Lewis Hall - Newcastle Player | Bye Bye Boehly

WeePat said:
That’s exactly the sort of role I was thinking when I said he could bring something to the LB role that neither Chilwell or Cucurella have in their skillset. I think he’d be incredible there and could turn into one of the best in the league but I also understand if he says ‘nope
I’m a midfielder, either play me in my natural position and let me go to a team that will’.
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Sounds like a good option for us if Tierney were to leave, with Timbers injury as well. Not that I think it would be likely.
 
Sounds like it’s Hall pushing for the move. Sigh.

 
WeePat said:
Sounds like it’s Hall pushing for the move. Sigh.

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What’s the realistic alternative, mate? Even if we send him out on loan and sell Cucurella by the time he returns next summer he’d still have Chilly and Maatsen to contend with. And in midfield there are even more competitors for a place.

It sucks, but I’m not sure what the Hall lovers want the club to do. And I mean realistically aka “just sell BOTH Chilwell and Cucurella” ain’t happening.
 
I think saying we put him up for sale is incorrect. I think it would be more accurate to say teams, including the one that wanted him on loan, wants purchase or an option to buy, and we have responded with “yeah? Then this is our price”

If I were him I would want to play in my natural position as well. One of the reasons you cl e to Chelsea’s academy is to make it to big time football… not necessarily Chelsea. Chelsea fans are going to have to get used to this because we are going to be scouting and developing talent on multiple levels… which means we will be selling a LOT of very good players.

BUT I think the days of almost ignoring the academy and letting super high class talents leave for 5m … or even free… are probably done.

If or when we make the jump back to Europe I could see a 20 yr old Hall fighting for time in the midfield. I could definitely see him having a pathway at LB, do I’d like him to stay, but do good business while still doing right by the players wishes … and people will keep signing up: that’s the formula.
 
Would love him here, the ideal Shaw replacement.
 
Orc said:
What’s the realistic alternative, mate? Even if we send him out on loan and sell Cucurella by the time he returns next summer he’d still have Chilly and Maatsen to contend with. And in midfield there are even more competitors for a place.

It sucks, but I’m not sure what the Hall lovers want the club to do. And I mean realistically aka “just sell BOTH Chilwell and Cucurella” ain’t happening.
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No, as is my post above, they better get used to sales. It will Happen a lot.

The old regime would have never given Hall a path, he would have left for like 3m nearly out of contract to somewhere, then get sold to a Newcastle.

If he wants to leave, I get it: 35m
 
GlasgowCeltic said:
good for him for pushing to leave
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You don’t have to “Push” to leave Chelsea. They are generally very willing to work with players on how they shape their careers, in return he JUST signed a 6 year extension a few days ago?

I think Newcastle (how did the auto correct on this thing make Newcastle into “my asylum”?)* being interested is a game changer for him. But by signing the extension he’s essentially saying “I would love to be part of your project, please pay my team appropriate compensation and I’ll be right there.

Fair enough
 
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Orc said:
What’s the realistic alternative, mate? Even if we send him out on loan and sell Cucurella by the time he returns next summer he’d still have Chilly and Maatsen to contend with. And in midfield there are even more competitors for a place.

It sucks, but I’m not sure what the Hall lovers want the club to do. And I mean realistically aka “just sell BOTH Chilwell and Cucurella” ain’t happening.
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He’s 18. You don’t cash in on an 18 year old HG gem this quickly. Unless of course he’s the one pushing for the move. Maatsen doesn’t seem like he’ll be used as LB by Poch.

You say Hall lovers as if not wanting him to be prematurely sold is somehow wrong or weird. If he wants to leave, then fair enough but that is only reason that justifies selling him to a direct rival.
 
WeePat said:
He’s 18. You don’t cash in on an 18 year old HG gem this quickly. Unless of course he’s the one pushing for the move. Maatsen doesn’t seem like he’ll be used as LB by Poch.

You say Hall lovers as if not wanting him to be prematurely sold is somehow wrong or weird. If he wants to leave, then fair enough but that is only reason that justifies selling him to a direct rival.
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No, what I mean by Hall lovers is the supporters of ours on social media acting like we’re selling a world beater. He’s still just a kid who may be great in a few years time. Or he may not be. Some are acting as if he‘s a generational talent.
 
Bluelion7 said:
You don’t have to “Push” to leave Chelsea. They are generally very willing to work with players on how they shape their careers, in return he JUST signed a 6 year extension a few days ago?

I think we asylum being interested is a game changer for him. But by signing the extension he’s essentially saying “I would love to be part of your project, please pay my team appropriate compensation and I’ll be right there.

Fair enough
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Honestly strange how people die on the hill of us being bad for young players.

Developing as a young player as Cobham is as close to a guarantee of a top flight career as it's possible to get.
 
Orc said:
No, what I mean by Hall lovers is the supporters of ours on social media acting like we’re selling a world beater. He’s still just a kid who may be great in a few years time. Or he may not be. Some are acting as if he‘s a generational talent.
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I think he is going to be great to be honest but the blow has been softened in my eyes after hearing he's a boyhood Newcastle fan.

If I developed at another club and Chelsea came in for me I'm making that move, can't really begrudge him for doing the same.
 
WeePat said:
He’s 18. You don’t cash in on an 18 year old HG gem this quickly. Unless of course he’s the one pushing for the move. Maatsen doesn’t seem like he’ll be used as LB by Poch.

You say Hall lovers as if not wanting him to be prematurely sold is somehow wrong or weird. If he wants to leave, then fair enough but that is only reason that justifies selling him to a direct rival.
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Newcastle is a good project and they seem to want him to contribute on the field NOW… and his family are Newcastle supporters and he likes the team.

No Shame in that. When it was other teams he was happy to go on loan to grow and prove himself, then fight for a spot here.

Newcastle may be different. I don’t think Chelsea is “trying” to sell him off.

But if you stand in the way of big opportunities for your players, then it will hurt the reputation we’ve built up that makes so many people want to go through Cobham in the first place.
 
Dancfc said:
Honestly strange how people die on the hill of us being bad for young players.

Developing as a young player as Cobham is as close to a guarantee of a top flight career as it's possible to get.
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Players see that. It IS weird that fans don’t get it.
 
Bluelion7 said:
Players see that. It IS weird that fans don’t get it.
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They seem stuck in the early Roman period where we admittedly did have a shocking record at getting youth into the first team or develop them into top flight players, although we did get unlucky in that the one that would have made it had such horrific injury luck that caused him to initially retire at 21 (he came out of retirement but his injuries already did him as far as making it at Chelsea were concerned).

Our record of recent years however has been nothing short of top class, since 2016 we've had an academy player become part of the squad for the upcoming season every year bar one and we're also producing multiple top flight quality players that are competing strongly in and in some cases (Tomori) winning the major top flight leagues.
 
Orc said:
No, what I mean by Hall lovers is the supporters of ours on social media acting like we’re selling a world beater. He’s still just a kid who may be great in a few years time. Or he may not be. Some are acting as if he‘s a generational talent.
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He’s a gem, honestly. Losing him is a big blow. Pretending it isn’t is what I find really weird. Hall is in the same tier of talent as Colwill and James as the crème de la crème of Cobham.

As I said, the only thing that justifies it is if he’s pushing for the move, which I doubt considering he reportedly signed a 6 year deal and had agreed to a loan to Palace. No player would do all of that and then push for permanent move away.
 
WeePat said:
He’s a gem, honestly. Losing him is a big blow. Pretending it isn’t is what I find really weird. Hall is in the same tier of talent as Colwill and James as the crème de la crème of Cobham.

As I said, the only thing that justifies it is if he’s pushing for the move, which I doubt considering he reportedly signed a 6 year deal and had agreed to a loan to Palace. No player would do all of that and then push for permanent move away.
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I disagree from what I’ve watched of him in our matches. He doesn’t jump off the TV screen like James and Levi did for me. He looks good for sure but not a sure-fire star, imo.

I’m just trying to imagine a scenario over the next few years where we think “damn, we miss Lewis Hall.” We’re jam packed at every position he would play in. And jam packed with top quality young players to make things worse for him.
 
Not surprised ETH isn't looking at this player. Some of his signing and our scouting department signing has been questionable. Hall would be a fantastic understudy to Shaw. Hopefully, we put in a bid for him.

Pochettino has to many left back at Chelsea, so I understand why he may not want to keep hold of him at the moment. I believe it might be a mistake for chelsea on the long run. Cucurella should be the one he sells, but I believe Cucurella has better relationships among players in his team and experience, which is why he may stay.

Moreover, Pochettino wants players That wants to be there and play at Chelsea. Perhaps hall doesn't want to be there since he is a Newcastle fan and asked to leave.
 
Why not develop him? Cobham might be a great guarantee for a career but I don't get why Chelsea frequently show disinterest in bright talents they create. I get it's pretty on the balance sheet but he looked a very promising left back with a great cross on him. Surely the main idea of an academy is to produce players with a love and loyalty to the club that will stay a long time and sales are the second option.

For me, I wouldn't want to see Mainoo leaving for 35 million at this stage because as nice as that chunk of money is, I want to see our academy produce stars I am actually invested in. I'd rather risk losing a bit of value for the chance to produce a player.

For me Chilwell and Cucurella are no great shakes. Chilwell is decent but he's not exactly a world beater. No reason to think he is so good that a young talent has no pathway. A team like Chelsea will always have a decent player or two in a starting position. If that's good enough to write off a youngster the chances of them breaking through are tiny.
 
Orc said:
I disagree from what I’ve watched of him in our matches. He doesn’t jump off the TV screen like James and Levi did for me. He looks good for sure but not a sure-fire star, imo.

I’m just trying to imagine a scenario over the next few years where we think “damn, we miss Lewis Hall.” We’re jam packed at every position he would play in. And jam packed with top quality young players to make things worse for him.
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That’s because he’s played out of position. He grew up playing midfield, but has almost exclusively played LB in the first team, but even still statistically he’s better than both Cucurella and Chilwell and provides a unique skillset to the role that we don’t have in the squad and would cost a helluva lot of money to buy on the market. The fact he performs better than actual LBs we paid huge money as an 18 year old midfielder is crazy. Letting talent like that walk for fecking £35M, to a rival club at that, is genuinely absurd.

We absolutely will up saying ‘damn we miss Hall’ and it’ll be sooner than in a few years.
 
I was laughed at earlier by that Duffer for mentioning the Hall family were huge toon fans, this move will most likely happen.Boehly fully aware Newcastle are the big boys here.
 
WeePat said:
That’s because he’s played out of position. He grew up playing midfield, but has almost exclusively played LB in the first team, but even still statistically he’s better than both Cucurella and Chilwell and provides a unique skillset to the role that we don’t have in the squad and would cost a helluva lot of money to buy on the market. The fact he performs better than actual LBs we paid huge money as an 18 year old midfielder is crazy. Letting talent like that walk for fecking £35M, to a rival club at that, is genuinely absurd.

We absolutely will up saying ‘damn we miss Hall’ and it’ll be sooner than in a few years.
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I guess I just have more faith in Chilly and Maatsen than you do. I don’t see Hall becoming better than either of them over the next 3-5 years.

And in midfield as you know we’ve got like 6 super talents that are 22 or younger. So in what way would we miss Hall?
 
My sense is that something big must have changed in the club's summer strategy, perhaps Chelsea never thought they would pay so much for Caicedo and/or didn't plan on signing both him and Lavia and then changed their minds.

You don't sign an academy kid to sign a six year contract with the plan to sell him a week later. I don't think I've ever seen that happen. And you don't sign that contract as the academy kid and his agent if you think you're leaving on a permanent deal.

All in all, it suggests that Chelsea may be flying fairly close to the sun financially, whether that is in terms of cash flow or FFP, because they're clearly not doing this purely for footballing reasons.

On a footballing level, selling Hall seems foolish to me simply because one of the big tactical trends of the last few years has been fullbacks that can invert into midfield and he seems like a perfect candidate to excel in that kind of role while still doing a respectable job defensively. Those players don't grow on trees. I think I would rather have his next five years than Chilwell's or Cucurella's.
 
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Orc said:
I guess I just have more faith in Chilly and Maatsen than you do. I don’t see Hall becoming better than either of them over the next 3-5 years.

And in midfield as you know we’ve got like 6 super talents that are 22 or younger. So in what way would we miss Hall?
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Maatsen hasn’t played a single minute at LB under Poch. He’s out of the equation here. Poch sees him as a LW and AM. Hall’s competition is Chilwell and Cucurella and I can guarantee you we’ll be on the market for a LB in 12 months after we offload Cucurella, and I’d argue he’s already pretty level with Chilwell, albeit they excel at different things. I also rate Hall a lot higher than Maatsen as a LB.
 
Abraxas said:
Why not develop him? Cobham might be a great guarantee for a career but I don't get why Chelsea frequently show disinterest in bright talents they create. I get it's pretty on the balance sheet but he looked a very promising left back with a great cross on him. Surely the main idea of an academy is to produce players with a love and loyalty to the club that will stay a long time and sales are the second option.

For me, I wouldn't want to see Mainoo leaving for 35 million at this stage because as nice as that chunk of money is, I want to see our academy produce stars I am actually invested in. I'd rather risk losing a bit of value for the chance to produce a player.

For me Chilwell and Cucurella are no great shakes. Chilwell is decent but he's not exactly a world beater. No reason to think he is so good that a young talent has no pathway. A team like Chelsea will always have a decent player or two in a starting position. If that's good enough to write off a youngster the chances of them breaking through are tiny.
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I agree with literally everything you wrote. It’s spot on.
 
Powderfinger said:
My sense is that something big must have changed in the club's summer strategy, perhaps Chelsea never thought they would pay so much for Caicedo and/or didn't plan on signing both him and Lavia and then changed their minds.

You don't sign an academy kid to sign a six year contract with the plan to sell him a week later. I don't think I've ever seen that happen. And you don't sign that contract as the academy kid and his agent if you think you're leaving on a permanent deal.

All in all, it suggests that Chelsea may be flying fairly close to the sun financially, whether that is in terms of cash flow or FFP, because they're clearly not doing this purely for footballing reasons.

On a footballing level, selling Hall seems foolish to me simply because one of the big tactical trends of the last few years has been fullbacks that can invert into midfield and he seems like a perfect candidate to excel in that kind of role while still doing a respectable job defensively. Those players don't grow on trees. I think I would rather have his next five years than Chilwell's or Cucurella's.
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The bolded bit is exactly what I’ve been saying. Totally agree.
 
WeePat said:
He’s a gem, honestly. Losing him is a big blow. Pretending it isn’t is what I find really weird. Hall is in the same tier of talent as Colwill and James as the crème de la crème of Cobham.

As I said, the only thing that justifies it is if he’s pushing for the move, which I doubt considering he reportedly signed a 6 year deal and had agreed to a loan to Palace. No player would do all of that and then push for permanent move away.
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Ohhh see, no, I don’t see him as being THAT good. I mean, I don’t mind it being bandied about while the fee is being discussed …
 
Abraxas said:
Why not develop him? Cobham might be a great guarantee for a career but I don't get why Chelsea frequently show disinterest in bright talents they create. I get it's pretty on the balance sheet but he looked a very promising left back with a great cross on him. Surely the main idea of an academy is to produce players with a love and loyalty to the club that will stay a long time and sales are the second option.

For me, I wouldn't want to see Mainoo leaving for 35 million at this stage because as nice as that chunk of money is, I want to see our academy produce stars I am actually invested in. I'd rather risk losing a bit of value for the chance to produce a player.

For me Chilwell and Cucurella are no great shakes. Chilwell is decent but he's not exactly a world beater. No reason to think he is so good that a young talent has no pathway. A team like Chelsea will always have a decent player or two in a starting position. If that's good enough to write off a youngster the chances of them breaking through are tiny.
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Why are you imagining disinterest? We wanted him to get a premiere league level loan, then compete for a spot that might well be cleared out a bit next year. A Prem level loan with starting minutes is a serious achievement at 18

Musiala, as a recent example, wasn’t kicked out of Cobham. He just wanted to go back to his native Germany and we did t want to be jerks about standing in his way.

If Hall actively wants Newcastle and they think he can play for them in their rotation right now… that is a completely different situation that just “trying to send him away”

A lot of academies are like escaping prison to get out of.The fact that Cobham has academy graduates on top level teams throughout the world is why we get the Lewis Halls of the world. Family of die hard toons. They had a super talented son, so they sent him … where? Oh, right, Cobham.

What we DO need is buyback price clauses if we think the player might be a fit in the future.

We got pretty lucky gettingOlise back for as little as we did.

Bashir Humphreys is in our plans, Hall is in our plans. Casadei counts as academy now and is in our plans, Chalobah can stay in our plans if he is ok with his role, so can Gallagher: we want them but that is up to them. We had planned on Mount being in our plans, James is our captain, Olise is Cobham academy, Colwill is s starter, Broja could still end up a starter. Burstow got a senior squad number.

Thats 10 academy graduates that we expected to be major parts of the first team, on the first team, or right in the verge of the first team. 3 more, like Alfie Gilchrist made the pre season tour roster.

I don’t think theres another Prem side that’s even close to that in terms of academy representation in their squad.
 
Bluelion7 said:
Why are you imagining disinterest? We wanted him to get a premiere league level loan, then compete for a spot that might well be cleared out a bit next year. A Prem level loan with starting minutes is a serious achievement at 18

Musiala, as a recent example, wasn’t kicked out of Cobham. He just wanted to go back to his native Germany and we did t want to be jerks about standing in his way.

If Hall actively wants Newcastle and they think he can play for them in their rotation right now… that is a completely different situation that just “trying to send him away”

A lot of academies are like escaping prison to get out of.The fact that Cobham has academy graduates on top level teams throughout the world is why we get the Lewis Halls of the world. Family of die hard toons. They had a super talented son, so they sent him … where? Oh, right, Cobham.

What we DO need is buyback price clauses if we think the player might be a fit in the future.

We got pretty lucky gettingOlise back for as little as we did.

Bashir Humphreys is in our plans, Hall is in our plans. Casadei counts as academy now and is in our plans, Chalobah can stay in our plans if he is ok with his role, so can Gallagher: we want them but that is up to them. We had planned on Mount being in our plans, James is our captain, Olise is Cobham academy, Colwill is s starter, Broja could still end up a starter. Burstow got a senior squad number.

Thats 10 academy graduates that we expected to be major parts of the first team, on the first team, or right in the verge of the first team. 3 more, like Alfie Gilchrist made the pre season tour roster.

I don’t think theres another Prem side that’s even close to that in terms of academy representation in their squad.
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Casadei is not academy player.

Ofcourse if every team can detach from reality and project who all might be part of first te squad while including their ex players then every team will have 10+ academy players in their squad.
 
Bluelion7 said:
Why are you imagining disinterest? We wanted him to get a premiere league level loan, then compete for a spot that might well be cleared out a bit next year. A Prem level loan with starting minutes is a serious achievement at 18

Musiala, as a recent example, wasn’t kicked out of Cobham. He just wanted to go back to his native Germany and we did t want to be jerks about standing in his way.

If Hall actively wants Newcastle and they think he can play for them in their rotation right now… that is a completely different situation that just “trying to send him away”

A lot of academies are like escaping prison to get out of.The fact that Cobham has academy graduates on top level teams throughout the world is why we get the Lewis Halls of the world. Family of die hard toons. They had a super talented son, so they sent him … where? Oh, right, Cobham.

What we DO need is buyback price clauses if we think the player might be a fit in the future.

We got pretty lucky gettingOlise back for as little as we did.

Bashir Humphreys is in our plans, Hall is in our plans. Casadei counts as academy now and is in our plans, Chalobah can stay in our plans if he is ok with his role, so can Gallagher: we want them but that is up to them. We had planned on Mount being in our plans, James is our captain, Olise is Cobham academy, Colwill is s starter, Broja could still end up a starter. Burstow got a senior squad number.

Thats 10 academy graduates that we expected to be major parts of the first team, on the first team, or right in the verge of the first team. 3 more, like Alfie Gilchrist made the pre season tour roster.

I don’t think theres another Prem side that’s even close to that in terms of academy representation in their squad.
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You're making a lot of excuses. We can all play the game of look at all these great academy prospects we have. Whether they are or not. I could list 8 of ours that are supposedly in plans when in reality about 1 or 2 probably realistically are.

Actions speak louder than words and what I'm talking about is players that actually make it at Chelsea and get decent investment in their chances at first team level. Only Mount and James have done anything substantial for the club and they broke through ages ago yet we're constantly hearing about Cobham.

Producing talent yes, making money.. probably, a decent pathway...not really. Be interesting to see how Colwill does or whether he's jettisoned fairly quick with all the money flying around.

I thought at OT he was your best player last year. That's what baffles me. If an 18 year old rocks up at OT and plays that well they have ability, why you would even think of selling says it all about opportunities. Then again, let's see, a loan would actually be a good play.
 
Bluelion7 said:
Why are you imagining disinterest? We wanted him to get a premiere league level loan, then compete for a spot that might well be cleared out a bit next year. A Prem level loan with starting minutes is a serious achievement at 18

Musiala, as a recent example, wasn’t kicked out of Cobham. He just wanted to go back to his native Germany and we did t want to be jerks about standing in his way.

If Hall actively wants Newcastle and they think he can play for them in their rotation right now… that is a completely different situation that just “trying to send him away”

A lot of academies are like escaping prison to get out of.The fact that Cobham has academy graduates on top level teams throughout the world is why we get the Lewis Halls of the world. Family of die hard toons. They had a super talented son, so they sent him … where? Oh, right, Cobham.

What we DO need is buyback price clauses if we think the player might be a fit in the future.

We got pretty lucky gettingOlise back for as little as we did.

Bashir Humphreys is in our plans, Hall is in our plans. Casadei counts as academy now and is in our plans, Chalobah can stay in our plans if he is ok with his role, so can Gallagher: we want them but that is up to them. We had planned on Mount being in our plans, James is our captain, Olise is Cobham academy, Colwill is s starter, Broja could still end up a starter. Burstow got a senior squad number.

Thats 10 academy graduates that we expected to be major parts of the first team, on the first team, or right in the verge of the first team. 3 more, like Alfie Gilchrist made the pre season tour roster.

I don’t think theres another Prem side that’s even close to that in terms of academy representation in their squad.
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Completely understood young player s point of view that they need first team football and could earn more money than what we offered to them now.

I mean Billy Gilmour could have played same amount of minutes or more if he stayed with us last season instead chose to brighton. Still he is bench player for them.

Take colwill, him too not started for Brighton last season after he forced the loan move. If he stayed with us he could have started more games for us than for Brighton.

We are trying to give game time to players but also players need to be patient. Not only us but all the big teams always focused on what they want now than developing youngsters by giving chance for sake of it.

Albeit hall played well in attacking phase he still need lot of improvement in defensive phase. Made mistakes like any youngsters mostly do.

Youngsters who backed themselves and move on to new team then also for them same things could happen. There is always tough competition for places in top sides. It's upto them to take the challenge.

But in midtable teams things won't be much demanding. If I am hall I will goto midtable team like palace or west ham not newcastle. Sign contract with release clause and build the career from earning first team place and get playing time by representing them.

Edited: This new regime still could sell chalobah,Gallagher if acceptable offer came. That's how they run it. Fans can't have every thing they wanted. When enjoyed of spending 900mn in three windows there is always things like this could happen.

As for ffp if above sales goes through we will be completely positive and still could spend 150 mn more without any problem.
 
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Bluelion7 said:
Ohhh see, no, I don’t see him as being THAT good. I mean, I don’t mind it being bandied about while the fee is being discussed …
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He’s a honestly a top prospect. Tell me another 18 year old who can statistically outperform two big money signings in their own natural positions when he’s played out of position. It’s especially crazy when you consider these were his very first steps into mens football. We will regret it big time if we sell him. He’ll flourish at Newcastle and he’ll do for them what neither Chilwell and Cucurella can do for us.
 
Newcastle feel £35M is ‘astronomical’. It’s more than what Arsenal are quoting them for Tierney. Cool story. Go and buy Tierney.

 
Sounds like Chelsea have reet fecked up this situation.
 
Rico Lewis and Lewis Hall will be the best English full backs in a few years.
 
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