I'd be happy if more Poch rumours keep surfacing, shows we being proactive. Highly doubt Eds doing something though. We are a reactive club, decisions before it's too late, but in Oles case too early.
Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion
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Look at it this way. Whether or not the plan is to let Ole go in the summer it's still in the club's best interest to say he stays or the players stop trying and the wheels fall off completely. Maybe moaning Gary neville does another impassioned rant like he did for Jose, the twat
At least Arsenal used to consistently finish top 4 back then!
We were disappointed with 2nd under Mourinho only a few years ago, now we're content with finishing 6th, with the majority of the fan base supportive, in total belief we're progressing..?
Think of how low we we're perceived to be in Mourinho's last season... our record is actually worse under Ole this season. Worse!
On average, you need 68 points to even finish fifth usually, with five of the last nine finishing in the 70s.
We're currently on course for a 54 points finish in the league. Wolves finished seventh just last year with 57.
So surreal.
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That tweet about top 6 being safety for this guy better not be true. This club is killing me
How the feck can top 6 be the expectation after £200m spent?
Makes me fecking sick.
Makes me fecking sick.
Mourinho delivered some cups and together with his track record and pedigree was able to survive.
He was then sacked when it became clear he wouldn't finish in 4th (in 6th place 11 points off the 4th). Poor comparison.
All these comparisons to Kopp seem irrelevant since Kopp turned down the United job in 2017. Do you really think Pep or ZZ would take the United job?
Most of the folks posting here would like to see OGS fired and replaced tomorrow if not sooner. If that was done, that would give us six managers in six years and eight months. This is a club in desperate need of stability.
I was not in favor of the interm appointment of OGS nor was I in favor of his permanent appointment based on lack of experience. From my perspective he has done a reasonable job having been dealt a terrible hand. The team he was handed to begin the current season had one proven Premier League CM. and Pogba, who was also the team's best player, has been out injured for almost a whole season. Under OGS' management Fred and McT are now clearly Premier League quality. But OGS has been forced to field a team with at best one to two CM's short and zero attacking CMs. United doesn't have the players to break down defensive teams. Hopefully, Bruno will fix that.
I'd like to see how OGS does with the full complement of three CMs which we will not have until either Pogba or McT return. In the meantime he is going to have to field a team without his three best players . That's going cripple any team in the Premier League. Meanwhile, all OGS can do is to try to develop the players he has. To date six players have made significant improvements under his management. At the end of the season take a hard look at how OGS has done with a full central midfield. Make an informed decision.
I'm not sure what highly credentialed manager would take the Manchester United helm. As explained by Woodward, the manager merely makes a recommendation for players to a committee of which he is a member. Woodward carries out the committee's recommendations to the extent that he has approved funding. Unfortunately Woodward lacks a football background and can apparently only work on only one possible trade at a time and in an extremely protracted manner. Maybe a highly qualified manager could work around those job limitations but that's what JM was and he said his job title should be changed from manager to coach since he has no control over transfers. My guess is JM looked at his situation and engineered his exit in a way that didn't cost him his exit fees. I doubt that top rated international managers are falling all over themselves to get the United job.
As to who cares about net. If you bought a new car every year for 30,000 while selling your one year old car for 20,000, that would cost you 10,000 a year. You can go on thinking it is costing you 30,000 a year if you want but you'd be wrong.
As to Herrera's valuation it's just conjecture absent an actual transfer price. I find the "transfer market" site's valuations to be frequently wrong. A 20,000 valuation for Herrera is a Championship League player evaluation like James. Apparently United's enlightened CEO agreed with that valuation and that's why he let Herrera go for nothing leaving a huge hole in central midfield.
Most of the folks posting here would like to see OGS fired and replaced tomorrow if not sooner. If that was done, that would give us six managers in six years and eight months. This is a club in desperate need of stability.
I was not in favor of the interm appointment of OGS nor was I in favor of his permanent appointment based on lack of experience. From my perspective he has done a reasonable job having been dealt a terrible hand. The team he was handed to begin the current season had one proven Premier League CM. and Pogba, who was also the team's best player, has been out injured for almost a whole season. Under OGS' management Fred and McT are now clearly Premier League quality. But OGS has been forced to field a team with at best one to two CM's short and zero attacking CMs. United doesn't have the players to break down defensive teams. Hopefully, Bruno will fix that.
I'd like to see how OGS does with the full complement of three CMs which we will not have until either Pogba or McT return. In the meantime he is going to have to field a team without his three best players . That's going cripple any team in the Premier League. Meanwhile, all OGS can do is to try to develop the players he has. To date six players have made significant improvements under his management. At the end of the season take a hard look at how OGS has done with a full central midfield. Make an informed decision.
I'm not sure what highly credentialed manager would take the Manchester United helm. As explained by Woodward, the manager merely makes a recommendation for players to a committee of which he is a member. Woodward carries out the committee's recommendations to the extent that he has approved funding. Unfortunately Woodward lacks a football background and can apparently only work on only one possible trade at a time and in an extremely protracted manner. Maybe a highly qualified manager could work around those job limitations but that's what JM was and he said his job title should be changed from manager to coach since he has no control over transfers. My guess is JM looked at his situation and engineered his exit in a way that didn't cost him his exit fees. I doubt that top rated international managers are falling all over themselves to get the United job.
RAB let me enlighten you. Pounds (£) and euros (€) are not worth the same amount. By today's exchange rate a £ is worth 1 and a € is worth .85 I used the £ symbol to indicate I was reporting pounds. You used the € symbol to report euros. And by today's exchange rate the 120 million £ I reported is worth the exact amount you reported in euros of €142 million. It's not hard.Arrivals sum: €214.00m
Departures sum: €71.98m
Arrivals - departures = €142.02m
Black and white.
And 40 million for Herrera...Even your own link has Herrera down as a market value of €20m but don't let that stop your Dougy. Who gives a feck about NET anyway? Ole has gotten rid of a striker he didn't want and saw as nothing more than a backup and has spent €214m.
As to who cares about net. If you bought a new car every year for 30,000 while selling your one year old car for 20,000, that would cost you 10,000 a year. You can go on thinking it is costing you 30,000 a year if you want but you'd be wrong.
As to Herrera's valuation it's just conjecture absent an actual transfer price. I find the "transfer market" site's valuations to be frequently wrong. A 20,000 valuation for Herrera is a Championship League player evaluation like James. Apparently United's enlightened CEO agreed with that valuation and that's why he let Herrera go for nothing leaving a huge hole in central midfield.
fecking hell @Douglas Crockett you’re not very good at this.
No, Klopp didn’t turn down the United job in 2017 for fecks sake
Another corker from @Douglas Crockett, no mate, it’d be 5 managers in six years and eight months.
If you wanna include Fergie you'd need to add a couple of decades onto that as you can't use a long serving managers final day in a 27 year spell to try and include him in an argument about instability, obviously. The "instability" started when Fergie left, not whilst he was here.
So yes, 4 managers currently in 6 years 8 months. Insane amount of patience really if you consider how wank we've been since SAF left.
We've done this before though when I showed you that since June 2013 the following clubs and their managers:
Madrid x 6 (Zidane is 2 of the 6)
Bayern x 5
Chelsea x 5
Barcelona x 4
United x 4
PSG x 3
Juventus x 3
All those clubs have been more successful in that time (and aside from Chelsea much more successful) which throws your stability argument out of the window.
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Ah so you just made it up instead. Nice
Net is a wank way to judge managers, we laughed at Liverpool for it for years. Ole didn’t even want Lukaku for God’s sake so got rid of a player he didn’t want and added 70 ish mil to his kitty to buy players he did want.
Now if he was forced to say, sell Pogba, a player he desperately wanted, I’d buy your argument, but he didn’t. He got rid of a player he didn’t fancy one bit and then went and spent now €214m Euros on players he does like. Simples.
Transfermarkt should always be viewed in euros as that is the currency of the site, it was 120m pounds when you looked because that was the day’s exchange rate. But always use Euros or you’ll end up with a completely different number in pounds next time you look.
Try Googling "Kopp turned down Manchester United job." I found six articles reporting that this happened and that's just on the first page. Six more on the second page. Turns out it happened in 2015.fecking hell @Douglas Crockett you’re not very good at this.
No, Klopp didn’t turn down the United job in 2017 for fecks sake
Here is the Manchester Evening News
Why Liverpool FC boss Jurgen Klopp rejected Manchester United managerial job
https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...ll-news/man-utd-news-liverpool-klopp-17076813
Yeah I don't need to google it, that's why I laughed at you for being so misinformed, he was Liverpool manager in 2017 so obviously we weren't offering him the fecking job then
And you've seriously posted a Robbie Fowler piece? hahah my God the depths you'll drop to. Fowler is full of shit there by the way, LVG had just qualified us for the Champions League and had spent a shit tonne in the Summer, we absolutely we not offering Klopp the job when he went to Liverpool, that is utter bollocks that not even Klopp himself has said, just Fowler trying to make out Klopp chose Liverpool when in reality Liverpool were his only real option at that point.
It wasn't 2015 either, it was firstly when SAF retired in 2013 and again when we ended up signing LVG. In 2013 we looked like a well run club and biggest in the World, so how does that fit into your narrative Dougy?
Around that time Klopp turned down Madrid, United, Chelsea (I believe), PSG because of one reason, stated by himself many times throughout his career, he doesn't break contracts, never has, never will.
If United, Chelsea or Madrid came in for him when he left Dortmund the story would likely have been very different. Fortunately for Liverpool though, they pretty much had a clean run at him.
Here's a wee piece not peddled by biased Liverpool loving Robbie Fowler in the shitty evening news: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/10/12/jurgen-klopp-turned-chance-manage-man-utd/
League Cup.
@Fooza... often true, but we defo sounded out Mourinho as early as January with LVG still in charge so, you have some hope
The Ole out vs Ole in argument reminds me of Atheist vs Hardcore believers
Ferguson retired May 19, 2013. That was six years, 8 months, and 20 days ago.
1) SAF
2) Moyes
3) LVG
4) JM
5) OGS
6) replacement
What I said was that if OGS was fired and replaced tomorrow that would make six managers within six years and eight months. I don't see what the problem is. Is it the 20 days?
We've done this shit argument before.
You want to show that the club has been unstable, how the feck does Sir Alex Ferguson come into that argument? The club became unstable the day Sir Alex left, 19th May 2013, since then we've had 4 managers.
Either that or it's the following:
In 33 years, 3 months, 3 days we've had 5 managers.
1) SAF
2) Moyes
3) LVG
4) Mourinho
5) Ole
Surely you see how fecking stupid that is?
Lots of successful clubs as I showed you have had more or equal the amount of managers in the past 6 years 8 months, we've had 4 and we've been wank, we show plenty of patience to our managers, many would argue too much. The likes of Bayern stay successful by recognising asap that they've made a shit decision, we let said shit manager spend a feck tonne of money, stay 2 years and then fire him. Stupidity at it's finest.
Or if you're not showing we're unstable, why the feck are you including Sir Alex, Manchester United manager of 27 years, what is your point then Doug?
Poch is coming, the only way Ole survives if he does something he's not been able to do since he was officially named manager, and that's go on a consistent winning run. He's finished come the end of the season.
I tend to agree. If he fecks it up with recent additions, he is gone come summer and rightfully so.
I feel Ole won’t last into next season because I’ve not seen enough consistency in this team to make his job safe.
Top 4 is not going to happen unless we go on a run we haven’t seen since he took the job permanently. Top 6 finish is more than achievable but would that be enough? We’d need to play some really Gucci football between now and the end of the season to make the board think he was on the right track.
Winning the EL will keep him in a job, and rightly so, but an FA cup win may not be enough - unless it ties in with improved style of play and top 6 or better.
Players coming back from injury and with the new additions, I’m hopeful we can kick in and score some more goals. Goals create confidence and that is what the team lacks. The football has been poor recently but we are almost there.
Sadly, I don’t see Pogba playing for us again but the rest of the team is more than capable to get the results for him to keep his job.
Top 4 is not going to happen unless we go on a run we haven’t seen since he took the job permanently. Top 6 finish is more than achievable but would that be enough? We’d need to play some really Gucci football between now and the end of the season to make the board think he was on the right track.
Winning the EL will keep him in a job, and rightly so, but an FA cup win may not be enough - unless it ties in with improved style of play and top 6 or better.
Players coming back from injury and with the new additions, I’m hopeful we can kick in and score some more goals. Goals create confidence and that is what the team lacks. The football has been poor recently but we are almost there.
Sadly, I don’t see Pogba playing for us again but the rest of the team is more than capable to get the results for him to keep his job.
He’s going regardless. Don’t see any truth in this top 6 stuff. He’s not going to improve results until the end of the season and even his most loyalists will lose faith.
What do you think happens if we slide down to a mid-table finish, but somehow fluke a EL win? Does Ole keep his job despite the league season proving he's not good enough, do they keep him on after winning a European trophy and ultimately acheiving the goal of CL qualification?
League Cup.
But far more important ways finishing 2nd with 81 points in his 2nd season remember.
Wasn’t sure where to write this, but have you seen our goals of the month (for the season) that United put out on social media?
3 out of the 6 goals are deflected. You gotta laugh.
3 out of the 6 goals are deflected. You gotta laugh.
Chelsea have won 2 league titles. That is much more succesfull.
This really. The Ole in brigade keep out making "alternative" facts or pulling lies out of their arse. Another thing is calling people who want Ole sacked haters. No, I don't hate Ole. He's a player legend and seems like a nice guy. I just want a far more qualified manager managing Man Utd. It's really not hard to understand is it? We are having our worst season since the PL began. There is very little to defend really other than we have been unlucky with injuries to key players and that's it really.
When someone says the word "hater" their argument by default becomes null and void.
That’s the interesting scenario in my opinion. I think the club will stick with Ole if he gets CL football through the EL and a poor league finish.
If not, an Fa Cup final and to at least be in with a shout of top 4 until the last day would be the absolute minimum. I don’t see how he keeps his job with a dismal 6th or below finish.
I dont see any chance of us finishing top 6 in any case.
Not unless pogba mctominay and rashford all get back playing soon, which they wont.
Not unless pogba mctominay and rashford all get back playing soon, which they wont.
My claim has been that over the past six years and 20 days six individuals held the position of being manager of Manchester United. This is assuming that OGS is fired and replaced tomorrow. So I looked up some statistics on managerial tenure in the Premier League and reached the conclusion my claim exaggerates the appearance of instability.
RAG is looking at length of tenure which is a better approach. Assuming OGS gets fired tomorrow that would give the four managers post Ferguson an average tenure of 612 days or 1.68 years. That's pretty comparable to the 2014-15 season when the average tenure was 1.8 years. However the trend is for the length of tenure to decrease as the chart in the second sky article shows. So it's fair to conclude that today Manchester United's tenure for the last four managers is right in line with the average for the league. It's no less stable than the league as a whole.
https://www.skysports.com/football/...tenure-of-managers-in-england-just-1-23-years
https://www.skysports.com/football/...e-longest-average-tenures-in-english-football
Now Spurs finish above us I wonder what the Ole in people are going to say?
Sacked if we finish outside TOP 6? Well, that's great news. No way we are finishing 6th, more like 10th.
Good post Doug. I'm amazed someone on here has gone back and researched his point, I'm beyond impresssed.
4 years ago people were saying exactly the same thing. We are reactive so there's no way we have another manager lined up.
End in 7th. Win EL, Win Fa cup. Sack him! Dream season from this point!
Well Catt, we had Mourinho lined up early doors. So early we couldn't even give LVG a week to revel in his FA Cup win
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It was like 5 mins after the ref blew the whistle.Well Catt, we had Mourinho lines up early doors. So early we couldn't even give LVG a week to revel in his FA Cup win
Exactly
One side has facts and empirical evidence on its side, the other has blind faith, magical thinking, and constantly struggles to warp reality to fit a narrative.
It was like 5 mins after the ref blew the whistle.
Ruthless.
but it's the only hope I'm clinging too. That we can still be ruthless enough to have everything in place for Poch to come in and only something absolutely remarkable between now and May could change that.8th.. It is a good place for Ole, because he never dreams of top 10. His level is relegation. He is a joke and a fraud and if he is here next season we will be relegated even if we buy Messi.
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