Maguire's persistent ball hogging

The best way to ensure that the midfielders in front of you are fully marked and ready for a press from the opposition, is to take 10 or more touches with the ball, slowly and casually strolling through the center of the pitch.

If you want a free man in the middle to pass to, move the ball from side to side with pace and purpose (aka quickly, no fecking dawdling on it) until an opportunity opens up.
 
Kid aside, maybe his persistent ball hogging is due to the lack of options in front of him?
Because you know, we're so badly coach and even the team play in positioning, receiving passes, beating your marker, good organization and proper plannings, to always give options to teammates are terrible. It's not surprising for our CBs to hog the ball for far too long.
 
Noticed everytime he gets the ball they stop harrying him and marks our midfielders instead. He doesn't have a decent long range passes and looks to pass to the wings. And our attacking fullback ala bissakas and shaws struggles to pass it forward and lump to the midfield. Gets intercepted. Rinse repeat
 
Web of Bissaka said:
Kid aside, maybe his persistent ball hogging is due to the lack of options in front of him?
Because you know, we're so badly coach and even the team play in positioning, receiving passes, beating your marker, good organization and proper plannings, to always give options to teammates are terrible. It's not surprising for our CBs to hog the ball for far too long.
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Then you move the ball quicker, even just sideways, with as few touches as possible to create some space. Doesn't help to take ten touches and then lob it out for a throw-in.
 
noodlehair said:
Fred is a better footballer and passer than Maguire. I don't think that's even remotely up for debate. It's literally Maguire's job as a centreback to give the ball to his midfield, not ignore them.
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God help us then as Fred is bang average at passing.
 
fps said:
This 100% there are bitter people on here looking to pile on to every player in every thread. With fans like these who needs enemies, he isn’t the issue and once he’s more settled in Manchester with his very young family he’ll improve further.
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Mate he’s English, comes from Sheffield and has played in England all his life. . It’s not exactly like he’s from a foreign country, can’t speak the language and his wife misses the sun.
 
wolvored said:
God help us then as Fred is bang average at passing.
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His passing is very worrying. There are a lot of things we lay people don’t understand about football but the one that’s the biggest mystery to me is playmaking. Some players have the ability to dictate the shape and tempo of a game to create attacking and defensive control. It took Carrick years to learn to do it at United, and United have lacked any such player since.
 
Pass, move, pass, move. Much easier when it's drilled into the team and they know there's always an option to pass to and where those are. Watch Citeh and marvel at how many times they move the ball with only 2 touches per player. Even in quick moves from one end of the pitch to the other. If Maguire played for Pep, he'd looks miles better than he does now. Our whole team need to move the ball quicker, not just Maguire. Heck, even our throw ins are delayed till all our men are marked tight!
 
wolvored said:
God help us then as Fred is bang average at passing.
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He's better at it than Maguire.

Not that this would be a problem if Maguire and Lindelof didn't spend half of each game passig the ball very slowly to each other before giving a hospital ball to Shaw.

The only defender I can remember us having who could hold onto the ball in an effective way was Rio...and that was because a) he was genuinely a very good technical footballer b) he would bring the ball forwards into space and commit players, then play an effective forward pass, not bring it forward and commit no one and then play it to the same place he could have the whole time anyway, and c) he didn't do it at such a slow speed that the entire game would have to stop and wait for him.

The problem is it's deveoped into a bad habbit now and both Lindelof and Maguire do it. If they get the balll near the start of the game the pace in our play immediately disappears and often doesn't come back.
 
noodlehair said:
When is someone on the coaching staff or in the team going to finally tell him to knock this off?

Can someone explain to me how it helps the team to have a centreback who can't play a simple pass without walking around with the ball for 20 seconds first? and who also seems completely incapable of actually giving the ball to his midfield at all? Nearly every pass he does play is either a hospital ball to the wing or pinged vaguely in the direction of one of the forwards.
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Or across the backline.
 
When he receives the ball you know he is going to give it to Shaw 8 times out of 10.
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This ! So irritating. He has the ball looks all around the field and then passes to Shaw. Pull my hair out.

This has to be seen by the coaches though. Can't have just one passing option.
 
He takes ages to get the ball out of his feet & never really looks in control of it, dwells on it for about 10 seconds & then either makes a 5 yard pass or gives it away.
 
We were absolutely rinsed for the fee their clown cost.

Hes bang average at best. So if United keep acquiring players like him there is no hope
 
Him and DDG must have the slowest brains in the team. It's absolutely annoying seeing them with the ball at their feet taking 10 seconds to calculate all the possible equations that would lead us into moving the ball quicker only to pass it sideways 2 seconds later, it's infuriating.
 
I think he moves it OK when he has options in front of him. Our playing out from the back is becoming an issue though. We're too slow at building from the back, it literally takes us forever once one of the centre backs picks up the ball just outside the 6 yard box to get even to midfield.

We should mix up our game, go long every now and then. Pump it down the flanks from goal kicks and let's compete. If we win it, then great. If not, then maybe we win the ball back high up the pitch from a throw in. Surely it's better than watching us dally around with the ball in our own half for minutes on end.
 
fps said:
His passing is very worrying. There are a lot of things we lay people don’t understand about football but the one that’s the biggest mystery to me is playmaking. Some players have the ability to dictate the shape and tempo of a game to create attacking and defensive control. It took Carrick years to learn to do it at United, and United have lacked any such player since.
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Our Shape and control in the Arsenal game was horrific. Watching Pogba, Matic and Maguire bunched together and try to quarterback at different time was laughable. Especially Pogba. So so awful.

Ole needs to sort it out quickly.
 
He needs to stop thinking he's the new Scholes. And please do the obvious pass when you have to not 5 seconds later.
 
Ole wont sort nothing out in his remaining time here. He bought Maguire and he will keep playing him, and give him false praise. He is too friendly with the players and wont rock the boat. Saying that Maguire was a lot better at Leicester and this shows, as well with other players there is something wrong with the training here. Bruno AWB even James were all better beginning of last year than this. Bruno since Jan
 
Bobcat said:
Come on. Hes been largely very solid for us. Worth 80 million? Not a chance, but hes not a bad player
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He really hasn't. The only times he's looked good is when the opposition can't get to him.
 
His ball hogging is made worse by that we have no cohesive understanding (pattern of play, systematic approach on how to progress the ball) among the players in our team. Everytime he gets the ball he has to attempt to find players to pass to, not know that the fullback will go there, winger will go there and the defensive midfielder will go there...

Unless you are able to assemble a team full of highly intelligent and experienced players, any manager without an ability to coach a relevant system and a cohesive understanding among players will fail.
 
Hammondo said:
He really hasn't. The only times he's looked good is when the opposition can't get to him.
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wolvored said:
Ole wont sort nothing out in his remaining time here. He bought Maguire and he will keep playing him, and give him false praise. He is too friendly with the players and wont rock the boat. Saying that Maguire was a lot better at Leicester and this shows, as well with other players there is something wrong with the training here. Bruno AWB even James were all better beginning of last year than this. Bruno since Jan
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He was solid. Whenever he didn't play in a high line. Same reason he was solid at Leicester. They also have a very good DM in Ndidi I think. I don't watch them much tbh.

I never get two decisions from Ole. Bought a very slow and static CB to play in a high line, with the slowest player at the club to cover. And bought a defensive RB to attack.
 
noodlehair said:
He's better at it than Maguire.

Not that this would be a problem if Maguire and Lindelof didn't spend half of each game passig the ball very slowly to each other before giving a hospital ball to Shaw.

The only defender I can remember us having who could hold onto the ball in an effective way was Rio...and that was because a) he was genuinely a very good technical footballer b) he would bring the ball forwards into space and commit players, then play an effective forward pass, not bring it forward and commit no one and then play it to the same place he could have the whole time anyway, and c) he didn't do it at such a slow speed that the entire game would have to stop and wait for him.

The problem is it's deveoped into a bad habbit now and both Lindelof and Maguire do it. If they get the balll near the start of the game the pace in our play immediately disappears and often doesn't come back.
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That's the biggest problem. When the ball finally reaches Shaw he is usually in a very very bad situation with no one to pass the ball to. We seem to get worse and worse playing the ball out from the back as well. Does my head in.
 
He is incredibly bad a cross field balls, I reckon at least 50% send their recipient out of play trying to head it to keep it in.
 
And who's fault is when Matic, Pogba, Fred, McT just like Maguire have no one bar Shaw or AWB available to pass to? Maybe it's Maguire's fault that we are not able to construct a well planned attack like the best attacking teams are able to do?

We are not a good coached side when it comes to scoring goals, everything is so labored and often predictable. Compare that to how Liverpool plays it's evident that the problem is bigger. If you also look past Maguire you will find that his partner is usually even worse and generally passes mostly to him, whether that is Axel Or Lindelof.
 
The ball hogging is actually not his fault.

In any functioning formation, you would have a midfielder drop deep for a close option, another midfielder opening up a wide option, the keeper and the other CB offering a safe option, and at least one wing back going wide and front to create options for a quick attack. What Maguire gets is McTominay hiding behind the opposition midfielders, Fred and Pogba doing 0 movement and at best just giving the ball back to him and wing backs dropping even deeper instead of offering good options up front.

Our circulation of the ball is literally:
Maguire to Fred, Fred back to Maguire, Maguire hogging looking for someone for 2 minutes,our defenders exchanging a couple of passes, same routine again, until Rashford, Martial or Bruno decide to come deep to take the ball from them, or if our wing backs decide to do a half-assed attempt at going forward (which in fact is our wing back going too wide, getting no help from our CM, passing the ball to a narrow space to our wing forward, and instead of coming forward as well to open up space and do quick 1-2s, they stay back wait for our attackers to produce a miracle).

Maguire is 10% of the problem here. Pogba and McT have a higher responsibility here, and so has Ole
 
Strelok said:
He was solid. Whenever he didn't play in a high line. Same reason he was solid at Leicester. They also have a very good DM in Ndidi I think. I don't watch them much tbh.

I never get two decisions from Ole. Bought a very slow and static CB to play in a high line, with the slowest player at the club to cover. And bought a defensive RB to attack.
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You are correct. Its like he either has no idea how a player plays, or was just buying British players for the sake of it and trying to make them play an alien system which they will never suit.
 
Web of Bissaka said:
Kid aside, maybe his persistent ball hogging is due to the lack of options in front of him?
Because you know, we're so badly coach and even the team play in positioning, receiving passes, beating your marker, good organization and proper plannings, to always give options to teammates are terrible. It's not surprising for our CBs to hog the ball for far too long.
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That's definitely part of it. But holding the ball for so long doesn't help create any space.

It honestly feels like he plays in such a way that he's clearly aware of his price tag and the old perception that he's some kind of ball playing centre back so he thinks it's his responsibility to be a bit creative from the back.
 
Maybe he think he is Beckenbauer, you know, he is the world most expensive defender afterall, and he is captain of a football club with probably the biggest followings in the world.
 
I can understand the hate that Maguire gets due to the mistakes he's made in multiple games this year but he's by far the most composed central defender we have at the club. He clearly has physical limitations in terms of pace and agility but I think he is superior to Lindelof in terms of passing, strength, and reading of the game. Is he worth 80m? Absolutely not, but he's still a good player and someone who could be a part of a title winning defense in an well-functioning team. I just think the way we've been set up in the several games this year exposes his weakness.
 
When I mentioned this last season before the lockdown. The Caf came down so strong on me. Today we are all realising that what I said was true. He only has 2 passes on him, one to the LB and two towards his partner in defense. He's just so slow on the ball but I wouldn't just blame him on this regard because the whole team is slow on the ball. We don't have a player who has a turn that will perplex the opponent. We don't have a forward player who can actually take it down to the touchline and swing in a cross and what's worse, we hardly have players in the box. There simply isn't any cohesion in this team. I simply don't know who to blame. Even smaller teams play a certain way but we simply have no style. It's rugged and just messy all over the park.
 
Godfather said:
That's the biggest problem. When the ball finally reaches Shaw he is usually in a very very bad situation with no one to pass the ball to. We seem to get worse and worse playing the ball out from the back as well. Does my head in.
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I think just because it becomes habitual. First two places Maguire looks now are to Lindelof and Shaw, and if neither are on his second instinct is to hold onto the ball until one of them is. Lindelof is exactly the same except sub Shaw for Bissaka.

Sometimes you see one of our midfielders come and stand between the back line to try and force themselves into possession, but even then they rarely get it and even when they do have had to vacate the space they were occupying to do so, so end up with no forward pass to play themselves. The defender's first instinct should be to move the ball forwards and if they can't it should go sideways immediately so the next defender can play it forwards before the space closes up.

More and more teams press now and that usually compounds the problem as we keep playing Matic or Pogba in the middle, both of whom themselves like to dawdle around on the ball and who also can't counter press, meaning that in the case of Matic he usually ends up stood so deep that the defence passing to him is meaningless.

We're such a bizarre team to watch as the front half of our team is very direct and high tempo, but we have games where despite having tons of possession opportunity, we only manage to get the ball to them a few times a half.
 
He isn't entirely to blame, pogba does the same and the reason being is because we are poorly coached and we rarely have players available in space or making runs behind the opposition defence.
 
Cheimoon said:
And to try and add something constructive: if a Rose, Nagelsmann or Hasenhüttl were to take over, what do you guys think would happen to Maguire? Would he able to adapt and keep his place?
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He should be the first one to be shipped out after Ole is sacked. Hopefully Lindelöf too. Worst CBs at United in the last 30 years.
 
noodlehair said:
I think just because it becomes habitual. First two places Maguire looks now are to Lindelof and Shaw, and if neither are on his second instinct is to hold onto the ball until one of them is. Lindelof is exactly the same except sub Shaw for Bissaka.

Sometimes you see one of our midfielders come and stand between the back line to try and force themselves into possession, but even then they rarely get it and even when they do have had to vacate the space they were occupying to do so, so end up with no forward pass to play themselves. The defender's first instinct should be to move the ball forwards and if they can't it should go sideways immediately so the next defender can play it forwards before the space closes up.

More and more teams press now and that usually compounds the problem as we keep playing Matic or Pogba in the middle, both of whom themselves like to dawdle around on the ball and who also can't counter press, meaning that in the case of Matic he usually ends up stood so deep that the defence passing to him is meaningless.

We're such a bizarre team to watch as the front half of our team is very direct and high tempo, but we have games where despite having tons of possession opportunity, we only manage to get the ball to them a few times a half.
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Yep completely agreed
 
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