Jude Bellingham | Confirmed Borussia Dortmund player

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Icemav said:
I said teenage talent not 16 exclusively. Anyway I think Cristiano played that game against us at 17, where he played some of the best in Europe and was outstanding, and joined at 18. Outrageous talent and fulfilled it. But there was no doubt he would become a top flight footballer, but becoming one of the greatest of all time was a bonus.
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Ronaldo was 18 when he played the friendly against us and Quaresma was heralded as the bigger talent even then. Many on this forum would've sold Ronaldo and replaced him with Aaron Lennon because he had no end product in 2005. The thread in question will still be floating around.

Bellingham is a 16 year old with immense potential for his age. I'm not sure why anyone would be against such a move. Most United fans would be over the moon if Bellingham came anywhere close to replicating Scholes, nevermind the two Ronaldo's, Messi etc.
 
Ali Dia said:
good shout. It’s a great place to develop players too. If was a young talented player I’d back myself to do well in the championship and then move to a big club on my own terms rather than waiting for an injury or some luck at a big club while stagnating at reserve level. also I assume a first team player in the championship makes more than a reserve youth player at UTD?
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Lingard had a great loan spell in the Championship when Harry Kane was struggle. But If you compare their academy stats, its quite opposite. I agree the level of our current reserve match is low, but we're plaing in Division 2 now, hopefully next season we will meet Chelsea and City again.
My point is Championship is not that great for players development, yes it is competitive but quality standard is low. You can take Norwich for an example.

I'd rather playing Chelsea, Liverpool and City reserve than staying in the Championship.
 
Number32 said:
Lingard had a great loan spell in the Championship when Harry Kane was struggle. But If you compare their academy stats, its quite opposite. I agree the level of our current reserve match is low, but we're plaing in Division 2 now, hopefully next season we will meet Chelsea and City again.
My point is Championship is not that great for players development, yes it is competitive but quality standard is low. You can take Norwich for an example.

I'd rather playing Chelsea, Liverpool and City reserve than staying in the Championship.
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Really, Leeds almost turned over arsenal a couple of weeks back.

Playing a game in front of 10 + thousands of fans is more of a learning curve IMO, also it is very competitive

TFM was playing the last game and ran from one side of the pitch to the other, in PL2 you can use your physique and power in the championship that is not the case.
 
Adnan said:
Ronaldo was 18 when he played the friendly against us and Quaresma was heralded as the bigger talent even then. Many on this forum would've sold Ronaldo and replaced him with Aaron Lennon because he had no end product in 2005. The thread in question will still be floating around.

Bellingham is a 16 year old with immense potential for his age. I'm not sure why anyone would be against such a move. Most United fans would be over the moon if Bellingham came anywhere close to replicating Scholes, nevermind the two Ronaldo's, Messi etc.
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Thats why the opinions of most fans are worth next to zero. Whatever have it your way..... Ronaldo was a punt, Queresma was a punt, Bebe was a punt,same for Bellingham. No sure things in this world.
 
Number32 said:
Lingard had a great loan spell in the Championship when Harry Kane was struggle. But If you compare their academy stats, its quite opposite. I agree the level of our current reserve match is low, but we're plaing in Division 2 now, hopefully next season we will meet Chelsea and City again.
My point is Championship is not that great for players development, yes it is competitive but quality standard is low. You can take Norwich for an example.

I'd rather playing Chelsea, Liverpool and City reserve than staying in the Championship.
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I agree. I don’t think it’s good for young talents technical development. I don’t see the hurry of a 16 year old playing senior football. Most times it’s actually not good for their physical development.
 
Number32 said:
Lingard had a great loan spell in the Championship when Harry Kane was struggle. But If you compare their academy stats, its quite opposite. I agree the level of our current reserve match is low, but we're plaing in Division 2 now, hopefully next season we will meet Chelsea and City again.
My point is Championship is not that great for players development, yes it is competitive but quality standard is low. You can take Norwich for an example.

I'd rather playing Chelsea, Liverpool and City reserve than staying in the Championship.
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The quality and standard is much lower in the u23 leagues
 
Number32 said:
Lingard had a great loan spell in the Championship when Harry Kane was struggle. But If you compare their academy stats, its quite opposite. I agree the level of our current reserve match is low, but we're plaing in Division 2 now, hopefully next season we will meet Chelsea and City again.
My point is Championship is not that great for players development, yes it is competitive but quality standard is low. You can take Norwich for an example.

I'd rather playing Chelsea, Liverpool and City reserve than staying in the Championship.
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I disagree with this maybe a couple of years ago I'd have understood but in the last few years championship teams have done well in the league and some of the individual players have made a big impact. The championship is also by far a higher ceiling then any of the U23s / U21s.
 
Icemav said:
I said teenage talent not 16 exclusively. Anyway I think Cristiano played that game against us at 17, where he played some of the best in Europe and was outstanding, and joined at 18. Outrageous talent and fulfilled it. But there was no doubt he would become a top flight footballer, but becoming one of the greatest of all time was a bonus.
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Where is the idea that he doesn't have skill coming from?

 
In Rainbows said:
Where is the idea that he doesn't have skill coming from?

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The idea came from the one earlier video posted. I personally asked if it was a good video of him that was fully reptesentative if his skillset and technical abilities. Most of us havent seen him play.

Thanks for the video. Seems he has a lot more in his locker than shown in the first highlights.
 
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passing-wind said:
I disagree with this maybe a couple of years ago I'd have understood but in the last few years championship teams have done well in the league and some of the individual players have made a big impact. The championship is also by far a higher ceiling then any of the U23s / U21s.
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Might be right for U23s in general, but we're talking about a 16 yo boy here. His lungs and bones is not ready yet to compete with a grown man. Most of 16 yo starters in england only had a short career due to injuries.
Competitiveness would also give them so much pressure on the pitch. Some people think its good for their mentality, but for me its like forcing a teenager to study hard to pass an exam in short period. The pressure would did more harm than good for his mental development.

Cassidy said:
The quality and standard is much lower in the u23 leagues
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Not so much in Division 1, in Division 2? Yes I agree, but Im confident we will play in Div. 1 next season.
 
Icemav said:
The idea came from the one earlier video posted. I personally asked if it was a good video of him that was fully reptesentative if his skillset and technical abilities. Most of us havent seen him play.

Thanks for the video. Seems he has a lot more in his locker than shown in the first highlights.
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I think at the moment he's in that Bambi on ice stage because he's at the age where he's going through a massive period of growth into his adult body. As his muscles fill out I think his balance will become better and he'll look a more poised player. The same thing happened with Rashford and is happening with Greenwood currently too a bit.

Number32 said:
Not so much in Division 1, in Division 2? Yes I agree, but Im confident we will play in Div. 1 next season.
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Sorry but you're living in cloud cuckoo land if you think that u23s is close to The Championship. The Championship is the strongest second league in the world. I've followed a number of young English players abroad in Holland recently like Clarke-Salter, Lewis Baker, Dan Crowley and Mason Mount and they all find it harder to look good in the Championship than they did in the Erdivisie. You are seriously underestimating the level.

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/343346/History/Mason-Mount

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/136461/History/Daniel-Crowley

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/136772/History/Lewis-Baker

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/312919/History/Jake-Clarke-Salter
 
Icemav said:
Thats why the opinions of most fans are worth next to zero. Whatever have it your way..... Ronaldo was a punt, Queresma was a punt, Bebe was a punt,same for Bellingham. No sure things in this world.
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Ronaldo was a punt ? Come on ? Ronaldo was obviously a superstar in the making. I can guarantee you maybe once or twice in Fergusons career his own players came in to the changing rooms and begged the manager to sign the player like they did with Ronaldo
 
Tel074 said:
Ronaldo was a punt ? Come on ? Ronaldo was obviously a superstar in the making. I can guarantee you maybe once or twice in Fergusons career his own players came in to the changing rooms and begged the manager to sign the player like they did with Ronaldo
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I agree with you. I was saying the same.
 
Tel074 said:
Ronaldo was a punt ? Come on ? Ronaldo was obviously a superstar in the making. I can guarantee you maybe once or twice in Fergusons career his own players came in to the changing rooms and begged the manager to sign the player like they did with Ronaldo
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Icemav said:
I agree with you. I was saying the same.
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Bellingham is massively highly rated in world football though. This game was described as one of the best performances by an England youth teams ever, in which Bellingham was the captain and got 2 assists. They completely played Brazil off the park which led to some nasty challenges from Brazil in frustration.

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/brazil-u16_england-u16/index/spielbericht/3178658

You can only really judge youth players by what they're doing at that age. Bellingham has been one of the best players in world football for his age and is playing senior football at a good level aged 16. He's a 'no brainer' of a transfer. His personality is supposed to be spot on and he's shown to be completely fearless playing against men in senior football so far. Is this a guarantee of him making it at United? The answer is no but he's well worth the gamble.
 
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Classical Mechanic said:
Bellingham is massively highly rated in world football though. This game was described as one of the best performances by an England you team ever, in which Bellingham was the captain and got 2 assists. They completely played Brazil off the park which led to some nasty challenges from Brazil in frustration.

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/brazil-u16_england-u16/index/spielbericht/3178658

You can only really judge youth players by what they're doing at that age. Bellingham has been one of the best players in world football for his age and is playing senior football at a good level aged 16. He's a 'no brainer' of a transfer. His personality is supposed to be spot on and he's shown to be completely fearless playing against men in senior football so far. Is this a guarantee of him making it at United? The answer is no but he's well worth the gamble.
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Ok fair enough and thanks for the info. I and a few others were just a bit underwhelmed by the initial highlights and asked if it was a good video of him. Thought he might be a very early bloomer and not sure of his ceiling, particularly as the words "sure thing" were used. Like I say most like myself really dont know anything about him. Its good to learn more.
 
Classical Mechanic said:
Sorry but you're living in cloud cuckoo land if you think that u23s is close to The Championship. The Championship is the strongest second league in the world. I've followed a number of young English players abroad in Holland recently like Clarke-Salter, Lewis Baker, Dan Crowley and Mason Mount and they all find it harder to look good in the Championship than they did in the Erdivisie. You are seriously underestimating the level.

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/343346/History/Mason-Mount

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/136461/History/Daniel-Crowley

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/136772/History/Lewis-Baker

https://www.whoscored.com/Players/312919/History/Jake-Clarke-Salter
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In my previous post the discussion is about the development of 16 years old boy in the Championship vs PL2.
Underestimating Championship? No, why would I wrote Harry Kane's struggle in that competion then

You miss the point on how a competition develop youngsters or its competitiveness.

Even competitiveness won't guarantee its quality. Norwich has struggle this season because they think they are good enough with the same squad who had dominating Championship last year. In other hand Sheffield made some good signings in the summer and it pays off.
 
Number32 said:
In my previous post the discussion is about the development of 16 years old boy in the Championship vs PL2.
Underestimating Championship? No, why would I wrote Harry Kane's struggle in that competion then

You miss the point on how a competition develop youngsters or its competitiveness.

Even competitiveness won't guarantee its quality. Norwich has struggle this season because they think they are good enough with the same squad who had dominating Championship last year. In other hand Sheffield made some good signings in the summer and it pays off.
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I feel like not being as good as the PL is kind of the point of the league below, and also is very much not evidence of it being lower quality than the PL reserve teams.
 
Just a small note that I heard an interview with him recently and he sounded extremely mature, determined, bright and a very decent character.
 
Ekeke said:
I'm saying that sounds too little
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He's still hasn't signed a pro contract yet, but based on what JB said, he wont leave unless they really need the money which it seems like they do. Best if we buy him then loan him back. They get the money, get to keep the player a little bit longer, and we get the added benefit of him getting consistent first team mins

Adnan said:
Birmingham were docked 9 pts in May 2019 for breaching EFL rules regards FFP. Currently they look like they're gonna face more punishment from the EFL for the same reason.
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This reminds me of Sessegnon, who was deemed too good for England's golden generation of under 17s that included Foden, Sancho and Hudson-Odoi and skipped that level. He made a big mistake in my opinion going to Spurs and should have stayed for another season in the Championship. If Bellingham has any sense he will stay where he is and continue his development.
 
SamoyedSam said:
This reminds me of Sessegnon, who was deemed too good for England's golden generation of under 17s that included Foden, Sancho and Hudson-Odoi and skipped that level. He made a big mistake in my opinion going to Spurs and should have stayed for another season in the Championship. If Bellingham has any sense he will stay where he is and continue his development.
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Sessegnon was pretty average in the EPL for Fulham so not sure how the move to Spurs was a mistake on his part.
 
Adnan said:
Sessegnon was pretty average in the EPL for Fulham so not sure how the move to Spurs was a mistake on his part.
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For that very reason. Abraham had a difficult first season in the EPL in a poor Swansea team so he dropped back down to the Championship. He came back a year older, stronger and with another 25 goals to his name. Sessegnon has gone from being one of the best attacking midfielders in the Championship to a backup left back for Spurs.
 
SamoyedSam said:
For that very reason. Abraham had a difficult first season in the EPL in a poor Swansea team so he dropped back down to the Championship. He came back a year older, stronger and with another 25 goals to his name. Sessegnon has gone from being one of the best attacking midfielders in the Championship to a backup left back for Spurs.
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Abraham didn't drop back down to the Championship by choice. And if Lampard hadn't been given the reigns at Chelsea, the chances are that the likes of Abraham and many others may still be on loan now.

Sessegnon was pretty underwhelming at Fulham in EPL and the best bet for him would've been to go to a midtable EPL club instead of Spurs.
 
So what happened?

Was there any bid? Rejected? Never happened?
 
Adnan said:
Abraham didn't drop back down to the Championship by choice. And if Lampard hadn't been given the reigns at Chelsea, the chances are that the likes of Abraham and many others may still be on loan now.

Sessegnon was pretty underwhelming at Fulham in EPL and the best bet for him would've been to go to a midtable EPL club instead of Spurs.
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It did Abraham a big favour and got him ready for the Chelsea first team. There's a reason Chong and Gomes have fallen behind. When they needed time out on loan to toughen up they were playing under 23s.
 
If we did buy him I'd hope we loan him out and let him stay at Birmingham for another season or so. Get him experience in an enivornment he's comfortable in.
 
SamoyedSam said:
It did Abraham a big favour and got him ready for the Chelsea first team. There's a reason Chong and Gomes have fallen behind. When they needed time out on loan to toughen up they were playing under 23s.
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Lampard being Chelsea manager did Abraham a big favour. LVG did the same with Rashford.

Sessegnon has played two seasons in the Fulham first team. One season in the Championship followed by a season in the EPL. Going back down to the Championship only made sense if there wasn't EPL options.
 
Rozay said:
Not really levelled out tbh. He’s made his first team debut already and is a fecking sensational talent to be fair.
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When that video was posted people were talking of him as the next Messi kind of level but having watched him for England he's only one of a number of talented players. Bellingham has been the best in that side, Harvey Elliot was promoted ahead of him to the 17s. Dembele hasn't played above his age group for England. He is an excellent talent no question but he doesn't boss games in his own age group at international level like he was doing in that video.
 
so the news about a bid came out and than nothing at all? No follow up, no further bidding, no rejecting or was it all fabricated to get clicks somehwere on the www?
 
Few months younger than Hannibal Mejbri and already getting games.

Perhaps worth of some attention...
 
Inigo Montoya said:
If the bell ends don’t accept that, they’re nuts. We paid less for James
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Pretty sure they'll accept. Convincing the player and his family will be the hard part at his age. But if we've offered £25m then I'm confident we've received encouragement from the player and his family.
 
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