Oil Money in Football | New City expose

In the end Tebas was the only one who denounced it publicly.

Unfortunately I think our clubs, Madrid, United, Bayern etc. were aware of the cover-up.
Maybe because they have something to hide, or because their new super league is enough reward.
Many commissions, from which all benefit. Curious too about the doped player

When we find out which of this is true or not and what follows, I think it will be interested, I think the fact the City fine was distributed between the CL clubs tells enough about where every other clubs morals lie, in particular Rummenigge. Splitting the fine between the clubs was a clear indication no one gives a feck about FFP.

The multiple CL winner is interesting, have a sneaky feeling it could be one of the big two... though it'll probably be someone who was a reserve. Pretty much has to be Real or Barca man though.
 
Not sure what all the fuss is about with 'oil money'. It's a global epidemy of fiscal tax avoidance, doping, state-funded sponsorship, children slavery and so on. Everyone watching and paying for modern football is supporting its business model and excesses.

Barcelona => Neymar transfer fraud + illegal under 18 buyings + fiscal fraud regarding its company status
Real Madrid => fraud sale of its training center to Madrid city + fiscal fraud regarding its company status
Valencia, Hercules, Eiche => fraud loans from Valencia community
Bilbao, Osasuna => fiscal fraud regarding their company status
FC Sevilla => illegal TPO
Real Sociedad => using tax fraud to pay players

AC Milan => illegal TPO (Pato for instance)
Juventus => doping system at club level (1996 for instance) + fixed games system (2006) + transfer fraud (for instance Pogba)

Man City => illegal TPO (Mangala for instance) + overvalued state-sponsorhip
Arsenal => offshore tax avoidance

PSG => overvalued state-sponsorship
Lille => tax fraud and offshore funds
Monaco => illegal TPO linked to Mendes
Lens => illegal transfer actions to avoid bankruptcy

FC Twente => illegal TPO

Ronaldo, Mourinho, Messi, Beckham, Platini, Alexis Sanchez, Carvalho (etc.) => tax fraud
Di Maria, Pastore => offshore money from sponsors leading to tax fraud
Higuain, Falcao (etc.) => tax fraud from transfer commissions
Mendes => tax fraud for many clients
Raiola => tax fraud
D'onofrio => illegal TPO
Zahavi => illegal TPO
Pinto da Costa => forged invoice
Doyen Sports => illegal global TPO system​


And so on. Now what's clean, fair and economically reasonnable in this sport today, who is playing by the moral, legal and financial rules ? As if none of these big worldwide corporations would mimic the financial twistings of the regular worldwide corps.

Spot on. We could add:

- France: Marseille in 1993
- Belgium: footballgate in 2018, and other scandals
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affaires_de_corruption_dans_le_football_belge
- Spain: Atletico Madrid
- Turkish and Eastern Europe clubs which do not pay wages
- ...

Regarding PSG, the contracts are legal and based on actual transaction: no fictitious nature.

The FFP has become a political way to safeguard the interests of a small circle of clubs and Tebas is one of their spokespersons. The great clubs prefer to operate behind the scenes.
 
When we find out which of this is true or not and what follows, I think it will be interested, I think the fact the City fine was distributed between the CL clubs tells enough about where every other clubs morals lie, in particular Rummenigge. Splitting the fine between the clubs was a clear indication no one gives a feck about FFP.

The multiple CL winner is interesting, have a sneaky feeling it could be one of the big two... though it'll probably be someone who was a reserve. Pretty much has to be Real or Barca man though.
Not the clubs , but the press and fans should put pressure. One thing is to have fiscal problems, and another to bribe Uefa.
About the player, possibly Real Madrid yes
 
Not the clubs , but the press and fans should put pressure. One thing is to have fiscal problems, and another to bribe Uefa.
About the player, possibly Real Madrid yes

100%. Football is rotten if this opened the can of worms and got it clean I'd be delighted.

I think its gonna be a Barca player, but wouldn't be surprised if its Real.
 
100%. Football is rotten if this opened the can of worms and got it clean I'd be delighted.

I think its gonna be a Barca player, but wouldn't be surprised if its Real.

are you willing to open that can and see Manchester City return to a secondary role?(with secondary role I mean more strict control and maybe out of C.L for a year, which I think could be your bigger problem).
Honestly I do not think it will happen, in the end there are too many interests.
I bet on Madrid because of the sentence "active player that won multiple C.L trophies"
Madrid have won 3 consecutive years, so if I had to make an advance, give a clue about the player, it seems more sensible to use that phrase to refer to a Madrid player, and not Barcelona
 
are you willing to open that can and see Manchester City return to a secondary role?(with secondary role I mean more strict control and maybe out of C.L for a year, which I think could be your bigger problem).
Honestly I do not think it will happen, in the end there are too many interests.
I bet on Madrid because of the sentence "active player that won multiple C.L trophies"
Madrid have won 3 consecutive years, so if I had to make an advance, give a clue about the player, it seems more sensible to use that phrase to refer to a Madrid player, and not Barcelona

I don't think it will happen either, if we are corrupt we should be punished, until there is evidence I choose to believe (perhaps naively to some) that we are innocent or not involved in bribery etc..

Us threatening Uefa in 2014 was something I supported at the time and still do. I actually wish we had pushed ahead and believe we could have got ffp abolished.

But... yes if we are involved in bribery then we should be punished. I'll still support the club, I did when we were in League 1 and it won't put me up or down.
 
Again you say fake sponsorships but with zero proof.

Imagine being as pig-headed as you :lol:

Here are some numbers, the jump in commercial revenue from 2009 to 2015:

Man United - 66m to 196m

Man City - 18m to 175m

Liverpool - 60m to 116m

Chelsea - 50m to 108m

Arsenal - 48m to 103m

For comparison some other top clubs in Europe's commercial revenue in 2015: Barcelona £186m, Real Madrid £188m, Bayern Munich £212m, PSG £226m

Nothing dodgy here at all folks, Man City's revenue is on par with behemoths like Barcelona, Bayern, Madrid and United in space of 6 years on top of 2 title wins. PSG are actually ahead of these giants because of 3 title wins on the trot :lol:

I really question sanity of some who genuinely believe all these sponsorships are a result of organic growth.
 
Imagine being as pig-headed as you :lol:

Here are some numbers, the jump in commercial revenue from 2009 to 2015:

Man United - 66m to 196m

Man City - 18m to 175m

Liverpool - 60m to 116m

Chelsea - 50m to 108m

Arsenal - 48m to 103m

For comparison some other top clubs in Europe's commercial revenue in 2015: Barcelona £186m, Real Madrid £188m, Bayern Munich £212m, PSG £226m

Nothing dodgy here at all folks, Man City's revenue is on par with behemoths like Barcelona, Bayern, Madrid and United in space of 6 years on top of 2 title wins. PSG are actually ahead of these giants because of 3 title wins on the trot :lol:

I really question sanity of some who genuinely believe all these sponsorships are a result of organic growth.

I don't know if you cook the books :wenger:


Forbes 2015 - top 20 most valuables clubs

Top_rich_club_forbes.png
 
On that other table you are 12th, revenue exceeds your value while only the top 4 can match it.
You don't do anything in Europe so no tv increase there while ( no offence) nobody watches French football.
That table is ridiculous. You dwarf Liverpool and Juve FFS!
 
Wow, PSG has higher match-day revenues than City and Liverpool.

Juventus is a special case: I don't think they like to pay taxes :D
 
On that other table you are 12th, revenue exceeds your value while only the top 4 can match it.
You don't do anything in Europe so no tv increase there while ( no offence) nobody watches French football.
That table is ridiculous. You dwarf Liverpool and Juve FFS!

Only one club is not sufficient to make a league very attractive globally
 
Wow, PSG has higher match-day revenues than City and Liverpool.

Juventus is a special case: I don't think they like to pay taxes :D
Do you think the leaks are true? the bribes to skip the FFP , the commissions for the world cup,etc, Or simply a campaign to discredit Infantino
 
So how can PSG justify the sponsorship increases? Its not like you're anything special in Europe.

We live in an ever-evolving world (!) and PSG is becoming a popular football club globally for diverse reasons: social media followers, famous players in key markets, shops opened...

PSG is getting a newly highly-remunerative contract with Nike for example.

That said, a part of these revenues are coming from Qatar. So, I can imagine the President Nasser Khelaifi calling his cousin or a friend of the Emir working for Qatar Tourism Authority and saying "Let's sign a sponsorship contract for 100 millions".
 
Pretty appalling theres hardly a whisper of this in british media. The comment of '1 down 6 to go' is disgusting too. A scum club who will inevitably tarnish the value of the Champions League soon
Yep. Media very quiet in the UK. The City PR companies must have quite a wide reach here and quite a large spend over the years.

Edit: By City I mean UAE FC.
 

That list actually goes against you, your revenue is higher than Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and Juventus :lol:

3 of them are giants of European Football!
 
Do you think the leaks are true? the bribes to skip the FFP , the commissions for the World Cup,etc, Or simply a campaign to discredit Infantino

Some of City's sponsorship deals are as suspect as it gets.

The bribes seem a little far-fetched but then again I wouldn't surprised to discover there is truth behind the allegations.
 
Do you think the leaks are true? the bribes to skip the FFP , the commissions for the World Cup,etc, Or simply a campaign to discredit Infantino

The leaks can be true but it could be also a campaign to foster a more strict FFP.

I think Qatar/UAE exert a lot of pressure in diverse ways but they are not stupid so they make the necessary not to be in a position to be sued.

The reality is that PSG has been punished in some years and FFP is first and foremost a political measure.

FFP make some clubs punished for being badly managed financially (accounting considerations).... or being financed by foreign States
 
That list actually goes against you, your revenue is higher than Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool and Juventus :lol:

3 of them are giants of European Football!

It is true that PSG receives a lot of money from Qatari organizations.
 
Did you guys get extra info in england? I don't remember seeing anything about bribery in our papers, i'm curious to know what proof they have.
 
That article has nothing in it whatsoever to back up the authors claims. Nothing whatsoever except him making vague assumptions with zero evidence. It's actually "I'm going to talk about Issa and link it to city for clicks".

You’re right, it doesn’t. It tells you what the evidence is(emails dumped online etc) and you can look at it for yourself. Don’t believe it if you don’t want to, that’s your choice.
 
Naive question but where is the problem?

I imagine it’s the infantio connection. Like he was pandering to the oil kingdoms, and helping them circumvent the rules instead of doing his job and being impartial. Also part ffp stats that sponsorship deals can’t be artificially inflated, which the allegations say is what happened. It would be like when city made their little video when they won the league and it had fake crowds in it, but instead of being sad it was an actual influence in their performance. While the other memebers of the top 6 can compete, it’s not very fair on other teams in the league that can’t compete with that spending.

To be honest I’ve not really been paying that much attention. Gave the whole thing a quick skim, but really if they weren’t corrupt as feck I’d be shocked.
 
You’re right, it doesn’t. It tells you what the evidence is(emails dumped online etc) and you can look at it for yourself. Don’t believe it if you don’t want to, that’s your choice.

So those emails say the club is Issa's? I suggest you read again because they don't.
 
So how can PSG justify the sponsorship increases? Its not like you're anything special in Europe.
It's investment in the club by Qatar and it is justified by the notion of "nation branding". What does that mean? It serves to build the image of the country, make it known as a diplomatic and business partner or potential touristic destination and provide a communication platform.

Concretely it shows their reliability and determination when when leading project, that may make the difference for obtaining a contract. It's one of their ways to diversify their economy for when the gas reserves run out.
It also helps them to get known to the world for what they are (good and bad sides) enough to keep their independance and discredit potential propaganda from Saudi Arabia looking for a cheap excuse to invade them to bring them to submission or to turn them into another Yemen (which is a real risk).

Finally contrary to, say, a lone shirt sponsorship, the investment in PSG grants increased visibility through thousands of press articles and hours of TV time highlighting the role of Qatar in PSG's success every year. That is definitely worth many millions.
 
Looking forward to City fans excuses for this. And how they make it an agenda against them.
 
It’s very simple what will happen. European super league will form and both city and psg will only be invited under serious regulations. The benefit of these two plastic shit houses is that nobody gives a flying feck about them so simply creating a league that doesn’t involve them harms nobody.
 
I can't help but think beyond football with this as well, take f.ex the general secretary Fatma Samoura, with a background as a diplomat and various positions within the UN, if she (and others with similarly high ranking positions through-out the world) are this relaxed about blatant corruption and bribes, what's to say they haven't been while in office in other instances? This could very well end up going way beyond football, and if there's credible threat, it seems that a lot of people should be going to jail.

For me there's no way just getting fired in shame is enough here? I am very curious as to how FIFA will respond to this, as clearly, just denying everything can not possibly work? Claiming that this is "bullshit" because the documents were stolen, screams to me of "we're only sorry because we got caught" and trying to play the victim card.
 
Have you actually read the article?

In January 2014, UEFA monitors sent auditors from PricewaterhouseCoopers (PwC) to Manchester. The result was a disaster. Fully 84 percent of "other commercial income" originated from sponsors from Abu Dhabi.:lol: According to the report, the club had hidden 35 million euros in costs from UEFA in its annual statement of accounts.

Manchester City reacted reflexively to the pressure with pressure of its own. The club put its lawyers on war footing, and almost all of its responses to UEFA reflected that aggression. "The PwC Report is seriously flawed in that it contains numerous erroneous interpretations of the Regulations, false assumptions of fact, errors of law and erroneous conclusions," read the reply. The lawyers demanded that the PwC auditors revise or delete large sections of their report. PwC refused, which further enraged the Manchester City attorneys.

In mid-March, Manchester City CEO Ferran Soriano carried out negotiations with Infantino related to the Financial Fair Play rule and threatened to challenge the Financial Fair Play rules in European Union courts. In an internal memorandum, the club's attorneys noted that if a "sensible settlement" was not reached with the Investigatory Chamber, Manchester City would "have no choice but to fight U (meaning UEFA) on all legal fronts." The club, they suggested, was expecting "a warning, but no further action."

Yet the evidence did not appear to be in Manchester City's favor. The marketing experts from Octagon, who had already issued a disastrous report card on Paris Saint-Germain at the behest of the FFP monitors, found that three of the four sponsoring contracts that Manchester City had signed with companies from Abu Dhabi were "significantly overvalued." They added that the deals, which had brought in 50 million euros in revenues, were up to 80 percent higher than their actual market value. Following an additional visit to Manchester, the PwC auditors determined that two Man City sponsors were "related parties." The same situation as with Paris Saint-Germain.

But by then, Infantino was already in the process of trying to outmaneuver the Investigatory Chamber. Together with CEO Soriano, he set up a meeting in early April between two lawyers, one representing Manchester City, the other UEFA. The two attorneys reached an agreement that the club would make a proposal for an amicable solution. It was a bit like a bank robber proposing an appropriate sentence to the prosecutor.

And City fans argued how their revenue wasn't cooked up and what a genius Soriano was :lol:
 
FFP should be chucked out all together and all clubs in UEFA competitions should only be allowed to spend, say, €100m a year on wages and another €100m on transfers net. The wealth of the club and the sources of their income shouldn’t come into it.