He asked me to name one defender tbh, Gvardiol is still a great defender to be fair, didn’t even know he was only 20.The kid is 20 ffs
Josko Gvardiol
- Thread starter Pogue Mahone
- Start date
Once he's got you stopping and starting, you're toast. Pace doesn't matter if you can't use it, and from a standing start, it's a redundancy.
This
Name a single defender on the planet that 35 y.o. couldn't do the exact same thing to.
Ffs people making it sound like Messi is just any other random player
Not a big deal, it happens to most young defenders .
Like most he does have this eagerness to go and do everything to win the ball higher up the pitch and can get caught out. Messi even allowed him to get back but that man is a magician tbf, he did it again
Like most he does have this eagerness to go and do everything to win the ball higher up the pitch and can get caught out. Messi even allowed him to get back but that man is a magician tbf, he did it again
To be fair, Juan Foyth did him up like a kipper with the exact same move towards the end of the game.
Messi destroyed him, but Messi has destroyed many a player.
Poor lad got Boateng'd. I mean, at least he didn't slip.
Possibly but late in the match, tired legs….anyway! I think most defenders have that moment where they get burnt. This time it was messi…
Mind you, although I think he is a absolute class, splashing 100m on him is madness imo. And that is from Croatian.. It is absolute gamble and those types of fee should go to attackers/ forward players.
Was dead certain De Ligt is a sure thing. No point in putting such a crazy burden on him. Would be best if he stays in current club another season if that's possible.
Athleticism is more than just pace though, you see the drills they do in the NFL? It’s just as much about having the natural athleticism and spring to be able to twist and turn, just like the top attackers. You said one defender current Messi couldn’t do that to in a hypothetical world I think the player I named is one, peak Messi though there’s really nothing you can do but don’t think he’s close to his peak anymore.
I feel it was poor defending from Gvardiol but it happens.
Trust me, this kid will be one of the best defenders in the future.
I see a great amount of potential in this kid. Experience will teach him to be a better player. Tell me a defender who never gets humiliated, the answer is zero.
When he is older or has more experience, he will decide the things/situations better. I must remind everyone this boy is only 20 years old and still in the learning process.
At least, I'm very impressed with his talent and performance, especially in concentration, mentality, and focus.
I will remind everyone again. Experience is very important in this position, especially in terms of decision-making. Considering that he is only 20 years old, I would say this guy is a real-deal talent.
His style reminds me of one of the all-time greatest defenders from the past( I won't tell his name).
I see a great amount of potential in this kid. Experience will teach him to be a better player. Tell me a defender who never gets humiliated, the answer is zero.
When he is older or has more experience, he will decide the things/situations better. I must remind everyone this boy is only 20 years old and still in the learning process.
At least, I'm very impressed with his talent and performance, especially in concentration, mentality, and focus.
I will remind everyone again. Experience is very important in this position, especially in terms of decision-making. Considering that he is only 20 years old, I would say this guy is a real-deal talent.
His style reminds me of one of the all-time greatest defenders from the past( I won't tell his name).
That 35 yo couldn't do the exact same thing to many defenders in this tournament. What a silly defense to a feck up at the biggest stage.
Name a single defender on the planet that 35 y.o. couldn't do the exact same thing to.
Messi just used his experience with the way he maneuvered the kid around with his stop start and direction. It's fine he will learn from it.
Agreed, if you could get a Rio or Nesta in his prime then maybe it is worth it but even then it’s an absurd fee.
Messis done worse to better players. He'll be fine
Vidić in his prime got turned so easy against Eto in UCL final, Messi embarrassed Boateng in his prime vs Bayern. These things happen to the best all the time, lad's 20 ffs...
I'll maintain, this isn't about lineal pace; once he gets a defender starting and stopping, it's about: agility, centre of gravity, balance and then acceleration - pace isn't a primary concern in such a scenario.
So even per your own post, it's not about the pace you entered the fray with. 35-yr old Messi still has agility on any CB.
He got schooled by the best player of all time but he looks like a superb defender especially at his age. He will have a great career
He's had a very good tournament but hopefully this match was a one off. Defensively he was all over the place today. I fault him for the first and third goal.
Can agree with that but there also a very small number of cbs who have the above you named, I really should have said athleticism but athleticism and pace go hand in hand.
As expected there will always be ridiculous overreactions.
Still clearly a class player.
Still clearly a class player.
Good defender, doesn't change anything.
No defender worth that much should be made to look like a mug like this. He should have brought him down sooner. He pretty much escorted him into the box. He’s good but not as good as some have made him out to be.
You can tell he is quality. He's gonna be a monster. It's obvious him and the entire croatian squad were tired.
Thats because VVD will never be caught one on one with Messi, he will rather delegate Fabinho Robertson and Matip to face Messi one on one while waiting to mop up
I didnt see the game. It wasnt really that bad from him. It was great by Messi.
I seen far worse.
I seen far worse.
Yep was thinking this but that’s actually the best way to defend against him, if he ever got isolated out wide don’t think he would quite embarrass him in the same way, VVD in his prime was an athletic beast and could twist turn and move as well as most elite attackers.Thats because VVD will never be caught one on one with Messi, he will rather delegate Robertson and Matip to face Messi one on one while waiting to mop up
We do have 4 or so games to judge this though we can always go back and watch these games, including the one Netherlands and Argentina just had.
That's nonsense. Plenty of world class defenders have been made to look like mugs.
im not sure this any comparison, he was turned by one the best players ever who was afraid to tackle once in box, even boetang being discussed like this is dis respectful
Not to forget the twist and turn, and the moment Messi got inside the box it was game over
I know it's not "this version of Messi" but I do remember him running rings around the entire Liverpool back four in the first leg of their 2019 CL tie. He's made damn near every CB in the world look like proper mugs, who cares, Gvardiol is still a kid and has immense qualities as a ball playing CB.
I don't think he's been the best defender at this world cup, he's had some good games and some terrible games.
He was very poor in the first half Vs Japan and extremely poor the whole game Vs Argentina, yet also was good against Brazil.
His positioning at times is baffling but I put that down to having to play next to Lovren and often playing left back for his club.
I wouldn't spend anything over £40m for him, I think anything over that and you will get burnt.
He was very poor in the first half Vs Japan and extremely poor the whole game Vs Argentina, yet also was good against Brazil.
His positioning at times is baffling but I put that down to having to play next to Lovren and often playing left back for his club.
I wouldn't spend anything over £40m for him, I think anything over that and you will get burnt.
My take on that goal is more that Gvardiol received no support from his team mates. He held him off from going directly towards goal for a fair bit, but in a situation like that you'd expect another player to join to cover Messi.
He's quick enough. The thing with Messi, even in a chase, you can't sprint because he can turn on a sixpence and his dribbling ability is just so immense that if you commit to a full sprint, he'll turn you inside out (which he did anyway tbf).
I also like how proactive he is when defending. Always keen to stop the attack high up the pitch at the risk of making himself look silly occasionally. It's the opposite of VVD who will backtrack till he's in the stands in fear of getting beat by someone.
He will always be known as the defender that was burned by Messi in the semis. People will be laughing each time they view highlight reels for 2022 world cup. I just don't see any way out for him, he'll have to retire from football.
He’s reminds me of peak Rudiger in that way. Really good, aggressive proactive CB.
He should have just fouled him. Defenders don't do that enough for me. Just take the foul and yellow and live to fight another day
He had another player coming back to cover who would have helped cut off Messi when he initially started moving back toward the top of the box. Great prospect in general but it was really shit defending. Gvardiol showed zero awareness of his teammate and the overall situation when he bit hard on that move toward the top of the box and therefore opened the door for Messi to reverse direction and beat him to the byline.