NFL 2023

P-Ro said:
I don't know why people are still unsure about Purdy. I'd put him in my list of the top 5 NFL quarterbacks alongside Mahomes, Hurts, Lawrence and Burrow.
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People are unsure about him because he is on an absurdly stacked team with a very effective system. Which is not the same as saying that he is not good or that he hasn't played very well for where he was drafted. We already know that the 49ers will make a run in the playoffs, let's see what happens when it comes to those really big games (e.g the Championship game). I maintain that the 49ers will not make the Super Bowl, that's my feeling.

Also, Lawrence is top 5 for you? And I don't know how you can put Purdy ahead of Allen and Jackson. He's also not better than Herbert or Tua IMO.
 
Andrade said:
People are unsure about him because he is on an absurdly stacked team with a very effective system. Which is not the same as saying that he is not good or that he hasn't played very well for where he was drafted. We already know that the 49ers will make a run in the playoffs, let's see what happens when it comes to those really big games (e.g the Championship game). I maintain that the 49ers will not make the Super Bowl, that's my feeling.

Also, Lawrence is top 5 for you? And I don't know how you can put Purdy ahead of Allen and Jackson. He's also not better than Herbert or Tua IMO.
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At this moment in time I'd put most of them ahead of him, maybe not Lawrence or Tua. Lawrence is on a poor team but makes a lot of boneheaded mistakes. The Dolphins are stacked, especially on offence, but aside from Tua having a bigger arm I think Purdy is better in most other aspects.

For all the talk it's the system too, Jimmy G would never and did never put numbers up like this. Purdy is already going for the longer throws and operating outside the usual Shanahan scheme, which is impressive since he is also just recovering from the MCL surgery. Shanahan hasn't trusted a QB like this since Atlanta went to the SB.
 
It is such a strange season for the Vikings. They improved in most key aspects but can't win which could be a good long term thing if it allows them to either get an elite defensive end/tackle or a franchise QB.
 
whitbyviking said:
At this moment in time I'd put most of them ahead of him, maybe not Lawrence or Tua. Lawrence is on a poor team but makes a lot of boneheaded mistakes. The Dolphins are stacked, especially on offence, but aside from Tua having a bigger arm I think Purdy is better in most other aspects.

For all the talk it's the system too, Jimmy G would never and did never put numbers up like this. Purdy is already going for the longer throws and operating outside the usual Shanahan scheme, which is impressive since he is also just recovering from the MCL surgery. Shanahan hasn't trusted a QB like this since Atlanta went to the SB.
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Purdy is like Brady in that he is elite in reading the game. It always takes a while for people to rate that; especially if the player also does not have any discernable physical skills.
 
whitbyviking said:
At this moment in time I'd put most of them ahead of him, maybe not Lawrence or Tua. Lawrence is on a poor team but makes a lot of boneheaded mistakes. The Dolphins are stacked, especially on offence, but aside from Tua having a bigger arm I think Purdy is better in most other aspects.

For all the talk it's the system too, Jimmy G would never and did never put numbers up like this. Purdy is already going for the longer throws and operating outside the usual Shanahan scheme, which is impressive since he is also just recovering from the MCL surgery. Shanahan hasn't trusted a QB like this since Atlanta went to the SB.
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I mean, he's better than Jimmy G so far, I'll give you that, but I don't think that is saying much. The point is more that saying he's top 5 is a stretch IMO, with all due respect to @P-Ro.
 
Dave Smith said:
Purdy is like Brady in that he is elite in reading the game. It always takes a while for people to rate that; especially if the player also does not have any discernable physical skills.
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You cannot be 'elite at reading the game' when you've played a handful of games in the NFL. What you can have (and what Purdy does appear to have, and what early Brady did have, because he was not 'elite at reading the game' from jump either) is good instincts which helps to minimise mistakes.
 
JPRouve said:
It is such a strange season for the Vikings. They improved in most key aspects but can't win which could be a good long term thing if it allows them to either get an elite defensive end/tackle or a franchise QB.
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Talent on their team and Cousins is OK. Just not getting the breaks they got last year
 
Andrade said:
Talent on their team and Cousins is OK. Just not getting the breaks they got last year
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There is a big whole at DT which is how opponents manage to escape pressure. Otherwise I wouldn't say that last season they got breaks but this season started with a ridiculous amount of unforced turnovers.
 
Was at the Niners Cowboys game, so many Cowboys fans at the stadium today, was hilarious (as always) to watch them get massacred.
 
Andrade said:
You cannot be 'elite at reading the game' when you've played a handful of games in the NFL. What you can have (and what Purdy does appear to have, and what early Brady did have, because he was not 'elite at reading the game' from jump either) is good instincts which helps to minimise mistakes.
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One point to make is coaches/coordinators often water down a system for young QBs until they mature into all this. Does help to be in a Shanahan system who is likely modifying things to Purdy's advantage. If he continues to progress the playbook will expand and he'll learn to master these dark arts. He looks really good but I've seen this with Rich Gannon and Jeff Garcia amongst others in these styles of offenses; Jimmy G was efficient the last two years but that was his ceiling - decent, perhaps Purdy's ceiling will be elite, to early to say. And it certainly helps to have Deebo, Kittle, and McCaffrey, and now Aiyuk has developed into a threat.

Dak's ceiling is decent but nowhere near elite. I think he needs to go elsewhere for his sake and for the Dallas organization to reset. I wrote the season off for them after Diggs' injury and that loss to Arizona was a blueprint how to go through them and how the team feeds into its own hype far too often. They're also still massively undisciplined.
 
Yesterday was so good compared to Wembley, felt much more like a representation of what a home NFL game is like. I’m not sure if that’s purely because Bills fans are decent or travelled better than previous teams that came over. Or maybe the acoustics of the stadium?
 
Carl said:
It's easy to be really down on the team and Dak after a game like that but you're too far in the opposite direction to those you're criticising. Dallas are a good team and will go to the playoffs. They're just not a top 10 team, and teams in that category occasionally get slapped.
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Yes exactly we will probably reach the playoffs but there's no way we winning there.

I just don't understand how anyone thinks we could possibly be contending for a Superbowl with our team and coach.

Mahomes wouldn't be too winning the Superbowl with this team although he might get there with some luck.

There are just too many teams better than us
 
MrMarcello said:
One point to make is coaches/coordinators often water down a system for young QBs until they mature into all this. Does help to be in a Shanahan system who is likely modifying things to Purdy's advantage. If he continues to progress the playbook will expand and he'll learn to master these dark arts. He looks really good but I've seen this with Rich Gannon and Jeff Garcia amongst others in these styles of offenses; Jimmy G was efficient the last two years but that was his ceiling - decent, perhaps Purdy's ceiling will be elite, to early to say. And it certainly helps to have Deebo, Kittle, and McCaffrey, and now Aiyuk has developed into a threat.

Dak's ceiling is decent but nowhere near elite. I think he needs to go elsewhere for his sake and for the Dallas organization to reset. I wrote the season off for them after Diggs' injury and that loss to Arizona was a blueprint how to go through them and how the team feeds into its own hype far too often. They're also still massively undisciplined.
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Yes, this is absolutely true, it helps a lot that he is throwing to monsters like that and also that he has a good O-line with the best left tackle in the game, and a really good defense. The 49ers are seemingly good at every position and they have a very good head coach to boot. I don't think anyone could do what Purdy is doing (not every QB succeeds in Shanahan's system) but I do think there are several other QBs in the league that could do what he's doing on that team and more.
 
JPRouve said:
It is such a strange season for the Vikings. They improved in most key aspects but can't win which could be a good long term thing if it allows them to either get an elite defensive end/tackle or a franchise QB.
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So many mistakes at critical moments in games. Last night being a prime example with Cousins offloading the pass to Mattison and he drops a relatively simple catch that would have likely put him in for a TD or at least got the Vikings to the goal line. Might not have made a difference in the end but you can't pass up those chances.

Poor in game management from Cousins/O'Connell has cost games too. Burning 2 timeouts yesterday because you can't sort yourself and then burning one on a challenge that was never going to be successful cost any chance of a comeback. Not spiking the ball against the Chargers likely cost that game although there were plenty other chances to win that one.

Frustrating to watch.
 
Andrade said:
Yes, this is absolutely true, it helps a lot that he is throwing to monsters like that and also that he has a good O-line with the best left tackle in the game, and a really good defense. The 49ers are seemingly good at every position and they have a very good head coach to boot. I don't think anyone could do what Purdy is doing (not every QB succeeds in Shanahan's system) but I do think there are several other QBs in the league that could do what he's doing on that team and more.
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Kinda reminds me of early days Russell Wilson where Seattle relied on Lynch and the LOB defense. Wilson was running a basic/limited offense that relied heavily on the run and play-action, and credit to Wilson he was careful with the ball and performed admirably as a young QB. Wilson ultimately matured into a top tier QB, literally carried them offensively for a few years, but once that defense begin to fall apart (various reasons), it showed he wasn't the type to carry them all the way. Just how good would those 2012-15 Seahawks teams have been with an elite veteran QB? They may have gone unbeaten at some point.

Purdy is giving me those Seahawks LOB vibes but with better offensive weapons and a better passing arm to compliment a monster defense.
 
I’m completely happy with Purdy getting disrespected and overlooked. The same arguments were being made against Brady in his early years. Keep ‘em coming, Purdy doesn’t care what anyone thinks of him.
 
Purdy is running the 49ers offense so well, playing really well. That’s the only thing that matters and he’s doing an outstanding job.
 
lsd said:
Cowboys fans are mostly idiots though and being one i world know.

The worst thing about losing like this is Cowboys fans will just blame Dak who while he certainly isn't good enough is not the reason we won't be going to a Superbowl.

We are not good enough from top to bottom and i really never understand why our fans don't get that.

We have kids for tight ends, one elite reciever and running backs that just run straight.

A coach who isn't good enough a GM who will always take the cheaper option in any trade deal.

A defence that are only the number one defence in the game when they are on their own social media accounts and then off course Dak

Bar that we are amazing
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We’ve never been able to stop the run for years. Our owner doubling as a GM is a joke. Our QB made his reputation from his first season. We’ve been the dumbest and most undisciplined team in the league for years. We can’t play on grass. We are the ultimate front runners. We will get 10-12 wins and lose away yet again in the playoffs.
 
sport2793 said:
Was at the Niners Cowboys game, so many Cowboys fans at the stadium today, was hilarious (as always) to watch them get massacred.
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Twenty dollars for a beer. TWENTY DOLLARS!!

Actually could not believe my ears.
 
Dan_F said:
Yesterday was so good compared to Wembley, felt much more like a representation of what a home NFL game is like. I’m not sure if that’s purely because Bills fans are decent or travelled better than previous teams that came over. Or maybe the acoustics of the stadium?
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More often than not it feels like the away team are the more supported teams.
I felt packers support last year was big but giants fans got really loud towards the end once they realised they would win.

Jags are weird cos they've hardly had the best support despite being home a lot of the games but recently have become good and seem to be picking up more fans
 
Mike McCarthy said it looks like Leighton Vander Esch (neck) and CJ Goodwin (shoulder) are headed to Injured Reserve.

edit: their schedule doesn’t look easy.
Dak already has what 5 INTs, running game is not flourishing. And now defense without Diggs and Vander esch.
 
whitbyviking said:
At this moment in time I'd put most of them ahead of him, maybe not Lawrence or Tua. Lawrence is on a poor team but makes a lot of boneheaded mistakes. The Dolphins are stacked, especially on offence, but aside from Tua having a bigger arm I think Purdy is better in most other aspects.

For all the talk it's the system too, Jimmy G would never and did never put numbers up like this. Purdy is already going for the longer throws and operating outside the usual Shanahan scheme, which is impressive since he is also just recovering from the MCL surgery. Shanahan hasn't trusted a QB like this since Atlanta went to the SB.
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Andrade said:
I mean, he's better than Jimmy G so far, I'll give you that, but I don't think that is saying much. The point is more that saying he's top 5 is a stretch IMO, with all due respect to @P-Ro.
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I'll be the first one to admit that I'm not the best judge of football players. But he's giving me Brady 2001 vibes by being elevated by the stellar o-line and skill position players around him. If he was just good you would expect him to have put in a few bum games but he's now 15 games in and seemingly hasn't put a foot wrong. I also think that if you put Josh Allen in that 49ers team they wouldn't be better, in fact I think they'd have lost a few games down to his brain fart turnovers. It's a shame we didn't get to see him against a team as equally stacked as the Eagles last year and being under pressure to score on every drive but we will come January and if the 49ers aren't banged up i fully expect to see them in the super bowl.
 
Every time he gets hit and stays down I wince. He’s 31 and worth 55m, at what point do you just decide to protect your brain and model clothes instead
 
So after our first games looked surprisingly ok, we’re starting to have the kind of season I expected.
 
HTG said:
So after our first games looked surprisingly ok, we’re starting to have the kind of season I expected.
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We badly need Aaron Jones. Having no run game and OL affected is not good and doesn't help Love.
Mlf making weird redzone play calls too doesn't help
 
MrMarcello said:
Kinda reminds me of early days Russell Wilson where Seattle relied on Lynch and the LOB defense. Wilson was running a basic/limited offense that relied heavily on the run and play-action, and credit to Wilson he was careful with the ball and performed admirably as a young QB. Wilson ultimately matured into a top tier QB, literally carried them offensively for a few years, but once that defense begin to fall apart (various reasons), it showed he wasn't the type to carry them all the way. Just how good would those 2012-15 Seahawks teams have been with an elite veteran QB? They may have gone unbeaten at some point.

Purdy is giving me those Seahawks LOB vibes but with better offensive weapons and a better passing arm to compliment a monster defense.
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Obviously Russ and Purdy are very different but I feel you on this comparison because the Seahawks were similarly able to build a very strong roster in Russ's first couple of season because Russ was a low draft pick on a rookie deal. We will see if Purdy and the 49ers can replicate the success of those Seahawks teams but I have my doubts. As I said, I've picked the Lions to win the NFC.
 
P-Ro said:
I'll be the first one to admit that I'm not the best judge of football players. But he's giving me Brady 2001 vibes by being elevated by the stellar o-line and skill position players around him. If he was just good you would expect him to have put in a few bum games but he's now 15 games in and seemingly hasn't put a foot wrong. I also think that if you put Josh Allen in that 49ers team they wouldn't be better, in fact I think they'd have lost a few games down to his brain fart turnovers. It's a shame we didn't get to see him against a team as equally stacked as the Eagles last year and being under pressure to score on every drive but we will come January and if the 49ers aren't banged up i fully expect to see them in the super bowl.
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These are all fair points. I think the 49ers are likely to be banged up come the playoffs (because they seemingly always are; if Kittle, CMC and Samuel all make it to January unscathed, I'll be amazed) and that's part of the reason why I don't have them in the SB, though I realise that they're the favourites to win the NFC at the moment (along with Philly).

I think Brady 2001 is different from Purdy though. The 49ers were good before Purdy, the Pats were bad before Brady. In fact, Belichick without Brady is extremely thin pickings generally, with Cleveland and New England, and questions are starting to be asked about old Bill.....
 
People underrate Purdy. I get that he is on a stacked team and couldn't have asked for better conditions to win.

However, people have to realise that he is still putting up unbelievable completion and passer ratings. For sure, he should have those things but the consistency he is putting that together week in, week out is unusual and I do not think that is replicated by another QB. Herbert and Allen (both QB's I like) for instance, imo, would still have a number of picks trying to play hero ball. Then there is the fact Jimmy G wasn't putting up such numbers. That for me puts him in the top 10-15 QB range already.

For me, Purdy can be said to be at least a floor, maybe two above Jimmy G already and that he should still improve significantly over the next year or two as he gets more snaps in the NFL.

The problem I guess is ceiling, but here is where I find NFL commentary annoying. For sure, Pat M is the QB1 by some distance in the NFL, then you have the other usual suspects. However, Purdy does not have to try and beat them at their own game, mobility, arm power etc, in order to get into the top 3-5 QB debate. His path is that of Brady, become a machine at reading the game, execute to a high level and be clutch. Those elements still beat out deep ball power plays over a course of a season and in the PO.

This all said, it is still early for Purdy. Tougher challenges await and I think the thing we all need to see most, is can he be clutch in a tight game against a QB like Pat M.
 
P-Ro said:
If I were them I'd look at offloading Cousins to the Jets (if they can afford him) and tanking for Caleb.
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I feel that ship has sailed now, particularly as Zach Wilson has shown glimpses of at least playing at the level of a game manager. If they didn't get anyone in when he looked terrible, doubt they would do a trade now.
 
Andrade said:
These are all fair points. I think the 49ers are likely to be banged up come the playoffs (because they seemingly always are; if Kittle, CMC and Samuel all make it to January unscathed, I'll be amazed) and that's part of the reason why I don't have them in the SB, though I realise that they're the favourites to win the NFC at the moment (along with Philly).

I think Brady 2001 is different from Purdy though. The 49ers were good before Purdy, the Pats were bad before Brady. In fact, Belichick without Brady is extremely thin pickings generally, with Cleveland and New England, and questions are starting to be asked about old Bill.....
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The Pats had a bad 2000 season during Brady's rookie year, but this was a club still with many holdovers from the 1994,1996-98 playoff runs and a .500 1999 season missing the playoffs by one win and possible tiebreakers, and with a Super Bowl loss in the mix. Not near SF's current performance or talent collection but also not necessarily bottom of the barrell like say when Parcells/Bledsoe arrived in NE in 1993 or when the Jimmy/Troy era in Dallas began in 1989.

Agreed that Belichick is nowhere near the echelon he's placed without Brady, that's basically been proven with TB12 winning Tampa while Bill has floundered since. They also likely stole all the Rams play call signals and formations in 2001 but we'll never know as the NFL destroyed all the tapes.
 
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