Not looking good for the Wii is it?

hungrywing said:
I have zero interest in video games except for Zelda, so I have no idea where the Wii is at in terms of software applications.
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It's basically the same for me these days, the only reason I bought a Wii was because of a potential future Zelda game. I loved Okami though, probably because it was basically like a Zelda game.

I constantly replay some of the older games every year as well.
 
Mozza said:
I'm sure they are devestated, they'll just have to take comfort in the billions its made them
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Weaste just strangled a small pony in envy/frustration.

So if you love ponies and/or WD (or if you don't particularly hate them) you'll do well to donate to the company that may or may not rhyme with pony.

(Don't buy anything with 'Pony' actually on it, especially if you're in a South Asian local marketplace, because none of the money actually goes to the pony that Weaste needs it to get to.)
 
The software graph is the problem, it's going into nosedive. There is very little 3rd party support, Nintendo themselves can't keep it afloat alone. As software support drops off, hardware sales will also drop off. It's ok some of you saying that they'll continue making casual dancing games, but how many of them do you need? Wii will not get close to PS2 numbers in its lifetime, Nintendo last two quarters posted losses, not profit.
 
Pretty much everyone here shares your opinion that the gimmick has played out and the famed Nintendo nonchalance with respect to outside developers has begun to rear its head.
 
:lol::lol:

Nice try Weastie old mate. Just because Nintendo released a machine that wiped the floor with all current generation machines you try to now claim it's doomed? I still don't understand you fanboys and your mentality towards any one particular company.

Oh and for all those being mislead, another year or two and you'll be seeing all new machines (or at least hearing about them) from all three (maybe four) major companies anyway.
 
Redlambs said:
Actually Sony are worse to deal with for developers. M$ are light years beyond the other two in support and tools.
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I don't know much about this stuff. Don't mind me. Normally I wouldn't clutter up the forum with this type of leads-to-nowhere posting, but I'm in a planetoid-sized procrastinative funk.
 
hungrywing said:
I don't know much about this stuff. Don't mind me. Normally I wouldn't clutter up the forum with this type of leads-to-nowhere posting, but I'm in a planetoid-sized procrastinative funk.
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Nothing wrong with entering a debate my friend! You never know, you might even educate someone or learn something yourself (though doubtful if it's Weaste doing the talking ;))
 
Redlambs said:
:lol::lol:

Nice try Weastie old mate. Just because Nintendo released a machine that wiped the floor with all current generation machines you try to now claim it's doomed? I still don't understand you fanboys and your mentality towards any one particular company.
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The figures speak clearly for themselves, their success was front loaded, the Wii has quite clearly burnt its bridges. It has nothing to do with fanboyism, other than you trying to defend an old argument with me when I told you this would happen. Just because it sold gangbuster numbers in hardware and software from the get go, does not mean that it will last, and the software sales numbers clearly show this, and almost every major 3rd party has jumped ship.

I have a fully functional SNES for god's sake, you're the arsehole here.
 
WeasteDevil said:
The figures speak clearly for themselves, their success was front loaded, the Wii has quite clearly burnt its bridges. It has nothing to do with fanboyism, other than you trying to defend an old argument with me when I told you this would happen. Just because it sold gangbuster numbers in hardware and software from the get go, does not mean that it will last, and the software sales numbers clearly show this, and almost every major 3rd party has jumped ship.
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:lol:

So a product that has been out for how many years now has sold how many units more than it's rival starts to slow in sales? HOLD THE FRONT PAGE!

You better tell the top Nintendo bods that this is all doomed and their little experiment is a failure.


For the record, it lasted a lot longer in sales terms than I ever thought it would. It must have been fuelled by all the idiots who bought it expecting it to ever be something it was never going to be ;)



I have a fully functional SNES for god's sake, you're the arsehole here.
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Do you want a cookie or something?
 
I don't think that 3rd party developers will lose interest in the Wii. 1)Because of the number of units currently in living rooms and 2)because it won't be too hard to develop exclusives for it, that uses the motion sensor.

As for future sales, I can't see them dying as you predict Weaste. I know a fair few people who don't have the first clue about gaming, wouldn't know the difference between the PS3 and the PS2 but they have either picked up a Wii or are thinking of picking one up in the future.

I bought it on release and just got bored of it soon after, played the decent titles it had out and then eventually just sold it on.
 
Redlambs said:
:lol:

So a product that has been out for how many years now has sold how many units more than it's rival starts to slow in sales? HOLD THE FRONT PAGE!

You better tell the top Nintendo bods that this is all doomed and their little experiment is a failure.

For the record, it lasted a lot longer in sales terms than I ever thought it would. It must have been fuelled by all the idiots who bought it expecting it to ever be something it was never going to be ;)
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I think that you very well know what happens when software sales start to drop off. It's not only selling less than the PS2 in terms of hardware around the same point in its life, it's dropping off rapidly in software at the same point that PS2 was increasing software sales. We know that Nintendo made profit on the hardware, and it's not surprising when you consider what it actually is inside the box, but the major profit has been from software sales, and it's dropping. XB360 and PS3 are not seeing software dropping off, it's growing, so it's something to do with the Wii specifically as a trend.

Redlambs said:
Do you want a cookie or something?
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No, it simply makes part of your argument irrelevant.
 
Devil_forever said:
I don't think that 3rd party developers will lose interest in the Wii. 1)Because of the number of units currently in living rooms and 2)because it won't be too hard to develop exclusives for it, that uses the motion sensor.
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What major 3rd party games are coming out in the next year for the Wii?

They don't give a shit, because they have a 150m+ audience to go after already with PS3, XB360, and PC, and the same game can be ported without too much difficulty to all of them. They cannot put it on the Wii without developing it from scratch. That's one hell of a problem.
 
WeasteDevil said:
I think that you very well know what happens when software sales start to drop off. It's not only selling less than the PS2 in terms of hardware around the same point in its life, it's dropping off rapidly in software at the same point that PS2 was increasing software sales. We know that Nintendo made profit on the hardware, and it's not surprising when you consider what it actually is inside the box, but the major profit has been from software sales, and it's dropping. XB360 and PS3 are not seeing software dropping off, it's growing, so it's something to do with the Wii specifically as a trend.
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So, you are comparing it to the PS2? Why is that exactly? What relevance does it's total sales figures have to anything?

Oh and you are just rambling on about something that is pretty obvious. Why it needed a thread like this is beyond me. If by not 'looking good' and 'doomed' you mean wiped the floor in sales with all it's current rivals, then yes I guess it's not been good and was doomed from the start :wenger:



No, it simply makes part of your argument irrelevant.
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On the contrary, your use of the SNES ownership to try to prove you aren't a fanboy just makes it seem a little sad. I still don't understand why you love Sony above all else, they are just another company who only really care about making money first, and creativity is somewhere down the list. Like everyone else really.
 
WeasteDevil said:
What major 3rd party games are coming out in the next year for the Wii?

They don't give a shit, because they have a 150m+ audience to go after already with PS3, XB360, and PC, and the same game can be ported without too much difficulty to all of them. They cannot put it on the Wii without developing it from scratch. That's one hell of a problem.
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I was just talking about the number of Wiis in living rooms compared to the PS3 and 360. Surely that will always have some pull for 3rd party developers.
 
Redlambs said:
So, you are comparing it to the PS2? Why is that exactly? What relevance does it's total sales figures have to anything?
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Mainly because PS2 is the benchmark and even you said that Wii was so successful because it was outdoing what PS2 did in its first 5 years. I'm simply pointing out that PS2 continues to sell 7 million units per year in the 12 year of its life for a reason, and the major reason for that is the length and breadth of its software library, mainly 3rd party, something that Wii is not going to achieve.

Redlambs said:
Oh and you are just rambling on about something that is pretty obvious. Why it needed a thread like this is beyond me. If by not 'looking good' and 'doomed' you mean wiped the floor in sales with all it's current rivals, then yes I guess it's not been good and was doomed from the start :wenger:
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It only wipes the floor in terms of sales during its lifetime, and its lifetime is going to be short. That's the point, it came too soon, it shot its load too soon. It was an impressive 14" penis that couldn't last. I wouldn't surprise me if XB360 sells more units at the end of its life than the Wii which will quite soon be replaced. How the feck can you compare sales of a 200 quid piece of 10 year old shit to a modern 500 quid packet of dogs bollocks? Of course the 200 quid piece of shit will sell more, most restaurants sell more rump steak than sirloin steak. What happens when the sirloin comes down in price to a point close enough to the rump? The sirloin however comes with some knives and forks.


Redlambs said:
On the contrary, your use of the SNES ownership to try to prove you aren't a fanboy just makes it seem a little sad. I still don't understand why you love Sony above all else, they are just another company who only really care about making money first, and creativity is somewhere down the list. Like everyone else really.
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If I loved Sony, I'd have a PS1 and a PS2 sitting here next to me. I don't. I do however have a SNES.
 
Devil_forever said:
I was just talking about the number of Wiis in living rooms compared to the PS3 and 360. Surely that will always have some pull for 3rd party developers.
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Maybe it is, but what is the attach rate for the Wii in terms of 3rd party games? If they were really that interested, you would have had MW2 released for Wii same time same date that it was for the PS3 and XB360. You would have GTA4 on the Wii, it does not exist. And so it goes on. All the 3rd party stuff is shovelware or flailing your arms around like a nutter games.
 
Redlambs said:
:lol::lol:

Nice try Weastie old mate. Just because Nintendo released a machine that wiped the floor with all current generation machines you try to now claim it's doomed? I still don't understand you fanboys and your mentality towards any one particular company.

Oh and for all those being mislead, another year or two and you'll be seeing all new machines (or at least hearing about them) from all three (maybe four) major companies anyway.
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Sega?
 
WeasteDevil said:
Maybe it is, but what is the attach rate for the Wii in terms of 3rd party games? If they were really that interested, you would have had MW2 released for Wii same time same date that it was for the PS3 and XB360. You would have GTA4 on the Wii, it does not exist. And so it goes on. All the 3rd party stuff is shovelware or flailing your arms around like a nutter games.
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Those two games don't really suit the Wii and a good share of its owners would have no interest in playing them.
 
He's also wrong about Microsoft and Sony, they have absolutely no reason to announce new consoles as their sales are increasing both in hardware and software, unlike Wii that is dropping in both.
 
WeasteDevil said:
Right, so we get Just Dance? How many times can you push that type of concept? In fact, what happens when Kinect comes out that is far more suited to that type of thing?

What happens when a PS3 is 150 quid?
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A particular section of the people who pick up the Wii, won't care how much the PS3 retails at, as they have no interest in it at all. Value for money or not, it simply won't appeal to them.

As for move, well the Wii is now seen universally to the casual market as the must have motion sensing device, Sony would need to spend a hell of a lot in marketing to spread the message about Move and that's before they can even establish themselves in the market for the casual gamers.

My mum nagged me to pick up a Wii, this is a woman, who knows absolutely nothing about gaming or computing full stop. You could say the word Move to her and it wouldn't mean anything to her. When you mention Wii, it instantly registers. I can't ever see my Mum picking up a PS3 and then the move on top of it.

You see the casual market as one that will dry up but I think there's a very very long way to go before that's the case. This debate would be better had in 3 years time. You can't label something as a "trend" after a dip, as you well know, one title alone can drive sales straight back up.
 
I have a working Game Gear as well, and it's rechargeable battery pack is actually bigger than the console itself. SEGA are not going back down this route, it almost destroyed them. He must be talking about Apple, there is no other daft enough to even try it, because it can seriously burn you. He forgot about things such as OnLive etc. but they are not major players right now, and he did explicitly state "major companies".
 
Devil_forever said:
A particular section of the people who pick up the Wii, won't care how much the PS3 retails at, as they have no interest in it at all. Value for money or not, it simply won't appeal to them.
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Ok, but that means that the Wii has expanded the market does it not? The 150m people that bought the PS2 are still there?

Devil_forever said:
As for move, well the Wii is now seen universally to the casual market as the must have motion sensing device, Sony would need to spend a hell of a lot in marketing to spread the message about Move and that's before they can even establish themselves in the market for the casual gamers.
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Move will not work this generation I feel, but it's not a Wii clone by any means. I think that move is targeted more at hardcore gamers.

Devil_forever said:
My mum nagged me to pick up a Wii, this is a woman, who knows absolutely nothing about gaming or computing full stop. You could say the word Move to her and it wouldn't mean anything to her. When you mention Wii, it instantly registers. I can't ever see my Mum picking up a PS3 and then the move on top of it.
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Ok, so as I said, it expanded the market, no?

Devil_forever said:
You see the casual market as one that will dry up but I think there's a very very long way to go before that's the case. This debate would be better had in 3 years time. You can't label something as a "trend" after a dip, as you well know, one title alone can drive sales straight back up.
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Yes, I agree with you, but that casual market, for example your mum, did not exist before the Wii did it? But what types of games do they like to play? Once you have the fitness game, once you have the table tennis game, etc. why would you buy another new one of the same type? It has expanded the market, I think the DS has done so even more, but there are still those 150m that bought a PS2!

It's those 150m that buy software on a regular basis, and it's software where the money really is.
 
I've got the master system adapter for it which isn't small, with that, the rechargable battery and it being an already hefty piece of equipment it wasn't the most portable piece of equipment. Still, I loved that bad boy, remember having a day off school and playing sonic chaos all day. 8bit gaming was the dog's danglies.
 
Ivor Ballokov said:
Ah right I was hoping for a miraculous return from Sega there. Up until the PS1 that's all I owned, still have a working gamegear somewhere. Can't imagine Apple getting into this market really.
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I can, the gaming industry is now the biggest in entertainment. Then you get the fact that, there are a fair few people, who'd buy anything with Apple's logo on it. Apple may well try and milk the hype they generate.
 
WeasteDevil said:
1)Ok, but that means that the Wii has expanded the market does it not? The 150m people that bought the PS2 are still there?



2)Move will not work this generation I feel, but it's not a Wii clone by any means. I think that move is targeted more at hardcore gamers.


3)Yes, I agree with you, but that casual market, for example your mum, did not exist before the Wii did it? But what types of games do they like to play? Once you have the fitness game, once you have the table tennis game, etc. why would you buy another new one of the same type? It has expanded the market, I think the DS has done so even more, but there are still those 150m that bought a PS2!

It's those 150m that buy software on a regular basis, and it's software where the money really is.
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1) I don't doubt that the PS2 market is still there but what's stopping them from investing in a 360? The PS2 sold a hell of a lot but that was down to a combination of factors, it was relatively cheap (after the price drop), had a mouth watering games library, there were tons of cheap games and it had a hell of a lot of hype and was seen as the must have console (a good proportion bought a PS2 based on the hype, just like how you see people opting for the I-Phone). The PS3 could drop it's price but it simply doesn't have the games library of the PS2 and its not close to being seen as the must have console by the masses. Also could Sony realistically drop the PS3's price to £150 without making huge losses on it? Will production cost drop by that much in the near future?

2) I think Sony see the move as a direct rival to the Wii (they see it as something that's going to appeal to the casual market just as much as it will to the "hardcore" one, mind you I can't see the hardcore market ever taking to it but that's another discussion to be had!) and if that's the case, the Move will not be anywhere near as successful as they hope. Buy a PS3 for £250 + the move for around £90, over the Wii? Not going to happen imo. Ditto for microsoft's cringeworthy effort.

3) I've made this exact same point to her but you can bet your house on it that my mum will pick up the next over hyped piece of kit or game that Nintendo release for it. That's how your average casual gamer thinks, sad but true.

Nintendo knew that they could never produce a console to compete with Sony or Microsoft for power, so they exploited a gap in the market and have made billions from it, it's amazing for a gaming company when they make a profit on hardware! Sony and Microsoft will be kicking themselves, microsoft more so than Sony, as Sony at least managed to push Blu Ray into the market. Their attempts to take on the Wii, show that the demand for motion sensing gaming is still very much alive.
 
So lets get this straight. Despite being the best selling console of this generation, the fact that sales have started to slow (long past most people's expectations) means that it's doomed?

Also, Sony only announced the PS3 when the PS2 sales all but dried up didn't they?

You are living in a dream world if you honestly think the new consoles are that far off, but we've had this discussion before and only time will tell.

It amuses me, though, that you continually talk about the amount of games on the PS2/3. There are plenty of highlights on those systems, but the PS3 is hardly swamped in actual good games now is it? The PS2 obviously has an even higher amount of shit.

Oh and the Wii must have only been a rubbish gimmick, so rubbish infact that your beloved Sony have nicked a Wiimote, stuck a ping pong ball on the end and changed the sensor bar to a camera. But of course, that's nothing like the Wiimote and the shovelware (which much of it is already on the PS3/Xbox anyway), won't just be ported across either will it.


I'll say it again, it's not really a shock that a product with such a vast sales rate and installed user base slows down in sales. The only real surprise is it's taken so long.
 
Devil_forever said:
Nintendo knew that they could never produce a console to compete with Sony or Microsoft for power,
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They could have quite easily competed power for power if they liked. They did in the last generation and may well do in the future.

What they couldn't and can't compete with is the budget for advertisements and buying rights to companies/games exclusivity which is a major factor in going down a different road. The Wii has proven more than capable of doing what they want, and since it's basically a slightly more powerful Gamecube they've made a fortune on hardware where the others have lost.
 
Casual gamers don't buy as many games, that's one of the problems with going after that market.

I would not be surprised if the wii sells the least amount of games this generation, regardless of console sales.

I hope they announce a new generation of consoles soon. I would expect it if they want them out the door in 2012. I don't like the idea of having to wait another 4-5 years.
 
I've skimmed the thread, admittedly, so I don't know if this has been mentioned but the Wii hardware was profitable whereas I don't think any Sony/MS gaming hardware has been profitable. From what I know, they sell it at a loss and make the money back on software.

As such, comparing the Wii to the PS2 is a bit OTT seeing as the Wii doesn't necessarily need software to make Ninty the cash. Sony needed PS2's out and about in order to interest developers. Ninty makes a sale, pockets the cash and then releases some first-party games to further boost the profit.

---

Having said all that, as an owner of a Wii I'm disappointed. Other than Zelda, Mario Party and Guitar Hero I have no reason to play the Wii. However, one thing that I think everyone seems to miss is that it's almost the perfect console for having mates round. When I wanna game properly I use my laptop but when I have friends round and we want to have a laugh, Mario Party/Guitar Hero is the way to go.

It would definitely be nice to have better games though. Then again, the console is perfectly placed. If you only play two or three games then the Wii is the cheapest console. For me personally, I paid £200(ish) and can now play Guitar Hero whereas my friends paid about a hundred pounds more for the privilege of doing so. (Software excluded!!)
 
DFreshKing said:
Nope, never saw a granny buy a PSX.

Sony invented the mainstream market, big difference.

The mainstream buy the most games, even more than the hardcore who tend to buy their favourite game and play it to death.
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So before the PS1, there was no mainstream market? Of course there was. There was no specific casual market however.

Sony's remit was always to get such a huge number of titles over quality back in the day to attract casual buyers who'd get bored easily and move on to the next. Hence why whereas Nintendo and Sega games had a lot more depth, the PS1 games were much more arcadey.
 
Redlambs said:
So before the PS1, there was no mainstream market? Of course there was. There was no specific casual market however.

Sony's remit was always to get such a huge number of titles over quality back in the day to attract casual buyers who'd get bored easily and move on to the next. Hence why whereas Nintendo and Sega games had a lot more depth, the PS1 games were much more arcadey.
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Which console before Ps1 sold the numbers to be classed as mainstream?

Gaming was niche before Sony, The casual market was created by the Wii.

I don't think were disagreeing actually, I just think I have two separate classes, mainstream and Casual, whereas you are saying all non hardcore are casual.
 
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