as do the other 2, but atleast out of the 3 carrick can make things happen
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When no one goes near him.
Do you think he would've been nearly as effective as Fellaini was against pool?
He's always been fast over distance - showed it tonight as well. He's pretty tall with long strides, so he doesn't look fast, but once he gets going he covers a lot of distance. His problem is his complete lack of acceleration.
I agree that he struggles a bit when teams press high, but I think he has always done that to some extent. When he has the ball, however, he uses very few touches and moves the ball quickly. It's a complete myth that he slows down our attacks as he is pretty much the one who initiates them. Pogba more or less walks half way across the pitch before he releases the ball; it doesn't matter much that he can beat Carrick in a foot race then, does it?
He doesn't look fast because he isn't fast. Other than the two I mentioned, which of the players out there is he faster than?
You really don't like him, do you? He has never been an enforcer, not even at 25 was he good at that type of role. He makes others play their game though, and is great at intercepting. He does the little stuff that hardly shows, such as showing for the ball and getting in the way. I remember one match against Chelsea they showed how hardly a single ball went up to their attack because somehow Carrick was in the way of every forward pass to Drogba.
depends what you mean by effective, i seem to be in the minority that wasnt happy with the performance....but i totally agree he couldnt start every game, maybe only 1 out 3, but he should of started more games than 2 so far
Depay.
He's incredibly overrated on here, it's things like saying he's 'quick' which always leads me to be on the other side of of the arguement, because statements like that are simply not true.
Whens the last big game he's played in where he's controlled things?
In terms of top speed? I would say he is faster than Herrera, Mata, about the same as Schneiderlin, faster than Blind and slightly slower than Fellaini (who also isn't awful in terms of top speed). Of course Carrick is no Walcott (although he has actually caught up with him on a longer run due to running fast and having a decent top speed). It's not his pace, be it slow or fast, that makes him slow down or quicken the tempo, it's his passing.
Herrera, Carrick and Pogboom three against Chelsea? 
Eh? So he's faster than Herrera but slower than Fellaini
When the feck did I say he is quick? I said he has a decent top speed, which he does, but his complete lack of acceleration makes him take about 20 yards for him to resemble any kind of pace - he's probably quite decent on a 100m run, but awful on a 10 yard run - the latter being much more important in football..
You think he is overrated? Scholes called him the most underrated player in England, right?
I know, it's what Scholes had said before changing his mind to discuss tempo.
Carrick does not play well against pressing teams becasue he can't cope under that kind of pressure.
Eh? So he's faster than Herrera but slower than Fellaini
Herrera's top speed is quite poor - do you know running? Look at Herrera running at top speed, his arms resemble that of a drunk person. Herrera is very quick off the mark though and thus appears fast, but on a longer stretch he isn't all that - just able to stop Lallana from catching the ball against Liverpool, and Lallana is hardly fast over distance either. Fellaini has very long legs and thus when he reaches top speed, after 40 yards, he is quite fast - but quite slow in terms of football fast due to his lack of acceleration, but not as bad as Carrick in that regard.
What does the bolded sentence even mean? Scholes said Carrick was a great player because he made everyone else good - a facilitator, not one to take the lime light, but one to do all the stuff that makes the team gel.
Fast and quick are two different things. Lingard is very quick, but not especially fast. Carrick has the mobility of an oil tanker - awful agility and very poor acceleration, but his top speed is pretty good and has allowed him to catch up with supposedly much faster players. Who would have thought that Gary Pallister was the fastest 100m runner Ferguson ever had? Big player with long strides who took a while to get going, but great top speed. Carrick has decent top speed.
Anyhow, it's his passing that makes him dictate the tempo - Scholes was never fast, but he had quicker feet and he could up the tempo with a single pass. The ball does move faster than even Bolt.
This game showed me that we need a younger Carrick type player and then play him with Herrera and Pogba in a three.
You're clutching mate. Just admit it and move on.
Top top drawer tonight, you sometimes forget just how good Carrick is. The perfect partner for Pogba too.
That last sentence is exactly it. Carrick can give our attackers the ball to feet in dangerous areas with one pass and does it on a consistent players with none of our other central midfielders except Pogba can do or look to do. If the forward player are clicking as they did for parts of today then it makes a massive difference. Obviously he has some weaknesses and you'd need someone like Herrera to help him but he's still got loads to offer.
Im not a big fan of Carrick though I accept he is good.
Today he was great, though. As he was in the last EL game.
Surely, he has to play in the EPL (fitness/tiredness permitting).
Today he was great, though. As he was in the last EL game.
Surely, he has to play in the EPL (fitness/tiredness permitting).
Just a thought....wouldn't Carrick fill the Pirlo role, at Juve?
So, you have the old head (Pirlo/Carrick).
The athletic tackler (Vidal/Herrera).
The dynamic midfielder who can turn defence into attack (Pogba).
As long as Carrick has a high energy player alongside him (like Herrera), Carrick should be able to play in the EPL.
So, you have the old head (Pirlo/Carrick).
The athletic tackler (Vidal/Herrera).
The dynamic midfielder who can turn defence into attack (Pogba).
As long as Carrick has a high energy player alongside him (like Herrera), Carrick should be able to play in the EPL.
usual Carrick, great passing but lacking mobility, home game against some poor Turkish side almost perfect for him. Certainly not good enough to start in tense premier league games every week but Jose can use him like this until he finally retires in summer. That pass to Mata for the penalty was vintage Carrick:-)
Clutching? What the hell. You made a silly, nonsensical statement about him slowing us down with your only argument being that he is slow and he stood on the ball a couple of times for four or five seconds. Watch the athletic Pogba play and you will see someone take three to four times as many touches to move the ball along. Carrick never uses, nor used at his physical prime, any physical pace to move the ball. He has always used his passing and ability to find space. Watch him closely and you'll see that most of the time he spends to, maybe three, touches to move the ball - that is very little for someone with so many passes.
My argument about his top speed is his ability to track supposedly faster players; it has nothing to do with him slowing us down or upping the tempo as he has never used physical attributes for that, nor did Scholes for that matter, nor did Pirlo or Xavi either as all of them were quite slow, but on a longer run, I'd wager that Carrick would beat them but he would lose in tight corners, and that has always been his problem when teams press him hard.
Solid performance from him. So far he's the best partner for Pogba that I can see.
This, pretty much, and Pogba does do it, but he takes much longer on the ball to make those passes. Obviously, Pogba is a lot more dynamic in tight corners (very agile for his size). Carrick's ball to Mata or especially the one to Depay where ha makes a simple pass on the ground with speed into the feet in what is hardly any space at all moves the game on as he bypasses three to four attackers. Herrera, admittedly, can do similar things with his sharp turns, but he can't do it as regularly with his passing.
Both need a Herrera type player for the big matches, I think, with energy and quick feet in tight corners.
I think what Carrick offers that no one else does for us is the passing from our own half. Pogba can do it but you don't want him there and none of the others seem to be able to do it or look to do it. If wecan get the wide players showing more movement like they did today which is one of our main failings in attack then with Ibra's hold up Carrick could really offer a lot with those passes to feet from deep. He won't suit every game but I think he's got more to offer than we've currently got from him.
Agree with this. We don't have similar players like him who likes to sit deep. Not sure Schweinsteiger can do it either. Is Mensah a good enough passer or should he rather be a b2b? Insane pace on the guy.
Yeah he was a bit of a beast, think he's got a while to go before he's ready though, if he does play midfield he's probably better of as a Herrera replacement where we need energy. Like others I'm keen to see a Carrick, Pog. Herrera midfield 3 in the big games although it means dropping Mata which is a shame but that 3 just has the right balance for me if we can get more out of the wide players.
@Rossa you're trying to claim Carrick is fast, just give it up.
Exactly this. He had some nice passes tonight and did well overall but Fehnerbache offered nothing going forward and the few times Carrick was pressured he lost the ball in dangerous areas. He's good enough for games like this but I hope we don't see him against any half decent sides.
Controlled the game. Typical Carrick really. Wouldn't start him against Chelsea, but he's still a very important player to the squad. So glad he got that extension.
I think I used the word "decent" to describe his top speed and said he had awful acceleration, but on a long stretch he isn't slow. You claim he slows us down when he in fact initiates every single fast attack we have with his incisive pass through the middle our to the wings, but yeah.
If there is a midfielder out there who can provide similar passing and composure from a deep position and actually can still run around a bit then please buy him for next season. Adds so much to our attacking play.
Agree with this. It's a dilemma, but one can keep Mata on the bench and put him on if we are chasing a goal. Carrick needs someone with energy next to him though. I still maintain that his recovery pace (over distance) isn't bad, obviously not Mensah-like, but he really struggles on those first five yards which leads him too far behind. But he has always been like this.
Isn't there some Portuguese fella that is quite similar, Neves or something like that? Never watched him.
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