I'm coming around to the idea of signing this player. We wont get Rice, Tchouameni or Frenkie. Kamara is the only better option and I don't see enough links to him.
Kalvin Phillips
- Thread starter Adnan
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Feck no!
Hell yes!
Dream bigger, I see us getting both Phillips and Kamara the amount of players we're losing.
De Jong is always in play with ETH on board.
People need to realise the system Leeds played in meant that Phillips was left on his own in the trenches taking shells most games. Had he had a CM partner he would be more highly regarded imo!
Agreed. just look when he was paired at the Euros
I think he’d improve our midfield, but that isn’t saying much
we all know the issue with these Brexit transfers, they’re way way over-priced
I was hoping that now we’ve gone down the hipster route we’d see the end to these types of deals
we all know the issue with these Brexit transfers, they’re way way over-priced
I was hoping that now we’ve gone down the hipster route we’d see the end to these types of deals
The Italians fairly gave them the runaround though. That would be one major niggling doubt I would have. If it comes to work rate and getting stuck in and inventiveness of short and long passing I like this guy for this league. I think he could ping to the wingers and Darwin in opens spaces quite effortlessly and he won’t be found jogging around off the ball.
https://breakingthelines.com/player-analysis/player-analysis-kalvin-phillips/
This was quite a detailed player analysis and worth looking at although it's a year old.
This was quite a detailed player analysis and worth looking at although it's a year old.
Not being considered is the Newcastle factor. If they express an interest then that price of £50 million goes up considerably. If ten Hag wants Philipps and feels he will suit his system then I’m all for it.
Phillips isn't a high enough level and would demand a huge fee. Its not like we're paying less than 30m for him which would be fair. We'd likely be paying 50m at least. He's also very injury prone.
I'd rather sign Kamara on a free who is younger and doesn't have those injury problems (yet at least). Take a punt on someone who could have high potential rather than a peak level player who isn't really of the level required IMO.
Saying that, better than nothing and what we have as a DM.
I'd rather sign Kamara on a free who is younger and doesn't have those injury problems (yet at least). Take a punt on someone who could have high potential rather than a peak level player who isn't really of the level required IMO.
Saying that, better than nothing and what we have as a DM.
Quality player. He will get his big move. May be he will move to Newcastle. If the rumored 60m transfer fee is true I would love him at Arsenal.
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I still think he would be an excellent transfer for United.
People are too obsessed with the notion that you need a DLP that is some kind of wizard on the ball. Given modern pressing and ball progression tactics, what is most important in these systems is that everybody in the back six (back four plus DM plus keeper) be above a certain level, not that any one player be Pirlo or Scholes. Whether pressing high or even in a mid block, opponents can design their press to force the ball away from a Pirlo and toward the weakest link anyway. You can see this with ETH's teams - it was great when he had FDJ, but now he has a much more limited CDM in possession and its not really a problem.
What you really need is a guy who can do the defensive work off the ball, both in terms of covering ground as a lone holding midfielder and understanding how to counterpress in a high block, and be good enough on the ball. Sure, ideally you'd like the guy to be excellent on the ball. But good enough can get you far enough.
I also think its important to bring a player into this role who can hit the ground running, because its hard to implement a new tactical system like ETH's if the guy in this role is learning from scratch. Phillips has spent his whole adult career learning football from Bielsa, with highly tactical possession strategies and lots of high pressing out of possession.
Phillips is also widely considered to have an excellent mentality and really good character in the dressing room, and United could use some more of those.
People are too obsessed with the notion that you need a DLP that is some kind of wizard on the ball. Given modern pressing and ball progression tactics, what is most important in these systems is that everybody in the back six (back four plus DM plus keeper) be above a certain level, not that any one player be Pirlo or Scholes. Whether pressing high or even in a mid block, opponents can design their press to force the ball away from a Pirlo and toward the weakest link anyway. You can see this with ETH's teams - it was great when he had FDJ, but now he has a much more limited CDM in possession and its not really a problem.
What you really need is a guy who can do the defensive work off the ball, both in terms of covering ground as a lone holding midfielder and understanding how to counterpress in a high block, and be good enough on the ball. Sure, ideally you'd like the guy to be excellent on the ball. But good enough can get you far enough.
I also think its important to bring a player into this role who can hit the ground running, because its hard to implement a new tactical system like ETH's if the guy in this role is learning from scratch. Phillips has spent his whole adult career learning football from Bielsa, with highly tactical possession strategies and lots of high pressing out of possession.
Phillips is also widely considered to have an excellent mentality and really good character in the dressing room, and United could use some more of those.
Arsenal needs him too if we can afford him.
Too English for me. Prefer us to sign a player I've never heard of before.
Kamara looks great...whoever he is.
Kamara looks great...whoever he is.
Have you done a survey?
I would definitely take him.
I really don’t rate him at all. Just another energetic midfield player who’s more about pashun than quality. Wouldn’t get anywhere near a pep team and if we want to build for Ten Hag that’s what we need to aim for. We have players just like him, we have no one who get get on the ball and actually pass the ball and take it under pressure. Would much prefer we look at Neves of someone in that style.
I really don't get why we are in for him. £50m for an injury prone player that isn;t even that good. A waste of money IMO
At Leeds Phillips is the main man in both offensive and defensive transitions in midfield. But if we bought him and utilised him as the secondary midfielder in possession and the primary DM without the ball, then he would become even more effective imo.
So it really depends on the composition of the midfield, and having two controlling #8s next to Phillips, has great potential. And Phillips has been playing for a head coach who has sacrificed defensive stability for goals, which is good preparation for a player to play for ten Hag, especially in the defensive transitions.
Leeds in the last two years (in the EPL) with and without Phillips, below.
With Phillips - played 43, won 20, lost 11
Without Phillips - played 27, won 6, lost 19
So it really depends on the composition of the midfield, and having two controlling #8s next to Phillips, has great potential. And Phillips has been playing for a head coach who has sacrificed defensive stability for goals, which is good preparation for a player to play for ten Hag, especially in the defensive transitions.
Leeds in the last two years (in the EPL) with and without Phillips, below.
With Phillips - played 43, won 20, lost 11
Without Phillips - played 27, won 6, lost 19
Name a transfer we have made that a) we had serious competition for the player and b) we never paid stupid fee or wages for? None. Both these players have loads of suiters - Rice wants Chelsea and Tchoumani wants Real Madrid. Plus that will be 70+ for Tchoumani and what for Rice? 90-120 mill? Are we going to pay that and will they come to a team in freefall and not in Champions league? I think fans need to wake up and realize we cant attract top players - unless we pay stupid fees and have no competition
Thought he'd be more favoured around here considering he was playing for one of Europe's top 'hipster' coaches.
But isn't he a target based on his performances for Leeds?
These guys' ability to play the pivot in a 4-3-3 is also all projection. By far, Phillips has much better experience than either in terms of developing his game within a similar role and system to ETH's.
Both Rice and Tchouameni look like great talents and you can make an argument that they would be able to learn that position. But it doesn't always work out that way. Or it could take them a couple years to really figure it out, and a couple years is a long time for a manager that will start getting judged the day he walks in the door. Not enough value is placed in general on finding players who have already done the things that your manager wants done in a particular position.
Even if they get him I’d go for Kamara on a free, it’s insane if we don’t on limited funds also bring back garner .It would leave us more money for other positions like center forward, winger and defenders . They should be working like mad to get players in on free transfers at the moment , but they should also be able to run and want to run for the coach.
50 million for this guy is almost as ludicrous as 80m for Maguire. As average as it gets.
Making it to a euro final isn't a credential to play for United.
England just doesn't have a great GK, CB or DM right now that can play at the highest level.
If we have to sign an English player for marketing reasons please let it be Bellingham/fullbacks/forwards.
Making it to a euro final isn't a credential to play for United.
England just doesn't have a great GK, CB or DM right now that can play at the highest level.
If we have to sign an English player for marketing reasons please let it be Bellingham/fullbacks/forwards.
Do we have still funds to buy 2 DM this summer anyway? ETH definitely need a baller in DM, if we get someone like De Jong, I don't mind to add another aggressive ball winner in our team, who is not bad in passing. I know options are running out with other clubs showing strong interested in Tchouameni etc and I don't know if Kamara willing to join us for free.
The thread reminds that United was once convinced to sign Kleberson after a WC. 
In reality Edu will probably go for Éderson from Salernitana. A much cheaper option if Salternitana relegate.
Leeds are pretty porous even with him in there.
I would rather add a bit more and go for De Jong. Not the same type, but we will only spend big on one midfielder, i would rather De Jong in that case.
Oh totally agree but think it's a no go
I think he’s a pretty good player and could end up doing very well for us under ETH if we do get him that is.
Reading about people’s doubts around Phillips’ fit and talent (although the injury record is a concern) reminds me of that time when posters here were raising concerns about Van Dijk and Mane at Southampton as potential transfer targets. Not saying that he’ll become world class like them, but imo he can definitely take that step up.
Reading about people’s doubts around Phillips’ fit and talent (although the injury record is a concern) reminds me of that time when posters here were raising concerns about Van Dijk and Mane at Southampton as potential transfer targets. Not saying that he’ll become world class like them, but imo he can definitely take that step up.
No. I’ll wait for him to turn us down in public because we are Manchester United and his family are die hard Leeds. Whilst his offspring now support Man City.
what's concerning about his injury record?
Leeds are gung-ho. I wouldn’t read too much into it.
This is all well and good but the problem is..Phillips is not "above a certain level" on the ball. It's not even about wizardry. At least not with respect to where Manchester United should be aiming for. He's pretty much average at best which is backed up statistically.
In my opinion he adds nothing that we haven't got with Fred if Fred finds himself in a better structured side where he doesn't have to carry the can himself. I think we need a different type of player.
He is a target because scouts are supposed to look at not only how he plays in the system/formation he is in but mostly at his individual ability.
Exactly!
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