McTominay - what’s his potential?

Stacks said:
He [McT] is made to hold because he lacks the talent and requirements to play elsewhere. 2 different managers have identified this.

Stop with the Fletcher disrespect. Scott is plays CB for Scotland nowadays which does not suggest he is the great Scottish midfielder that was Darren Fletcher.

:lol: So reactionary. literally one performance and now he is the GOAT? if you look at his performance thread it has very little praise and much talk of his limitations and the need of an upgrade and then one top performance vs Leeds and BANG, he can be the best all of a sudden. We will need to upgrade on Scott at some point

Fletcher made premier league team of the year. Scott could never.
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I maybe have to repeat the headline? We are discussing potentials!

It’s fair enough to have different opinions, but you don’t have to behave like an arrogant smartass.

McT is pretty much still a newbie in PL. He played som really good games last season as well, but has struggled after summer. He will continue to grow and develop. I’m sure we haven’t seen the last brilliant game from him.

I’m sorry not to share your nostalgic view regarding Fletcher. Fletcher was a good player, but to me it was primarily because of his stability. McT has in my view possibility to become more prominent on the pitch than Fletcher (read: physical presence and drive forward)

I actually don’t remember Fletcher was able to dominate a game the way McT did agains Leeds, but forgive me if I’m wrong. I start to get old and my memory is not what it was.

So I still think McT has greater potential than Fletcher, mostly because there’s som indications he may have a greater upside or higher top level inboard compared to Fletcher.
 
Interesting question, potential.

The only way I can think of answering that question is to suggest that Scott McTominay played to his full potential yesterday. It's pretty hard to imagine how he could possibly have played any better.

But he displayed that performance against a newly promoted side. Can he possibly put in such a performance against a club like Spurs or Chelsea? Forget the goals...just the ability to read opposition movement, intercept the ball and carry it forward and deliver final balls.
 
Ole's screen said:
Really? You think Matic, Carrick, or Scholes peaked at 24 and didn't improve after that? In fact historically I'd say midfield players peak a lot later than 24 because it has a lot to do with anticipation and positioning which comes with experience.
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I would say all of those players were established first team at a bug club quality by the time they got to 24, I would agree that all improved but none went from good squad player to top line first team player. Mctominay at the moment is a solid squad player for a team fighting for top 4. Hoping he can make a the step up to a solid first choice centre mid for a team challenging for top 4 would be a good hope. I think hoping beyond that is a lot to expect for a player who is no longer a young player.

of course many midfielders change as they get into their late 20 and some adapt well as they slow some adapt badly. Generally though their playing style changes. And maybe this will bring out somthing else in Mctominay. But at the moment if he can step up to be more than a squad player then it would be an achievement.
 
He's already a good player and has been for a year or so now. Doesn't have the flashes of brilliance of Pogba or the nippyness of Fred but he's more reliable in possession than either and a proper box to box player.

Not a world beater by any means but he's got enough in his locker than he'd be useful at pretty much any club. Also he scored against City from about 700 yards out in the last ever moment of the last ever game of football ever that a proper crowd was allowed at.
 
He played a game that I have never seen him play like that before. He has very quick feet and had pace too. He was more aware of his positional play too but I still feel that he is not a holding midfield player at all. He does not seem to have that ability to play in that position against top teams. He is better going forward and Ole has mentioned that he used to be a striker before.
 
Nicolarra90 said:
Why that much butthurt with the lad?
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not butthurt. Just think he is being overrated and past players are being underrated
Polar said:
I maybe have to repeat the headline? We are discussing potentials!

It’s fair enough to have different opinions, but you don’t have to behave like an arrogant smartass.

McT is pretty much still a newbie in PL. He played som really good games last season as well, but has struggled after summer. He will continue to grow and develop. I’m sure we haven’t seen the last brilliant game from him.

I’m sorry not to share your nostalgic view regarding Fletcher. Fletcher was a good player, but to me it was primarily because of his stability. McT has in my view possibility to become more prominent on the pitch than Fletcher (read: physical presence and drive forward)

I actually don’t remember Fletcher was able to dominate a game the way McT did agains Leeds, but forgive me if I’m wrong. I start to get old and my memory is not what it was.

So I still think McT has greater potential than Fletcher, mostly because there’s som indications he may have a greater upside or higher top level inboard compared to Fletcher.
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Fletcher was also a great at hunting people down on the pitch, tackling and was quite quick around the pitch. He played with more energy than McTominay who is a bit lumbering. In 2009 when Fletcher (aged 25) got a 2nd yellow vs Arsenal and was to miss the CL final, many believed this could be a deciding factor to us not being able to contend with Barcelona's midfield due to his ability to track people in midfield and win the ball. This was a midfield with Iniesta, Xavi and Busquets. think about that. 25 year old Darren Fletcher's exclusion from the CL final was being previewed as a huge disadvantage to the current European champs in their upcoming match against the best midfield ever. McTominay could never
 
Fletcher would have made no difference in the final against that Barca side. It's a myth.
McTominay if he keeps playing like this would be a better player than Fletcher. He certainly was not lumbering yesterday.
 
Stacks said:
not butthurt. Just think he is being overrated and past players are being underrated
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The players are not isolated, they read everything and all comments get to them. The mental aspect of the game is never measured but it's really important, as I think there's not much ability gap between players in general.

If us as fans don't raise the morale of our players then the confidence on the pitch obviously drops and so do their performances.
 
It was a great performance from Scott against Leeds but let's not get carried away. He exploited the space that Leeds allowed and he ran the game. He has potential to be a very good squad player for us, lile Nicky Butt or Phil Neville. I hope he sticks around for the rest of his career, I really like him as a player, but he should not be starting key games for us.
 
Reminiscent of a young Darren Fletcher, both on the pitch and in the way he gets absolutely shat on by United supporters for no good reason.
 
The thing about Fletcher is that he can still put good delivery or cross to the box, I get the comparison but there are still other aspects that I see differently. I actually see Fred more similar to Fletcher than McTominay to Fletcher. McTominay reminds me of Goretzka more.
 
LDUred said:
First of all, we have to analyze the players when they were at the same age.

He's got all of the attributes Fletcher had at that age, and a few more besides.

For one he has that physicality to bully other players. While nowhere near the technical level of a Scholes, he is still slightly better in possession than Fletcher was. He doesn't dilly-dally, and while he needs a touch, it's not at the pedantic levels of a young Fletch.

He's got more of a goal threat and he looks like he's only going to get better in that department. The way he took his second goal today was very classy indeed. I've never seen Fletcher strike the ball with the same ferocity (and accuracy) that McTom has.

While he has a similar role in the team, he's not limited in the way that Fletcher was. You can see him imposing himself on the opposition as an attacking threat, not just as someone to contain them.

I don't think we are talking world class here or anything, but he's clearly a stronger prospect than Fletcher was at the same age.
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You seem to be under the misapprehension that a Fletcher comparison is negative. Fletcher was often chosen ahead of Carrick before his health issues. I like McTominay, he's big quick and strong, presses well and carries the ball forward well and has a good shot. He's also very effective playing in a low block.
What he lacks and stops him being IMO a real top level midfielder, is the ability to dominate possession in midfield. He typically makes a third or more less passes than Matic Fred and Pogba and when he plays for Scotland in defence it's a similar story. I think not being able to really put your foot on the ball and control your team's possession is a limiting ability in a player who mostly plays as a pivot. That being said there are times when McTominay reminds me of Sergei Milinkovic-Savic with his energy, if not generally creative contribution.
 
Foxbatt said:
He played a game that I have never seen him play like that before. He has very quick feet and had pace too. He was more aware of his positional play too but I still feel that he is not a holding midfield player at all. He does not seem to have that ability to play in that position against top teams. He is better going forward and Ole has mentioned that he used to be a striker before.
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Last year season 19/20?
When he was in his McTominator form for 2-3 months before his injury - carrying the ball deep in our half upwards and past by many players as far as into the box. And this is against far better PL standard defense, not Leed's championship level defense. Won us penalties which the other players either wasted or scored. Lots of players manage to stop his progress by fouls, not Leeds where he can brush them off easily. Huge threats too in and around the box, often came close to scoring in many games.

I agree he's not suited as a holding midfielder at all or at least not yet. His ability in attacking and defending plus his good positional sense meant that B2B role suits him so well to the tee. It's widely known he started as a striker at youth level. I don't recall any good reports about his performances there. Close to leaving us in 16/17.
 
UNITED ACADEMY said:
The thing about Fletcher is that he can still put good delivery or cross to the box, I get the comparison but there are still other aspects that I see differently. I actually see Fred more similar to Fletcher than McTominay to Fletcher. McTominay reminds me of Goretzka more.
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I think quality wise rather than stylistically is the reference. A player who's a major contributor but isn't a Scholes or Keane level player.
 
Salil said:
I can't agree more. He seems very composed and was making excellent forward runs yesterday. If he continues this, no reason he can't contribute 8-10 goals every season.
It's funny how people say he has no place in a title winning squad. Actually, it's these kind of players who are essential to building a team that can challenge and win regularly. A team of 11 Pogbas won't win anything. Individual brilliance gives the necessary spark but you need such players to make sure the team plays as a cohesive unit.
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Neither will a team of 11 McTs, like you said, a team requires balance. McT brings that of course
 
Scholsey2004 said:
You seem to be under the misapprehension that a Fletcher comparison is negative. Fletcher was often chosen ahead of Carrick before his health issues. I like McTominay, he's big quick and strong, presses well and carries the ball forward well and has a good shot. He's also very effective playing in a low block.
What he lacks and stops him being IMO a real top level midfielder, is the ability to dominate possession in midfield. He typically makes a third or more less passes than Matic Fred and Pogba and when he plays for Scotland in defence it's a similar story. I think not being able to really put your foot on the ball and control your team's possession is a limiting ability in a player who mostly plays as a pivot. That being said there are times when McTominay reminds me of Sergei Milinkovic-Savic with his energy, if not generally creative contribution.
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Savic is much more technical and has more flair than McTominay. I never seen a single bit what McTominay done even in one game only to be the same as Savic. Mctominay isn’t like Savic in general creative contribution. Savic’s creative contribution is more like Pogba than McTominay.

Just want to take a small note about Fletcher and Carrick there. Fletcher only chosen ahead of Carrick in 09/10, the season when Fletcher got into PFA team of the season. 08/09, both were equally being picked, even the match against inter in 08/09 Carrick was picked in both legs while Fletcher was benched in 2nd leg. Other seasons, Carrick was always ahead.
 
lex talionis said:
Interesting question, potential.

The only way I can think of answering that question is to suggest that Scott McTominay played to his full potential yesterday. It's pretty hard to imagine how he could possibly have played any better.

But he displayed that performance against a newly promoted side. Can he possibly put in such a performance against a club like Spurs or Chelsea? Forget the goals...just the ability to read opposition movement, intercept the ball and carry it forward and deliver final balls.
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He was Excellent away to PSG. Compare to Fred how he handled the yellow.
 
Stacks said:
25 year old Darren Fletcher's exclusion from the CL final was being previewed as a huge disadvantage to the current European champs in their upcoming match against the best midfield ever. McTominay could never
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McT proved just that in the first game against PSG. Even though Barcelona was a better team, Neymar and Mbappe are even better players than the players you mentioned.
 
His potential is to be a very valued member of the squad. So far he’s better in games where we have less of the ball so if he works on his short passing, he will easily be at United till the end of his career.
 
I always worry when I see Fred and McT on the team sheet, it goes back to when we had no Fernandes and Pogba was injured, we just couldn’t create chances or score goals. I like McT and against PSG two years back he was fantastic and had a great game the other day. Like Martial though he is 24. At what point do you expect a complete player? Strikers seem to get there at 26 in my opinion.
 
Plays his best football against teams that attacking oppositions,not so much against low blocks.This sums up his strengths and weaknesses.Good at breaking up play and carrying the ball.

His biggest weakness in my opinion is his first touch. He traps the ball a little bit away from him,this is not ideal for playing in a congested area. Secondly his weight of ground and short passes are either to short or too long.If he can sort out these two things, he will be more than a squad player for us.
 
He is another player that works best when he has space. With park the bus defenses he lacks the technical skill. The quick one twos. The fast quick precise passes. He along with a number of our players need to prove they can do this before they can step up a level.
 
There seems to be loads of fans in the player performance forum that want him out the club, they wait for him to have a bad game to pile on the abuse. I really don't get it, even if you don't rate him highly why wouldn't you just keep him round as a squad option? Is the reason we've been so shit post Fergie because our 5th or 6th choice midfielder isn't top quality? Very bizarre.

I like him. I don't think he has anywhere near the technical passing ability to ever be top class unfortunately, however his tackling, energy, ball carrying and physicality are all fantastic. He has a very good shot on him too, and I expect he'll start scoring from our attacking set pieces at some point because he gets his head to the most of anyone except Maguire.
 
forevrared said:
Reminiscent of a young Darren Fletcher, both on the pitch and in the way he gets absolutely shat on by United supporters for no good reason.
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fletch was much more “resisted” by united fans in his early days. Much much more than Scot. Fletch went on to be a great servant for the club and someone admired by many.

scot has great leadership skill and good quality in him. He’ll be an important player (probably not the first name on the team sheet though) for a very long period
 
There was not much defending needed from him against Leeds. It was end to end stuff and they did not pass around. It was straight to the attack and that helped him in his role. Both McTominay and Fred are quick enough to join the attack in tandem. Matic is not. It also depends on the other players to pass the ball to the midfield player making those runs. Now if Bruno or Martial did not find him then if they break and score McTominay would be slated by everyone.
That is why top coaches will always say when and if a defender joins the attack and is in space give him the ball. Because he is out of position and in a good space if he does not get the ball and if the opposing team breaks then they will be in trouble.
 
Foxbatt said:
Fletcher would have made no difference in the final against that Barca side. It's a myth.
McTominay if he keeps playing like this would be a better player than Fletcher. He certainly was not lumbering yesterday.
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we'll never know and at the time, most hailed it as a big loss. We probably would of lost the game but without him our midfield consisted of Carrick Anderson and Giggs so lacked any sort of energy, combat, athleticism or stamina. These guys looked exhausted after the first 30 mins. We saw how well Chelsea did with an energetic player like Essien in there.

I don't see how. Fletcher was able to hold down a place in one of the top sides in Europe. McTominay wouldn't start for our current side if we had a decent DMC. I doubt he'll start much in the future
 
UNITED ACADEMY said:
Savic is much more technical and has more flair than McTominay. I never seen a single bit what McTominay done even in one game only to be the same as Savic. Mctominay isn’t like Savic in general creative contribution. Savic’s creative contribution is more like Pogba than McTominay.

Just want to take a small note about Fletcher and Carrick there. Fletcher only chosen ahead of Carrick in 09/10, the season when Fletcher got into PFA team of the season. 08/09, both were equally being picked, even the match against inter in 08/09 Carrick was picked in both legs while Fletcher was benched in 2nd leg. Other seasons, Carrick was always ahead.
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Ok, I think you've misunderstood almost everything I said. I said mcTominay reminds me a bit of Milinkovic-Savic with his energy, not his creative output. I also said Fletcher was often, not typically, picked ahead of Carrick. Read the post again.
 
Wow, I am shocked that we are talking about Fletcher and McTominay as if they are world class player. Sorry, both are decent players but can be easily replaced by another.
 
Just want him to keep building on the performances, rather than a purple patch.
 
r0663664 said:
Wow, I am shocked that we are talking about Fletcher and McTominay as if they are world class player. Sorry, both are decent players but can be easily replaced by another.
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No one has said either of them are world class, but they are each good enough to play important roles in the squad at one of the top clubs in the world. Fletch put in loads of performances that were of the highest quality, even if it wasn’t every week. McTominay has likewise had some of his best matches against some of our toughest opponents.

Anyway, if it were so easy to replace them, we would’ve done so. As it stands, we’ve spent £50m+ on the likes of Fred, who is only arguably better than McTominay when he’s on form.
 
r0663664 said:
Wow, I am shocked that we are talking about Fletcher and McTominay as if they are world class player. Sorry, both are decent players but can be easily replaced by another.
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no, they weren’t world class, and we don’t need them to be.

But you are completely wrong to say they can be easily replaced.

how much have United spent on midfielders in the last decade, and how many of those midfielders are better than McT? Even fewer were better than Fletcher.

if he was playing for another team, we would be looking at £30m at least to buy him - and I’m being conservative l.

remind me how much Longstaff was quoted for

in addition, these are lads who have been brought up through the academy, have been with United their entire careers - that’s not easy to replace at all.

it’s intangible - but to have lads come through and play for the first team is extremely important for United.
 
Scholsey2004 said:
You seem to be under the misapprehension that a Fletcher comparison is negative. Fletcher was often chosen ahead of Carrick before his health issues. I like McTominay, he's big quick and strong, presses well and carries the ball forward well and has a good shot. He's also very effective playing in a low block.
What he lacks and stops him being IMO a real top level midfielder, is the ability to dominate possession in midfield. He typically makes a third or more less passes than Matic Fred and Pogba and when he plays for Scotland in defence it's a similar story. I think not being able to really put your foot on the ball and control your team's possession is a limiting ability in a player who mostly plays as a pivot. That being said there are times when McTominay reminds me of Sergei Milinkovic-Savic with his energy, if not generally creative contribution.
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I like Fletcher but the overrating is ridiculous. In no shape and form was he often chosen ahead of Carrick. In 08/09 Carrick clocked more minutes than any other midfielders in the club despite missing almost 2 months of football. He played every minute of football in the CL knockout stages and played every game in our 14 clean sheet run. He is easily our most important midfielder in that period.
 
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