Let's finish this Jigsaw!

[Red Hand Devil]

You can't compare our situation now to the treble season, we aren't going to win the treble next season anyway, but we had 4 strikers for 2 spots which actually is the same as 2 for 1.

No, it's not the same - we had 4 for 2. 2 for 1 is having only 2 Strikers - we had 4.

Thinkin we wont win the Treble next season is somewhat defeatest imo. The club firmly believe we can win every comp we enter next season - if we get the right aquisitions in. That's the ambition & determination every fan wants to see from a top club like ours..

 

[SoCross]

Guys, we also need to sell/loan out some players. Our first team squad is huge right now. Lets say we get a new ST, a new CB and the team below is out starting line up;

De Gea

Darmian
New CB
Smalling
Shaw

Carrick/Bastian
Morgan S
Herrera

Di Maria
Rooney
Depay

These are the players that can be on the subs bench.


Jones
Evans
Rojo
Blind
Bastian/Carrick
Mata
Fellaini
New ST
Adnan
Perreira
Young
McNair
Blackett
Valdez
Valencia
Wilson
Hernandez

17 players, for 7 positions!

We'll definitely see departures if we are to expect more arrivals. If we get a CB - that's Evans gone. If we get a striker - that's Hernandez gone. Rafael is on his way out, so is Valdes. You don't have Lindergaard or Lingard on there either. Definitely having a few extra faces; LVG will thin it.

 

[Red Hand Devil]

I haven't posted for some time my reason being that firstly I was fed up waiting for some transfer news, then I went full muppet mode over the weekend and couldn't keep up with the pace of it all, now with some reflection its time to take a deep breath and seriously consider what, or rather who is next, I am totally baffled why we have sold RVP, despite his relatively poor season I really can't think who can replace him, (and I think most agree he does need replacing), of those mentioned, Kane/Cavani/Laccazette/Benteke etc the argument seems to be that none of them are prepared to play second fiddle to Rooney ! well if any of them are worthy of the shirt, and good enough to be starting regardless of whether its with, or instead of Rooney then get them signed, my preference would be to take a punt on Laccazette. As for a CB, you could argue that LVG will have spent enough time with Smalling and co to know whether we need one or not, he has stated that he will only buy if its an improvement on what we have, that narrows the field more than people imagine, Otamendi had a great season but was it a 'one off' ? I would like to think that we are still trying for Ramos, but if it means losing DDG then I would look elsewhere, maybe Howedes ? To summarise I agree with most that we could do with another Striker and an experienced CB, but also like most people I'm not sure who, lets trust LVG on this one.

Welcome back man

Howedes is injured mate & yes - we gotta trust LvG & Ed to sort us out once & for all..

 

[GloryHunter07]

If we really want to wrap things up than we need 2 CBs, a striker and a GK (unless DDG signs a new contract up).

So we are only about half way through the jigsaw!

 

[RedStarUnited]

No, it's not the same - we had 4 for 2. 2 for 1 is having only 2 Strikers - we had 4.

Thinkin we wont win the Treble next season is somewhat defeatest imo. The club firmly believe we can win every comp we enter next season - if we get the right aquisitions in. That's the ambition & determination every fan wants to see from a top club like ours..

I think he meant per position. 2 strikers per each striker position.

We'll definitely see departures if we are to expect more arrivals. If we get a CB - that's Evans gone. If we get a striker - that's Hernandez gone. Rafael is on his way out, so is Valdes. You don't have Lindergaard or Lingard on there either. Definitely having a few extra faces; LVG will thin it.

Id imagine he wants a 20 to 25 man squad tops. We need to shift about 5 players minimum.

 

[Michael T]

You're bankin on Rooney - almost 30 years old, to carry us the whole season in every comp & havin our only option, Wilson, as back up?

We won the Treble havin 4 Strikers - we aint gettin anywhere near that with just havin Rooney & Wilson mate!

Agreed - another top CF is an absolute necessity going in to the new season. A quick reminder of what happens when you have good options to bring on up front!




If that doesn't end the debate, nothing will!

 

[Red Hand Devil]

So we are only about half way through the jigsaw!

That's my opinion anyway GH.

In my perfect muppet-world, we'd get Ramos & Otamendi as our CB's & Cavani & Lacazette as our Strikers.

Never gonna happen of course, but as many of those & i'd be delighted - especially those CB's to make us so solid, now we have a midfield that's gonna shield them & support the attack..

 

[devilish]

So we are only about half way through the jigsaw!

We may be able to get away with 2 if ddg stays

 

[devilish]

That's all very well & good, but if you look at Barca with them having Messi, Suarez & Neymar - they're all Strikers 1st & foremost, but are all-round forwards too, but their eye for goal is in the DNA. You cant compare what they have to what we have.

You're takin a punt on Memphis to hit the ground running too & continue his goal-scoring spree
from last season. Mata isnt prolific in scoring goals & neither has Rooney been since 2009/10.


It would be suicide if we didnt bolster our Strike force - after we've just sorted out our midfield..

Rome wasnt built in a day and barca took risks (neymar), spend big money (suarez) and had to wait (messi and iniesta development) to become the juggernaut they are today. We will have to do the same. Rooney, depay, di maria and mata forward line may not be at the same level of barca however its highly competitive

 

[stevoc]

That's my opinion anyway GH.

In my perfect muppet-world, we'd get Ramos & Otamendi as our CB's & Cavani & Lacazette as our Strikers.

Never gonna happen of course, but as many of those & i'd be delighted - especially those CB's to make us so solid, now we have a midfield that's gonna shield them & support the attack..

Why the feck would we need two new strikers?

We only play with one and we already have 3. If Rooney's fit he's playing and i would prefer that to be up front than in midfield.

I doubt we will even sign one striker unless we offload Hernandez.

 

[Red Hand Devil]

I think he meant per position. 2 strikers per each striker position.

Nah, i think he was alluding to us only playin with one Striker man.

2 for 1 = 2 Strikers for one position so we only need 2, with one as back up.

For a club like ours - having only 2 Strikers is complete madness. We're traditionally a thrilling footballing team that scores lots of goals to entertain the fans - we aint doin that with a knackered Rooney from playin every game at 3 years old & an inexperienced Wilson who's still learning his trade & probably should go out on loan more importantly.

Atleast one Striker is a complete necessity & anyone who thinks differently, has lost the plot. We've sorted out CM, so now we've gotta sort out the CB & Striker situation & then we're ready to go for it all..

 

[Shark]

Why the feck would we need two new strikers?

We only play with one and we already have 3. If Rooney's fit he's playing and i would prefer that to be up front than in midfield.

I doubt we will even sign one striker unless we offload Hernandez.

What makes you think LVG trusts Hernandez so much that if Rooney gets a long term injury, he's our only option?

 

[stevoc]

What makes you think LVG trusts Hernandez so much that if Rooney gets a long term injury, he's our only option?

I don't particularly but you can't go into a season planning on your key players getting long term injuries and stock piling expensive players to cover for them.

I actually think Hernandez will move on and we will sign a striker, but if he stays i think theres a chance we will go into the season with just Rooney, Hernandez and Wilson.

 

[Red Hand Devil]

Why the feck would we need two new strikers?

We only play with one and we already have 3. If Rooney's fit he's playing and i would prefer that to be up front than in midfield.

I doubt we will even sign one striker unless we offload Hernandez.

Because we only have one decent one & Rooney cant play every feckin game next season - not to mention we need plan B's, C's & D''s etc..?!

We just lost RvP & Falcao for Christ sake & Chicharito will be gone too - who's far from United standard quality anyway!

 

[devilish]

Because we only have one decent one & Rooney cant play every feckin game next season - not to mention we need plan B's, C's & D''s etc..?!

We just lost RvP & Falcao for Christ sake & Chicharito will be gone too - who's far from United standard quality anyway!

2 is overkill. Just keep chica and bring a new striker. Also rooney, new guy and wilson are good enough

 

[Shark]

I don't particularly but you can't go into a season planning on your key players getting long term injuries and stock piling expensive players to cover for them.

I actually think Hernandez will move on and we will sign a striker, but if he stays i think theres a chance we will go into the season with just Rooney, Hernandez and Wilson.

There's not a chance of that happening mate. LVG clearly doesn't rate Hernandez and Wilson is still a prospect. It'd be lunacy to go into the season relying on Rooney as our main striker.

 

[AngeloHenriquez]

Because we only have one decent one & Rooney cant play every feckin game next season - not to mention we need plan B's, C's & D''s etc..?!

We just lost RvP & Falcao for Christ sake & Chicharito will be gone too - who's far from United standard quality anyway!

Far too over the top, typically we will play with 1 striker, looking back at Rooneys record, you can see he has great fitness, every reason to believe he will start at least 70% of games, I can't see how having Wilson & 2 new strikers (Assuming Javier leaves), will be beneficial for any of their game time.. We need to purchase someone like Lacazette/ Barbosa who has potential to be great, but needs to prove it. I also wouldn't worry about backup game time in a sense, as if their good enough to displace Rooney, VG won't keep them on the bench.

EDIT: As far as Plan B goes, if Rooney is injured, Wilson will play, if not Fellaini gives us a more physical hold up option, Depay would give us a pacey toe the line forward, we only need someone who is still learning, IMO ideally would be good aerially.

 

[stevoc]

There's not a chance of that happening mate. LVG clearly doesn't rate Hernandez and Wilson is still a prospect. It'd be lunacy to go into the season relying on Rooney as our main striker.

Can i take it you didn't read the first part of that sentence?

 

[Red Hand Devil]

2 is overkill. Just keep chica and bring a new striker. Also rooney, new guy and wilson are good enough

There's that word again!

Overkill is us stackin up with players of the same calibre & cant all play. Who's gonna compete with Rooney for a starting berth - Chicharito?

He's absolutely shit for Christ sake Dev & Wilson isnt ready yet & may never be either..

 

[RedStarUnited]

Nah, i think he was alluding to us only playin with one Striker man.

2 for 1 = 2 Strikers for one position so we only need 2, with one as back up.

For a club like ours - having only 2 Strikers is complete madness. We're traditionally a thrilling footballing team that scores lots of goals to entertain the fans - we aint doin that with a knackered Rooney from playin every game at 3 years old & an inexperienced Wilson who's still learning his trade & probably should go out on loan more importantly.

Atleast one Striker is a complete necessity & anyone who thinks differently, has lost the plot. We've sorted out CM, so now we've gotta sort out the CB & Striker situation & then we're ready to go for it all..

Yes that's what he meant. If we play with one striker, having 1 back up is the same as playing with 2 strikers and have 2 back up.

Agreed - another top CF is an absolute necessity going in to the new season. A quick reminder of what happens when you have good options to bring on up front!




If that doesn't end the debate, nothing will!

People need to put this 4 strikers in 99 thing in to context;

• We played 442 back then, which meant we could play 2 strikers every game. York and Cole were our main strikers.
• Sheringham was 33 in 99, not the age of all these other targets everyone in here wants us to buy. Oh and he scored 5 goals all season.
• OGS was happy to be a bench player. A rarity in a player as good as he was. Think about how much Hernandez has been complaining about not playing, You never heard that from Ole.

So there you have it, we had 2 top strikers because we needed 2 top strikers for the formation we played. We had a 26 year old bench player who never complained about being a bench player. And an over the hill striker who barely contributed - I know he did in the CL final but im talking over the season.

 

[stevoc]

Because we only have one decent one & Rooney cant play every feckin game next season - not to mention we need plan B's, C's & D''s etc..?!

We just lost RvP & Falcao for Christ sake & Chicharito will be gone too - who's far from United standard quality anyway!

Rooney can't play every game? FFS he's 29 not 39, besides he won't have to we have Wilson and Hernandez/new striker to play in a lot of games.

Two new strikers is overkill, theres a reason we let Falcao and RVP go because we won't be playing with 2 strikers anymore ergo we don't need those numbers upfront.

Rooney = Plan A
Hernandez/New striker = Plan B
Wilson = Plan C

No need for a plan D, you don't stock pile 4 players for one position.

Also since when has Hernandez been far from United quality? He would be one of the best back ups around.

 

[Adcuth]

Agreed - another top CF is an absolute necessity going in to the new season. A quick reminder of what happens when you have good options to bring on up front!




If that doesn't end the debate, nothing will!

Brings a tear to the eye to this day

 

[Red Hand Devil]

Rooney can't play every game? FFS he's 29 not 39, besides he won't have to we have Wilson and Hernandez/new striker to play in a lot of games.

Two new strikers is overkill, theres a reason we let Falcao and RVP go because we won't be playing with 2 strikers anymore ergo we don't need those numbers upfront.

Rooney = Plan A
Hernandez/New striker = Plan B
Wilson = Plan C

No need for a plan D, you don't stock pile 4 players for one position.

Also since when has Hernandez been far from United quality? He would be one of the best back ups around.

Far too many holes i could pick with the above, but i couldnt be arsed. It's way too obvious that i dont need to spell it out..

 

[Sylar]

I think Striker is more important than CB.
Our CBs were hardly troubled or looked shaky between the Spurs - City match and thats because we had Carrick there helping to ease their mind (even the Chelsea match they were hardly troubled). Having a stronger midfield in front of the CBs will ease their mind (especially since we now have players who will also want the ball of the CBs so they dont have to launch as much).

I think a striker is more important, cos we are in big trouble should Rooney get injured / go on a cold streak as he sometimes tends to do.

 

[RedRonaldo]

You're bankin on Rooney - almost 30 years old, to carry us the whole season in every comp & havin our only option, Wilson, as back up?

We won the Treble havin 4 Strikers - we aint gettin anywhere near that with just havin Rooney & Wilson mate!

442 vs 433

We only need 1 striker starting in our current line-up. We have Rooney, Hernandez and Wilson for 1 position. (If we sell Hernandez we may need to buy another. And also, Real only has Hernandez as backuo for Benzema last season)

 

[RedStarUnited]

I think Striker is more important than CB.
Our CBs were hardly troubled or looked shaky between the Spurs - City match and thats because we had Carrick there helping to ease their mind (even the Chelsea match they were hardly troubled). Having a stronger midfield in front of the CBs will ease their mind (especially since we now have players who will also want the ball of the CBs so they dont have to launch as much).

I think a striker is more important, cos we are in big trouble should Rooney get injured / go on a cold streak as he sometimes tends to do.

City were on fire for the first 10 minutes or so. Could have scored more than the one they did.

The only reason Id guess we want a CB is because Jones and Smalling are very injury prone. If they were not, we might not have been looking to get someone else in.

 

[Roman Bellic]

So no Jigsaw then?

 

[Sylar]

City were on fire for the first 10 minutes or so. Could have scored more than the one they did.

The only reason Id guess we want a CB is because Jones and Smalling are very injury prone. If they were not, we might not have been looking to get someone else in.

Thats a fair point, but I wouldnt put that down on our CBs, our midfield was over the place (except herrera I felt who was the only one able to escape tight areas and keep the ball). Our Cbs were under pressure but ultimately did well to hold it to one (their first goal I blame our midfield for not tracking runners).

I think a striker (kinda like RVP first season) will be a huge difference in the tight games and even the big games.

 

[Will Absolute]

Ffs I was expecting an actual jigsaw...

I expected you to be an actual pigeon..

We don't always get what we want.

 

[Cal?]

442 vs 433

We only need 1 striker starting in our current line-up. We have Rooney, Hernandez and Wilson for 1 position. (If we sell Hernandez we may need to buy another. And also, Real only has Hernandez as backuo for Benzema last season)

I don't think comparing with Real works, they can play no striker and Ronaldo will still score enough to have them ticking along.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

I expected you to be an actual pigeon..

We don't always get what we want.

 

[stevoc]

Far too many holes i could pick with the above, but i couldnt be arsed. It's way too obvious that i dont need to spell it out..

''Far too many holes i could pick'' starting with your own no doubt. FFS give over you muppet the only thing that's obvious in here is that you are talking a load of old waffle.

You want us to have 4 players for one position, even a specialist position like GK only has 3. Do Real or Chelsea etc. have 4 strikers for one position no they don't because it's overkill.

 

[Devil may care]

The CB piece of the puzzle will be a formality IMO, either Otamendi or Ramos will arrive, maybe even both if Real Madrid blink, if not we'll keep De Gea for another season.

The striker is the much tougher call, big decision ahead for LvG I feel given the Rooney conundrum.

 

[stepic]

we only need one striker, two is a joke. but that striker needn't be some nobody who's willing to play second fiddle to Rooney, he should be as good a striker as we can possibly get. Rooney should earn his spot just like anyone else.

likewise we only need one CB, not two. Smalling has done enough to warrant a spot, and we already have ample backup.

 

[RedStarUnited]

we only need one striker, two is a joke. but that striker needn't be some nobody who's willing to play second fiddle to Rooney, he should be as good a striker as we can possibly get. Rooney should earn his spot just like anyone else.

likewise we only need one CB, not two. Smalling has done enough to warrant a spot, and we already have ample backup.

Depends how you look at it. if LVG thinks Rooney is the best player or best attacker, he wont sign someone to challenge that. Chelsea are not looking to get someone in to make Hazard earn his place are they?

 

[RU Devil]

Agree that we probably need a CB (Otamendi/Ramos), but while we're relatively thin at striker, I've been questioning the need for a world class or even international class CF. In this group, I include players who have played for their national teams, like Kane (whom I really don't rate yet). Of the current available forwards, maybe Lacazette could do the trick for us, but how willing would he be to play second fiddle to Rooney? Then there's Cavani. Anyway, would spending 30 mil on a second choice striker be smart? I guess eventually he could supplant Rooney (mainly due to age), but I'm of the opinion that there are times you need to rely on the midfield to take up the slack. For example, for our 2006-7 title, our main forwards were Rooney & Saha, with a big assist from Ronaldo plus Solskaer, and a cameo from Larrson. Despite Saha being a crock, we were able to win the league and get to the CL Semi's. If Memphis can do a creditable imitation of a young Ronaldo, we could get away with signing a serviceable striker (Charlie Austin, Mario Gomez, Michu or similar ilk), plus we have a lot of firepower across the whole midfield (probably more than 2006, excluding Ronaldo).

Honestly wouldn't be surprised to get a late move for a forward, bargain bin hunting style.

 

[Red Hand Devil]

''Far too many holes i could pick'' starting with your own no doubt. FFS give over you muppet the only thing that's obvious in here is that you are talking a load of old waffle.

You want us to have 4 players for one position, even a specialist position like GK only has 3. Do Real or Chelsea etc. have 4 strikers for one position no they don't because it's overkill.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

Guys, we also need to sell/loan out some players. Our first team squad is huge right now. Lets say we get a new ST, a new CB and the team below is out starting line up;

De Gea

Darmian
New CB
Smalling
Shaw

Carrick/Bastian
Morgan S
Herrera

Di Maria
Rooney
Depay

These are the players that can be on the subs bench.


Jones
Evans
Rojo
Blind
Bastian/Carrick
Mata
Fellaini
New ST
Adnan
Perreira
Young
McNair
Blackett
Valdez
Valencia
Wilson
Hernandez

17 players, for 7 positions!

Ye, exactly! Not a lot of people think about this, but that's way too many.

I personally feel the players that I've highlighted will either be sold, loaned or play for the U21's, which will leave us 10 players for 7 positions, which isn't too bad, although I'm not sure who I'd want to leave out the squad in the list above.

Possibly something like:

De Gea
Darmian - Smalling - ? - Shaw
Carrick
Bastian - Herrera
Mata - Rooney - Di Maria


Valdes - Jones - Rojo - Schneiderlin - Fellaini - Depay - ?
​

If any players get injured in game:

Jones can cover for Smalling and LCB

Rojo can cover for LCB and Shaw

Schneiderlin for Carrick or Bastian

Fellaini for Herrera or possibly Rooney

Depay for Mata or Di Maria

New Striker for Rooney

That would leave out Young, Blind and Valencia.

 

[stepic]

Depends how you look at it. if LVG thinks Rooney is the best player or best attacker, he wont sign someone to challenge that. Chelsea are not looking to get someone in to make Hazard earn his place are they?

Hazard is a lot better than Rooney though. Rooney is on the decline and it's a shame Moyes gave him that ridiculous contract.

 

[itso 7]

Rooney can't play every game? FFS he's 29 not 39, besides he won't have to we have Wilson and Hernandez/new striker to play in a lot of games.

Two new strikers is overkill, theres a reason we let Falcao and RVP go because we won't be playing with 2 strikers anymore ergo we don't need those numbers upfront.

Rooney = Plan A
Hernandez/New striker = Plan B
Wilson = Plan C

No need for a plan D, you don't stock pile 4 players for one position.

Also since when has Hernandez been far from United quality? He would be one of the best back ups around.

This is what people are overlooking, we don't need another high profile striker because we will be playing with only one. Hernandez/new striker and Wilson will play when Rooney can not. Fellaini, who I think will be struggling for games in midfield, will play there when we are in dire straits.

Now we simply need to close the CB signing and declare our transfer business, both incoming and outgoing (after getting rid of Evans and Rafael), done.