Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

I see Tuchel is going to become the new enemy of the state on here, just like Poch before him. All because people have the audacity to rate him and suggest he's a better manager than Ole.

It surprises you? He basically accepted a 6-month trial at Chelsea and got his three-year deal by winning the CL and amassing more points in the league than anyone bar City. We're here discussing if we should expect from the manager of Manchester United to mount (not win, just be in the whereabouts come spring) a title challenge in his third full season at the club. Imagine, also, the backlash if Tuchel manages to win major honours with Lukaku firing on all cylinders. Not only that, when he took over, Tuchel argued that Chelsea had every right to wait and judge how well he would perform in those six months. As far as one extreme side of the debate goes, you could say Tuchel is the anti-Solskjaer.

As for the debate between Carragher and Neville, it's just a nonsensical discussion for the sake of arguing. Neville is right, of course. Neither Klopp, Pep nor Tuchel would win the title with this United side. Absolutely no chance whatsoever, zero, zilch. What he doesn't say though is that neither of them, 3 years and 400 million pounds after day one, would be relying on a midfield that consists of Fred and Mc Tominay, neither of them would be as dependent as we are now on route-one football and neither of them would not have an answer regrading which is their best-xi, if someone asked them that particular question.

 

[Mainoldo]

I don't know, man. That lineup kind of looks like a rocket.

Was trying to launch us to first.

 

[Karlos PFC]

Well go and support PSG then.

I could sort of understand people being angry at a club legend as manager who was say tenth. If you can't even support him when we come 3rd and 2nd in an incredibly tough league and are trying to push on then what kind of fan are you?

What will you be like when the next man gets no higher than 2nd place? Let's just sack everyone who doesn't come 1st. Is that what we now are?

Are you for real, what are you talking about? You think you are a bigger Man United fan than everyone else? What the hell ? How did you get promoted with views like these?

Listen man I am a Manchester United fan not a Ole fan, Jose fan or whoever the hell the manager is. If someone I feel is not up to the job then sure I'd have someone better.

Ole is here for 3,5 years and we still are getting served shit on a stick with the odd game here and there, as was the case with every manager post SAF. He hasn't implemented any particular style of football, our building from the back is dreadful, he still offers new contracts to deadwood or players that are not up to the required level like Lingard and Jones, he can't get the best out of even his own signings like VDB, we aren't consistent and never were we as long as Ole is here and you can check all 3,5 seasons(talking about highs and lows every season), he still hangs on Pogba or Bruno having a good day, after spending almost 400m you and his pals as Gary Neville claim that he needs more and the best part is that every time we will be in need of a new GK, RB, CB, CF or whatever because guess what all teams strengthen with every transfer period. We had Lukaku and he preferred Martial which is OK by me but come on man you can't claim that Chelsea are a great side that got even better by an Ole cast off.

And last but not least we fecking bottle it every time that matters (see all the semis and the EL final).

 

[Raven]

Redcafe Boom cycle is still on , I guess

Really really embarrassing stuff.

 

[bond19821982]

Really really embarrassing stuff.

Can't blame anyone for not believing though. Do you really think we will do a title challenge this year ? Honestly, I don't.

 

[Raven]

Are you for real, what are you talking about? You think you are a bigger Man United fan than everyone else? What the hell ? How did you get promoted with views like these?

Listen man I am a Manchester United fan not a Ole fan, Jose fan or whoever the hell the manager is. If someone I feel is not up to the job then sure I'd have someone better.

Ole is here for 3,5 years and we still are getting served shit on a stick with the odd game here and there, as was the case with every manager post SAF. He hasn't implemented any particular style of football, our building from the back is dreadful, he still offers new contracts to deadwood or players that are not up to the required level like Lingard and Jones, he can't get the best out of even his own signings like VDB, we aren't consistent and never were we as long as Ole is here and you can check all 3,5 seasons(talking about highs and lows every season), he still hangs on Pogba or Bruno having a good day, after spending almost 400m you and his pals as Gary Neville claim that he needs more and the best part is that every time we will be in need of a new GK, RB, CB, CF or whatever because guess what all teams strengthen with every transfer period. We had Lukaku and he preferred Martial which is OK by me but come on man you can't claim that Chelsea are a great side that got even better by an Ole cast off.

And last but not least we fecking bottle it every time that matters (see all the semis and the EL final).

2.5 years. If you don't even know how long he's been manager, is it worth reading anything you post?

 

[Raven]

Can't blame anyone for not believing though. Do you really think we will do a title challenge this year ? Honestly, I don't.

I believed before the end of the last season we'd mount a title challenge this term, one shitty result in our second game of the season won't change that.

 

[He'sRaldo]

Feels like we're right back to the Jose days, where a select few would use various excuses to defend the manager no matter what.

No need to preemptively excuse any failures. Let him work, let's see how the season plays out. We came 2nd last year and have a good enough team to win the league, so that's the expectation. Falling short will be a disappointment.

 

[Raven]

Feels like we're right back to the Jose days, where a select few would use various excuses to defend the manager no matter what.

No need to preemptively excuse any failures. Let him work, let's see how the season plays out. We came 2nd last year and have a good enough team to win the league, so that's the expectation. Falling short will be a disappointment.

Exactly, if he doesn't come very close to winning the title this year, we need to look at alternatives, all these fecking hysterics over one shitty result is mind melting.

 

[VanDeBank]

It was a lineup using the various options I had. My lineup never had Lindelof and it never excluded Sancho!

Also our current manager is literally playing Lindelof, Matic and Fred . But you are questioning my line up. Maybe just understand what the post is trying to say and if you get lost at any point..Just highlight it. I’m happy to explain my points. I can even go in-depth on why players should play where I’ve put them and where players I haven’t selected can fit in.

It’s really not complex and I don’t even believe in the formation for this team.

• Matic only played because McTominay is injured. You're aware Ole favors McTominay over Matic?
• I never mentioned Fred.
• Lindelof isn't going to be first choice. Are you aware we signed Varane?

Either Telles or Lindelof would be added to the side if we played 3-5-2. You do know what / means?

I like how you're pretending your lineup is so big brain when you didn't even include Rashford or Greenwood. Why is that? You've clearly thought this through to the point where I could study it for next 20 years and still not grasp it.

Did you simply forget Rashford and Greenwood play for United or do you not rate them and think they don't belong in a starting XI?

 

[Robbie Boy]

I believed before the end of the last season we'd mount a title challenge this term, one shitty result in our second game of the season won't change that.

Yup, said at the end of last season we would challenge this season, and I'm still of that mindset. The performance against Southampton was, to put it bluntly, fairly shite. But it's the second game of the season, so it's not the end of the world. If we're playing like that after ten games, I'll be very worried.

I'm confident when everyone is fit and firing, we'll be a good side to watch. Ole has also talked a good game this summer and I feel we'll see a-lot of improvements from him. He deserves the season to see how he fares, given his steady progress to-date. Unfortunately, awkward questions and big decisions will come into play if we look miles off challenging.

 

[Olecurls99]

Yup, said at the end of last season we would challenge this season, and I'm still of that mindset. The performance against Southampton was, to put it bluntly, fairly shite. But it's the second game of the season, so it's not the end of the world. If we're playing like that after ten games, I'll be very worried.

I'm confident when everyone is fit and firing, we'll be a good side to watch. Ole has also talked a good game this summer and I feel we'll see a-lot of improvements from him. He deserves the season to see how he fares, given his steady progress to-date. Unfortunately, awkward questions and big decisions will come into play if we look miles off challenging.

I agree wholeheartedly.

See, I'm not against reasonable questioning.

 

[Robbie Boy]

I agree wholeheartedly.

See, I'm not against reasonable questioning.

Good to hear

 

[Leftback99]

For me if we let this transfer window go by without strengthening in centre midfield he's made a mistake. It should have been priority in my view despite everyone getting over excited about Sancho and Varane. This team is hamstrung by lack of quality on the ball in CM.

As for Sunday we drew a game we did more than enough to win on the balance of chances. The reaction here has been ridiculous.

 

[Adisa]

Neither Klopp, Pep nor Tuchel would win the title with this United side

But that's not what Carragher said. The summary of what he said was that people would rate the chances of this squad winning the title better if those coaches were in charge. Think the two are different.

 

[Adisa]

I believed before the end of the last season we'd mount a title challenge this term, one shitty result in our second game of the season won't change that.

Never believed we had any chance of challenging for the title and probably why I couldn't care less about Saturday's result. A team that challenges has to consistently play better than we do.

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

But that's not what Carragher said. The summary of what he said was that people would rate the chances of this squad winning the title better if those coaches were in charge. Think the two are different.

I was talking more about Neville because Carragher basically summed up what many "Ole-outers" have been saying over the last couple of years. Neville talked about the deficiencies that still exist in the first team. He's right when he's arguing that United will soon need to break the bank for a forward. That's a problem, and it would still be one even if Klopp and Pep were at OT. What he deliberately leaves out of the equation is that, at the beginning of Solskjaer's tenure, we had a forward with similar traits to the one we seem to be after, but we used to let him warm the bench or played him as a RW in favour of a false #9. Now, we seem to be after a classic #9 again. Such discussions make sense at the beginning of a manager's tenure, not when he's already 2.5 years into the job. What Neville said can go on indefinitely... we also need a new keeper who'll be able to command his area, a RB who won't treat the ball like a hot potato, one or two ball-playing midfielders and quite possibly a winger who will be able to add width. The list can go on forever. And these are real issues that exist and will probably plague us throughout the season. And this is exactly the kind of sorting out that the aforementioned managers did without needing three seasons of rebuilding.

 

[Mainoldo]

• Matic only played because McTominay is injured. You're aware Ole favors McTominay over Matic?
• I never mentioned Fred.
• Lindelof isn't going to be first choice. Are you aware we signed Varane?

Either Telles or Lindelof would be added to the side if we played 3-5-2. You do know what / means?

I like how you're pretending your lineup is so big brain when you didn't even include Rashford or Greenwood. Why is that? You've clearly thought this through to the point where I could study it for next 20 years and still not grasp it.

Did you simply forget Rashford and Greenwood play for United or do you not rate them and think they don't belong in a starting XI?

I have no words. Clearly your just being ignorant to the team I set up. It’s fine

 

[VanDeBank]

I have no words. Clearly your just being ignorant to the team I set up. It’s fine

"I'm playing 5d chess, but you're not interested in it, even though you asked me about it, so I don't need to explain it".

How did you manage to put together a Manchester United lineup that doesn't include Rashford or Greenwood, but does include Matic, Telles and Dalot and claim to have put considerable thought into it?

I don't know whether to add or

 

[Mainoldo]

"I'm playing 5d chess, but you're not interested in it, even though you asked me about it, so I don't need to explain it".

How did you manage to put together a Manchester United lineup that doesn't include Rashford or Greenwood, but does include Matic, Telles and Dalot and claim to have put considerable thought into it?

I don't know whether to add or

Cavani Sancho
Cavani Rashford
Rashford Greenwood
Cavani Greenwood
Martial Sancho
Martial Greenwood
Martial Rashford
Greenwood Sancho
Cavani Martial

Pick one. What difference does it make

But yes If you want you can have Rashford and Greenwood in and leave Cavani and Sancho on the bench. I suppose you’d have a problem with that too. Again who’s raising these fans.

 

[Lewnited]

Only really relevant to this thread in that Solskjaer manages the team but I found it interesting.

Thought this a really good breakdown and summarises where we went wrong on Sunday pretty clearly. We've failed to move the ball well against an organised press since the Jose days, and it's something we still struggle with just as much now.

Cavani's freakish work ethic and ability to find spaces helped alleviate some of our issues last season, but more often than not our forwards spend the whole game isolated, usually only to be bailed out by Bruno or Pogba. This absolutely has to be addressed this season or we'll barely make it over the 80 point mark, let alone challenging for the title.

 

[VanDeBank]

Cavani Sancho
Cavani Rashford
Rashford Greenwood
Cavani Greenwood
Martial Sancho
Martial Greenwood
Martial Rashford
Greenwood Sancho
Cavani Martial

Pick one. What difference does it make

But yes If you want you can have Rashford and Greenwood in and leave Cavani and Sancho on the bench. I suppose you’d have a problem with that too. Again who’s raising these fans.

Why play in a way that leaves 2 class players on the bench, only to field 2 players that are completely unproven in the PL (Dalot and Telles) and a player who's only had one good game a season for the past 2 years and is on the decline (Matic)?

Surely you understand that buying a 80m winger only to sack our manager because he drew a game and replace him with a manager that doesn't use wingers is utterly moronic?

If we parted with Ole it would be a lot more sensible to bring in a manager that doesn't have a rigid system that doesnt fit our squad. Conte isn't a good fit and given his history would only be a stop gap.

We already missed the Tuchel boat, let's not do silly things because we drew a game.

I get your skepticism and I share it to a large extent, but Ole hasn't molested our squad like the previous 3 idiots in charge and the progress has been measurable.

 

[Raven]

Yup, said at the end of last season we would challenge this season, and I'm still of that mindset. The performance against Southampton was, to put it bluntly, fairly shite. But it's the second game of the season, so it's not the end of the world. If we're playing like that after ten games, I'll be very worried.

I'm confident when everyone is fit and firing, we'll be a good side to watch. Ole has also talked a good game this summer and I feel we'll see a-lot of improvements from him. He deserves the season to see how he fares, given his steady progress to-date. Unfortunately, awkward questions and big decisions will come into play if we look miles off challenging.

Don't be so reasonable, it's very unfashionable, reactionaries only please.

Never believed we had any chance of challenging for the title and probably why I couldn't care less about Saturday's result. A team that challenges has to consistently play better than we do.

Fair enough, I guess we'll have to see come the end of the season, or maybe sooner if you're right. I would point out though that our title challenge last season derailed at the same time that Pogba got injured, we've since added Sancho who should (in theory) alleviate some of the creative burden if Pogba finds himself injured again.

 

[Mainoldo]

Why play in a way that leaves 2 class players on the bench, only to field 2 players that are completely unproven in the PL (Dalot and Telles) and a player who's only had one good game a season for the past 2 years and is on the decline (Matic)?

Surely you understand that buying a 80m winger only to sack our manager because he drew a game and replace him with a manager that doesn't use wingers is utterly moronic?

If we parted with Ole it would be a lot more sensible to bring in a manager that doesn't have a rigid system that doesnt fit our squad. Conte isn't a good fit and given his history would only be a stop gap.

We already missed the Tuchel boat, let's not do silly things because we drew a game.

I get your skepticism and I share it to a large extent, but Ole hasn't molested our squad like the previous 3 idiots in charge and the progress has been measurable.

Okay. Finally a sensible response. I wasn’t indicating anything I just said it was very easy for us to switch to 352 and for us to send out a very strong team. Yes I get it would mean a lot of good talent on the bench. However we currently have Pogba, VDB, Bruno as very good midfield options and our current midfield duo is McFred. You mentioned how can we leave Rashford and Greenwood out. We could easily play Pogba Cavani and Sancho as our front 3 this season and it would equal exactly what you are concerned about.

We have great players but w very dysfunctional team which has been successful in being super safe and making sure our defence is protected in every game.

I just don’t get what’s so great that makes people afraid of change. I’m different I’m not afraid of trying to win. Which is exactly what we are doing at the moment. Creating an amazing team too scared to actually try and win a title because we don’t want to upset people.

 

[Ish]

Charrager is always spot on in these debates. He's a far superior pundit.

Gary's only comeback was "they tried with a proven manager and it didn't work" - as though you paint LVG Mourinho Tuchel Pep with the same brush.

Yea, Neville really lost me there the moment he started blabbering on about world class LvG and Jose.

 

[Ish]

Yup, said at the end of last season we would challenge this season, and I'm still of that mindset. The performance against Southampton was, to put it bluntly, fairly shite. But it's the second game of the season, so it's not the end of the world. If we're playing like that after ten games, I'll be very worried.

I'm confident when everyone is fit and firing, we'll be a good side to watch. Ole has also talked a good game this summer and I feel we'll see a-lot of improvements from him. He deserves the season to see how he fares, given his steady progress to-date. Unfortunately, awkward questions and big decisions will come into play if we look miles off challenging.

Good post. Where I am at currently as well.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

Interesting comparison

Imagine Klopp with Ole's budget.. Gharragher was spot on. Garry was talking crap.

 

[United in sin]

Never believed we had any chance of challenging for the title and probably why I couldn't care less about Saturday's result. A team that challenges has to consistently play better than we do.

I agree. To be honest I don't see us challenging for major honors while Solskjaer is at the helm.

 

[tenpoless]

Only really relevant to this thread in that Solskjaer manages the team but I found it interesting.

Michael Owen thread. Armchair manager analysis.

 

[crossy1686]

Imagine Klopp with Ole's budget.. Gharragher was spot on. Garry was talking crap.

fecking hell...

 

[Giggsyking]

Well go and support PSG then.

I could sort of understand people being angry at a club legend as manager who was say tenth. If you can't even support him when we come 3rd and 2nd in an incredibly tough league and are trying to push on then what kind of fan are you?

What will you be like when the next man gets no higher than 2nd place? Let's just sack everyone who doesn't come 1st. Is that what we now are?

He is a fan that care more about the club than a former player.
This is his 3rd season and in 3 months he will enter his 4th year as a manager. If he does not win a major title he should resign to show some respect for himself and the club that trusted him for 4 years and hundreds of millions. His fanboys can follow him if they like.

 

[Giggsyking]

I see Tuchel is going to become the new enemy of the state on here, just like Poch before him. All because people have the audacity to rate him and suggest he's a better manager than Ole.

Anyone who think Ole is on the same level or above Tuchel, should go and get his head checked.

 

[romufc]

Are you saying he's a better manager than Tuchel and Pep or what's the story here?

No, I am not saying that. It am responding to the poster that said Tuchel implemented a playing sytle and named the formation and he beat Pep twice. I mean even Ole has done that.

I know and understand a top manager gets us challenging.

 

[romufc]

"Now they play a possession-based football with more defensive discipline. They have also implemented a man-marking style." i said that, and they play like this every game.

We play counter, but are clueless against teams that sit deep. We always rely so much on individual brillance to save us in those games. If anything, it's much harder to know Ole's style than Tuchel.

Also, Tuchel inherited the same squad Lampard had. And won the UCL knocking out both Madrid teams and beating Pep in a final. Ole is still trophyless.

Ole in the games that matter, usually fail. All semi-finals lost to Pep and Frank, the europa final, and even in the UCL. We needed just 1 point in the last 2 group games and we lost both, one of those against Tuchel's PSG.

So we are clueless against teams that sit deep? but we finished second? how can a clueless team finish 2nd out of 20?

After that, you are saying games that matter, do PL games not matter against City, Chelsea and the like? We have won those games too.

Yeh, Tuchel inherited a very good team, did Ole inherit a very good team?

Can you explain what you mean by rely on individual brilliance? Because I am seing alot of Liverpool goals coming from Trent, Salah brilliance

City score loads of goals due to KDB brilliance.

The top clubs all have players with individual brilliance, which is why they win trophies. Why do you think Barca won so much with Messi? Or Real with Ronaldo?

 

[Ludens the Red]

Reading through the thread now and this is an excellent post.
When discussing how strong our rivals are, people only talk in hindsight. 10 months ago, most people here wouldn't touch virtually all of Chelsea's squad with a 40 ft barge pole if they were given to us for free. Now all of a sudden, they have this "incredible squad". The changing of the goalposts is endless.

Yeah and in all honesty if United were offered Mendy, Rudiger, Christensen, Kovacic, Alonso, a year ago, a month ago or now, I don’t think any United fans would be bending over backwards welcoming them in. For me there’s only two Chelsea players in a hypothetical world I’d want us to break our backs to get and that’s James and Kante.

 

[Robbie Boy]

No, I am not saying that. It am responding to the poster that said Tuchel implemented a playing sytle and named the formation and he beat Pep twice. I mean even Ole has done that.

I know and understand a top manager gets us challenging.

Fair enough.

 

[romufc]

Fair enough.

I do know our manager's deficiencies however some of the criticism is unfair on him IMO.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Yeah and in all honesty if United were offered Mendy, Rudiger, Christensen, Kovacic, Alonso, a year ago, a month ago or now, I don’t think any United fans would be bending over backwards welcoming them in. For me there’s only two Chelsea players in a hypothetical world I’d want us to break our backs to get and that’s James and Kante.

I think if we swapped Kante for one of our CMs we’d go from having a worse squad than Chelsea to a better one.

 

[Dr. StrangeHate]

No, I am not saying that. It am responding to the poster that said Tuchel implemented a playing sytle and named the formation and he beat Pep twice. I mean even Ole has done that.

I know and understand a top manager gets us challenging.

Beating Pep in a knockout match vs a league match is quite different.

 

[VanDeBank]

Beating Pep in a knockout match vs a league match is quite different.

Because one match is for the league and the other is for a cup?