Any Ajax fans that can give some insight about ETH rotation at Ajax? How much did he rotate? If he didn't rotate much, did it hurt you in the latter stages of the season? I mean, tbh the situation is not really comparable as Utd has to fight in more or less every game to get the win. Ajax won most games comfortably and was dominating the league. But still interested to hear from Ajax fans.
Lack of rotation: Will this hurt us deeper in the season?
- Thread starter Samid
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Is it not possible to just trust the qualified people, with all of the data, who spend all week with these players, to make the right decisions about rotation?
Absolutely not. These FM players only see imaginary % numbers next to players and if they are not 100% then they need rotating!
So many people on here who insist on making their thoughts known about every single possible thing. Looking for negatives to moan about. We're in such a great moment. If you can't enjoy this then it's probably time for something new
I would like to see a bit more rotation, not just for giving certain players a rest but to get other players up to match speed a bit more in case we have to rely on them, plus it would probably improve their morale and motivation a bit if they get the odd chance to strut their stuff.
I think it is due to a lack of trust in the other squad players. In general there seems to be less rotation though than in the decade before.
Imagine we’ll see a bit more rotation when the players are actually showing signs of being tired.
Can't fault his selection tonight honestly.
We are threadbare in midfield. Those three was the only selection we could make with Eriksen AND McTominay out. Playing LIndelof at DM from the start would be crazy
We are threadbare in midfield. Those three was the only selection we could make with Eriksen AND McTominay out. Playing LIndelof at DM from the start would be crazy
Get over yourself, top red. Similar stupidity was being spouted when OGS was playing Rashford all the time and now the same types go on about how he was overplayed.
video game fans.
I think he’s done pretty well over the last 2 weeks Ten Hag by managing minutes.
De Gea - rest tonight
AWB- doesn’t really need resting considering he missed half a season
Dalot - injured
Martinez- 2 games since Arsenal/ 1 game rest - was eased back into it post World Cup
Varane - 1 game since Arsenal (70 mins) / 2 games rest
Maguire & Lindelof both with 1 stwrt
Malacia- 2 games / 1 off
Shaw- 1 game/ 2 off
Casemiro - played in all 3 but subbed after 70 mins in 2 games - didn’t play at arsenal
Fred - first start tonight
Bruno - 70 mins at the weekend
Rashford- 2 games of 60 minutes , half an hour tonifht
Antony - 1 full 90 and 2 70 mins
Weghorst - 70 mins tonight
Other than Bruno I think we’ve managed the last couple of weeks just about right.
Keep Martial fit and we can rotate the front 6:
Martial
Weghorst
Rashford
Garnacho
Antony
Sancho
with Elanga and Pellistri we’ve got good depth up top
Midfield still a little light but with Sancho playing as a 10 tonight we’ve got options now to get some rest into Bruno.
De Gea - rest tonight
AWB- doesn’t really need resting considering he missed half a season
Dalot - injured
Martinez- 2 games since Arsenal/ 1 game rest - was eased back into it post World Cup
Varane - 1 game since Arsenal (70 mins) / 2 games rest
Maguire & Lindelof both with 1 stwrt
Malacia- 2 games / 1 off
Shaw- 1 game/ 2 off
Casemiro - played in all 3 but subbed after 70 mins in 2 games - didn’t play at arsenal
Fred - first start tonight
Bruno - 70 mins at the weekend
Rashford- 2 games of 60 minutes , half an hour tonifht
Antony - 1 full 90 and 2 70 mins
Weghorst - 70 mins tonight
Other than Bruno I think we’ve managed the last couple of weeks just about right.
Keep Martial fit and we can rotate the front 6:
Martial
Weghorst
Rashford
Garnacho
Antony
Sancho
with Elanga and Pellistri we’ve got good depth up top
Midfield still a little light but with Sancho playing as a 10 tonight we’ve got options now to get some rest into Bruno.
Looking from outside, that might be the case.Trying to think this through, I’m less concerned about our first team - I suspect we limit physical training between games with most of that coming in the game, whilst our non-playing squad might have a different training regime.
From my perspective, my main concern is IF we do suffer injuries at some point, will our backups have the match sharpness we need them to have to step in? I trust ETH, so I’m sure this is all thought out. But meh, that’s the one question I have in my mind.
From my perspective, my main concern is IF we do suffer injuries at some point, will our backups have the match sharpness we need them to have to step in? I trust ETH, so I’m sure this is all thought out. But meh, that’s the one question I have in my mind.
We just might be able to rotate a little bit more in midfield provided Sancho can stay fit and healthy of course along with addition of Sabitzer too
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Sancho might be moving into middle,however do feel we could have done with another one in there
I think things look a bit better now. In the last month or so or so we used to have only Garnacho, Fred and Pellistri as the viable option of the bench in terms of attacking and midfield subs.
However with the inclusion of Sancho and Martial back and signing of Wout (not counting Sabitzer as he is the replacement of Eriksen), we have three options in attacking sense and provides us a good cushion to rotate players
We can realistically play against Palace as front 6:
Wout
Rashford Bruno Garnacho
Sabitzer Casemiro
And use this front 6 against Leeds
Martial
Sancho Bruno Antony
Fred Casemiro
This gives complete rest to the likes of Rashford, Wout, Garnacho, Sabitzer.
So after a long time we appear to have options of the bench and can use subs at 60 mins mark.
Another way to look at it is Newcastle will play 90 mins 3 matches which equates to 270 mins.
If we use our top players for 60 mins for 5 matches and rest them for one match. That makes it 300 mins only. So not soo much difference.
However with the inclusion of Sancho and Martial back and signing of Wout (not counting Sabitzer as he is the replacement of Eriksen), we have three options in attacking sense and provides us a good cushion to rotate players
We can realistically play against Palace as front 6:
Wout
Rashford Bruno Garnacho
Sabitzer Casemiro
And use this front 6 against Leeds
Martial
Sancho Bruno Antony
Fred Casemiro
This gives complete rest to the likes of Rashford, Wout, Garnacho, Sabitzer.
So after a long time we appear to have options of the bench and can use subs at 60 mins mark.
Another way to look at it is Newcastle will play 90 mins 3 matches which equates to 270 mins.
If we use our top players for 60 mins for 5 matches and rest them for one match. That makes it 300 mins only. So not soo much difference.
That's my take on it.
Baffled why people who not even involved in football are constantly moaning about his line ups, who he should be resting and not, and then blaming the manager if a player gets injured when it quite frankly no one can call.
If you had this mindset about players getting injured etc, you wouldn't be a manager it's that simple.
He knows the players and team better than us all, and has the relevant data around him provided by the specialists in that field who work at the club.
Interesting interview I stumbled across the other day from Casemiro when he was back at R.Madrid.
The premise of it was that Casemiro was playing too many games and needed a rest, to which Casemiro responded with something along the lines of 'i know my own body and I feel much better when I'm playing, I rest better in between games to make sure I'm ready for the games every week'.
EtH has a team of specialists around him, the experienced players (Case, Eriksen, Bruno and even Rashford) all know their bodies and limits.
Also I've never seen the team as fit as they are right now.
I think we will be absolutely fine moving into the second half of the season. Especially with Sancho back, Garnacho looking sharp and Sabitzer onboard.
The premise of it was that Casemiro was playing too many games and needed a rest, to which Casemiro responded with something along the lines of 'i know my own body and I feel much better when I'm playing, I rest better in between games to make sure I'm ready for the games every week'.
EtH has a team of specialists around him, the experienced players (Case, Eriksen, Bruno and even Rashford) all know their bodies and limits.
Also I've never seen the team as fit as they are right now.
I think we will be absolutely fine moving into the second half of the season. Especially with Sancho back, Garnacho looking sharp and Sabitzer onboard.
Blame it on football manager.
Matches like yesterday night are a non-issue, really. Except that 10-minute spell after the attacking subs, in which we scored the goals, we played the whole game in 2nd gear. Hopefully, we'll also learn to control and kill games off like this against tougher league opponents.
I remember the same discussion being made about Messi when Pep was at Barcelona. He wanted to rest and protect him for the big matches but Messi insisted on playing every game because he felt that this was the best way of retaining or recapturing his game rhythm.
I've always felt that Bruno (and now Casemiro) was similar. He plays himself into form. It's understandable too since our whole game basically goes through both of them. They feel they always have to be alert and battle-ready.
Even in Eriksen's case, the fact that we signed a replacement in 24 hours shows that the manager doesn't really trust Fred as the first choice in that role for a relatively long period. So, no point screaming our lungs out. It is what it is.
I remember the same discussion being made about Messi when Pep was at Barcelona. He wanted to rest and protect him for the big matches but Messi insisted on playing every game because he felt that this was the best way of retaining or recapturing his game rhythm.
I've always felt that Bruno (and now Casemiro) was similar. He plays himself into form. It's understandable too since our whole game basically goes through both of them. They feel they always have to be alert and battle-ready.
Even in Eriksen's case, the fact that we signed a replacement in 24 hours shows that the manager doesn't really trust Fred as the first choice in that role for a relatively long period. So, no point screaming our lungs out. It is what it is.
Obviously the fitness coaching staff and players themselves know when they’re exhausted and would hopefully say so. I just wonder if ETH is worried that beyond his core group of players, the ones stuck on the bench week after week aren’t even capable of improving with extra support.
True. Eriksen injury wasn't because he wasn't rested, it was on thuggery by that Scouse cnut.
I don't think anyone got out of 3rd gear last night
I think the obsession a lot of fans have with rotation comes from the latter years of SAF's reign, where it often felt like we were rotating players just for the sake of rotating
Exactly. If anything nights like that are helpful for chemistry and keeping things ticking over. It was a breeze.
And they forget that, even then, there were certain players who were, at times, indispensable. In 2012-13, for example, RvP and Carrick were both unmovable in the starting lineup.
The rotation moaners are going to be losing their shit leading up to the final. Imagine being 3-0 up against Barca in the first leg. They'll be besides themselves come the second leg three days before the final (which, by the way, they were probably sacking off at the start of the season).
He is rotating though. Between the arsenal game and yesterdays match, the following players been rested:
Varane
Shaw
Martinez
De gea
Casemiro
Rashford
The only player that hasnt has been Bruno, but hopefully with Sancho back that can help.
Varane
Shaw
Martinez
De gea
Casemiro
Rashford
The only player that hasnt has been Bruno, but hopefully with Sancho back that can help.
Also too much rotation affects the cohesion of your best lineup in my opinion
Not true at all. The best teams over the last ten years have been ones that rotate between mid week and weekend games. Look at the lineups used by City, and in comparison Liverpool for example (who largely played the same players every game). SAF was a master at rotation.
I think the rotation issue is being over analysed, but it’s a forum so I get that.
The Barca ties being so close to the Newcastle final will be interesting.
Let’s see what happens in the 1st leg.
The Barca ties being so close to the Newcastle final will be interesting.
Let’s see what happens in the 1st leg.
I don't know how much it impacted them, but it was one notable thing that a couple of Ajax fans mentioned in here when he first joined us. That ETH really didn't rotate very much. From memory it was something that did frustrate them a little as it felt like some youngsters weren't getting as many chances as they'd like, but that's about all I can remember.
I would have liked a large amount of rotation over the last two games (all our main players playing one game, but not both), but coming into those two matches I would have said there were five key players we should be ensuring didn't play both.
Martial - Obviously fine there.
Varane - All good.
Eriksen - We'll never know. It was fine that he played the first game as long as the plan was to have this one off, but unfortunately he got that injury.
Rashford - On the one hand I would have liked him to not come on at all against Forest, but on the other I think that bringing on our big guns may have been good man-management for Sancho as it maximised the chances of his return being positive. All good.
Bruno - This one was a bit annoying. There's been a couple of times in the past where it's felt he's been overplayed and he started getting sloppy and less effective with his defensive work, so I really hope that doesn't happen again. Should have been rested in one of these games IMO.
Some might mention Casemiro, but he missed the Arsenal game so it wasn't as important to get that rest.
So Bruno was the only one that I'm actually a bit worried about.
Martial - Obviously fine there.
Varane - All good.
Eriksen - We'll never know. It was fine that he played the first game as long as the plan was to have this one off, but unfortunately he got that injury.
Rashford - On the one hand I would have liked him to not come on at all against Forest, but on the other I think that bringing on our big guns may have been good man-management for Sancho as it maximised the chances of his return being positive. All good.
Bruno - This one was a bit annoying. There's been a couple of times in the past where it's felt he's been overplayed and he started getting sloppy and less effective with his defensive work, so I really hope that doesn't happen again. Should have been rested in one of these games IMO.
Some might mention Casemiro, but he missed the Arsenal game so it wasn't as important to get that rest.
So Bruno was the only one that I'm actually a bit worried about.
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In ETH we trust. Just leave him to do his thing, guys a genius
in fairness to bruno, defensive work is not his main game. his role is to get the ball into the box as quickly and effectively as possible, and there are few better at manufacturing and exploiting space than him imo. if you expect him to track back and make heroic tackles all the time you are going to be disappointed.
as for the rotation issue, the players who participated in last night's game are not going to be doing any hard running between now and palace at the weekend. they'll be working on recovery, conditioning and tactics. games bring players on and help the team to gel better. i do agree though, we need to be careful with injuries and yellow cards toward the end of the season as the squad is very exposed if a couple of key players are out.
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Caftards don't really understand the concept of time, that's why. The whole point of this thread was to predict if it will hurt us later in the season and you get some applauding that we're winning now, completely missing the point of the thread. Reading is hard.
there was an article in the athletic today (sorry if it’s mentioned below) about how ETH wants the first team to be able to play his style and routines automatically. There are no easy or rest games until we are the best team again. It’s pretty simple. It also lays down a marker to the squad players that they need to be fully on board and pushing hard or else they will only ever get token minutes. Competition in the squad is what we’ve been crying out for. Players were walking around downing tools and starting the next game. This is solid management at this point in time with a squad still learning and a club trying to right it’s course
If we get knocked out by Barcelona it will reduce the amount of possible games by 4+. I would fancy our chances to progress pretty far in the competition if we can get past Barca. If we reached the final that's like what, seven extra games?
So the answer to the OP I feel will be determined by the Barca result. If we progress then yes, fatigue will be a serious problem at the end, otherwise I think we'll be ok.
We're on track for a 55 plus season right now, which is a lot of games on a condensed schedule.
So the answer to the OP I feel will be determined by the Barca result. If we progress then yes, fatigue will be a serious problem at the end, otherwise I think we'll be ok.
We're on track for a 55 plus season right now, which is a lot of games on a condensed schedule.