Risking their bodies? All the league needs to do is work on the schedule a bit to make it less congested so the well being of footballers isn't sacrificed. The physical toll all these games with no break takes on them is ridiculous. You struggle to feel sorry for footballers at risk of getting injured? Ah right, use and abuse them for the greater entertainment of impatient fans right? What a ridiculous thing to say. They are human beings just like the rest who deserve their rights and an appropriate time to rest. They aren't slaves for your amusement.
Jordan Henderson : voices player welfare fears | Rice: Obscene schedule of games
- Thread starter YzWayne
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There are plenty of ways to go about it. Other leagues don't have anywhere near the same issues with congestion as the premier league has, and they manage to squeeze in a winter break.
What's the point of the league cup for any big club? Why is it only the premier league that didn't introduce 5 subs per game? Why do they need to put 2 games within 3 days? Why can other leagues adjust the weekend schedules for teams depending on European commitments, but the premier league always refuses to do so?
All valid questions that should be changed.
Slaves? Physical toll? Sacrifised?
Due to the risk of them getting a hamstring injury? A bit of a cramp at the end of a game? Sure, it can be avoided. But of all the employers welfare I am concerned about these days, you will not find the footballers at the top. Probably closer to the bottom of that list. And for a priviliged footballer to be crying over his welfare these days? It is just ridiculus.
I can't make sense of that post.
Why is it ridiculous? Without referencing irrelevant low paid and/or over-worked professions please.
Yeah I can't disagree with you if that's the mentality that have.
I think much of it is due to jealously about what they earn.
Another slant seems to be the injuries and @andersj I'm surprised to see you playing it down. A football career at the top level is very short and time is precious. Why should players risk easily avoidable injuries, and why should clubs lose out, just so the PL can make as much TV revenue as possible with a ridiculous schedule.
You clearly have no idea what state the bodies of professional athletes are left in once they are done their careers. More injuries due to fatigue only makes it worse. We aren't talking cramp or hamstring injuries. We're talking about the need to do full knee replacements and so many athletes being left with all sorts of damage for the rest of their lives.
Of course a footballer will worry about himself? Who the feck else is he going to worry about? Everyone fights the fight that they can have a say in. Nobody is asking you to stand up for them. It's just a common sense, decency point. The well being of footballers is always ignored and the quality of their play suffers. Their physical health suffers. Their mental health suffers. There are EXTREMELY simple changes that can easily be made that will improve all 3. Fans will enjoy watching higher quality football more frequently, as the players aren't injured or knackered. Players will be happier and healthier and they'll have better lives after retirement.
The past few years have been incredibly fecked up how they've just been adding and adding to their schedules between club level and international football with no resistance. Players are now standing up and want change because it simply can't go on like this and it needs to be scaled back.
Are you that fecked in the head and selfish that you can't understand that whatever line of work, whatever your pay, that the physical and mental health of EVERYONE should be prioritized and taken more seriously? This isn't the 1980's. Get with the times. People's well being shouldn't be abused.
I don’t understand why the answer is less football...the answer is squad management...if clubs cared so much about their players they would look after them better. Managers should Look at their own schedule and say, I’m gonna rest xyz this game because I have to...for their sake...don’t continue flogging players and then point fingers at the league and say-“ now look, you made me give that player a fuking heart attack”...it’s not that difficult to understand.
In any other profession, if my employees are too tired to do the job or are exhausted or their health is at risk- that’s my fault...so I get more employees...if I’m less productive...I put strategies in place to account for the shortfall and try get back to where we were with a new approach. I don’t keep working my best employees into the ground And ask my customers to settle for less of the product. I adapt and my employees come first. The league don’t employ these players.
The answer is simply more focus on squads and youth teams as part of the first team jigsaw. This all works itself out to an extent...
Lesser clubS gets knocked out of cups, they play less games, they get less money...the price for being a better team is playing more games-but they get more money and so should be able to afford bigger squads to handle the additional fixtures.
More and more of them are you know having cardiac problems... that's a pretty big welfare concern that comes above cramp.
Because their «welfare» is better taking care of than 99,9 % than the rest of the world.
More and more? Do you think more professional footballers have cardiac problems than in the rest of the population (between 20 and 40)?
And I also think their employers should start taking better care of them. Maybe they should even take better care of themself. But is the welfare of footballers a big issue? Not at all!
It's not quite the same thing. Take the NFL for example. They had 16 game seasons for ages until this year they increased it by 1 game, to a lot of complaints. Just 17 games though. Once a week. Physically, they can't handle more. Everyone knows that the more games that are played, the more injuries that happen. The idea that a greater quantity of a product just makes it better is just wrong. Diluting the quality to increase the quantity is never a good idea. The quality of the product is increased greatly just by relieving some physical stress. And like I said, they are simple changes. Get rid of the league cup, or just for clubs in Europe at the very least. It makes no sense why it exists for them. Enable teams to make 5 subs like the rest of Europe. Remove cup replays. Work with clubs to have appropriate rest days between every game. Work with clubs on the scheduling of games during congested periods like every other league does (CL game coming up in midweek? Then play Friday or early Saturday. Had a game on Wednesday? Then you can't play until Tuesday.). Get rid of pointless international breaks, get rid of pointless international friendlies, maybe just completely revamp the international football calendar all together. Scrap talk of a World cup every 2 years (again, diluting quality with quantity). They already have major tournaments every 2 years anyway, unless they plan on just scrapping the continental cups which I don't agree with.
It's incredibly simple changes that are done pretty much everywhere else that would greatly improve the overall quality of football and reduce the amount of injuries. How can that not be a better thing for all?
Liverpool can't rest rest Mo Salah for x, y and z, eventually fall out of the title race, have manager lose his job that's ridiculous. The problem is the schedule.
Man City played 62 games last season between 21st of September and 29th of May. 62 games in 250 days not including internationals in the same period. 4 days per game. Add in 6 internationals and its 68 in 250 so 1 game for Cities players every 3.5 days...
Ah right, because they get paid a lot of money means they don't have a right to basic human workers rights, and their well being doesn't matter. You sound like a bit of a cnut to be honest.
What a guy!
It's just crazy to have 0 empathy here. It's the same mentality that people had when the issue of concussions in football and hockey were first brought up. "Ah you get paid stop complaining". There's an easy fix to it, and it GREATLY improves the quality of life for these human beings.
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Upping your game to hyperbolic whataboutery isn't helping me to understand your position.
What would be your thoughts on player welfare and what Pep/Klopp/Henderson have said if the max salary in the PL was, say, £100k a year? Would your opinion be any different?
Where did I say more than the rest of the population? People who are under enforced rest as part of a strict routine for probably 70 hours per week.... train optimally, eat optimally and you wanna compare that to morbidly obese Joey aged 36 who eats mc donalds all day, downs 18 cans of lager and lives in him moms basement playing League of Legends when he's not at his office job?
How about we make the comparison to something more realistic, footballers a few years ago when they weren't run into the ground?
You think footballers don't take care of themselves? Really? Just because its not a big issue to you, doesn't mean its not a big issue.
It's a big issue for footballers. That's the point. You're allowed fight your own corner, regardless of how much you get paid.
This is a bit mad. You say that they should be taken care of better but also think they should just shut up and get on with it because they sleep on a big pile of money?
No! Because they would still be so priviliged to be able to make a good living out of playing football! I know quite a few who did (not PL-money). Most of them went through injuries, but I think all of them would have given anything and everything to be able to have ten more years in football.
And what you call «whataboutery» is not totally irrelevant either. In fact, I would rather call it «context».
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What I find bizarre is that the the player / manager comments are directed at the PL, whilst the clubs have already voted to continue the schedule.
Seems to me they’re barking up the wrong tree?
Seems to me they’re barking up the wrong tree?
If Klopp and Pep think that they are putting their players welfare at risk, I am saying they should use someone else. I am also saying that maybe players themselves should consider what they put into their bodies and how they take care of it if they think their welfare is at stake.
And I am saying that «players welfare», overall, is pretty damn good in the PL. In fact, I would argue that the welfare of few others are as good. Hence, I think it sounds a bit stupid when players/coaches, in this environment, complain about there welfare.
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Fighting for quadruple every year gets you that. Now imagine winning that quadruple you would probably need one or two games even more, but luckily for your players you didn't play that much.
Other european leagues aren't as sellable/watchable abroad as PL, especially in the Eastern part of the world.
And PL has the biggest TV money of all the leagues out there now, thanks to mamy countries in the East, where Christmas season isn't a big deal...so PL teams have no option but to play, even if they don't want to.
I agree with you on this, it`s down to the managers to manage their squad better. There is no need to overplay anyone with the sizes of these squads.
Isn't that the point though? It's near impossible to manage your squad with covid. Benitez was saying that the PL say they have 13 players so must play. That includes Calvert Lewin who hasn't played in two months.
Huge injury risks and hardly gives the clubs breathing space to look after their players?
I do get what you're saying- we've obviously all invested emotion, time and money into football to varying degrees. But given we now have oil state-owned clubs battling those owned by Russian oligarchs and US billionaires, it's hardly the romantic memory of football in our grandad's day.
Even plucky little Leicester are owned by Thai billionaires and have merchandise shops in Asia.
It's harder for a lot of people to as closely identify with clubs, let alone rely on them for purpose in life, when the sport is a multibillion global marketing machine.
Globalization and Cable TV killed romanticism in football clubs.
While I agree with Jippy’s point, I disagree that globalisation has killed the romanticism in football.
You say that PL players are looked after better than other leagues. Is there any evidence of this?
From what I know that isn't true. None of the other big leagues have two domestic cups. The PL is the only one that instead of having a Xmas break has a even more packed than normal schedule and most of the other leagues rejig their schedule when teams are playing in Europe to give them more time between games.
In my opinion how much someone gets paid shouldn't come into a conversation around how they are treated or how many games they are expected to play. Also it isn't context. How badly someone in another industry gets treated is irrelevant. One thing isn't ok because something else is worse.
By the way what is <<this business>> all about? I've only seen it in pseudo-code and it's meaningless to me in an English sentence.
Why don't they just play different players?
Clubs and players complain about this stuff, but the whole squad is not used enough to alleviate this. There are ways to do it, but they just don't.
In the end, they are bringing it on themselves, also.
Clubs and players complain about this stuff, but the whole squad is not used enough to alleviate this. There are ways to do it, but they just don't.
In the end, they are bringing it on themselves, also.
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Because they can't afford to lose games? Because if they leave out x or y they have 40k people wanting their head? Because there is so much money in football that doing so cause repercussions?
Because covid has sidelined a lot of their players at the busiest time of year and they are down to 13 or 14 players having to play a game every 3 days, in shitty conditions?
Because football players are people too and the mental fatigue of constant travel and danger from the pandemic is taking a toll on them and they are worried?
The idea that its just as simple as use x or y instead of a or b is nonsense. The players and clubs play too much, a potential 70 club games per season not including internationals is ridiculous and puts huge strain on both the physical and mental health of players and its been increased 10 fold in the pandemic. Having 10 international games in a season is not unheard of. So 80 matches per season? Something has to give.
Henderson is obviously right.
The caf and whataboutism - name a better duo.
Some of the posters saying players should just ask to sit out a game when they're feeling overworked or that managers should use their squad more would be among the first to complain if we dropped points because we played squad players they didn't rate or a player declined to play.
If anything, the fans welfare needs to be talked. We are the ones who are constantly exploited, used and cheated. Players & clubs can all very superficial about fans, and this festive season is no different.
They just want the money to pour in, and the fans lack the lobby & pressure to change it. Hendo like typical A- star player is an idiot, who can only think of himself...
They just want the money to pour in, and the fans lack the lobby & pressure to change it. Hendo like typical A- star player is an idiot, who can only think of himself...
Doing away with international football (at least the pointless friendlies) would go some way to alleviating the problem of overworked players. Seriously, would you really miss international football if it suddenly disappeared from this plane of existence?
Ditto the League Cup, the FA Cup and Piers Morgan while we're at it. Get rid of them all I say.
Ditto the League Cup, the FA Cup and Piers Morgan while we're at it. Get rid of them all I say.
Jorginho played 43 games last season in a season where Chelsea reached the FA Cup final, the Champion's League final, and the Euro's final. That is pretty much maximising a season in terms of available games.
Would you say he played too much last season? I would say no. That averages less than a game per week over the course of a year. You could make it 43 weeks with 7 weeks holiday, which is way beyond a normal jobs holidays.
Last season, he had no injuries, so every game missed was due to squad management. In the end, managers have a choice of who to play and when. A lot of the time they do not use it.
Jorginho had the potential to play in 78 games: Chelsea (59 games) and Italy (19 games). Management chose to only play him 43 times overall, and 6 of those were sub appearances. The option is there.
Jorginho plays for Chelsea. Declan Rice has had to play potentially every 4 days since lockdown ended 18 months ago. Its not so easy to rotate when you aren't City, United or Chelsea.