There are several "senior" players we have in the club who won't look out of place in a 2008 Spurs team. He's one of them.
10
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 43
- Goals
- 8
- Assists
- 5
- Yellow cards
- 2
- Red cards
- 1
- Status
There are several "senior" players we have in the club who won't look out of place in a 2008 Spurs team. He's one of them.
To be honest, I don't think his 2022-23 season was that much better than Martial's 2019-20 season. Both very good seasons, but hardly all-conquering.
Last edited:
?? You really do not see the difference between 19 y old, 70k a week Garnacho and 26 y old, 375k a week Rashford?
Onana not having a good run? Maguire? Dalot? AWB? Mainoo? Hojlund breaking records? Bruno not being top class but within his measures, performing? Amad? Mount getting back and scoring?
But, again, you really don't think Garnacho's run the last 7 months completly stinks out whatever Rashford is serving? I'm kind of lost for words...
I have been following Man United since the around 1980.
The big difference here is that mid 90s we were already a titlewinning team and had our best ever generation of youngsters coming through the ranks. We didn't have massive weaknesses in our squad like we do now. Then you can do sideways moves or recruit from your own ranks. The last season with Kanchelskis and Ince we would have won the league if we just beat West Ham on the final match day, or if Cantona hadn't done his kung fu back in January. We also had enough points that season to win us the league any other year in the 90s. Point is we already had by far the best squad in the country and the class of Scholes, Becks, Butt, Giggs and Keane was ready handle the midfield the next 10 years from there. We won the PL in Erics last season here and came second the season, remember. Then we came back and won the treble with Teddy in a backup role where he played by far the least of our 4 strikers.
Right now we are as far away from being title contenders as we've been since the 80s and have much bigger issues than getting rid of Rashford....and none of the five players mentioned are better LWs than Marcus, or as good.
A new management with a better man management skills should get a chance to make this group of players pull in the same direction, work their socks off for eachother and become better proffesionals. Players with suboptimal habits and mindsets are not chronics and changing their mindsets is not as hard as you would think. You just need to address it and have the right focus on it. ETH has not found the formula and has the charisma of a brick , so it would be interesting to see a new manager have a go at it. Maybe hire some people designated to work with the mental aspect of the game and guide players who need it in the right direction, in stead of just trusting that the players either are good pros or not.
It's obvious that, right now, it's not a good environment in and around the manager and squad.
Weird because I felt the same way about Hojlund. He'd be a great fit as a target man for a Dyche side, would get more service too.
Rashford seems more of a Dembele type, a luxury player who will show flashes of brilliance when he's not the face of the club and heavily relied on week in week out.
Why are you pointing the finger at Garnacho? I think every player in our squad has been performing at a level or more below their ceiling this season, and I'm blaiming ETH and his crew for it. We've had maybe two good team performances the last 12 months. Mainoo and Garnacho has been positive surprises and I look forward to see them in a team that is not as out of tune as the current one. Onana has been good.
I have different expectation to Rashford than I have to Garnacho, yes.
I expect Rashford to be more consistant, be a better rolemodel and give his all every time he's on the pitch, and I think he deserves critizism on all those points.
I always expected Garnacho to be inconsistant and it's natural for a teenager to make some bad decisions every now and then, but I certainly think he could have done better too. Both with and without the ball. He's workrate has been great though. Same with Hojlund.
Maybe you didn't understand me. You said the players all downed tools long ago and it's all fault of management.
Garnacho is working his balls off, runs on everything, tracks back and generally looks much more 375k a week than Rashford. It seems you give Rashford a free pass for just milking huge amounts of FFP money out of our budget whilst not doing the work when, Garnacho, evidently, does.
On top of that, if we continue your line of thinking,players can down tools anytime they deem tactics not right. We get in an endless loop of hiring expensive managers, who fail after 18 months, then these guys know the drill, fill up their bank accounts and wait for victim manager number umpteenth to emerge. That has to be the wrong approach. Even if you're right that the players don't believe in the manager anymore, do you really want to use that argument even in the slightest to make a manager change? The players would constantly keep the club hostage to their moods.
Last edited:
That's not how things were perceived back then though. Many pundits spoke of us not winning the league, some even placing us 4th at the time which would be great if we did it now but was a travesty back in the time. Manchester United weren't even able to secure SAF's only target at the time ie Darren Anderton (thank god).
My points are simple
a- removing toxicity and complacency trumps on everything. We're better off with a lesser player that is 100% committed to the cause then someone whose is more talented but would switch on and switch off according whether he likes the manager or not
b- balance is everything. A well balanced team would probably win over an unbalanced one filled with stars and would definitely win over an unbalanced one filled with overrated players.
We can argue whether we have the former (I think we do) but we certainly can't argue on the latter. Our defense is a mismatch of two different styles (Maguire, AWB and Lindelof are suited for a deep line, Varane, Martinez, Malacia and Dalot for a high line while Shaw can play both but is always injured), Bar Mainoo our CM is an utter mess. Most of our flank men think that there are all Ronaldos. They are lazy, they put their own interest first and would only pass the ball under torture. Even in our prime we could only afford 1 Ronaldo and to support him properly we had to build a squad around him with players like Park and Rooney fecking their careers to support him. These wingers are nowhere near to that level. Up front we only have Hojlund.
I was very critical to the likes of McT and Maguire and I still want them out of the club. However the first player I would sell if I was INEOS would be Rashford (bar of course the likes of Sancho). God knows how much we need to make a statement that NO ONE, not even Rashford, is bigger then the club
Spurs is spot on. They're exactly his level. Or Newcastle.
He's basically a less frilly David Ginola.
Do you ever envision Rashford doing what Rodryo and/or Vini did in defensive work last night ?
I think he definitely could, but I don't see him doing it. He's lost whatever spark he had.
The only way I see it happening if it's a choice between that or the bench. You could see it last night in the Real Madrid players, the commitment they had for their shirt. I miss seeing that in our team when the going gets tough
Actually yes. Especially Mitoma, I could easily see him at City.
I haven't said anyone has downed their tools either. I think most our players are doing the best they can. I'm blaiming the current management for not getting the most out of our players, for the regression of the entire squad, for not successfully implementing a system/philosophy, for not managing/coaching players optimally, for not successfully implementing a healthy culture in the squad etc... It's just a long series of chaos and bad team performances. It makes me wonder what we actually do in practice.
I also said Rashford deservedly has gotten critizism for not being consistant, for not being the rolemodel he should be and for sometimes looking a bit lazy and like it's all the same to him. I want to see what a management with better people and man management skills can do with the squad (also with Rashford and Sancho - who both have WC ceilings in my opinion), and I think we need to get rid of players that is obviously not good enough before removing them.
I’ve generally been really impressed with our players’ attitude this season.The tactics look hopelessly naive and yet they’ve kept plugging away and produced results like the 4-3 against Liverpool, or the 3-2 against Villa.
As for Rashford, he was dropped in November as he was out of sorts. Since he came back, I actually think the Rash-Hoj-Nacho frontline has looked pretty strong (given how bad the supply to them has been). He’s got his head down and played well. The problems recently have been more due to Højlund and Garnacho really struggling (understandably as they are still young players), rather than Rashford.
I take issue with your framing here.
Make no mistake, in terms of progressive passes received, Rashford (8.0 per 90m) and Garnacho (9.5 per 90m) blow Hojlund’s service out of the water (5.4 per 90m). And that’s not even factoring for overall touches.
The reality is actually that Rashford and Garnacho are abysmal progressive passers (passers in general, really) and therefore can’t find Hojlund. When we talk about a lack of service to Hojlund let’s be super explicit - that is Rashford and Garnacho’s poor passing over anything else. As wingers’ progressive passing goes, Rashford is in the 33rd percentile, Garnacho is in the 10th percentile. When you consider both of our starting wingers are that poor, Hojlund’s conundrum makes a great deal more sense.
These are pure head-down speed merchant players. The two major differences are that Garnacho tracks back more actively and is younger so will likely develop further.
At 26, this is Rashford in his final form. He’s not consistently good enough to help take us back to the top. He’s pure profit and worth a considerable amount. We must improve our progressive passing as a unit and the flanks are our biggest opportunity to do that.
While I doubt it will happen this summer, I personally think it’s time to say thank you for the memories and move forward.
this is the problem with this team.
We did it with Martial and Pogba under Jose and Rashford under Rangnick
This needs to be a high performance environment, if you have not performed in 2 years get out of the club. Sancho has been here under 2 managers + 1 interim across 3 years and has not delivered.
Luckily there was a press release back in January or maybe February saying Berrada works on this principle, and is a sound ethos for any football club.
The whole ‘let’s see these players under a new manager’ defence some people still have is wearing thin, which has started ever since Jose left. Face it, some of these players suck or worse don’t give a feck... they perform well initially then once comfy with the new manager or get a new contract they revert to type.
I hate the mental gymnastics surrounding players like Rashford where everything around him has to be simultaneously specific and even perfect in order for him to perform well, like he’s with his girlfriend, he’s 100% injury free, a specific set of players have to be around him playing a certain way, the wind is blowing north that day, the FTSE 100 is up etc.
This is not a legit argument, nobody will pay 80mp for him, that is the whole point. End of last season, maybe, but too late now nobody will pay us that much while paying him that salary based on current form. In this situation, hate the player but don't hate the game.
I seriously don't see why would we sell him this season, it's not like we have so many good wing forward option atm. Ganarcho is still inconsistent as expected of a youngster. Antony is only descent on his best day. Amad is only good as a squad player and nothing more.
Likewise Hojlund is not good enough to find Rashford or Garnacho.
Rashford did best with Martial up front because Martial can drop deep, hold on to the ball and play Raahford & Greenwood in to score goals.
Hojlund is a pure poacher & we shouldn't change the whole team dynamic to just get the best out of Hojlund when there is more important players like Garnacho we should try get the best out of.
We need to find a striker like Martial who can play forwards in.
The only one i know is Zirkzee who doesnt have the most amazing stats for a CF.
Maybe Toney is good at it too.
I agree he's not worth 80M but I think there is a slim chance we can still get close to that. For some reason Rashford is still rated highly but a lot of people.
No. I even thought in the Bournemouth game - look at how Solanke tracked his men back to the edge of his box on a few occasions. It's just not part of his game and whoever wants him in their side has to accept that.
The thing we all heard was that PSG always wanted Rashford, that is the only club that we heard in the past 2 years or so.
But in a recent report 2-3 weeks ago, PSG informed that they have no interest whatsoever about Rashford, esp. when looking at his form at United. Understanding French is not my strong suit, but that sounds like a clear no, never ever ever, to me. That would make a lot of sense since they already got rid of Neymar, Messi and Mbappe who are somewhat troublemakers in one way or another, why would they want another one of the same sort to come in?
To avoid this kind of issue where we have to stuck with a certain player with attitude in the future, we need to make a strong policy that outragious salary demand, in respect to performance, should not be tolerated and anyone who do that in the future should be kicked out of the club disgracefully.
It is just a British media rumour and typical "Let us use United for clicks" in media. If we put a decent price, everyone will just run away. If we put a low price, we may have some teams who would be ok to take a cheap punt and see what happens.
Nope - I think more than desire I think it's because he has permanently fecked up his back / hip. You see him going into a challenge and every time he clutches that lower back / hip area when he gets up.
Coventry 3:3 Man Utd
What else more to say…
World class player. 100 million would be way too low. PSG better get that 150 million ready. Then I might consider it. 200 million even. Pound sterling.
Stinker after stinker after stinker, horrid player
Absolute joke of a player.
He didn't want any part of this today.
Forson was far better.
Forson was far better.
0/10
Even as an apologist, I am lost for excuses.
Dearie me. New lows
Hopefully he takes all the time in the world to heal.
A total embarrassment and disgrace on the pitch. Ten Hag must have a real hard on for him to not sub him after a performance like that and only did it because of his injury.
He needs to be sold this summer
Useless player. Hopefully PSG are dumb enough to sign him.
3 hundred seventy five thousand pounds. per week! Why not step up in the penalty shoot out? I don care if he scores 15 goals the next 5 games, Rashford needs to go. What a unbelievbale waste of money.
He is a massive problem.
Offers absolutely nothing. Can’t wait to see the back of him if ETH or any future managers have a spine.
- Status