Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

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Xaviboy said:
If it does go belly up for Ole and he gets sacked this season what about Luis Enrique?
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I think he'd be a good option although he'd have to walk away from the chance to take Spain to a World Cup should United want to replace Ole Gunnar Solskjaer with 'Lucho' before next year's World Cup.

Erik Ten Haag and Zinedine Zidane are other people worth considering. Ten Haag's style of play is impressive. Although that would come with another stylistic shift for United. Zidane might just fit United's squad a bit better. Does Zidane have his heart set on managing the French national team after the next World Cup though?
 
Samid said:
You're implying you've never seen a game under Ole where we've looked well drilled and coached. That's all I need to know about your crap opinions on football. I've got better things to do than waste time trying to convince the angry 'individual brilliance', 'counter attacking only' and 'no patterns of play' mob. Try watching games objectively and you'll see loads of examples of a well drilled team.
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Hahahahaha...Me thinks the lady doth protest too much...don’t like being proved completely wrong I see. No worries.

Again, i think you will find thousands of fans on here who agree that other than the way we set up to counter attack strong teams..(City,PSG,Pool,Leipzig).there is no attacking identity in this Utd team and Tuesday proved we should be pretty worried about other tactical deficiencies as well.
 
KiD MoYeS said:
Ole in or Ole out, I think the one thing we can all agree on is that he does need to deliver this season. Its only September, can we hold off on sticking the boot in on a club legend for a few more months?
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I think there is no waiting till tomorrow when you have Cristiano Ronaldo at 36. The time is today and if Ole is not the solution, then its best to invest in someone who can be. There is a multiple champions league winning manager unemployed at the moment.
 
Drainy said:
:lol:

Pep made Messi. Good one.
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That's not what I said, engage your mind please before mocking my post. Let me elaborate. Guardiola didn't 'make' Messi, he made a key decision by switching him from a RW to a central role as a false 9. It made Messi more effective than he was under Rijkkard as his offensive numbers blew up exponentially the season Pep took over.

To accommodate this positional switch he put Eto'o and Henry on the outside, which was a surprise and eventually pushed Eto'o out of the club. Pep made big changes fast, and took Barcelona to another stratosphere with Messi as his main man. Messi wasn't the talisman at Barca before Pep took over
 
This thread goes in cycles. Soon the other side will get their turn. Maybe we go on a winning streak or smash a top team or something else but their time will surely come.

Whether Ole is good enough for us to challenge I cannot say with 100% certainty because if he was good enough to take us to 3rd and 2nd given the squad then I wouldn't rule him out for being good enough to at least challenge for the league. That is the expectation I've set. And so far despite the poor performances or result in the last game, he is still on track to meet my expectations.
 
I Can’t wait for the next game and hopefully for the latest wave of negativity to pass so it can be enjoyable to post on here again!

Were we terrible the last night? So bad. Probably the worst game of Oles tenure

But

We have to move forward either way. 3 points against West Ham away would be sweet and 3 historically potential banana skin away fixtures out of the way with a fairly decent return. More fitness and familiarity and onto the next. Hopefully Ole solidifies the midfield again and we will be fine. Grinding out results is ok while we tinker and try to find the balance between attack and defence again. The balance will tip in our favour more often than not with the quality that we have. When we open up and go end to end it could genuinely finish any score and with Matic and Pogba or Pogba Fred we don’t offer the defenders enough protection consistently to not get suckered. We need to start ruthlessly controlling games like the favourites and be aggressive and professional and set the solid platform for our attackers to do the damage.
 
United in sin said:
That's not what I said, engage your mind please before mocking my post. Let me elaborate. Guardiola didn't 'make' Messi, he made a key decision by switching him from a RW to a central role as a false 9. It made Messi more effective than he was under Rijkkard as his offensive numbers blew up exponentially the season Pep took over.

To accommodate this positional switch he put Eto'o and Henry on the outside, which was a surprise and eventually pushed Eto'o out of the club. Pep made big changes fast, and took Barcelona to another stratosphere with Messi as his main man. Messi wasn't the talisman at Barca before Pep took over
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That's literally what every manager does. You introduce a young striker out wide and as they mature move them central so they can be more productive.

Messi was an inevitable figure in the history of the game whether Pep was there or not. Its disingenuous and pathetic to wank off Pep by crediting him with Messi's rise.
 
Karlos PFC said:
I'm over it mate but I wasn't suggesting to go and get Klopp or Pep. The discussion was about why do we keep insisting on an experiment when our most hated rivals went for managers who know how to coach a team that's all.
And your answer was "go and support PSG then..."
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We came 3rd and 2nd in the toughest league in world football and are currently top and you want the manager out. It's laughable. Who on earth sacks a manager sitting top after 4 games? This fan base are like kids who got 10 toys at Xmas but wanted 11 so throw a tantrum.

I think you need to get used to the idea that we won't win every game and we will drop silly PTS every now and then. The most stupid thing this week has been the over reaction by people. We lost mainly due to the fact we had ten men let's be honest. We were never losing that game 11 v 11. Never in a million years.

I blame AWB far more than I blame Ole for some questionable subs. That needless challenge by AWB put us under enormous pressure.

Bad day at the office. Still think we will qualify from the group and hope we bounce back this weekend.
 
Castia said:
Make or break this season for Ole. I’m not sure a 4th place finish would keep him in the job he needs to be winning a trophy and challenging for the title with that squad.
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The depressing this is that it probably would keep him in the job, even though it shouldn't.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
What you call toxicity may be level-headed logic to others, and what you think is level-headed support may be head-in-the-sand ignorance to others. Many watch our football and find that in itself the cause of negativity, so it's only natural for them to vent here, thereafter. If you're asking them to not support the club, I doubt that's something they want to do.
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Good post this.
 
I'm not interested in the Ole in or out discussions but for the record I still want him to stay, the club and our results evolve better with stability. (to a certain point)

With that said I think it's clear for everybody to see that aftyer three seasons we still have more or less issues with;

a) our build up play (slow)
b) keeping ball possession where we create chances because of a good game plan and of tactical smartness
c) the problem when inferior tactical instructions make our level of game quality drops in and between our matches. Thats a sign of bad coaching.
d) no plan B or C

Ole needs to adress these problems. If we lack knowledge, experience or whatever just deal with it and find solutions. Against Young Boys it was pain full to watch us play after the red card. What the hell was our coaching staff thinking?

Be man enough and identify your weaknesses and correct them asap. That's what successfull leaders do.
 
7even said:
I'm not interested in the Ole in or out discussions but for the record I still want him to stay, the club and our results evolve better with stability. (to a certain point)

With that said I think it's clear for everybody to see that aftyer three seasons we still have more or less issues with;

a) our build up play (slow)
b) keeping ball possession where we create chances because of a good game plan and of tactical smartness
c) the problem when inferior tactical instructions make our level of game quality drops in and between our matches. Thats a sign of bad coaching.
d) no plan B or C

Ole needs to adress these problems. If we lack knowledge, experience or whatever just deal with it and find solutions. Against Young Boys it was pain full to watch us play after the red card. What the hell was our coaching staff thinking?

Be man enough and identify your weaknesses and correct them asap. That's what successfull leaders do.
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I think everyone sees it this way, the problem is some people think he's incapable of solving it (which if we're honest he has isn't a bad guess as he's been here long enough), and some are willing to give more time.

I believe Ole is suffering from succeeding a host of managers that drained the fan base. We can say folks are being impatient, but #1 Ole has been here for many years, and #2 we've been going through this for nigh a decade.

From my perspective I don't think Ole's football has changed since he's started here. He's just gotten better players, but even they can't mask the deficiencies.
 
tenpoless said:
At least one of them should be replaced. Have been here longer than Ole, under different managers and theres nothing special about the result of their work.
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Why should they? Unhappy with the results? Is a second place last season an underachievement in your opinion? Don´t want to see what they can do this season, as least as long as we are sitting on top of the league?
 
Dve said:
Why should they? Unhappy with the results? Is a second place last season an underachievement in your opinion? Don´t want to see what they can do this season, as least as long as we are sitting on top of the league?
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Not results. They were here with Jose and now with Ole and we see the same problems. If they're the ones fully responsible for coaching the players as the tweet suggested... then they're not doing very well. Because the teams we've had didn't seem to know how to control the midfield and right now it's the same problem.
 
Dve said:
Why should they? Unhappy with the results? Is a second place last season an underachievement in your opinion? Don´t want to see what they can do this season, as least as long as we are sitting on top of the league?
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Ole lucked out last season with Chelsea and Liverpool being in shambles for differing reasons. I predicted long ago that it would be a reality check for us once they got their shit together, and that's what is going to happen unfortunately. We aren't going to finish above City, Chelsea or Liverpool playing like this.
 
padzilla said:
I said this squad, as in THIS squad, not the one from five years ago.
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And I'm saying the side 5 years ago was as strong as the one now (relative to the opponents - as in the base was then lower), and we finished 6th.

People like to think that top 4 is a given for strong sides, however, we have seen in the past things not going exactly as per the plan
 
Andrew7582 said:
Ole lucked out last season with Chelsea and Liverpool being in shambles for differing reasons. I predicted long ago that it would be a reality check for us once they got their shit together, and that's what is going to happen unfortunately. We aren't going to finish above City, Chelsea or Liverpool playing like this.
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So he should be sacked, not based on results, but on your personal expectations for this season. Got you.
 
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Rash Decision said:
I certainly hope you're right. Based on current evidence I think we lack midfielders with the required balance of workrate, defensive awareness, and passing ability, especially if we want to play Pogba and Bruno together. But I share the hope that with a robust system, they can be coached to perform well enough against the weaker teams. It's just the fact that we've still seen no sign of it till now that makes me pessimistic. Of course Ole still deserves a little more time though.
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I absolutely agree that we require midfielders with the attributes you describe. And I can understand people being pessimistic about Ole's long-term credentials in the job. I think that's a reasonable stance to take.

But I think this season will likely define Solskjaer's tenure at the club. But at this early stage of the season he's doing fine and we're in a good position still.
 
Dve said:
So he should be sacked, not based on results, but on your personal expectations for this season. Got you.
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People keep bringing up the second place finish while ignoring the context. The writing is on the wall in terms of how this season is going to go and the club should be getting ahead of the problem by sounding out candidates for the job instead of burying their heads in the sand. The way we play and this standard of coaching isn't going to take us to the top so if that's what the goal is then changes are going to have to be made sooner or later. Preferably sooner so that we don't waste the prime years of the world class players that we have, leading to the next manager having another rebuild on his hands. Either you believe that Ole is the man to win us a major titles or you don't, if you don't then why would you keep him any longer?
 
Andrew7582 said:
People keep bringing up the second place finish while ignoring the context. The writing is on the wall in terms of how this season is going to go and the club should be getting ahead of the problem by sounding out candidates for the job instead of burying their heads in the sand. The way we play and this standard of coaching isn't going to take us to the top so if that's what the goal is then changes are going to have to be made sooner or later. Preferably sooner so that we don't waste the prime years of the world class players that we have, leading to the next manager having another rebuild on his hands. Either you believe that Ole is the man to win us a major titles or you don't, if you don't then why would you keep him any longer?
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Because managers are judged on results, and because you don´t get the sack if the results are good - unless you are a complete arse and causes uproar in the dressing room. If we in the end of the season look back and are unhappy with the results, then ok, there is a discussion to be had, but not after 4 games - and especially not when we´re in top of the table.
 
Ole has done well to build a squad that looks like it can challenge for major titles.

And in that sense he's made the rod for his own back even longer and heavier. Because Ronaldo is on a timer, while Pogba and Bruno are not going to hang around if the manager and coaching department aren't good enough.

This is getting to that situation wise people have spoken of for years now. Ole has had 3 years to build a squad that looks capable of competing again. And he's done a decent job, at least with the incoming players if not the deadwood. All credit to him for that. And now we find someone who knows what they're doing at the sharp end of these competitions, which Ole clearly does not.
 
Dve said:
Because managers are judged on results, and because you don´t get the sack if the results are good - unless you are a complete arse and causes uproar in the dressing room. If we in the end of the season look back and are unhappy with the results, then ok, there is a discussion to be had, but not after 4 games - and especially not when we´re in top of the table.
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You make a fair point in terms of not sacking him this early in the season, but then you go on to say that you'd give Ole the whole season! If Chelsea had done that they wouldn't have won the CL, we need to be more proactive then that like other elite clubs are. Like the poster above said the timer is ticking down on our best players careers, some people act as if we have all the time in the world. A lot of people on this forum only seem to care about the current manager with no regard for the next one who will have to clean up the mess left by the previous one who has wasted the prime years of our best players. How about making the job easier for the next manager that comes in?
 
Mentality Monsters said:
Ole - "we want Jesse here for the long term"

He really, really doesn't help himself.
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I'm sure some expert here will explain how Ole is actually playing 3D chess and doesn't really intend on keeping Lingard. Then when the extension is announced, it'll be hailed as a brilliant move to "protect his value".
 
It's a fascinating situation really. It's possible he only has five games left as a Champions League level manager (because we fail to qualify, he gets sacked and no other club at that level gives him a job).

It's also possible he wins us league title number 21, things snowball and he's here 15+ years winning loads of silverware.

In a way neither situation would surprise me, but I'm fairly certain that we have reached crunch time, one way or the other.

I still hope this is the year where everything goes right for us and proves to be the start of the next golden era.
 
Big Ben Foster said:
I'm sure some expert here will explain how Ole is actually playing 3D chess and doesn't really intend on keeping Lingard. Then when the extension is announced, it'll be hailed as a brilliant move to "protect his value".
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And then absolutely nobody will bid for him and we’ll end up paying him £120k/w for four (+1) years of the exact same we’ve seen from him over the past four years.

We’re too sentimental as a club. Should’ve cashed in on Tuanzebe when Villa were promoted as well. Have Liverpool regretted selling any of their 5-6 talented youngsters that have fetched them upwards of £100m?
 
Andrew7582 said:
You make a fair point in terms of not sacking him this early in the season, but then you go on to say that you'd give Ole the whole season! If Chelsea had done that they wouldn't have won the CL, we need to be more proactive then that like other elite clubs are. Like the poster above said the timer is ticking down on our best players careers, some people act as if we have all the time in the world. A lot of people on this forum only seem to care about the current manager with no regard for the next one who will have to clean up the mess left by the previous one who has wasted the prime years of our best players. How about making the job easier for the next manager that comes in?
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We don´t need a next manager if Ole does well. And no, I did not mean to say that he should be given the whole season what ever happens, of course not.
 
hobbers said:
Ole has done well to build a squad that looks like it can challenge for major titles.

And in that sense he's made the rod for his own back even longer and heavier. Because Ronaldo is on a timer, while Pogba and Bruno are not going to hang around if the manager and coaching department aren't good enough.

This is getting to that situation wise people have spoken of for years now. Ole has had 3 years to build a squad that looks capable of competing again. And he's done a decent job, at least with the incoming players if not the deadwood. All credit to him for that. And now we find someone who knows what they're doing at the sharp end of these competitions, which Ole clearly does not.
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To be fair, we have spent huge amounts of money. We should have a good squad. We should judge Ole by a normal benchmark rather than against Van Gaal (or, to a lesser extent, Mourinho) who was utterly inept at improving the squad. Of the purchases, apart from Bruno, it‘s hard to say who has outperformed expectations, while, among the squad he inherited, Shaw is the only big improvement. On the flip side, 100m has gone out of the door on a limited fullback and VDB while Martial is no better than 5 years ago ago. It’s a decent body of work but, in my opinion, it doesn’t compensate for his obvious limitations at this level compared to the managers at City, Liverpool and Chelsea. I think deep down we all know how this movie ends even if some are less willing to face up to it than others.
 
MoskvaRed said:
To be fair, we have spent huge amounts of money. We should have a good squad. We should judge Ole by a normal benchmark rather than against Van Gaal (or, to a lesser extent, Mourinho) who was utterly inept at improving the squad. Of the purchases, apart from Bruno, it‘s hard to say who has outperformed expectations, while, among the squad he inherited, Shaw is the only big improvement. On the flip side, 100m has gone out of the door on a limited fullback and VDB while Martial is no better than 5 years ago ago. It’s a decent body of work but, in my opinion, it doesn’t compensate for his obvious limitations at this level compared to the managers at City, Liverpool and Chelsea. I think deep down we all know how this movie ends even if some are less willing to face up to it than others.
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No it doesnt compensate and that's why he has to do something nobody really expects him to be capable of this season, i.e. keeping us in a title fight until the final day, or getting to the CL semi finals or beyond, to convince me he's worth a fourth full season.
 
AshRK said:
So what should he say, that Jessi is no longer in our plans and will be in reserves. That's not how a manager works. You don't want an unhappy soul with you. Yes we should have sold him this summer but to expect a manager to openly bash his player never goes well
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If a bit part player rejects you, what's the point in trying to swoon him? It comes across as weak to me. He could just say "we've offered him a contract, we'll see how it goes as the season progresses" nothing to read into.
 
SeasonTransfers in (m)Transfer out (m)Net spend (m)Manager-Manager net spend total (m)
13/14
£69.42​
£1.62​
£67.8​
Moyes-£67.8
14/15
£175.82​
£42.03​
£133.79​
LvG
15/16
£140.4​
£90.6​
£49.8​
LvG-£183.59
16/17
£166.5​
£42.53​
£123.97​
Mourinho
17/18
£178.56​
£40.95​
£137.61​
Mourinho
18/19
£74.43​
£27.5​
£46.93​
Mourinho-£308.51
19/20
£211.32​
£73.06​
£138.26​
Ole
20/21
£75.42​
£17.1​
£58.32​
Ole
21/22
£126​
£27.09​
£98.91​
Ole-£295.49

People are forgetting what a mess we were in when Ole took over. It was an ageing first XI full of psychologically broken players. Not only has he turned around the fortunes of the club as a whole, he's also turned things around the performancse of several individuals that had been alienated within the dressing room.

It's massively to Solksjaer's credit that our standards are now about winning the PL and winning the CL. He's transformed United back into being challengers again. For that alone, he's done a brilliant job at United.

Yes, he's spent money. But less than Mourinho. And probably also less than LvG too if you account for inflation since 2016. The difference is how much higher Ole has lifted expectations as a result. We've been getting significantly more bang for our back since he was appointed.

We've been on a constant upward trajectory ever since Jose was sacked. I'll continue to be on board for as long as the ascent lasts.
 
AshRK said:
So what should he say, that Jessi is no longer in our plans and will be in reserves. That's not how a manager works. You don't want an unhappy soul with you. Yes we should have sold him this summer but to expect a manager to openly bash his player never goes well
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There's a great deal of distance between openly bashing a player and trying to extend his contract, tbf. Just let it run down and let him go if we can't sell him, at this point.
 
Reports today that Ole has said United are doing everything possible to keep Lingard…

I have been Ole in up to now, but that is a sackable offence.
 
Dante said:
SeasonTransfers in (m)Transfer out (m)Net spend (m)Manager-Manager net spend total (m)
13/14
£69.42​
£1.62​
£67.8​
Moyes-£67.8
14/15
£175.82​
£42.03​
£133.79​
LvG
15/16
£140.4​
£90.6​
£49.8​
LvG-£183.59
16/17
£166.5​
£42.53​
£123.97​
Mourinho
17/18
£178.56​
£40.95​
£137.61​
Mourinho
18/19
£74.43​
£27.5​
£46.93​
Mourinho-£308.51
19/20
£211.32​
£73.06​
£138.26​
Ole
20/21
£75.42​
£17.1​
£58.32​
Ole
21/22
£126​
£27.09​
£98.91​
Ole-£295.49

People are forgetting what a mess we were in when Ole took over. It was an ageing first XI full of psychologically broken players. Not only has he turned around the fortunes of the club as a whole, he's also turned things around the performancse of several individuals that had been alienated within the dressing room.

It's massively to Solksjaer's credit that our standards are now about winning the PL and winning the CL. He's transformed United back into being challengers again. For that alone, he's done a brilliant job at United.

Yes, he's spent money. But less than Mourinho. And probably also less than LvG too if you account for inflation since 2016. The difference is how much higher Ole has lifted expectations as a result. We've been getting significantly more bang for our back since he was appointed.

We've been on a constant upward trajectory ever since Jose was sacked. I'll continue to be on board for as long as the ascent lasts.
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I repeat myself but I think we are setting the bar too low. Moyes and Van Gaal were abysmal while Mourinho was late era Mourinho. Under Ole, we have definitely done better in the transfer market but it’s more par for the course as opposed to the previous stunning levels of under- achievement and waste. It‘s not like we have been picking up the likes of Irwin or Cantona (or Andy Robertson for a more modern example) for peanuts. It’s a pass, nothing more.
 
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