[Norris]

He's been used on the right on the left in the middle , lying deeper, earlier in the season . Give me Park any day.
Lingard was a lot better earlier in the season but he's not strong enough and I know he's a local lad and loves United but something is not right, he's 24 in December - unless he improves drastically in his play very quickly he won't have a future here - if and when LVG leaves (ie in the summer) it's a certainty we'll buy someone of much better quality to play on the right.

I just said he reminds me of Park. Din't say he was as good as him. . And by that comparison, I mean he could be used as that relentless engine that Park was so often reliably good at.

Not everyone develops the same to be honest. So why should that be a surprise. Mahrez is 25 and he was unheard of until this season and now he's being linked to all the big boys. Same for Vardy, Payet just to name a few from a long list of late bloomers.

What improvement are you exactly talking about ? The major weakness right now for the first team is his finishing (I really don't know how to explain this but he was really good in this aspect at the Youth level). I am not saying United won't go and buy a RW (Regardless of who's in charge, but finding a quality RW might be a little harder than you think!), but the criticism on him is very unwarranted. He had an excellent first half. He has a really good understanding with Martial and Rashford which is really amazing since we all kept saying that van persie and Falcao just needed some game time to really click and then you have these young guys showing us just how easily it's done. His movement is fantastic, his work ethic is great. And when needed he brings the ball forward 30-40 yards and helps us advance.

 

[ArmchairCritic]

I think there's more in his game and I know he's 23 but that really is not that old. A bit more final product in his game and I think he's an good squad player, he seems much more at home with Martial and Rashford linking up with him. I don't think he's really at the standard we expect of a proper United winger but he is very useful for specific types of games where we have to put a bit more focus on link up play and when we have to deal with good full-backs/wingers. He's always going to get attract a lot of criticism because his game is so simple, but I do think guys like Lingard are very important to building a good team. He was the only one who stuck up for Rashford up at City and he really does love playing for us, other more expensive guys have come in and not show anywhere near the same application as him.

He needs to start producing passes like the one where Martial was offside more often and to be a little more composed in front of goal. I think he can become a squad player who chips in with 10 goals/10 assists over a long season.

 

[Norris]

He's always going to get attract a lot of criticism because his game is so simple, but I do think guys like Lingard are very important to building a good team.

Very well said.

 

[limerickcitykid]

Misses too many sitters and it pisses me off. Could have cost us today.

Neither of his chances were sitters. He also played through Martial who skied it over the net. Could have cost us today.

 

[Paul the Wolf]

I just said he reminds me of Park. Din't say he was as good as him. . And by that comparison, I mean he could be used as that relentless engine that Park was so often reliably good at.

Not everyone develops the same to be honest. So why should that be a surprise. Mahrez is 25 and he was unheard of until this season and now he's being linked to all the big boys. Same for Vardy, Payet just to name a few from a long list of late bloomers.

What improvement are you exactly talking about ? The major weakness right now for the first team is his finishing (I really don't know how to explain this but he was really good in this aspect at the Youth level). I am not saying United won't go and buy a RW (Regardless of who's in charge, but finding a quality RW might be a little harder than you think!), but the criticism on him is very unwarranted. He had an excellent first half. He has a really good understanding with Martial and Rashford which is really amazing since we all kept saying that van persie and Falcao just needed some game time to really click and then you have these young guys showing us just how easily it's done. His movement is fantastic, his work ethic is great. And when needed he brings the ball forward 30-40 yards and helps us advance.

Although his finishing is horrendous, that is the least of my concerns.
He had a reasonable first half, which is what I said much earlier but one half in 10 games is not enough , I must have missed the 30 or 40 yard runs (with the ball)he keeps doing or the tracking back he doesn't do, wrong positioning, rarely wins a challenge etc etc , forget his finishing. I see a lot of easy touches and short passes - occasionally he might do something of note but it's nowhere near often enough

Vardy & Mahrez suit Leicester's style perfectly this season, next season, who knows, Leicester will probably fade away again. Payet's been around a long time and only Uk fans think he's a new thing but he only came to the UK last summer.

 

[Drainy]

From watching him for a long time, he always stuck me as the type that misses some easy chances and then scores the occasional ridiculous goal.

If he can start scoring scruffy goals he'll be a good player because he gets into the right positions

 

[Norris]

Although his finishing is horrendous, that is the least of my concerns.
He had a reasonable first half, which is what I said much earlier but one half in 10 games is not enough , I must have missed the 30 or 40 yard runs (with the ball)he keeps doing or the tracking back he doesn't do, wrong positioning, rarely wins a challenge etc etc , forget his finishing. I see a lot of easy touches and short passes - occasionally he might do something of note but it's nowhere near often enough

Vardy & Mahrez suit Leicester's style perfectly this season, next season, who knows, Leicester will probably fade away again. Payet's been around a long time and only Uk fans think he's a new thing but he only come to the UK last summer.

The thing is you are expecting him to give you a 8 or 9 star performance each game, which I know he won't be able to do. But I do expect a solid 7 or thereabouts most of the time which is more than enough for certain games.

He does track back quite a bit actually. For example, in today's game, the Cleverley miss was when Lingard made a late lunge to throw him off. Granted it was rash and maybe even a little lucky, but he's usually done a pretty solid job of doubling up on that side with the RB. Regards to positioning, I am not really quite sure what you mean, because Wingers positioning is a lot more lax compared to defenders. Only thing is he shouldn't be found caught up too high up the field with the RB next to him, but even then, most of the blame falls on the RB. In an attacking sense, he's a winger. Unless he has clear tactical instructions, he is free to do what he wants in the final third. Regarding the 30-40 yard bursts, he has done it in previous games more than a couple of times. So you might want to look that up.
Also basically to you, easy touches = not good enough now ?? Some of the best players in the world are famous for getting the basics right. Then they add more dimensions to their game. I am not suggesting he is going to be world class either, but being able to do the simple things right is Football 101. There are higher rated players with fat wages who don't even get this concept.

The problem is you expect him to be world class and people have been so spoilt by top class wingers down the years that they expect the next superstar in him. If you keep your expectations to realistic levels and know 100% exactly what you will get from him every game, then you will realize he's not as bad as people think.

And I wasn't talking about a player's suitability to a system or whatever. I was suggesting that you can not expect every one to develop the same. Plenty of players in history are late bloomers. Some have even gone on to become legends. Maybe Lingard is one of them. Maybe he's not, who knows. But the boy atleast deserves a chance before being branded with one label or another.

 

[Ish]

Whenever I read this thread I feel like I'm in some sort of messed up twilight zone

Depending on whose posts you read, his performances veer from "shit/invisible" to "excellent" FFS.

 

[Drainy]

Whenever I read this thread I feel like I'm in some sort of messed up twilight zone

Depending on whose posts you read, his performances veer from "shit/invisible" to "excellent" FFS.

It's because in the second half he was invisible, in the first he was very good outside of the box and central to a lot of our positive play but also missed some good chances

In fairness, he was very mixed in the match so depending on what you focus on he could have been good or terrible.

 

[stepic]

He was wank today.

 

[Ish]

It's because in the second half he was invisible, in the first he was very good outside of the box and central to a lot of our positive play but also missed some good chances

In fairness, he was very mixed in the match so depending on what you focus on he could have been good or terrible.

Tbf, it's not just today's match. It almost happens after every match.

 

[Scorpy]

Neither of his chances were sitters. He also played through Martial who skied it over the net. Could have cost us today.

No need to be pedantic about today's chances when he's been missing sitters all season. His finishing is shit, but has some good qualities - good movement off the ball, link up play, defensive work, pace on the wing etc. We just need another right winger of much better quality if we want to progress as a team and be more creative and efficient. For all his strengths, Lingard is a pretty limited player but it's always good to have a player with great attitude like him in the squad.

 

[Paul the Wolf]

The thing is you are expecting him to give you a 8 or 9 star performance each game, which I know he won't be able to do. But I do expect a solid 7 or thereabouts most of the time which is more than enough for certain games.

He does track back quite a bit actually. For example, in today's game, the Cleverley miss was when Lingard made a late lunge to throw him off. Granted it was rash and maybe even a little lucky, but he's usually done a pretty solid job of doubling up on that side with the RB. Regards to positioning, I am not really quite sure what you mean, because Wingers positioning is a lot more lax compared to defenders. Only thing is he shouldn't be found caught up too high up the field with the RB next to him, but even then, most of the blame falls on the RB. In an attacking sense, he's a winger. Unless he has clear tactical instructions, he is free to do what he wants in the final third. Regarding the 30-40 yard bursts, he has done it in previous games more than a couple of times. So you might want to look that up.
Also basically to you, easy touches = not good enough now ?? Some of the best players in the world are famous for getting the basics right. Then they add more dimensions to their game. I am not suggesting he is going to be world class either, but being able to do the simple things right is Football 101. There are higher rated players with fat wages who don't even get this concept.

The problem is you expect him to be world class and people have been so spoilt by top class wingers down the years that they expect the next superstar in him. If you keep your expectations to realistic levels and know 100% exactly what you will get from him every game, then you will realize he's not as bad as people think.

And I wasn't talking about a player's suitability to a system or whatever. I was suggesting that you can not expect every one to develop the same. Plenty of players in history are late bloomers. Some have even gone on to become legends. Maybe Lingard is one of them. Maybe he's not, who knows. But the boy atleast deserves a chance before being branded with one label or another.

I don't expect an 8 or 9 performance from him , he's not capable - a 6 or 7 would be nice. His average rating on here is 5.6, my average for him is 5.5. If he'd have played the 2nd half today the same as the first I would have given him a generous 7, he got a 5 because of his second half showing. I think I gave him a MOM earlier in the season. Trying to pick out an occasional benefit to the team really sums up what the problem is.

We have Martial on the left and Lingard on the right - someone on here seems to suggest Lingard is better than Martial, heaven help us if Lingard is still playing for us next season as first choice, only under LVG could this happen - we need someone of Martial's quality on the right

 

[Sylar]

If he can work on his finishing, he would move to a 8/10 player. Everything else he does (including the build up and play) is good. As I said earlier in this thread, I can see why he plays on the right for us, because we dont have anybody better than him (maybe if Young was fit or maybe valencia if he could cross, lol).

But hopefully he still sees minutes / games next season cos hes a good squad player to have. I would still like him to have competition however.

 

[stevoc]

Excellent first half (most impressed i've been with him) But a bit meh second half, the game passed him by.

If he can start playing like he did in the first 45 on a regular basis and improve his finishing he could be a really good player for us.

 

[Mainoldo]

I think he is still coming to terms that he is playing at this a level. He is a far better finisher than he is showing which is annoying. I mean that left foot strike today!!! Horrendous. With time he will settle his shooting nerves. He's not Anderson bad.

 

[Perrick Dubois]

Don't know why everyone is ripping him so hard. He is a tidy little player and intelligent off the ball. His game will come together when Van Gaal leaves, he isn't a prototypical player under his leadership and I feel his game is stretching to try and accommodate the discipline rather than the natural growth.

 

[Giant Midget]

I think he is still coming to terms that he is playing at this a level. He is a far better finisher than he is showing which is annoying. I mean that left foot strike today!!! Horrendous. With time he will settle his shooting nerves. He's not Anderson bad.

That really was set up niceley for a placed, curling shot into the corner. 10/10 goal on FIFA.

 

[Perrick Dubois]

That really was set up niceley for a placed, curling shot into the corner. 10/10 goal on FIFA.

Ashley would have buried it...

 

[afrocentricity]

When LVG leaves and Lingard is no longer in the team, will the Lingard Fanclub call for LVG to be reinstated?

You're trying too hard mate, it's like you are reading from the caf attention seekers handbook.... I get your point, you've made it enough times. Time to move on I think...

 

[Freak]

I still don't know what he does well for an attacking player.

 

[shabadu84]

Shown enough intelligence with his link-up, runs, and positioning to make me think he can improve the finishing and decision making with a little more experience. The connection with Rashford and Martial is promising, think it's harsh to say he can't be a decent player eventually. 36 games played for us is too early to write him off

 

[Americano]

Misses too many sitters and it pisses me off. Could have cost us today.

He has had more than a few golden chances in front of goal that didn't go in, hasn't he? We can't really depend on him to finish consistently. The way we play, we badly need those goals.

 

[AR87]

He has had more than a few golden chances in front of goal that didn't go in, hasn't he? We can't really depend on him to finish consistently. The way we play, we badly need those goals.

His finishing is poor, but at least he's actually getting in to those positions. Our other options on the wing aren't exactly inspiring right now or provide any type of attacking verve, which is why the handwringing over Lingard is ridiculous.

I doubt even his biggest supporters would say they think he is or will be good enough as a nailed on starter for a team pushing for the league, but as a squad option over the course of a season where you'd hope to be pushing on all fronts domestically and in Europe, he is a solid.

 

[Adisa]

So bloody lackadaisical in front of goal. He could easily and should be in double figures this season. Produced a decent save in the one on one from Robles. However the chance when he sliced the ball is unacceptable at this level. Needs to work on it if he's ever going to be good enough.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

His finishing is fecking terrible. You could make a decent length YouTube video of all the really good chances he's blown this season.

I still think he's an average player, I'd be happy to have him as a squad player but after this season he shouldn't be considered a first teamer.

 

[.Rossi]

One of the weirdest players I've ever seen in my life.

Sometimes he makes me think, "feck me, you really are shite"
Other times, he makes me think "There's a good little player in there"

 

[superdry]

One of the weirdest players I've ever seen in my life.

Sometimes he makes me think, "feck me, you really are shite"
Other times, he makes me think "There's a good little player in there"

Summed up perfectly.

 

[NoPace]

I still don't know what he does well for an attacking player.

Moves the ball quickly to teammates and is fairly quick. Sometimes finds decent pockets of space a bit tucked in from the right wing. There are a fair amount of similar sort of wingers/wide attacking midfielders at non-CL La Liga sides, if maybe generally a bit less quick and a bit more creative on the ball. Susaeta at Bilbao is one that comes to mind.

Had a good game today. The fact that he can play as a CM, W or as a 10, seems to have some chemistry with Rashford and to a lesser extent Martial and that he can't be on huge wages should mean he gets another few years here.

 

[Stobzilla]

We had about 19 shots on goal and it seemed like he had a hand in about 10 of them, as well as a couple of great balls in behind that were fluffed by a poor first touch.

 

[Gatti33]

Too wasteful in front of goal and if he doesn't sort that out can't see him lasting very long. At the moment he's all we have in that position so will do but I have a feeling if we do make a marquee signing this summer it'll be a winger/wide player and it'll be him who will be dropped. Rightly so in my opinion.

 

[Sean_RedDevil]

If Lingard's finishing would be at least average then he would have scored at least 15 goals this season......a shame his finishing is awful and that isn't good enough for a club like ours.

 

[Verminator]

If Lingatd's finishing would be at least average then he would have scored at least 15 goals this season......a shame his finishing is awful and that isn't good enough for a club like ours.

So, more than Martial then?
There is a narrative on here that I don't like. He got hammered for hitting that half volley at the keeper, which was a very difficult chance and a hard skill to pull off. Martial hits the ball further over the goal than he was away from it, under less pressure, but he is flavour of the month, so that's OK.
If Martial had not scored in the 93rd minute, he would still have been given a pass, while Jesse was torn to shreds.
Let's just see how things play out. I know Jesse is a better scorer than he has shown in the first team. I think it's just a mental problem for the moment.

 

[blitz133w]

It's always the final moment that people remember, whether it's missing chances or scoring. Since his arrival and with Rashford on the pitch, I've never seen our front four play such fluid attacking football since post-Ferguson. They change positions so often and it's creating huge problems for the opposition defense. He dribbles the ball as well in the opposition half which not many of our players can do. Yes, his finishing is very poor but he creates so many chances and gets into such good positions. We always struggled to create chances under LvG but there's always Lingard who manages to get into great positions before missing chances. It's only a matter of time before he starts scoring. I said the same about welbeck and I still believe he would have come good if Sir Alex was around for more time. He needs fans to be more patient. He's started most of our previous 10-15 matches including some very big games I think and he's done well enough to receive another start.

I genuinely thought fans give the benefit of doubt to academy players and are always more patient with them, but for some reason this is never extended to Lingard who has done pretty well every time he's on the pitch bar couple of occasions. Is it because of Rashford and Fosu-Mensah's brilliant start to their fledgling careers?

Best part I like about him is he never stops running. And he's not running around like a headless chicken either. Look at his first touch, he always wants to take the ball forward unlike half our senior players. He drops into midfield when it's needed and supports the CMs as well. He doesn't look like he'll be among the future Balon D'or winners but that doesn't mean you give up on him. He's very comfortable with the ball and has enough pace to trouble any defender. He doesn't have excellent dribbling skills like Martial but he's a quality support player. How many times have you seen him lose the ball? I haven't checked the stats but for a young attacking player, I think it should be impressive. And he ALWAYS drops back to help out the fullback. Every time an opposition winger is in a good position, Lingard is there to stop him.

He deserves more time before us couch-experts dish out the final judgement on him.

 

[Gerald G]

He played well in the first half but faded in the second. But he misses too many crucial chances. He needs to take some of these as they've cost us already this season and will continue to cost us.

 

[limerickcitykid]

So, more than Martial then?
There is a narrative on here that I don't like. He got hammered for hitting that half volley at the keeper, which was a very difficult chance and a hard skill to pull off. Martial hits the ball further over the goal than he was away from it, under less pressure, but he is flavour of the month, so that's OK.
If Martial had not scored in the 93rd minute, he would still have been given a pass, while Jesse was torn to shreds.
Let's just see how things play out. I know Jesse is a better scorer than he has shown in the first team. I think it's just a mental problem for the moment.

Not to mention it was Lingard who played Martial through to sky it over but of course he never gets credit for the pass and there is no mention of the miss for Martial. Martial is obviously better but Lingard makes the same miss and it is all about how he misses open net sitters 10 times a game and hides from the ball somehow despite getting these chances and creating chances for others. Then there is the never takes a man on people who seem to think taking a man on is the only possible way to attack.

 

[Verminator]

Not to mention it was Lingard who played Martial through to sky it over but of course he never gets credit for the pass and there is no mention of the miss for Martial. Martial is obviously better but Lingard makes the same miss and it is all about how he misses open net sitters 10 times a game and hides from the ball somehow despite getting these chances and creating chances for others. Then there is the never takes a man on people who seem to think taking a man on is the only possible way to attack.

I'd missed those.
He's one of the few that will actually carry the ball 40 yards down the middle, creating panic in their defence.

And yes it was a good pass with a really neat delay/dummy.

 

[limerickcitykid]

I'd missed those.
He's one of the few that will actually carry the ball 40 yards down the middle, creating panic in their defence.

And yes it was a good pass with a really neat delay/dummy.

Oh he gets it all the time. It is because most of his runs are bursts into open space between defenders, very effective and very good play but likewise of course it doesn't get noticed because it'll just be played off as running with the ball unopposed which it isn't. If it isn't 1 on 1 dribbling like Martial does then it doesn't count for some. That is the only way to do it. God I hate people who go on like taking a man on is the be all and end all of football.

 

[Shamwow]

Love watching his style of play when he's got the bit in between his teeth.

 

[Riz]

Similar to Mata's improvement when Herrera is buzzing around him, Lingard's game raises dramatically when he's linking up with Martial and Rashford. We need to keep these 3 up front for the remainder of the season as it'll give us the best chance of winning the cup and/or making top 4. If Rooney has to be shoe horned in somewhere, ffs, then keep it as that midfield role he's been playing.