I know what you mean, and I mean, Mata is a great player to watch. But what I meant in that post was more like, if you're facing a team who is parking the bus, and Mata gets the ball 30 yards out, you don't really expect him to do anything other then lay the ball off to somebody else, or potentially play a ball over the top for somebody (hasn't really happened here yet so far though). That's what I mean by he won't get the fans out of their seats. Give it to Ronaldo, Bale, Di maria, and even Januzaj is developing the trait, but you give it to them and they have the ability to dribble past 3-4 players and have a shot at goal with range.
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Yeh, I understood your point and somewhat agree, my point was just a general view regarding that type of issue.
Found myself watching this. Really does showcase his good finishing.
How do we get him in the box more to get into these positions? If we had a DM, I suppose Herrera could push up and allow Mata to be in the box, with the extra CB covering for Herrera? Shaw has already shown he can find that cut back pass which ends up in Mata's zone a couple times in pre season and I think we need Shaw and the RWB to really stretch and pull opposing defensive lines to get Mata that space to finish.
How do we get him in the box more to get into these positions? If we had a DM, I suppose Herrera could push up and allow Mata to be in the box, with the extra CB covering for Herrera? Shaw has already shown he can find that cut back pass which ends up in Mata's zone a couple times in pre season and I think we need Shaw and the RWB to really stretch and pull opposing defensive lines to get Mata that space to finish.
I can't get why the opinion on Mata has changed so much since last season. People were practically drooling over how good he was during those last 6 games he played as a number 10 last season. Can't believe how many people are leaving him out of their lineup or playing him out wide so Rooney can slot in as a number 10. Rooney is the better number 9 but as a number 10 he doesn't come close to being as good as Mata. Sometimes playing all of your best players isn't the best option for the team and I think we must play only one of Rooney or RVP should we switch to a 1 striker system and I'm sure van Gaal will think the same, remember his quote saying that if he plays 4-3-3 he will have to bench 3 out of his 4 strikers? 
Di Maria pace is only going to benefit Mata if it happens. No danger Juan loses his place in the team. LvG is all about intelligence and Mata is probably our most intelligent player alongside RvP.
I can't get why the opinion on Mata has changed so much since last season. People were practically drooling over how good he was during those last 6 games he played as a number 10 last season. Can't believe how many people are leaving him out of their lineup or playing him out wide so Rooney can slot in as a number 10. Rooney is the better number 9 but as a number 10 he doesn't come close to being as good as Mata. Sometimes playing all of your best players isn't the best option for the team and I think we must play only one of Rooney or RVP should we switch to a 1 striker system and I'm sure van Gaal will think the same, remember his quote saying that if he plays 4-3-3 he will have to bench 3 out of his 4 strikers?
A lot of people have changed their opinion based on parts of pre season and the Swansea match. For some reason they didn't pay attention to Rooney's link up play during the Swansea match. That is not what you want out of a #10. The former and the fact that he's captain means he will never be dropped in the eyes of a lot of people.
I also think Mata is a better #10 because not only does he bring end product, but his touch is consistent, and looks to create from the hole more than Rooney does. It's all up to how LVG sees Rooney though. Despite Mata being a better #10 in the eyes of ourselves, he might fit LVG's philosophy better and start over him.
Up to this point, he hasn't had to consider Rooney as a #10 due to having no world class wingers and he hasn't had a chance to really assess who is the better #9 due to RVP's injury. In the 352 he could pick two strikers and thus RVP and Rooney didn't clash. In a 352 Mata and Rooney weren't competitors for the 10 spot. These are things that will be debated inside LVG's head now that there are more players available to him and a possible new formation. It's too early to conclude anything at this stage.
The good thing is this move surely adds pressure on him. Now he needs to find his best form otherwise either Rooney (with RVP on top) or Kagawa will take over
I can't get why the opinion on Mata has changed so much since last season. People were practically drooling over how good he was during those last 6 games he played as a number 10 last season. Can't believe how many people are leaving him out of their lineup or playing him out wide so Rooney can slot in as a number 10. Rooney is the better number 9 but as a number 10 he doesn't come close to being as good as Mata. Sometimes playing all of your best players isn't the best option for the team and I think we must play only one of Rooney or RVP should we switch to a 1 striker system and I'm sure van Gaal will think the same, remember his quote saying that if he plays 4-3-3 he will have to bench 3 out of his 4 strikers?
I think we can easily have the diamond formation with Rooney and RvP up front or have a 4-2-3-1 with Di Maria/Mata/Rooney as the 3 behind RvP. All three can be given the license to roam and make sure we have a fluid attacking line up. That is something I miss the most from the Rooney/Ronaldo/Tevez partnership. The fluidity and interchanging was orgasmic at times. The three would interchange so much that defenders had a hard time defending and marking them. That is what made us a lethal attacking team that time IMO.
You're sort of assuming that Rooney's touch is consistent and he performs at his best every match when saying that a Rooney, Mata, Di Maria partnership would be the best setup. On a good day Rooney has the best touch in the world but he also has many games were his touch is so bad it almost looks like he kicks the ball away from himself. Swansea last week was one of those games. He would have gotten a free shot on goal at least 3 times had he controlled those through balls from Mata and Januzaj during that Swansea game.
If his touch lets him down then he will be poor no matter where we play him. In that case we have Januzaj waiting for his chance. Point is I am talking about 3 world class players there and hoping (assuming) that they will be on form and injury free. Obviously that won't be the case all the time and that is when other squad members come in the picture.
I'm happy in that if we do get DM that gives us an attack of RVP, Rooney, Di Maria, Hernandez, Wilson/Welbeck, Mata, Kagawa, and Januzaj to fill the front 4 positions. That's an attack that can equal anyones and gives us a wealth of options to choose from depending on form and opposition. Everyone should get game time even if it means being left out of big games, a welcome headache.
I think if we sign Di Maria it's just the sort of player Mata needs. I think Mata with Di Maria and Januzaj either side with Rooney/RVP up top would be very good. The problem we've had for too long is that we've wanted our wingers to stay wide/they've been reluctant to come inside. The extra variety in the runs they will make would give Mata the options he needs as typically his choice of pass is to try and pick out one of the strikers who are tightly marked or roll it out wide, there's rarely that run from outside to inside to pick out or open space.
But I think with Rooney captain and RVP sure to be a favorite than we'd need to play a diamond to play everyone. I think it would be a shame if we played Rooney off RVP as I don't think Rooney excels there nor would bring the best out of Di Maria or Januzaj just because of his style of playing there and what he wants to do.
A diamond though would keep Mata/RVP/Rooney where they want to be and then Di Maria/Herrera have the energy to burst forward and overlap Mata to give an extra passing route. I don't think it would work as well as the first approach I mentioned but I think it's the only realistic way to play all our best players.
But I think with Rooney captain and RVP sure to be a favorite than we'd need to play a diamond to play everyone. I think it would be a shame if we played Rooney off RVP as I don't think Rooney excels there nor would bring the best out of Di Maria or Januzaj just because of his style of playing there and what he wants to do.
A diamond though would keep Mata/RVP/Rooney where they want to be and then Di Maria/Herrera have the energy to burst forward and overlap Mata to give an extra passing route. I don't think it would work as well as the first approach I mentioned but I think it's the only realistic way to play all our best players.
Sunderland 1:1 Man Utd
To be honest Mata is looking more like a waste of money as each game goes by. That money could have been used so much better elsewhere. He's a great guy and a great player but I just don't think he's a Manchester United player at all.
Needs to be dropped and someone should be given a chance. On current form, he's horrible
Of the attacking players we had on today he should be the last one dropped. The other two were worse.
Since the end of last season he's our only reliable source of goals, and yet he still gets shat on on here. I just don't get it. He's almost the only attacking player we have who looks comfortable on the ball, sadly enough.
It gets worse. This is a post from another universe. A screwed up universe.
Certainly better than RVP and Rooney and probably our biggest attacking threat.. Mata was average but we had virtually no movement in front of him.
The good thing is that he scores goals and we need his goals, his play hasnt been very good.
If only we had a midfield which allows him to be more active in the final third as a Number 10 should as opposed to having to drop so deep to start things off
But that's a sign of our problems. He shouldn't be the one scoring the goals he should be creating them and yet he hasn't. And he's not scoring the amount of goals that our going to pick us up and win us games.
There was a moment in the second half where he'd been on the ball for a good 5-10 seconds with his head up clearly looking for Rooney or Welbeck to get in behind Sunderland, but both came short for the ball.
I think the current clashes come from our players wanting to walk the ball in.
He had to come so deep to get the ball today with Cleverley and Fletcher scared to make passes over 5 yards in a forward direction. Then as Mata came deep Rooney and van Persie came deep. And then when one of the three were on the ball, no one was looking to get into, or in behind the Sunderland defence and it all looked very poor.
Good goal (it's refreshing to see a United player sniff out a chance in the 6 yard box nowadays), but we need to get equally good player on the left and right of him to stretch teams if he's going to have any chance of looking good. He was never the type to take the ball and single handedly destroy teams.
I think the current clashes come from our players wanting to walk the ball in.
He had to come so deep to get the ball today with Cleverley and Fletcher scared to make passes over 5 yards in a forward direction. Then as Mata came deep Rooney and van Persie came deep. And then when one of the three were on the ball, no one was looking to get into, or in behind the Sunderland defence and it all looked very poor.
Good goal (it's refreshing to see a United player sniff out a chance in the 6 yard box nowadays), but we need to get equally good player on the left and right of him to stretch teams if he's going to have any chance of looking good. He was never the type to take the ball and single handedly destroy teams.
Like Kagawa, he suits a more counter attacking, direct style.
He's not like Silva who thrives with slower tempo and congested areas.
And with our quality of football, It's like plonking him in the Newcastle United team with Rooney and wondering why things things aren't working.
He's not like Silva who thrives with slower tempo and congested areas.
And with our quality of football, It's like plonking him in the Newcastle United team with Rooney and wondering why things things aren't working.
At least he can be predatory in front of goal and prove efficient even if his overall performance is mediocre or poor. The last half of last season was indicative of that and it might be much of the same this season. You expect more.
Wasn't as bad as RvP and Rooney though.
Wasn't as bad as RvP and Rooney though.
Scored 7 goals in the last 8 PL games...
Hold on, you're saying he's not good enough for United.
I point out that he's our only source of goals.
And you say that's another reason he's not good enough?
Give him a worthwhile midfield to work with and he'll be even more productive.
Not very good. Scored a goal but still. Went for a hiding again.
Mata reminds me so much of Berbatov....he doesn't get involved enough due to a huge lack of pace which makes life impossible for all our other attackers around him....From what I've seen of Mata since he arrived here I am thinking Mourinho mugged us and I can see Mata being benched if Di Maria arrives. I'd sell Mata before selling Welbeck any day but we'll not even get a half of what we paid back for Mata from anyone else so that's why Welbeck will be sacrificed instead...
He's starting to look like another panic buy from Moyes where Moyes was willing to throw crazy money at anyone that was willing to sign for us in a desperate attempt to try and save his own sorry ass last January whether they were the right fit or not
He's starting to look like another panic buy from Moyes where Moyes was willing to throw crazy money at anyone that was willing to sign for us in a desperate attempt to try and save his own sorry ass last January whether they were the right fit or not
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Not a good performance but like others, suffers from a lack of pace and tempo in the team alongside him.
I'm saying that he was signed as a midfielder / no 10 to provide service to our strikers and he isn't currently doing. Goals are great but no one can argue that he is currently justifying the amount we payed for him. I am frustrated with everyone at the moment so bare that in mind. We just need to be seeing more of him and more of everyone.
Spot on. If we can get di Maria and januzaj down the flanks, then the range of Matas ability will be shown. He thrives on other players movement , he'd have been some player in our previous squads with Ronaldo, tevez, and old school Rooney. The problem he has now is everyone is either running toward him or behind him.
Players like Mata need the rest of the team to be at their 100% to look good. He thrives around quick tempo, sharp play, accurate passing and quick one twos. The closest thing to a one-two he's getting right now is Rooney's first touch. We will never see how good Mata is if our team keeps playing the way it is. Fletcher and Cleverley couldn't even get a 10 yard sideways pass right.
He didn't go for a hiding. He was even too deep at times, what game do some of you watch? The lack of runners up front is a big reason why Mata hasn't excelled here, if our attackers make good and fast runs, he'll thread passes to them all day long.
What are ppl expecting him to do? He was better than both RvP and Rooney, so should we drop all 3 then? He had to drop deep, helped out in defence, scored our only goal and won some free-kicks. If ppl are expecting Ronaldo/Messi level performances from one player alone then they will be disappointed and it won't matter if that player is Herrera, Mata, Di Maria or Vidal. No one will get us over the line alone if some others are playing like amateurs.
Indeed, if anything he needs actual football players in midfield with him and players giving him the ball in the right spaces.
One thing I do expect better from him is his delivery from set pieces which has been atrocious in the first two games.
He's just not a Manchester United style player. Kagawa deserves a chance in the next game.
And having mata in your team does not require the need of playing 2 strikers, why? because his contribution makes up for that one striker sacrificed, he scores goals especially with di maria on board. The rooney and rvp axis has not place in this team if you have mata on board. I do think 4231 is the best way to get the best out of mata, and for me di maria mata and janazaj in a front 3 behind the striker will offer us more balance, very few teams play 2 upfront. Mata needs players with pace for mata to do well, with wingers that can do damage it gives mata the space, and he has far more options either side of him. If everything is played infront of him, it makes mata's job much harder, and you may is well play him out wide
Imagine how good we could be playing this
di maria mata janazaj
rooney
mata would be like a new signing, and we would regain that speed that has been lacking for so long
He'll not be getting it unless you're talking about MK Dons. Kagawa isn't even next in line.
He, Rooney and RVP don't get the ball enough to be effective, constantly dropping deep because our midfield can't find them with a pass or make space for them.
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