New Left Back

I think people over estimate our financial strength.
We are not in a position to pay 54m for a LB when there are other areas of the team needing reinforcements.
 
Wilson Litchmore said:
Seem to be a big thing at the time?? It was more a proffessional player thinking its ok to come back overweight. Shaw clearly learned from that as he took his PT on his next holiday....
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I don't think he ever called Shaw overweight, that was just how people interpreted it. But even if that were the case I'd put it down to naivety rather than an attitude problem.
 
Surely we can get Rose for decent fee if he puts in a transfer request and kicks up a fuss?
 
CM10 said:
I don't think he ever called Shaw overweight, that was just how people interpreted it. But even if that were the case I'd put it down to naivety rather than an attitude problem.
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I think Shaw has a naturally stocky build, but LvG had a go at him over his fitness pretty much as soon as he took over, Shaw was made to do extra work on his own and LvG said he was nowhere near the required level of fitness.
 
I very much doubt Rose would be available without Martial being involved in the deal, Tottenham would do what Inter did with Perisic.
 
Mr Smith said:
Sorry, you mean a 22 year old who's been at the club 3 years, and suffered a freak injury that kept him out of football for almost a year? Yeah, he's really run out of chances... :rolleyes:
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3 years and roughly 10 good games during that time - I'd say that's as bad as things get.
And while you can write off 0.75 of a season due to the injury, what is the excuse for the other 2.25 seasons?
The guy has struggled with injury, fitness & weight-issues for 3 successive years and there simply is no excuse for this.
Phil Jones is the other player who falls into this category (ie. constantly injured or unfit).

ZAGREB RED said:
I think Shaw has a naturally stocky build, but LvG had a go at him over his fitness pretty much as soon as he took over, Shaw was made to do extra work on his own and LvG said he was nowhere near the required level of fitness.
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Correct.
Basically, it took 1 whole year for Shaw to get into the sort of shape that LVG found acceptable.
Essentially, Shaw skipped his first season with us.
 
sunama said:
3 years and roughly 10 good games during that time - I'd say that's as bad as things get.
And while you can write off 0.75 of a season due to the injury, what is the excuse for the other 2.25 seasons?
The guy has struggled with injury, fitness & weight-issues for 3 successive years and there simply is no excuse for this.
Phil Jones is the other player who falls into this category (ie. constantly injured or unfit).
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Personally, I think it is incredibly harsh, bordering on naive to suggest a player will simply bounce back immediately after an injury as serious and as long term as Shaw's in 2015/16; he was never going to immediately return to the form he showed before it. As for his first season, Southampton to Manchester United is a big step up for a then 19 year old, and Van Gaal's demands for a wing-back was at the time a significant change. And by the way, there's nothing wrong with telling a young player he needs to improve. Fans these days react so quickly when a manager criticises a young player: "the manager doesn't rate him at all, he isn't good enough". It's never seen for what it often is; a tactic to try and encourage a young, hungry player to improve (a tactic that by the way, seemed to have worked for Shaw until his untimely first injury).

I'd agree his last 6 months at United have been very disappointing, but in the context of everything that has come before it, I think it is slightly harsh to say he has no excuse, and definitely premature to say he can't still become a great player for us. Is this a big season for him? Yes. Should we be writing him off before it starts? Absolutely not.
 
we definitely need a better left back than Blind and Darmian - it's a weak spot for us.
 
We need a left back more than a left winge, it will give rashford /martial alot of freedom.
After a left back, a right winger for me is even more important.
 
E-mal said:
We need a left back more than a left winge, it will give rashford /martial alot of freedom.
After a left back, a right winger for me is even more important.
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Agreed. The only reason our RW position is not brought up as much is due to Valencia being strong going forward. We're definitely unbalanced from left to right.
 
Shaw (and Young) both on their way back it seems to give us more options there if we don't go for a new one.

Still think a left winger is more likely myself.

 
I am quite content with Blind as our first choice LB, and Darmian as his backup. At this stage, I wouldn't count on Shaw considering that he has showed like 4 good matches in 3 years here, and has given a match to Jones about which one of them spends more time injured.
 
Revan said:
I am quite content with Blind as our first choice LB, and Darmian as his backup. At this stage, I wouldn't count on Shaw considering that he has showed like 4 good matches in 3 years here, and has given a match to Jones about which one of them spends more time injured.
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I thought Blind was our weakest player today, got caught out twice by Arnautovic and showed a distinct lack of pace. He may cost us goals against better quality opposition. His eagerness to get forward at any opportunity is a plus point and his passing overall is pretty decent, but ultimately he just doesn't have the required toolset to be our first choice left back. Good squad player no doubt.
 
If the Rose deal was possible I think he'd make a good enough addition to be a starter but not so incredible that Shaw couldn't challenge him.
 
Devil may care said:
If the Rose deal was possible I think he'd make a good enough addition to be a starter but not so incredible that Shaw couldn't challenge him.
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Currently? There'd be no challenge imo. Rose is the best LB in the league and Shaw is seemingly never even available.
 
Womp said:
Currently? There'd be no challenge imo. Rose is the best LB in the league and Shaw is seemingly never even available.
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What I meant was that Rose is a good LB but not insurmountable for Shaw over time, he wouldn't mean the end for him IMO.
 
Devil may care said:
What I meant was that Rose is a good LB but not insurmountable for Shaw over time, he wouldn't mean the end for him IMO.
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Oh of course, he's got talent for sure but that position needs to be nailed down sooner or later, whether it's by Shaw or a new signing. It's been a problem area for us for years now and imo our weakest position by far. Even today when seemingly everyone else was immense, Blind seemed to be the odd one out.

Shaw has the talent but can he overcome whatever it is that's been holding him back is the question.
 
Womp said:
Oh of course, he's got talent for sure but that position needs to be nailed down sooner or later, whether it's by Shaw or a new signing. It's been a problem area for us for years now and imo our weakest position by far. Even today when seemingly everyone else was immense, Blind seemed to be the odd one out.

Shaw has the talent but can he overcome whatever it is that's been holding him back is the question.
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I agree, we need to nail the LB spot down with a geuine top quality starter for Shaw to chase, I wouldn't waste another season just hoping he might come good. I'd like to see Rose come in as starter with Shaw as his back up and Darmian moved to RB cover with Blind as a utility plater for LB and CB.
 
Member 5225 said:
Surely we can get Rose for decent fee if he puts in a transfer request and kicks up a fuss?
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Wierd thing is IF he was ever going to force a move this window why oh why would he apologise for making the statement a day after it was published? Surely he would use it as leverage.
 
For me this is the only position where we could and should strengthen this month. I understand those who want a winger, but I think there's more than enough options up front to make it work. Can't really say the same about the LB position ... it would greatly improve the team if we had a left back with a similar impact on the game as Valencia on the right side. Darmian is better off as Valencias backup on the right side, and I think Blind just doesn't offer enough in an attacking aspect. I really want Shaw to succeed (I still remember those few games in his second season before the injury ... he was outstanding), but him staying fit and fully convincing Mourinho is something I currently have little confidence in.
 
Fraud said:
I think that Alex Sandro is a good option.
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Chelsea have tried and failed, he is not for sale.

We have not been linked with any left backs all summer, nothing to indicate we are in the market. Blind, Shaw, Darmian, Young, all options. Not the best left backs the world has ever seen, but we'd need to sell some bodies before any more come in I feel.

Shaw can make that position his own, he just needs a run of games there.

Not a problem area for me when Lingard and Fellaini are getting regular game time. Personally feel we need to sign a winger and use Pereira more than Fellaini
 
Its ridiculous that we have 3/4 left backs and not one of them is close to nailing down that spot, they all have massive flaws.

Shaws the closest obviously but at some point we'll have to give up on him. Big season for him, if we get a LB before the window shuts he'll be gone.
 
InLevyITrust said:
Wierd thing is IF he was ever going to force a move this window why oh why would he apologise for making the statement a day after it was published? Surely he would use it as leverage.
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To avoid being denied his move ala D.Costa?
 
If we 'manage' to get Rose, this will be a great summer. Three EPL proven players signed from our direct rivals and all starters for their respective teams. It will feel like the old days.
 
Member 5225 said:
To avoid being denied his move ala D.Costa?
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Bit of a long shot IMO, Poch has said his apology was accepted and his in the plans. I doubt apologising would
Make much difference to wheather he was going to be sold or not. I don't think he will force anything this season.
 
sunama said:
3 years and roughly 10 good games during that time - I'd say that's as bad as things get.
And while you can write off 0.75 of a season due to the injury, what is the excuse for the other 2.25 seasons?
The guy has struggled with injury, fitness & weight-issues for 3 successive years and there simply is no excuse for this.
Phil Jones is the other player who falls into this category (ie. constantly injured or unfit).



Correct.
Basically, it took 1 whole year for Shaw to get into the sort of shape that LVG found acceptable.
Essentially, Shaw skipped his first season with us.
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Thats not true at all, LvG praised Shaw for knuckling down and starting to control his weight about a month after criticising him for it, basically said he'd done everything asked.
Also his weight wasnt what kept him out of LvGs lineups his first year, he just kept picking up minor injuries every other week, everytime he was (nearly) fit LvG invariably had him in the squad/lineup.
 
ThanksBoss26 said:
Shaw (and Young) both on their way back it seems to give us more options there if we don't go for a new one.

Still think a left winger is more likely myself.

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That must feel surreal playing a training game in the stadium that was full a mere hour before!
 
Devil may care said:
What I meant was that Rose is a good LB but not insurmountable for Shaw over time, he wouldn't mean the end for him IMO.
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If you buy a 27 year old left back for £50m, it's going to be one incredible mission to get back in for the foreseeable for Shaw.
 
Infestissumam said:
For me this is the only position where we could and should strengthen this month. I understand those who want a winger, but I think there's more than enough options up front to make it work. Can't really say the same about the LB position ... it would greatly improve the team if we had a left back with a similar impact on the game as Valencia on the right side. Darmian is better off as Valencias backup on the right side, and I think Blind just doesn't offer enough in an attacking aspect. I really want Shaw to succeed (I still remember those few games in his second season before the injury ... he was outstanding), but him staying fit and fully convincing Mourinho is something I currently have little confidence in.
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Shaw has some parallels with Jones, who half the Café were screaming to get rid of for ages.
Then he gets fit again and looks good again and it's a case of, oh yeah, he's quite good player.
 
Sandikan said:
If you buy a 27 year old left back for £50m, it's going to be one incredible mission to get back in for the foreseeable for Shaw.
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LvG played Ashley Young over Di Maria, if the performance warrants it I think it can be done, but the point would be moot if that was the price as there's no way we'd pay that IMO.
 
Alex Sandro would be a dream signing, he looks like he could play LB, LWB, LM or LW, I know Juve won't sell cheaply if at all, but if you don't ask, you don't get
 
Sandikan said:
Shaw has some parallels with Jones, who half the Café were screaming to get rid of for ages.
Then he gets fit again and looks good again and it's a case of, oh yeah, he's quite good player.
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I think you forget how good the player is while they are injured. Certainly is the case with me every time Jones has a good game.
 
Robertd0803 said:
I think you forget how good the player is while they are injured. Certainly is the case with me every time Jones has a good game.
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Can work both ways I think. Fletcher seemed to be hyped up to ridiculous levels when he was missing, while Jones and Smalling seem to have to build back up from "totally useless" from many when they're out.
 
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