Are you sure? maybe for those who understand. Words like "United will ruin even Maradona's talents" will mean exactly that for majority of people and most of the time They will defend what They love (United). I can't see his words helping Pogba's situation to be honest, if He has one shit game all hell will break loose. But fair enough, We'll see.
Let's not buy Raiola players again - ever
- Thread starter ThomasEmil
- Start date
Fair enough, and for some reason I feel like Woodward/United have enough experience to know this as well. Chances are - they are not taking Raiola comments as painfully as we are?
What do you mean by "help Pogba"? There is only two outcomes here, either United build a winning foundations or Pogba is out, there is only answer that can be given and it's from the club with actions, whether hell break loose or not isn't the issue here.
Ok well if we’ve got to the end and we both agree that Raiola is a classless prat but united need to sort their act out then that’s probably fair fecks
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In an open and free European market, I don't think the law would allow restrictions on salaries and fees.
It's also an highly questionable point. Players and clubs need representation and that function will be remunerated.
FIFA is considering it https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...ned-limits-on-agent-fees-loan-deals/40200545/
UEFA also has considered it https://www.espn.com/soccer/blog-ue...sidering-cap-on-fees-that-clubs-pay-to-agents
Ironically, the two examples of feck ups they discuss both involve United transfers - Sanchez and Pogba ones.
Your point about compiance with EU laws is indeed interesting. If FIFA/UEFA introduce something it will likely be amendment to Fair Play and can still get contested in EJC court just like 3+2 rule got overruled in '90s
What's the issue here?
If you want the player pay up. If you think the amount is too much then dont buy the players.
How is it agents fault? Raiola or no raiola. We value pogba at 90m hence we strike the deal to buy him for 90m. It's like buying a yatch and complaining about the docking cost.
Isnt that how free market works? I dont see united fans complaining when they flex their muscle and use their financial prowess to poach players from a weaker league that can't compete in terms of wages, but somehow when they screw us for a few extra millions we're crying foul? If we are paying 15m for raiola that simply meant he has our balls in his grip, and there's nothing we can do to tell him to feck off.
We point the fingers on agents and accuse them to inflate prices, they didnt. It's the big clubs that's keep on paying more and more so that they can get the best players playing for them that's inflating the price.
It takes two to tangoes.
If you want the player pay up. If you think the amount is too much then dont buy the players.
How is it agents fault? Raiola or no raiola. We value pogba at 90m hence we strike the deal to buy him for 90m. It's like buying a yatch and complaining about the docking cost.
Isnt that how free market works? I dont see united fans complaining when they flex their muscle and use their financial prowess to poach players from a weaker league that can't compete in terms of wages, but somehow when they screw us for a few extra millions we're crying foul? If we are paying 15m for raiola that simply meant he has our balls in his grip, and there's nothing we can do to tell him to feck off.
We point the fingers on agents and accuse them to inflate prices, they didnt. It's the big clubs that's keep on paying more and more so that they can get the best players playing for them that's inflating the price.
It takes two to tangoes.
You keep saying "free market" but I am not sure it means what you think it means. "Free market" does not mean it's free for all, especially in sports. There are many examples of regulations, including Fair Play. Caps on agent fees can be established to avoid exploitation. The idea being that super agents have more power than players so it's important to ensure they don't abuse their power. Protecting players is important since they are the ones playing in the end. There would be no game without them. Whether you agree or not, is up to you, but it has nothing to do with "free market", whatever you think it means.
That idea is fallacious though, you naively think that the idea is to protect players when it's in reality to limit the amount of money shared with players. The reason clubs don't like agents and want to limit their influence is because it increases labour costs, most players have no idea about how much they are actually worth and clubs won't and don't tell them.
I am actually not saying anything, mate, just citing what UEFA said:
(from: https://www.espn.com/soccer/blog-ue...sidering-cap-on-fees-that-clubs-pay-to-agents). What I am saying is that "free market" doesn't mean no regulation. Obviously, everybody has their "sinister" interests in this, there're huge amounts of money involved.
Free market doesn't mean no regulation but as I said, in your article Ceferin isn't even hiding where his priorities are.
But Ed likes him, he makes Ed look big time.
Yeah, pretty incredible.
Some agents are shady but it's generally for the benefit of clubs or concerns the exploitation of young players from poor backgrounds and wouldn't really be included in an agent fee cap because these things are generally illegal from the beginning and aren't in the books. But if you want an anecdotal example outside of football, you have Russell Okung who thought that he could negotiate his own contract.
Almost 1 billion in players. He knows how to make money.
But your man Raiola isn't that type of agent. He's a fat prick who fixes meetings for the world's best players - he has nothing to do with them being good players.
No one knows what's written into a sell on clause. Wouldn't surprise me if Dortmund have had to have a smallish sell on clause with a nice fat bonus for Raiola inked in. If he does well at Dortmund I expect he will be on his way within 2 seasons to a big club. Not United obviously but Real or Juve.
Which us exactly what Haaland and his father wanted. Another stepping stone club
Good agents make deals happen that suit their client not the club
I agree that Juventus aren't a good fit for Haaland at the moment. They have 3 strikers who are clearly better then him. However Juventus aren't usually great spenders. They tend to pay less in salary then we or Real do.
Re Pogba and Raiola, am not sure why anyone has a problem with Raiola. He is merely Pogbs’s mouthpiece and conduit. And Raiola's job is to get what his client wants, and for his client and himself to be paid the most possible amount for that. So of course in such a public and specialised industry, that will involve lots of subterfuge and brinksmanship. Raiola is just doing his job, and he is very very good at it.
When Raiola speaks in public about one of his clients, it is as good as words coming directly from the client, whom has most likely vetted and approved the exact wording. In Pogba's case, we had the same shit from Pogba via Raiola in the summer (and from Pogba himself!) and so it’s not surprising the same rhetoric is starting as a new transfer window opens.
Given how pogba abused the club as a teenager and his cynical behaviour after we paid a world record fee to bring him back, I can’t think of a mercenary like him in our history. I feel more positively towards Tevez!
How Pogba gets any sympathy or support from United fans on this matter is difficult for me to emphasise with or understand. I don’t get it.
When Raiola speaks in public about one of his clients, it is as good as words coming directly from the client, whom has most likely vetted and approved the exact wording. In Pogba's case, we had the same shit from Pogba via Raiola in the summer (and from Pogba himself!) and so it’s not surprising the same rhetoric is starting as a new transfer window opens.
Given how pogba abused the club as a teenager and his cynical behaviour after we paid a world record fee to bring him back, I can’t think of a mercenary like him in our history. I feel more positively towards Tevez!
How Pogba gets any sympathy or support from United fans on this matter is difficult for me to emphasise with or understand. I don’t get it.
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Cap means clubs can exploit players for cheap. Nothing to do with protecting them. Protecting them from smart agents to they earn less?
One party's fat prick is another party santa claus.
They're worth what a club will pay to secure a transfer from another club, not what an agent's commission is.
Raiola might be a dick but he doesnt do anything that isnt sanctioned by the player and his management team. Not sure why people here dont realize that.
Pogba could silence him with a word but he will not because Raiola is doing the job he is paid to do.
To be fair, if I were Haaland agent, I’d exactly advise him to do the same. Sign for Dortmund for more game time first and as stepping stone to fully develop/establish himself as good player, then move to another big club later in his career to take more challenge for more trophies and bigger pay cheque.
That's why he sign for dortmund. Because they accept being a stepping stone, got a damn good deal out of it, made a gentlement agreement that they wont stop him leaving in 3-4 years time. Dortmund got a great talent, some tens of millions eventually, and probably similar deal in the future with other raiola talent.
Why is it so hard to understand for united that football used to be a win win deal. All they asked is a release clause that's higher than our purchase price. If we had a believe the kids would fall in love with us why not? Can't blame halaan for wanting an insurance before committing to a midtable team without a clear plan. Getting him for 30m with a buyout clause of 50m is still better than nothing at all. At worse we got 2 years of good services and 20m profit.
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I'm talking about the negotiation of a contract and the cost of labour not transfer fees but even then clubs use intermediaries to go around the fact that they can't talk to under contract players without their clubs' consent, so they can't complain when they have to pay said intermediaries.
This. I still find it hard to read when people are almost excusing Pogba in all this.
Because we're not some stepping stone and a feeder club ? We're low now but not that yet.
Maybe you're fine with being a stepping stone but thanks God not the majority of our fans, and our club.
Juve are known to let players go if they want to leave, I wouldn't call Juve a stepping stone/feeder club.
Release clause Is not a problem if players want to stay, and if players dont want to stay you should ask yourself why.
It's very different between let players go if they want and the club thinks it's ok with a right price and let them go whenever they feel like with a price well below their worth.
The Juve case is an interesting one. They were a big club without the supposed financial muscle of a big club just few years ago. Atm I have no idea how financially strong they are but they seem doing fine.
You think Utd is a feeder club ?
Do you even know the difference between a feeder club and a big club ? If yes, could you tell me?
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Days after blasting Manchester United and their project for their recent malaise, agent Mino Raiola has now slammed Ajax for how they handed Matthijs de Ligt's transfer to Juventus in the summer.
The central defender was pursued by a number of elite clubs in Europe including PSG, Manchester United and Barcelona but the Italian champions secured his signature on a five-year deal in July.
Juventus paid an initial fee of £67.8million to Ajax for the player, who followed Frenkie de Jong in leaving Ajax after the midfielder left for Barcelona in a £65million deal which was announced nearly a year ago.
But Raiola insists he remains unhappy with how Ajax handled losing their two star players, especially with their demands once de Jong had departed.
'I don't want to say too much about it anymore, the most important thing is that Matthijs is happy,' Raiola told Dutch outlet Voetbal International.
'A year earlier, Matthijs was able to go to Juventus, but Ajax asked him to stay when certain agreements were made.
'But due to the transfer of Frenkie de Jong to Barcelona, from which a top amount rolled out, Ajax suddenly wanted much more than what was agreed upon.
'What frustrates me most is that this has gone behind Matthijs's back. My problem is that I identify with my football players. I am that player, at least that's how I feel.'
Raiola's comments come after he launched a withering attack on United, claiming that the club is a 'problem' for his client and insisting that he would now not help any of his other players move to Old Trafford.
In an astonishing attack, Raiola blasted the United hierarchy as 'out of touch with reality' and lacking a 'sporting project' and suggested that the club is so dysfunctional that it would even have ruined the careers of Diego Maradona, Pele and Paolo Maldini.
Raiola brokered Pogba's £89million return to Old Trafford from Juventus in 2016, but believes the club is not suited to the Frenchman anymore.
'Pogba's problem is Manchester United. It's a club out of touch with reality and without a sporting project,' Raiola told Italian news outlet La Repubblica.
'I wouldn't take anyone there, they would even ruin Maradona, Pele and Maldini.
'Paul needs a club and a squad, one like Juventus was before.'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/f...hijs-Ligts-exit-days-savaging-Man-United.html
The central defender was pursued by a number of elite clubs in Europe including PSG, Manchester United and Barcelona but the Italian champions secured his signature on a five-year deal in July.
Juventus paid an initial fee of £67.8million to Ajax for the player, who followed Frenkie de Jong in leaving Ajax after the midfielder left for Barcelona in a £65million deal which was announced nearly a year ago.
But Raiola insists he remains unhappy with how Ajax handled losing their two star players, especially with their demands once de Jong had departed.
'I don't want to say too much about it anymore, the most important thing is that Matthijs is happy,' Raiola told Dutch outlet Voetbal International.
'A year earlier, Matthijs was able to go to Juventus, but Ajax asked him to stay when certain agreements were made.
'But due to the transfer of Frenkie de Jong to Barcelona, from which a top amount rolled out, Ajax suddenly wanted much more than what was agreed upon.
'What frustrates me most is that this has gone behind Matthijs's back. My problem is that I identify with my football players. I am that player, at least that's how I feel.'
Raiola's comments come after he launched a withering attack on United, claiming that the club is a 'problem' for his client and insisting that he would now not help any of his other players move to Old Trafford.
In an astonishing attack, Raiola blasted the United hierarchy as 'out of touch with reality' and lacking a 'sporting project' and suggested that the club is so dysfunctional that it would even have ruined the careers of Diego Maradona, Pele and Paolo Maldini.
Raiola brokered Pogba's £89million return to Old Trafford from Juventus in 2016, but believes the club is not suited to the Frenchman anymore.
'Pogba's problem is Manchester United. It's a club out of touch with reality and without a sporting project,' Raiola told Italian news outlet La Repubblica.
'I wouldn't take anyone there, they would even ruin Maradona, Pele and Maldini.
'Paul needs a club and a squad, one like Juventus was before.'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/f...hijs-Ligts-exit-days-savaging-Man-United.html
Someone posted a client list of this fat prick few hours ago. I got a quick look and none of his clients is currently in Real, Barca, Bayern, Liverpool and even fecking City.
There must be a reason for that.
Then maybe agents should also learn to shut their mouth and stop talking bs after the player is bought. Raiola since 2016 has been doing nothing but saying shit about the club. How is that fair on the club? Maybe he is still butt hurt that Sir alex called him bag of shit, which by the way he is.