Joey Barton - ex manager - wannabe podcaster

[Sandikan]

He compared her to serial killer Rose West, then later doubled down and said she was in the 'Joseph Stalin category' for 'murdering hundreds of thousands of ears'.

Sounds like the sort of routine some "edgy" comedian would do without any scrutiny.
I'm in favour of idiots being shut down as a rule though.

 

[duffer]

Free speech isn't a thing in the UK, anyway.

It's not a thing anywhere. There's various legal limits everywhere.

 

[Sandikan]

Sigh. Why do you think I’m sticking up for him? Barton is a cnut, and what he said was offensive. I’m sticking up for everyone’s right to talk shit and not have the police lock you up for it.

There's tiers of chatting "sh!t" though isn't there.

Saying things that are just plain untrue, or galvanise morons to harass someone shouldn't ever be considered your "right" to free speech.

 

[Sandikan]

Free speech isn't a thing in the UK, anyway.

It is, but it doesn't mean what some think it means.

 

[2 man midfield]

There's tiers of chatting "sh!t" though isn't there.

Saying things that are just plain untrue, or galvanise morons to harass someone shouldn't ever be considered your "right" to free speech.

You can sue someone for defamation, slander etc but that’s a civil matter not a criminal one.

I agree that inciting someone else to commit harassment is different but I didn’t see that in his tweets. Just a lot of offensive nonsense - the usual course of action is to ignore the cnut doing it.

If his followers took it upon themselves to then go and harass her, then that’s them doing it. They should be charged with harassment, however I don’t think you can say there was incitement for that in his initial tweets.

 

[cafecillos]

No - hate speech, inciting violence etc aren’t included under free speech

Those are not the only things not protected though. Although it varies from legal system to legal system, plain insults are also not protected. Whether they are serious enough to warrant criminal prosecution is another debate. But it has to be clear: we are not debating free speech/freedom of expression here.

 

[thisisnottaken1]

The impact of people like Barton et al is having very real consequences for women and girls.
Seems a bit nuts to me everyone can’t see this.

https://www.theguardian.com/society...y-england-wales-police?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Do people like this not consider the impact on their mother, sister, daughter, etc and other women and girls in their lives? Whom am I kidding, of course they don’t.

 

[Scanny]

Do people like this not consider the impact on their mother, sister, daughter, etc and other women and girls in their lives? Whom am I kidding, of course they don’t.

Not to mention that this “version” (Barton’s/Tate’s etc) masculinity is not good for the mental health of the majority of men.

 

[thisisnottaken1]

Not to mention that this “version” (Barton’s/Tate’s etc) masculinity is not good for the mental health of the majority of men.

Exactly. It doesn’t benefit anybody

 

[Gabriel Djemba-Bebe]

Having read over this back and forth, I can see what 2 man midfield is saying. You seem to want others to follow your train of thought and criticise them if they don't agree. Just like the other guy calling people incels because they don't have an extreme left approach.

For the record though I don't agree with Barton, but I do think people should be allowed to have their own opinion as long as it doesn't break the law

The fact that this is the only comment posted by this account in months, and they haven't logged in since, makes me think this is likely a burner account for someone to back themselves up when they're losing an argument.

 

[thisisnottaken1]

The fact that this is the only comment posted by this account in months, and they haven't logged in since, makes me think this is likely a burner account for someone to back themselves up when they're losing an argument.

It’s a fecking shite comment. I hate when people say shite like “you only call someone [accurate description] because you disagree with them”, and it’s like fecking NO, we call someone that because that’s what they are. In this instance, someone is being called an incel because they express the same ideology that those people do, which is one that is deeply misogynistic. I technically fit the original criterion for “incel”, which is that I’m 25 years old and have never had a girlfriend, let alone sex (which is really bad), but I don’t go around spouting sexist bile and blaming women for my lack of success, as even though I have autism and ADHD, I acknowledge that a lot of it is probably my fault, partly due to being a bit of a recluse.

 

[The Real No7]

The fact that this is the only comment posted by this account in months, and they haven't logged in since, makes me think this is likely a burner account for someone to back themselves up when they're losing an argument.

Not a burner just don't comment much

 

[The Real No7]

It’s a fecking shite comment. I hate when people say shite like “you only call someone [accurate description] because you disagree with them”, and it’s like fecking NO, we call someone that because that’s what they are. In this instance, someone is being called an incel because they express the same ideology that those people do, which is one that is deeply misogynistic. I technically fit the original criterion for “incel”, which is that I’m 25 years old and have never had a girlfriend, let alone sex (which is really bad), but I don’t go around spouting sexist bile and blaming women for my lack of success, as even though I have autism and ADHD, I acknowledge that a lot of it is probably my fault, partly due to being a bit of a recluse.

Well what is an incel then

 

[Tarrou]

Well what is an incel then

someone who can't get laid who hates women, and also men who get laid

 

[The Real No7]

someone who can't get laid who hates women, and also men who get laid

This is exactly my point that I made. Calling someone an incel because they don't agree with a point of view is common place now on the Internet. Much like the people who call other people incels are often *****.

No doubt the people who use that term doesn't read over the actual arguments people make just get enraged for the sake of it. I would also have no doubts that these same people agree with transgender men fighting women because they are a woman now.

 

[The Real No7]

This is exactly my point that I made. Calling someone an incel because they don't agree with a point of view is common place now on the Internet. Much like the people who call other people incels are often *****.

No doubt the people who use that term doesn't read over the actual arguments people make just get enraged for the sake of it. I would also have no doubts that these same people agree with transgender men fighting women because they are a woman now.

When the caf is censoring a word s i m p there is a problem

 

[top1whoisman]

When the caf is censoring a word s i m p there is a problem

There’s plenty of other forums available.

 

[Gabriel Djemba-Bebe]

someone who can't get laid who hates women, and also men who get laid

Barton's horrible comments towards women is likely to attract a few people who fit that description. Or, as @The Real No7 has interpreted this - incels are also people who 'don't have an extreme left approach'.

 

[Semper Fudge]

When the caf is censoring a word s i m p there is a problem

Feel free to go elsewhere.

 

[The Real No7]

Barton's horrible comments towards women is likely to attract a few people who fit that description. Or, as @The Real No7 has interpreted this - incels are also people who 'don't have an extreme left approach'.

Do you care to read over the original argument and pick out what 2 man midfield said that was wrong and also what I have said that is so wrong?

 

[Gabriel Djemba-Bebe]

Do you care to read over the original argument and pick out what 2 man midfield said that was wrong and also what I have said that is so wrong?

I'm not particularly interested in the argument you two were having. Randomly sensationalising my incel comment was what I took issue with here:

You seem to want others to follow your train of thought and criticise them if they don't agree. Just like the other guy calling people incels because they don't have an extreme left approach.

 

[thisisnottaken1]

This is exactly my point that I made. Calling someone an incel because they don't agree with a point of view is common place now on the Internet. Much like the people who call other people incels are often *****.

No doubt the people who use that term doesn't read over the actual arguments people make just get enraged for the sake of it. I would also have no doubts that these same people agree with transgender men fighting women because they are a woman now.

A trans man is a man who was assigned female at birth. It’s not a man who feels like he’s a woman. Imane Khelif isn’t even transgender, she’s a cis woman.