[Joemo]

Not only do fans not want to see it, but it's not the style we play. Considering LVG's preference for possession football, Fellaini's coming on just felt incredibly bizarre. It's like LVG just has a couple of non-possession based options who are terrible, in order to convince us that we all actually do like his style of play.

Yeah, I meant to add that in actually. It's like he thinks "we'll hoof it for the last 20 minuutes, so that they'll appreciate the tumescent possession football I'll serve them next Saturday"

 

[Walrus]

There's not particularly a lot of exaggeration, though. People are saying he had a shite game. Which is fair, because he was.

I don't see what's particularly ridiculous about us launching long balls to him, because his height and physicality mean that it's supposed to be something he's inherently good at. It's part of why we use him. He just constantly fouls people, though. He was hopeless tonight.

I cant be bothered to dig out all the comments from here and the match day thread, but people talking about terminating his contract, it being the worst performance they have ever seen from a professional footballer etc, are exaggerations.

He was bad tonight, but in my opinion it is just as much to do with the tactics (or lack of) that we employ once he comes on. Again - work the ball into a decent crossing area and Fellaini has shown he is a threat. Hoof it up from the LB position and there really isnt much that he (or many other players) can do with it.


Anyway, right now is completely the wrong time to attempt to have any objective discussion about Fellaini (not a dig at you specifically), so that is all I will say on the matter for now.

 

[ManUtd1999]

We are creating nothing time and time again with Fellaini on the bench. That's the problem, not him.

 

[FC Ronaldo]

Stats:

0 shots.
14/20 passes.
5 failed short passes. 1 long pass failed.
70% pass completion.
0 crosses.
0 take ons.
3 ball recoveries.
2/4 aerial duels.
0 tackles.
1 interception.
0 clearances.

 

[Invictus]

Almost as bad as the legendary Bayern 'performance' which Marca refused to rate. It's really disappointing that a player like Fellaini is our plan B to be honest. Just today - Madrid brought on Benzema, PSG brought on Lucas, Atletico brought on Vietto - all brilliant footballers that can play with the ball on the ground, quick of foot and mind, and are capable of creating something out of nothing. Meanwhile we throw in a player who's useless in midfield for a possession based system, and who doesn't know what to do when the aerial route in cut out. Please get rid in the summer, or preferably in the winter, and bring in someone who consistently makes an actual impact, and doesn't necessitate an overhaul in terms of the team's approach.

 

[Cheesy]

I cant be bothered to dig out all the comments from here and the match day thread, but people talking about terminating his contract, it being the worst performance they have ever seen from a professional footballer etc, are exaggerations.

He was bad tonight, but in my opinion it is just as much to do with the tactics (or lack of) that we employ once he comes on. Again - work the ball into a decent crossing area and Fellaini has shown he is a threat. Hoof it up from the LB position and there really isnt much that he (or many other players) can do with it.

Of course there are some exaggerations. There always are whenever anyone has a shite performance.

The tactics weren't really at fault for his poor performance. I agree we should've been working the ball into crossing positions, but the problem is that when we play long balls, Fellaini is expected to be efficient in doing well with them. He's a big guy and an aerial threat. It should be his forte. Instead, he often fluffed them, and just has a frustrating knack of constantly fouling people.

To say it was the worst performance we've seen from a footballer would be over the top, but honestly, it was an absolutely terrible performance. If someone were to write a parody performance from Fellaini, based on all the aspects of his game he's regularly ridiculed for, then it'd be something close to what he delivered tonight.

 

[sullydnl]

Wasn't good but that's really our own fault for relying on him to be good in those circumstances.

 

[ManUtd1999]

I cant be bothered to dig out all the comments from here and the match day thread, but people talking about terminating his contract, it being the worst performance they have ever seen from a professional footballer etc, are exaggerations.

He was bad tonight, but in my opinion it is just as much to do with the tactics (or lack of) that we employ once he comes on. Again - work the ball into a decent crossing area and Fellaini has shown he is a threat. Hoof it up from the LB position and there really isnt much that he (or many other players) can do with it.


Anyway, right now is completely the wrong time to attempt to have any objective discussion about Fellaini (not a dig at you specifically), so that is all I will say on the matter for now.

Thanks for being sensible. We had THREE 0-0 in a row. Fellaini didn't start in any of those. People forget quickly...

 

[Walrus]

Of course there are some exaggerations. There always are whenever anyone has a shite performance.

The tactics weren't really at fault for his poor performance. I agree we should've been working the ball into crossing positions, but the problem is that when we play long balls, Fellaini is expected to be efficient in doing well with them. He's a big guy and an aerial threat. It should be his forte. Instead, he often fluffed them, and just has a frustrating knack of constantly fouling people.

To say it was the worst performance we've seen from a footballer would be over the top, but honestly, it was an absolutely terrible performance. If someone were to write a parody performance from Fellaini, based on all the aspects of his game he's regularly ridiculed for, then it'd be something close to what he delivered tonight.

The thing that gets me is that every time he is stuck up front for this reason, he doesnt do well. And yet the fans still for some reason think and expect that this is what he is meant to be good at. Fellaini isnt a striker, or a target man, despite his physical attributes. He hasnt been brought up and trained in that position or role. Its not what he did at Everton and 'why' we signed him, its not what he should be doing now. Fellaini is an aerial threat from set pieces, but he has never that I can think of, shown that he has a particular proficiency for consistently winning aerial duels with opposition CBs.

 

[sammsky1]

He was not great, but tonights dire performance has nothing to do with him.

Fed up with Fellaini being the scapegoat. Leave the poor guy alone.

 

[MThomas]

Our 2nd-3rd best player (de Gea, Herrera and him).

Thats as insane as it gets

 

[Cheesy]

The thing that gets me is that every time he is stuck up front for this reason, he doesnt do well. And yet the fans still for some reason think and expect that this is what he is meant to be good at. Fellaini isnt a striker, or a target man, despite his physical attributes. He hasnt been brought up and trained in that position or role. Its not what he did at Everton and 'why' we signed him, its not what he should be doing now. Fellaini is an aerial threat from set pieces, but he has never that I can think of, shown that he has a particular proficiency for consistently winning aerial duels with opposition CBs.

Then what should he be doing? He had a string of impressive performances in midfield last season, but he's nowhere near good enough to be relied upon as a genuine, long-term option in central midfield. Not only is he not good enough as a passer, or someone who can potentially control the game, but his style just clashes horrendously with our admittedly dull possession football. We know he's not a forward. But he's not a very good midfielder either.

 

[Cheesy]

He was not great, but tonights dire performance has nothing to do with him.

Fed up with Fellaini being the scapegoat. Leave the poor guy alone.

I don't really understand comments like this. How does a dire Manchester United performance have nothing to do with someone who put in a dire performance for...Manchester United? It was hardly solely down to him, yeah, but that doesn't excuse him from the fact that he was terrible. Especially when he was brought on as an impact sub, whose role was to change the game for us.

He's not the scapegoat either. He's one of many players being criticised, along with Rooney, Martial, Depay, Schneiderlin, Schweinsteiger, Lingard in the 2nd half, and our manager for his tactics.

 

[Untied]

He was really poor tonight, but even worse he came on and completely ruined the shape of the team. That's not necessarily his fault: I mean it wasn't his decision to bring him on to flounder about in central midfield for 20 minutes. But he was sent on with 30 minutes or so to help win the game, and judged on that basis, he was pathetic.

 

[Walrus]

Then what should he be doing? He had a string of impressive performances in midfield last season, but he's nowhere near good enough to be relied upon as a genuine, long-term option in central midfield. Not only is he not good enough as a passer, or someone who can potentially control the game, but his style just clashes horrendously with our admittedly dull possession football. We know he's not a forward. But he's not a very good midfielder either.

Unfortunately, I dont think there is a role in the current 4-2-3-1 that really suits him. In this setup you have to either be a #10 or a holding midfielder, of which I regard Fellaini as neither. Fellaini has had some very good matches for us as a DM, but its not a role I want to see him in regularly.

Last season he had a lot of good performances, and the majority were a direct result of the system we played - a proper backward-facing 4-3-3. A single holding player (Carrick), allowing both Fellaini and Herrera to play essentially as advanced box-to-box roles with plenty of license to attack, but also able to defend. Herrera was the more creative and playmaker type of the two, Fellaini was obvious the physical element.

Anyway this has all been stated before. Like I said, I dont think he is that effective in a 4-2-3-1 and I think the same about Herrera, Schneiderlin and Carrick. Basically all of our midfield. Carrick and Schneiderlin both operate most effectively as the sole holding player, and both Herrera and Fellaini operate more effectively as the more advanced CMs in a 4-3-3. I think it has hindered us substantially that LVG has insisted on changing the system to 4-2-3-1 this season and that is one of the reasons for the poor performances.

Basically as some others are also saying - it is the tactics. This sounds like an excuse, it isnt - Fellaini still played badly - but to be honest, even when he has been one of our best players it still wasnt 'good enough' for the fans. There are a lot who simply will never be happy with Fellaini in the side regardless of how well he plays (and some such as @Invictus freely admit that).

 

[Mciahel Goodman]

It's sad that people have come to accept this level of performance to the point where people will make excuses for the guy. Was never good enough to begin with -- even though he's played well in patches since joining.

What's his best position? As a striker? Nope. Not good enough. Midfielder? Nope, completely pointless. Could do a job for a lesser team, but out of his depth here.

 

[Cheesy]

Unfortunately, I dont think there is a role in the current 4-2-3-1 that really suits him. In this setup you have to either be a #10 or a holding midfielder, of which I regard Fellaini as neither. Fellaini has had some very good matches for us as a DM, but its not a role I want to see him in regularly.

Last season he had a lot of good performances, and the majority were a direct result of the system we played - a proper backward-facing 4-3-3. A single holding player (Carrick), allowing both Fellaini and Herrera to play essentially as advanced box-to-box roles with plenty of license to attack, but also able to defend. Herrera was the more creative and playmaker type of the two, Fellaini was obvious the physical element.

Anyway this has all been stated before. Like I said, I dont think he is that effective in a 4-2-3-1 and I think the same about Herrera, Schneiderlin and Carrick. Basically all of our midfield. Carrick and Schneiderlin both operate most effectively as the sole holding player, and both Herrera and Fellaini operate more effectively as the more advanced CMs in a 4-3-3. I think it has hindered us substantially that LVG has insisted on changing the system to 4-2-3-1 this season and that is one of the reasons for the poor performances.

He played quite well in a series of performances last year, but his form for us has mostly been limited to those games. Herrera has been decent at times in an attacking role this season, while Schneiderlin has generally looked solid enough despite being poor tonight.

It's very concerning though if a player can't adapt at all to a 4-2-3-1 system at all. Granted, some players will have preferred systems, but you'd expect them to be able to do something in most systems. It's not as if a player has to be a nailed on defensive mid in a 4-2-3-1 either: if he's playing beside someone like Schneiderlin, you'd expect Fellaini to be able to have a bit of attacking imperative and create some chances, or control the midfield. He's just not been very good there, and I feel like excuses based on the formation are ultimately a bit futile.

 

[Ixion]

I'm not a Fellaini fan and wish we didn't resort to using him as a plan B but to be fair to him he isn't playing every week and at best is making mostly cameos where we'll inevitabely lump it up to him and their defenders know whats coming. He can't play himself into form or anything like that.

 

[Cheesy]

I'm not a Fellaini fan and wish we didn't resort to using him as a plan B but to be fair to him he isn't playing every week and at best is making mostly cameos where we'll inevitabely lump it up to him and their defenders know whats coming. He can't play himself into form or anything like that.

Even if he's not going to be able to play himself into form though, we'd surely at least be expecting more than the dross he showed tonight when on the pitch.

 

[Walrus]

He played quite well in a series of performances last year, but his form for us has mostly been limited to those games. Herrera has been decent at times in an attacking role this season, while Schneiderlin has generally looked solid enough despite being poor tonight.

It's very concerning though if a player can't adapt at all to a 4-2-3-1 system at all. Granted, some players will have preferred systems, but you'd expect them to be able to do something in most systems. It's not as if a player has to be a nailed on defensive mid in a 4-2-3-1 either: if he's playing beside someone like Schneiderlin, you'd expect Fellaini to be able to have a bit of attacking imperative and create some chances, or control the midfield. He's just not been very good there, and I feel like excuses based on the formation are ultimately a bit futile.

I just found/find it incredibly annoying that LVG chose to change the system to one which in my view does not suit any of our midfielders - except maybe Schweinsteiger. For me, Herrera's best position is as a #8, and same for Fellaini, and Schneiderlin - like Carrick - operates best as the single holding midfielder, not part of a duo. It might seem like a fairly small change in shape, but I think it makes a hell of a lot of difference.

The proof of all this for me is that our performances this season have mostly been slow paced and pedestrian. I do think that and the change of shape are purely coincidental.

Anyway going back to Fellaini, I hate seeing us hoofing long, hopeful 60 yard passes up to him as much as anyone else. I just choose to blame LVG for deploying him that way, and presumably instructing the team to play that way. It doesnt completely exonerate Fellaini - he made some very poor decisions such as passing to Martial who was clearly in an offside position - I just dont think that Fellaini can ever really be effective that way, and that it was an absolutely stupid idea to try to play hoofball against a team who have just brought on a 3rd CB specifically to counter that tactic. For a so-called master tactician, LVG tends to get 'countered' very easily by opposing coaches.

The really ridiculous thing was that when Fellaini initially came on, Young put in a couple of great crosses - but at that point in the game Fellaini was still playing CM. Once he swapped with Rooney and went up front, we abandoned crossing and started hoofing it.

 

[Bwuk]

It's sad that people have come to accept this level of performance to the point where people will make excuses for the guy. Was never good enough to begin with -- even though he's played well in patches since joining.

What's his best position? As a striker? Nope. Not good enough. Midfielder? Nope, completely pointless. Could do a job for a lesser team, but out of his depth here.

Agree entirely. He's woeful, and has never been good enough. It's embarrassing subbing him on and hoofing it long to him.

 

[Ash_G]

The problem is though that it's hard for Fellaini to come on and not change the way you play. He's just such a different type of player that he's inevitably going to have that sort of impact on the side. Especially when he's replacing someone like Schweinsteiger, and he's a much more direct player playing in a side who often likes to go for more possession based play.

I think there's definitely a way to have him come in without completely changing how we play. For example why push him right up with the striker? Play him as a 3rd midfielder and lets continue to dominate the ball and work our way in to crossing areas where he can then get in the box and cause havoc. You look at how he was used during his best spell for us last season, he played deeper he;ping us progress up the pitch and then got in the box. For some reason we're now just sticking him right up top and then struggling to actually work our way up the pitch. Doesn't make any sense to me.

 

[Sylar]

I dont get the point of him. We bring him on for Basti which means we immediately lose full control of Midfield we had.
We brought on Young with him but then play Fellaini at DM.

We finally swap him and Rooney, but then put Fellaini up top and put Martial out wide (instead of two up top).
We hit long balls to him from our own half meaning he cant do much with it.
And when we do get it to him, hes not doing anything with it, either he doesnt jump, (or when he does he fouls the guy), or he knocks it to an opposition player or is offside.

Hes not a good plan B at all (and it really should be reserved for the last 5-10 minutes not the last 30 minutes).

 

[Cheesy]

I think there's definitely a way to have him come in without completely changing how we play. For example why push him right up with the striker? Play him as a 3rd midfielder and lets continue to dominate the ball and work our way in to crossing areas where he can then get in the box and cause havoc. You look at how he was used during his best spell for us last season, he played deeper he;ping us progress up the pitch and then got in the box. For some reason we're now just sticking him right up top and then struggling to actually work our way up the pitch. Doesn't make any sense to me.

He was a lot better in midfield last season, but the problem is that it was mostly just a good spell of form. Not to take it away from him, of course, but he was playing in a side which had managed to turn its possession football into a much more positive, attacking style. It probably helped him that the rest of the side was performing; midfielders like Cleverley and Anderson had benefited from that in the past, despite the fact that they turned out to be quite rubbish.

The problem is, though, that the style of football some believes he excels in: a direct, attacking version of our possession football, is only something we manage to deliver when we're playing well. Which essentially says to me that Fellaini is someone who isn't really particularly capable of performing well unless those around him are also doing so. Ultimately, his passing is often incredibly sloppy. As is his ball control and dribbling. His main attributes are his physicality and presence, but it just doesn't seem to fit into the side at all.

 

[Acole9]

We need to stop relying on him to get us out of trouble all the time, while he can prove to be a handful at times we need more alternatives.

 

[ZDwyr]

A very bad performance. You can tell by the fact that even his chest control was poor that it just wasn't working for him. People will obviously overreact and give him a 1 or a 2 in the ratings, want his contract terminated, "worst performance ever by a United player" etc. It was a bad match and he has to do better.

 

[Walrus]

He was a lot better in midfield last season, but the problem is that it was mostly just a good spell of form. Not to take it away from him, of course, but he was playing in a side which had managed to turn its possession football into a much more positive, attacking style. It probably helped him that the rest of the side was performing; midfielders like Cleverley and Anderson had benefited from that in the past, despite the fact that they turned out to be quite rubbish.

This isnt really a very fair argument, since Fellaini was normally one of our better players and was integral to a lot of those performances, rather than just a beneficiary of them. You (not personally) are happy to hold Fellaini responsible when the team is playing badly, then you should give him credit when the team is playing well.

Anyway I dont think it was just a good spell of form - what happened was that teams (starting with Mourinho) recognised that Fellaini was central to a lot of our play, and so set out to stop him. Chelsea played Zouma in midfield and man marked Fellaini at Stamford Bridge - it worked, but the reason it worked was rather ironically that we didnt have any Plan B for when Fellaini was taken out of the game.

We have had numerous 0-0 results without Fellaini being involved. If memory serves we had three 0-0 games on the trot where the likes of Mata and Herrera couldnt create anything, but when Fellaini came into the team we started scoring. It wasnt a coincidence. Even when he isnt playing well, Fellaini basically forces the opponent to react - even with tonights horrible display, we saw that as soon as Fellaini came on, PSV immediately had to respond by bringing on a 3rd CB to deal with him. You can blame Fellaini for that, or you can blame LVG for not being able to exploit the fact that PSV have just brought on an extra defender, by adjusting our gameplan accordingly.

 

[Devil may care]

He was like an Elephant chasing a mouse with the ball tonight, shocking stuff.

 

[Ash_G]

He was a lot better in midfield last season, but the problem is that it was mostly just a good spell of form. Not to take it away from him, of course, but he was playing in a side which had managed to turn its possession football into a much more positive, attacking style. It probably helped him that the rest of the side was performing; midfielders like Cleverley and Anderson had benefited from that in the past, despite the fact that they turned out to be quite rubbish.

The problem is, though, that the style of football some believes he excels in: a direct, attacking version of our possession football, is only something we manage to deliver when we're playing well. Which essentially says to me that Fellaini is someone who isn't really particularly capable of performing well unless those around him are also doing so. Ultimately, his passing is often incredibly sloppy. As is his ball control and dribbling. His main attributes are his physicality and presence, but it just doesn't seem to fit into the side at all.

Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of Fellaini by any means and fully agree with the limitations you've mentioned. I just think that if we are going to use him there is a better way to do it and the way we have been this season has for me been poor and that whilst he isn't an ideal player he isn't as ineffective as we're making him look or as detrimental to the team as he appears. There's a tactical element in what we do when he comes on for me which is a much bigger and more frustrating issue as it doesn't need to be that way.

It's like if you had Lampard a couple years ago and you know he's great at getting in to good positions and nicking a goal, for me, you'd bring him on as a 3rd midfielder, continue to build the play and just have him there as someone who may get in to a better position/be more clinical. However I think with LVG he would just stick him up top with the striker and not actualy play to his strengths. Like I said with Fellaini he should just slot in to midfield and get in to the box as we get in to wide areas, opening space for others as he'll attrack defenders or winning the ball.

 

[Jonno]

He might have the odd effective game, for example I was in the Stretford End last season when he helped us smash City 4-2.

However, he is not a Manchester United player, I just don't like him in our team. We're playing in the top competition in the world tonight and we're resorting to Championship football to try and get a goal.

 

[NinjaFletch]

Never ever use the word "never" when you're wrong. If you say that he "never" then you probably have NEVER seen him playing... oooops, see, I misjudged you, just like you missjudged him.

He's tall.

Despite that he does not contest that many headers (he prefers to peel off the defender and control with his chest), he does not win many headers, he wins even fewer headers without fouling somebody, and when he manages to not do all of those things and actually wins it, he has very little control of where he's heading the ball to.

He's shit in the air.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

He's tall.

Despite that he does not contest that many headers (he prefers to peel off the defender and control with his chest), he does not win many headers, he wins even fewer headers without fouling somebody, and when he manages to not do all of those things and actually wins it, he has very little control of where he's heading the ball to.

He's shit in the air.

Not sure I'd say shit, but yeah, he's not good in the air at all. Well, not for what we're asking him to do with his head and not for a man his size certainly. It's why I don't get why we lump it up to him, and why none of our players try and get near him for the knockdowns/lay-offs when we do.

He's good in the air in terms of defending corners, and running onto a cross in the penalty area (but he has to be running, forget stationary jumping), but that's about it.

 

[Roboc7]

I just found/find it incredibly annoying that LVG chose to change the system to one which in my view does not suit any of our midfielders - except maybe Schweinsteiger. For me, Herrera's best position is as a #8, and same for Fellaini, and Schneiderlin - like Carrick - operates best as the single holding midfielder, not part of a duo. It might seem like a fairly small change in shape, but I think it makes a hell of a lot of difference.

The proof of all this for me is that our performances this season have mostly been slow paced and pedestrian. I do think that and the change of shape are purely coincidental.

Anyway going back to Fellaini, I hate seeing us hoofing long, hopeful 60 yard passes up to him as much as anyone else. I just choose to blame LVG for deploying him that way, and presumably instructing the team to play that way. It doesnt completely exonerate Fellaini - he made some very poor decisions such as passing to Martial who was clearly in an offside position - I just dont think that Fellaini can ever really be effective that way, and that it was an absolutely stupid idea to try to play hoofball against a team who have just brought on a 3rd CB specifically to counter that tactic. For a so-called master tactician, LVG tends to get 'countered' very easily by opposing coaches.

The really ridiculous thing was that when Fellaini initially came on, Young put in a couple of great crosses - but at that point in the game Fellaini was still playing CM. Once he swapped with Rooney and went up front, we abandoned crossing and started hoofing it.

At some point you have to accept that he can't live off a handful or good performances and a few important goals, he did have af we very good games but he finished the season playing very poorly as wells one thing which a lot of people like to pretend never happened.

Since he signed he has been poor overall and there is currently very little point in him even coming on as a sub in any game because he looks lost and we end up just hoofing it to him. Hopefully LVG will start bringing on other players instead of him in future games.

 

[NoPace]

He needs to move as much as we need to replace him with a real CM. He's not going to start for Belgium at this rate with Witsel and Nainggolan ahead of him. He's getting worse in midfield by virtue of not playing there every week.

 

[iKeano]

I've said it before and I'll say it again... He's an Everton midfielder, not a Utd striker. That display last nite was a humiliation. His 'aerial prowess' is the biggest myth in football, the only 2 headers he 'won' last nite he knocked straight to PSV players. His touch is terrible and his distribution is pathetic. When he's not falling over he's clattering straight through the back of opponents or elbowing them in the face.
That said, can hardly blame him. He should never have been bought and he shouldn't ever be used, let alone be a plan B....or C or D!
When he comes on, it's a panic move, the manager panics, the fans panic, he panics and the team panic. Our shape was shambolic after he came on, it was like watching playground football with zero shape.
As I watched Fellaini stroll around the pitch last nite without breaking a sweat, while the famous Man Utd hoofed pointless ball after ball up the pitch, all I could think of was George Best spinning in his grave at what's become of "football taught by Matt Busby".

 

[Escobar]

If Schweinsteiger was fit to play 90 mins he wouldnt come on. We were worse than before when he came on and that means something

 

[Unlikely lad]

I think that might have been one of the worst performances of someone in a United shirt. Shocking stuff

 

[Dirty Schwein]

I was starting to warm to Fellaini but the way he is used is really getting on my nerves. The minute he comes on, you know our play will become that of the Stoke under Pulis. It's embarrassing to see that in the UCL.

 

[Parma Dewol]

I was starting to warm to Fellaini but the way he is used is really getting on my nerves. The minute he comes on, you know our play will become that of the Stoke under Pulis. It's embarrassing to see that in the UCL.

Totally agree. I used to think Fellaini could be our Yaya, the kind of player who would take a game by the scruff of the neck and make things happen with marauding runs, but no such luck.

 

[Zoo]

He is wasted here and is so much better then this plan B lump it strategy. Can see him angling for a move.