starts to go beyond comedy and into the realms of worrying delusion!

 

[crossy1686]

You seem more upset and angry than anyone else!

Not at all as it happens. You are yet to contribute something to the discussion.

 

[crossy1686]

Once somebody starts talking about their own 'management experience' as evidence of why they know more than somebody else who they've never even met it starts to go beyond comedy and into the realms of worrying delusion!

Never said any of those things so let's not go down the road of making stuff up to support an argument, there's enough of that going round. This seems to have struck a nerve with you also for some reason?

 

[soaphroniscuss]

It’s not my job to scour the world for managerial talent..we can definitely do better

Some people find this very difficult to understand.

 

[soaphroniscuss]

Absolutely. Once he's had a preseason and changed some players he will need to perform. I've certainly not seen enough to make any decisions on him one way or another.

There are a few people here that seem to want him sacked right now though which is stupid.

No he will not. The excuses are already locked and loaded.

"It's the lazy players".
"He needs time".
"It's a huge job".
"The board didn't get him the players he wanted".

etc

 

[crossy1686]

Poster 1 - "I'm not sure OGS is the right manager for this job..."

Crossy - "You IDIOT, you childish moron. Stop complaining! NOW! AAARRRRGGGHHH"

Poster 2 - "Yeah I really think the club could've done better than Ole as a manager and his form really concerns me"

Crossy - "Grrrraaaggghhh, you KNOW NOTHING ABOUT LIFE. You're not a real fan. CALM DOWN!!!"

Poster 1 - "I'm just not seeing a good pattern in Ole's football that inspires me, and his favouring of Young, Rashford and Jones doesn't fill me with confidence"

Crossy - "CALM DOWN!!! I HATE YOU!!!

Poster 2 - "Yeah, this rebuild is a massive job... we should be looking at a top manager to conduct it"

Crossy - *existential wailing*

When this coming season falls apart, be it in August or later, the excuses for Ole you can basically guarantee will be the following...

1. He didn't get what he wanted in the window and now needs another window.

2. *if Pogba is still here* - It's Pogba's fault that the manager is unskilled to the level required.

3. It's some other individual player's fault for 'turning the dressing room against him'. Maybe Martial. Someone who shares physical attributes of Pogba, Martial, Rom, Lingard...

Obviously, a large number of those bleating the excuses will be oppo WUMs on here pretending to be United fans - as is the case right now with a good number of the most tedious 'Ole at the wheel' brigade.

 

[Rusholme Ruffian]

Not at all as it happens. You are yet to contribute something to the discussion.

I've made my opinion clear on a few other threads (probably this one too - a lot further back).

Never said any of those things so let's not go down the road of making stuff up to support an argument, there's enough of that going round.

What does this mean then?!

Just shows your general lack of life experience and knowledge on anything thats above your station.

You would have a very different perspective on just how difficult management at this level can be if you have any management experience to fall back on.

 

[soaphroniscuss]

Pep was the manager of a reserve team, so was Zidane before they got major jobs, is that mediocre as well?

Solskjær won a first league title in the history of a club in a one team league. Just because people on here don't rate the Norwegian league doesn't mean it's not an achievement, Fergie did similar in Scotland. good managers are capable of getting average players to play beyond their means.

The argument you're using is also definitive and doesn't hold up once Solskjær wins a major trophy. People said Klopp was a cup final bottler, then he won one, so what is he now? What about Pochettino also? He's a shit manager because he hasn't won a trophy? What happens when he does? Is he still shit?

Klopp won the German Cup in 2102.

The Scottish league was very different back then. Winning in Norway and winning in Scotland (back then) are not very similar. SAF won a European CWC with Aberdeen as well, beating Real Madrid in the final and Bayern Munich in the Q/F. His achievements with Aberdeen are at a level above anything that Ole has done as a manager.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Klopp won the German Cup in 2102.

Did he?! No wonder he knew exactly which players to sign for liverpool.

 

[soaphroniscuss]

I don't have to have any insight into your life experiences. You're advocating for a manager to be sacked after a 6 month stint in charge of a team mid way through a season. That says everything about your general life experience at management.

There are no sides, I've openly said that should Solskjær lose his job next season it will be deserved, I've also said he should be given time and support to get it right. I look at things objectively but there's a couple of people in here making baseless claims.

Life experience on the bleeding edge of unfettered global competition and naked capitalism, in Sweden?

 

[soaphroniscuss]

Did he?! No wonder he knew exactly which players to sign for liverpool.

and in 2020 Ole ....

 

[nyanza]

Did he?! No wonder he knew exactly which players to sign for liverpool.

At least we know he won't be here in 2102, the cnut.

 

[SteveW]

No he will not. The excuses are already locked and loaded.

"It's the lazy players".
"He needs time".
"It's a huge job".
"The board didn't get him the players he wanted".

etc

I don't get this to be honest. It's as if you think supporters won't mind losing as long as it's with Ole. I'd imagine he'll be judged like any other manager. If it becomes apparent that he's not good enough supporters will want him gone.

The point many are making is that it's way to early to make that decision right now. He's had a great spell and a bad spell. Once he's had a preseason and made a few signings we should have a better idea of what to expect going forward. As it stands right now we just don't know. Anyone pretending they do is not worth listening to imo.

 

[soaphroniscuss]

I don't get this to be honest. It's as if you think supporters won't mind losing as long as it's with Ole. I'd imagine he'll be judged like any other manager. If it becomes apparent that he's not good enough supporters will want him gone.

The point many are making is that it's way to early to make that decision right now. He's had a great spell and a bad spell. Once he's had a preseason and made a few signings we should have a better idea of what to expect going forward. As it stands right now we just don't know. Anyone pretending they do is not worth listening to imo.

I suspect not. In fact, I am sure he will not be judged solely on his performance.

 

[JustAGuest]

I've spent much less time on the cafe recently and it's done me good. I'm generally just keeping an eye on transfers and leaving it at that. So many people just seem to want to vent right now and have no interest in being sensible, balanced or fair.

When the vibe is like that there's no real value in coming on here. I can assure you that while it may seem the cafe has lost its mind there are still plenty of sane supporters out there who just can't be bothered arguing with entitled brats on the internet.

This sums it up quite well. Let's just let them have their own echo chamber I guess.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

Have people seen this grade A idiots transfer wish list after giving contracts and captaincy to Young and Jones?

He's clueless and completely out of his depth. Club's a joke.

You should probably stop believing everything you read in the papers especially when it's coming from questionable journalists.

 

[George The Best]

I suspect not. In fact, I am sure he will not be judged solely on his performance.

If we still have any ambition this must be the sole reason for deciding if we’ve got this appointment right or wrong. There’s no room for sentiment at this level. Jury still out for me until July 1st, but I hope Ole turns this around. What really worries me is that we have a bad transfer window - then I can see all sorts of arguments taking place about who is to blame.

 

[rcoobc]

It's a shame all these other "Fans" don't also support a lower league team.
I have Wycombe Wanderers to help this balance.

That Moyes season? Disaster right, 7th place, oh no!

No, Wycombe started the last day of the season in 23rd place in league 2 - and relegation would most likely have seen us go bust.
Now that was almost a disaster.

United will always come back with their money - I never worry "too much" about United, versus my other boys.

A bit of course, as it's hard to see us overhauling City anytime soon for instance (I really don't think we're miles off Arse n Chelsea even now)

But I then think back to 2003 or 04, when Chelsea looked an absolute animal. They never seemed to concede a goal, let alone not win. Yet that era passed.

Great stuff well said

 

[fergiesarmy1]

If we still have any ambition this must be the sole reason for deciding if we’ve got this appointment right or wrong. There’s no room for sentiment at this level. Jury still out for me until July 1st, but I hope Ole turns this around. What really worries me is that we have a bad transfer window - then I can see all sorts of arguments taking place about who is to blame.

If we have a bad transfer window that’s mainly Woodward’s fault, he wants total control, he’s got it and keeps failing miserably. At the end of the day you could put anyone in as manager if you end up with virtually the same set set of players we currently have we are doomed.