Still find it a bit weird that Messi has played over 1000 games and yet where you rate him is if his NT wins the next game. You'd think that what hes done in those 1000 games isnt enough already. Its like gloating about Ronaldo being shit whilst he's very nearly 38.
Lionel Messi | PSG Watch
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That's... disturbing. You're probably a Tears Morganesque weirdo.
But that’s not related to me assessing said run and assist. I want to see Messi/Argentina in the mud - my post history is consistent on that regard. I’m a fan of Mbappe - to me he could be the legend killer - and I want to watch him holding Messi’s carcass on the biggest stage. Break his spine like Bane did Batman and toss him to the bushes while majority of redcafe panics and doesn’t know what to do. I dream of it. I need it in my veins.
None of that matters in regards to what I’m said about that specific run though. Gvardiol was hilariously bad there. I just don’t think much of it.
For the record, I think Messi might indeed be the best of all time and I’ve said this before.
Also I was clearly saying that because of this chucked inducing bit
You're just reading too literally into this, maybe? I mean legend killer like Randy Orton, and clearly the post was filled with tongue-in-cheek exaggerations as I also said I want Mbappe to bury Messi.
Wait, what? You're the one that started talking about machines and true magicians and Mbappe never reaching Messi's heights. All I said is I find Mbappe's own story incredible and that at 23 he has a chance to achieve something Messi never will. Then you started going about supporting casts and "Mbappe not being the sole reason for success", as if Messi has not had some of the best that ever played football around him for many of his achievements.
Nah, this stems from you getting weirdly and unnecessarily defensive about Messi despite me calling him the best. In my ideal world, Morocco would win this world cup, but I'd settle for Mbappe cooking something special for Messi in the final. Even a Giroud dagger. I'll just be happy seeing snot and tears of desperation out of Messi either way, to be quite honest.
That's... disturbing. You're probably a Tears Morganesque weirdo.
Also I was clearly saying that because of this chucked inducing bit
Nah, wanting to see him destroyed in the final doesn't mean I hold a bias against him in general
Come onIt further highlights the highly fickle and reactionary nature of the social media generation. Doesn't matter what someone has achieved over a couple decades, its all about the next game
This is the case in every sport now it's horrifying. Brain dead generation.
I get what you mean but also it’s the World Cup final, it shouldn’t make your mind up, but it should matter a lot. Not all games are equal obviously, a World Cup final is the top 5 biggest games of that 1,000, it has greater weight than 10 or 20 league games in people’s memory.
It doesn't matter how fast you are on a run, what matters is if you beat the defender/s. Actually it is more impressive if you do it without pace because pace needs space to exploit while relying on body feints, balance and anticipation does not. The best dribblers don't need pace even if it obviously helps. I also don't think that he just could've fouled him. It's an art to lure the defender in, controlling the ball just close enough for him to believe he can get to it when it is actually unachievable.
And I think you underrate Cristiano in his late United/early Madrid years. That guy was a real competition for Messi, beating players for fun and cutting through multiple opponents at once regularly. His close control and finishing with both feet was better than Mbappe's if you ask me. And in terms of close control it's not even that close. And yes, Mbappe is only 23 but I've seen him forgetting the ball, being to fast for it or stumbling more often than I've seen Cristiano until now.
Which doesn't mean Mbappe isn't exceptional in these regards. He is a very good dribbler and excellent finisher. Paired with his pace his control is incredibly hard to defend against. But his technique in itself isn't as good as those of the three players mentioned and to be honest, there are quite a few others who are better than him in this regard that are currently active or have retired not too long ago.
Not saying he's a pace merchant or anything like that, far from it. But pace and the awareness of space are his outstanding attributes, the rest isn't on the same level, albeit still very good.
You could have a Lithuanian/Bulgarian/Uzbeksitani guy literally scoring a hat trick every game of his career and still a lot of people would tell us Mbappe is better because he won the WC at 19.
What are you talking about? It wasn't impressive to me. The defending was poor. I've seen Messi do better. You won't convince me otherwise.
No, I didn't overrate pace as again, it's one of the things to look at when examining a run, I mentioned other things, and my comments were made in relation to what Gvardiol could have done to stop him. I specified that the top speed wasn't particularly impressive because Gvardiol kept up with him and had ample opportunity to foul him since Messi's close control and change of pace was something he struggled with. He didn't, I found it comical and now I'm dealing with "it's an art to lure the defender-" babble on redcafe because I didn’t think it was anything crazy. Unbelievable.
"the best dribblers don't- need" is also "2+2" type babble I'm not interested in.
Yes sure. Are you sure you're a fan Mbappe or...Nah, wanting to see him destroyed in the final doesn't mean I hold a bias against him in general
My bad, based on your previous posts I assumed babble is the one thing you're interested in.
To some extent i agree. But he's 35 ffs. It just he's still able to make those moments, but he's best chance to strut his stuff in the wc was in 2014. His decline is very noticable, but he's can still produce moments of genius. I just feel he's too old to try and make this the ultimate deciding factor. And even if he wasnt old it would be a bit fickle anyway.
Yes, your bad. Assumptions is something this thread does often and leads to babble like what you've posted - which I'm in fact not interested in
Have a good dayThat doesn’t really make sense, if the Bulgarian guy is scoring a hat trick every game of his career then Bulgaria are qualifying for the World Cup first of all, then probably winning it, he qualifies his Bulgarian team for the Champions League and they win their group and Real Madrid, PSG and Man City are trying to sell their souls to sign him.
I don't see him winning the WC, France are too good.
It would be a fairy tale ending, but I don't see them beating France.
Morocco has to play perfect today too and they just don't have enough.
It would be a fairy tale ending, but I don't see them beating France.
Morocco has to play perfect today too and they just don't have enough.
Assumptions is something this thread does often and leads to babble like what you've posted - which I'm in fact not interested in
Now we only need to find out what you're interested in, since I can tell by your posts it is definitely not football
I feel like the poster you're quoting has undermined a valid point by going for hyperbole. A better way of getting his point across would be to say that Erling Haaland could score 50 goals in the Premier League this season and win the Champion's League but won't get near the Balon d'Or because Norway aren't as good as Argentina or France.
On youtube comments he's become LM10. No. Please no. CR7 is better.
Also PR7 and CR37 were memorable. Can't do anything with LM10 till he turns 40.
Also PR7 and CR37 were memorable. Can't do anything with LM10 till he turns 40.
I always root for Messi’s downfall but if we are all honest with ourselves he is the GOAT. His performances during this WC, at his age, have got me starting to feel he deserves a WC and might get my support.
Agree to disagree, Mbappe and Ronaldos technique is pretty close both Neymar and Messi for example have better technique than both, both Mbappe and Ronaldo were great footballers but also both relied on athleticism so I don’t even get your point overall.
Case in point for this is Giggs. He was lighting quick as kid, slowed down a bit after those hamstring injuries in his teens and twenties and obviously lost pace progressively through his 30s, but at 39 he could still sell a defender with a feint.
Well, the goal were he ran throught the right flank and assisted Julian was the most reminiscent of the young Messi. He's got that amazing balance but those type of runs are not as often as before, anyway he's having a great tournament and can't wait to see how France will handle him.
There was a great video of him happy drunk on the team bus during the parade (in 2009 iirc?).
Hope he wins it so I can see that laughing ninja turtle Mbappe crying.
Messi haters is truly something special.
This is it folks. 1 Match. Where it will be decided if he is the goat or not. Everything accumulates down to this single moment.
Doesnt matter if he scores or assists in the final, he MUST win. A goat must have a WC win.
Like Maradona. Even though he cheated against England. (Would love to see the reaction if Messi did the same thing).
This is it folks. 1 Match. Where it will be decided if he is the goat or not. Everything accumulates down to this single moment.
Doesnt matter if he scores or assists in the final, he MUST win. A goat must have a WC win.
Like Maradona. Even though he cheated against England. (Would love to see the reaction if Messi did the same thing).
That would be an amazing twist in the tail of the goat debate if Argentina win through a last minute Messi handball goal.If he gets injured and the team wins then its even more meaningful
Messi did cheat and score a goal with his hand reminiscent of Maradona. In 2007, on the day of Saint Tamudo
@carvajal
@carvajal
15 years!Messi did cheat and score a goal with his hand reminiscent of Maradona. In 2007, on the day of Saint Tamudo
@carvajal
Look how we've ended up
I'm still going with Argentina but I think many have already sold their souls to Mbappe.
15 years!
Look how we've ended up
I'm still going with Argentina but I think many have already sold their souls to Mbappe.
Next flavor of the day.
He does have the means to be the next great though. We'll see.
@giorno who would you like to see win the final?
Argentina tbh
Cheers
How would you compare Messi and Maradona? Interested to hear your insight on the two.
I find it almost impossible to pick between the 2.
Those stats, nothing new to a lot of us tbh. Thats why i laughed when some people said Cr7 is more complete and/or only goals matters
I think the French players probably have more to fear from him. France don’t have a genius in their side if it becomes a tight game.
Brazil are every bit as good as this French side if not better and Argentina beat them in the last final. 3-0 against a very good Croatia side was quite ominous plus Argentina barely got out of second gear.
great read
I'll go through that at some point but I don't like comparisons across sports. It's just so arbitrary. Having said if one actually watches the sport rather than just focusing on team achievements, G/A etc it's obvious that Messi is comfortably the best footballer od the last 2 decades (my time watching football).