Joshua Kimmich — free agent in the summer, Bayern withdraw renewal offer

Players should be judged more on minutes played than age nowadays with the sport science to back it up.

He's played an insane amount of games over the years so you'd imagine he's dropping off a cliff shortly, if he hasn't already.
 
MiceOnMeth said:
If Bayern aren't keen to renew it tells you all you need to know. Clubs like Real or Bayern don't let players who are still in their peak leave (usually)
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You have Bayern fans in this thread that are clear it’s not about his lack of ability but the ruined relationship with the club
 
MiceOnMeth said:
If Bayern aren't keen to renew it tells you all you need to know. Clubs like Real or Bayern don't let players who are still in their peak leave (usually)
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We offered more than 20 million a year, apparently. We tried.
 
hellhunter said:
But why did Bayern allow that relationship to degrade?
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Because we couldn’t afford to pay a player millions who wasn’t allowed to play, due to being unvaccinated. That’s where all this stems from.
 
Shinjch said:
I don't watch Bayern much, has he reached the heights that were expected of him? Or is he seen as someone that fell short?
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No but that's mostly because he was thought of as having matthaus potential which frankly he didn't get to.
 
Could be like an Eriksen signing for us. Get a couple of good seasons out of him, rotate him and Mainoo/Collyer around.

On a free, i think it's a good signing, unless he's got an injury record or there is signs of decline.
 
Mainoonited said:
Could be like an Eriksen signing for us. Get a couple of good seasons out of him, rotate him and Mainoo/Collyer around.

On a free, i think it's a good signing, unless he's got an injury record or there is signs of decline.
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His injury record is almost perfect. There are very few players out there with better availability. His current injury is the first in ages.
 
HTG said:
Difficult to say. I think he never became that incredible worldclass player many hoped for. But he is still very, very good and could play for basically any team in the world.
The reason we’re letting him leave isn’t really related to his performances. He’s still really good and considering his incredible fitness, will likely continue to be so for a while. He’s just asking for too much money and the relationship with the club is damaged, ever since he refused to get vaccinated during Covid and missed time because of it. And as the relationship isn’t that great, both sides, but especially Kimmich, played hardball in the negotiations and we seem to have had enough of that.

There have been reports that he offered himself to other clubs, but their offers were nowhere near what we offered. Shortly afterwards, we have taken our offer from the table.
I would not rule out an extension. But now it would have to come from his initiative and he’d have to accept a team friendly deal. I’d be fine with that, but could live with his departure, too.

If United were to be interested, he could be a really good player for you. As long as you don’t overpay. Other than the Covid drama, he’s been a model professional, leaves everything he has on the pitch and wants to lead his team.
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Thanks for all that info.

I don't think he'd come to us anyway, given the state we're in. And if he did, it would probably be if we were the only team prepared to offer him mad wages - which we definitely shouldn't. Players joining a club for that reason, against all footballing sense which would indicate going elsewhere, hasn't worked out well for us in the last decade.

Given his injury record seems fine, then if he'd come on acceptable wages then I can see the argument for him replacing the Casemiro / Eriksen role (if we can offload the former).

But not the kind of player I'm mostly hoping we target. We should be prioritising players in their prime for this summer. Our squad currently mostly has developing players still not in their prime, and older players past it. I don't want us adding too many more of either of those at this stage. We need to start getting more players in their prime - 23-28 type range. We have too few of those, and too many that are either still raw and inconsistent or past their best / never fit.
 
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Red Star One said:
it's a different kind of risk to buy a 30 yo past his peak for 70m, like we did with Casemiro, and a different risk to bring a 30 yo past his peak on a free, even on a healthy salary.
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Exactly. It’s closer to Eriksen than Casemiro. On a reasonable salary and a 2 year deal I don’t see why he can’t be a squad option.
 
HTG said:
Difficult to say. I think he never became that incredible worldclass player many hoped for. But he is still very, very good and could play for basically any team in the world.
The reason we’re letting him leave isn’t really related to his performances. He’s still really good and considering his incredible fitness, will likely continue to be so for a while. He’s just asking for too much money and the relationship with the club is damaged, ever since he refused to get vaccinated during Covid and missed time because of it. And as the relationship isn’t that great, both sides, but especially Kimmich, played hardball in the negotiations and we seem to have had enough of that.

There have been reports that he offered himself to other clubs, but their offers were nowhere near what we offered. Shortly afterwards, we have taken our offer from the table.
I would not rule out an extension. But now it would have to come from his initiative and he’d have to accept a team friendly deal. I’d be fine with that, but could live with his departure, too.

If United were to be interested, he could be a really good player for you. As long as you don’t overpay. Other than the Covid drama, he’s been a model professional, leaves everything he has on the pitch and wants to lead his team.
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Thanks for the context and insight.
 
Amira said:
Exactly. It’s closer to Eriksen than Casemiro. On a reasonable salary and a 2 year deal I don’t see why he can’t be a squad option.
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That's a big issue though. According to the Bayern poster on here, he's been offered good terms but his wage demands are very high.

Eriksen's stock was hardly high when we signed him. He'd had his heart issues and was playing for Brentford. Kimmich is opting to leave one of the biggest clubs in the world because they can't match his wage demands. I don't think we'll pick him up on a reasonable salary.

It'll probably be one of those 'frees' were the money saved by the buying club on a transfer fee is negotiated into very high player wages, signing on fees, agent fees, etc.
 
bosnian_red said:
The mistakes that bite us in the ass are spending big money on these players, not getting them on frees. We spend big which limits our future spending as it has a big impact on our FFP/PSR stuff. If he's on a free then as long as it's wages that are representative of his level then it's fine. We are able to have big wage players, it just has to make sense. If you have too many older players it's a problem, but we're going to lose a few older players and high earners so there will be space for that, and he fits a need.

Not a chance anyway, City seem the most realistic option.
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It's not just that though, the kind of clubs that might want these players when we need to move them won't be able to afford the wages because we pay towards the top end for them. Plus there'll be signing on fees etc. it's just the kind of player we should be avoiding in general and is the kind of quick fix we've made mistakes with.
 
what could how wrong? we couldn’t possibly be casemiroed twice, could we?
 
There’s no chance he’d sign for us unless he was getting Casemiro type money and a 4 year deal, there’s a good chance we’d have paid that in the past but surely no chance at all now.
 
Bayern rarely let good players go.
 
Great player but United have been burnt here before... Schweinsteiger, Casemiro, Varane.

When clubs as good as Bayern & Real at squad building suddenly let 30+ year old players go who've been a core part of their success you have to ask why.

In terms of fit as well, he's not athletic enough to play RWB in Amorim's system and probably not physical enough to play in a 2-man midfield either.

This aside from the fact I highly doubt he'd join current United. Feels like a City signing, perhaps Barca if FDJ leaves and they want a shiny new toy.
 
Joshua Kimmich is already 30?! Jesus Christ. Damn lord time flies...I feel so old now. For some reason, I still thought he was only 25. Doesn't feel that long ago he just broke out as a puppy-eyed teenage sensation for Die Mannschaft.
 
DavelinaJolie said:
It's not just that though, the kind of clubs that might want these players when we need to move them won't be able to afford the wages because we pay towards the top end for them. Plus there'll be signing on fees etc. it's just the kind of player we should be avoiding in general and is the kind of quick fix we've made mistakes with.
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Sometimes it depends on if it can be a good footballing decision. It's a massive if, because i don't think he wants to come to Manchester United, but IF we signed Kimmich, even on big wages, if we got 2 close to peak seasons, and 1 season where he does a job as a sub or as cover, and it means we have a world class talent in the squad, who is doing it on the pitch too, improving the game of those around him and someone for Mainoo/Ugarte/Collyer to learn from/work with - any money we spend is money well spent. Even if it means we have him for a 4th season where he's naff.

It would also mean we could spend money on another CM and finally have a well stocked midfield.

I think when we signed Matic, it really helped Herrera and Pogba when we played a midfield 3. Just a shame we never persisted with that and built around that midfield model.
 
DannyCAFC said:
Great player but United have been burnt here before... Schweinsteiger, Casemiro, Varane.

When clubs as good as Bayern & Real at squad building suddenly let 30+ year old players go who've been a core part of their success you have to ask why.

In terms of fit as well, he's not athletic enough to play RWB in Amorim's system and probably not physical enough to play in a 2-man midfield either.

This aside from the fact I highly doubt he'd join current United. Feels like a City signing, perhaps Barca if FDJ leaves and they want a shiny new toy.
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Hear hear!

Let's never buy another Casemiro, is not worth it.
 
According to reports he had talks with Barca but they dropped out because of his wage demands.
Apparently he has also been talking to Liverpool.

I dont know what else he wants from us.
-We got a new coach where he can shine again as our leader in CM.
-He was offered a slightly increased salary (Neuer extended for a decreased salary, Müller and Sané are still open but its clear that if they extend, they will also do for less money).
-Apparently he was promised to become captain once Neuer retires
-We already extended with Musiala and Davies, so we will have a great team for the rest of Kimmichs career
-Kompany, Eberl and others in charge have praised him again and again in public

If thats not enough, he should go. No player is bigger than the club.
This could even be a blessing in disguise for us and the development of Pavlovic and Bischof as well as a 2nd chance for Palhinha.
 
Great player but he's at that uncomfortable age where you really don't know what you're signing up for anymore.

I think he could plug into a ready-made team as the #6 and be very good. We're not that club, though.
 
I have little doubt that he would walk into the team, but I still don't want him. I want players I can watch improving, not players where I just have to hope he can stave off decline for another season. 5 years ago a no brainer, but not now.
 
HTG said:
His injury record is almost perfect. There are very few players out there with better availability. His current injury is the first in ages.
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Just like Mason Mount then. I already didn't want him but HTG's posts have convinced me that it would be a terrible signing.
 
Red Star One said:
That’s harsh, borderline clueless, to compare Mount to Kimmich, even if it’s just their fitness
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Mount was apparently rarely injured too and he had a serious injury right now we bought him. Tell me why it's clueless to compare the two?
 
Pexbo said:
Looks like a United signing that is regretted after about 10 months.
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He'll either move to Barca/Madrid/Liverpool/City and be excellent for the next 4 years, or we will give him a 15m a year contract just so he can disappoint.
 
HTG said:
Difficult to say. I think he never became that incredible worldclass player many hoped for. But he is still very, very good and could play for basically any team in the world.
The reason we’re letting him leave isn’t really related to his performances. He’s still really good and considering his incredible fitness, will likely continue to be so for a while. He’s just asking for too much money and the relationship with the club is damaged, ever since he refused to get vaccinated during Covid and missed time because of it. And as the relationship isn’t that great, both sides, but especially Kimmich, played hardball in the negotiations and we seem to have had enough of that.

There have been reports that he offered himself to other clubs, but their offers were nowhere near what we offered. Shortly afterwards, we have taken our offer from the table.
I would not rule out an extension. But now it would have to come from his initiative and he’d have to accept a team friendly deal. I’d be fine with that, but could live with his departure, too.

If United were to be interested, he could be a really good player for you. As long as you don’t overpay. Other than the Covid drama, he’s been a model professional, leaves everything he has on the pitch and wants to lead his team.
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Would disagree with him not being world class, while I understand now there is a lot of debate on his true ability after Tuchel made a point of it last season, he was quite unanimously regarded as world class from 2019-2022 when he first started playing as a CM. The change of opinion started more with how aggressive Tuchel was against him playing in central midfield and that there is a group of diehard Tuchel fans who have just stuck to that opinion.

I still think he's world class. He's an amazing passer and his ability to create from deep is second to none right now, the stats show it as well with him ranking consistently very high in terms of shot creation. He certainly isn't a good dribbler , and something that distinguishes him from someone like Pedri, who is amazing at dribbling out of pressure, but makes up for with generally being tidy under possession and not losing the ball when pressured. Where he's also shown weakness in is defending, which is why he's been moved out from his preferred number 6 to somewhere between a 6 and 8.

He's becoming a Kroos/late-Pirlo type player who is exceptional at passing but lacks the energy to go up and down the pitch, and therefore needs more energetic players around them. Pirlo thrived in a 4 man central midfield with Marchisio, Pogba and Vidal since he had runners and was left to distribute the ball, Kroos similarly in his last season with Valverde, Camavinga and Bellingham after struggling the previous 2 in a 3 man midfield. Can imagine Kimmich being great in Amiron's 4 man midfield with someone like Ugarte next to him and another CM/AM who has high energy.

His first preference would definitely still be to stay at Bayern but if he's being forced out then it's obviously out of his hands. I don't think it's that Bayern don't rate him, he's played every minute of every match up until his recent injury and has been amazing this season.
 
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It won’t be truly free. “Free transfers” for high profile players, more often than not, will include a sizeable sign on bonus, agent fees that are higher than for a regular transfer, and obviously high wages.

Considering his age, and that he’s a silly quack, that we’re skint, and that Amorim wants very high energy football and requires a lot from his midfielders, and that Kimmich will have better options, I’d say this is not worth it.

But yes, he’s still an excellent player as of today. No one knows how long that will persist.
 
I'd take him on a free depending on his salary requests. If he fits into the budget plan on a 3 year deal max, happy days. Can play RB and midfield.
 
No thanks, players that leave Bayern and Madrid have not been good for us. Regardless of him being free.. which he wont be because he will want a signing on bonus.

His wages to come to us would not be cheap either.

He is 30 now as well, so its Casemiro, Eriksen all over again where they wont be able to play the high press in a year.
 
I'd take him, I want at least 2 CMs brought in and we have a lot of other areas that need to be addressed, at least two more forwards and player to play in that wing back position and a new GK (in an ideal world).

I want players in midfield that value the ball and dictate play to help us get more control in games.
 
The more relevant question is, even if we wanted him, why would he want to join us?
 
Absolutely not.

Not yet another big name that wants a payday now they're over the hill.
 
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