Originally posted by passiveman:
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I have had a good education, including a degree in Elecronic Engineering a difficult subject. I made every effort to improve my chances fot the future - and in spite of that I was laid off by an American/Dutch company during restructuring last Christmas. With a shortage of work available in the technical sector, I have had difficulty finding a permanent job. Are you saying that if I went on welfare - and I may have to pay for food and lodgings soon - that I am a blight on society?
You've probably never been in a position of poverty, probably had every advantage - that's the only way I can understand your attitude toward those out of work.
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You do not belong to the long term un-employed cathegory. You are young, well educated and probably looking for a job which is the relevant issue? You can't do anything if a company have to cut expenses you will get unemployed and then it's great to have a system that will provide a safety and temporary stability, there are those who get sick and need a similar type of stability.
What I am against is that people live on these benefits their entire life and use the system without actually contributing to it through taxes or even try to find job. Miss-usage of it can ultimately lead to its collapse, people are only willing to pay so much tax.
Originally posted by mathiaslg:
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Yeah, that would solve it
It always get's lost on the Yanks in the end doesn't it. I think you took my post a little too literally.
It's not an argument Math - I'm disturbed at the right-wing rantings coming from AhmedDimwitson, a lot of these protests are legitimate, they may well be flush with members of communist groups, but the primary reason they are happening is the sense of outrage at the IDF in it's spurious use of force against a civilian population albeit one which may include terrorists. This man wishes to write off all the protests as some form of left wing conspircy - I have never once voted for a left wing party - but I will be attending the next protest outside the Israeli embassy in Dublin because of my dissatisfaction with aspects of their administration's approach.
Oh but of course I am unemployed, therfore a blight on society...
Oh but of course I am unemployed, therfore a blight on society...
Well, suffice it to say, with the coming to power of that twit Sharon, we are now faced with an unsolveable problem. At this point, I think there is going to be substantial bloodshed on a very large scale in the middle east before any kind of semblance of peace can be reached.
There's always a point where there is no turning back, there was in WW 1 & 2, Korea etc. We have reached that point here. Neither side will back down until they've suffered substantial casualities and loss of life - that will be the only reality that will put any sense in anyone now - they will eventually grow tired of war, and call a truce, hopefully Sharon doesn't drag the entire world into it with him, because he is a warmonger, of that we can be positive.
There's always a point where there is no turning back, there was in WW 1 & 2, Korea etc. We have reached that point here. Neither side will back down until they've suffered substantial casualities and loss of life - that will be the only reality that will put any sense in anyone now - they will eventually grow tired of war, and call a truce, hopefully Sharon doesn't drag the entire world into it with him, because he is a warmonger, of that we can be positive.
& they gave perez nobel prize also.
Can't control Genien refugee camp Roy ?..I'm hearing reports via several channels that yr heroec army comitted massacers their ...
When you look at pro palestinians demos all over the arab world, try to realize the age of ppl marching......the vast majority r young ppl.....Israel succesfully i should say planted the seeds of hatred against her n the arab world even n moderate countries like Eygpt & Jordan.
Originally posted by tareq abd albari:
<strong>When you look at pro palestinians demos all over the arab world, try to realize the age of ppl marching......the vast majority r young ppl.....Israel succesfully i should say planted the seeds of hatred against her n the arab world even n moderate countries like Eygpt & Jordan.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Yippie!
So now you're gonna hate us?
Feck
And I had a feeling you lot already did?
Originally posted by Roy:
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Yippie!
So now you're gonna hate us?
Feck
And I had a feeling you lot already did?
If working towards educating the future generation isn't a good idea in your opinion, what is?
heey roy : what's the matter ?,,can't keep it quiet & decent language?
Is it irritaiting to u to state facts ? is it annoying to c almost the whole world condem & reject the actions of yr government?
Is it irritaiting to u to state facts ? is it annoying to c almost the whole world condem & reject the actions of yr government?
being displaced since 1948, Being deprived from their basic rights, being humilated on road blocks, ...ect,,,no wonder they blow themselves.
Both sides are to blame in this. Both sides have commited atroicties. The only way out is for both sides to negotiate, and the first step towards that is to gain credible leadership. Sharon and Arafat have zero credibility when it comes to the ability to honestly negotiate peace settlements, hence there will have to be new leadership brought forth on both sides. Netenyahu is also not going to cut it as a replacement for Sharon, since he advocates completely dismantaling the Palastinian Authority. The next Palastinian leader has to unite and gain political control over all of the factions, otherwise this tit for tat cycle will never end.
Originally posted by Roy:
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If I knew any aliens I'd tell them to smack one right on that El Akza place and right on the Western Wall...
Problem solved
and maybe one on the temple mount and chuck a couple around tel aviv ...
and these pro palestinian marches aren't only in arab countries ...
ive even seen some in argentina
Raoul: i think most of us here here agrees on the fact that both sides to blame 4 the current crisis,,,but i 'd like to know how humilating Palestinians in check points by Israel's army officers can contribute to Israel's security.?!....
How can not allowing pregnant Palestinian women from going to a hospital can contribute to Israel's security ?!
both sides to blame,yes,,but Israel is getting the results of miss treating Palestinians 4 the last 35 years or so.
How can not allowing pregnant Palestinian women from going to a hospital can contribute to Israel's security ?!
both sides to blame,yes,,but Israel is getting the results of miss treating Palestinians 4 the last 35 years or so.
They have check points between Palestinian cities ,,4example the ordinary time 4 a journy from Ramallah to naplus takes 30 minutes ,,,with all the blocks & checkpoints it takes half a day.
Originally posted by tareq abd albari:
<strong>Raoul: i think most of us here here agrees on the fact that both sides to blame 4 the current crisis,,,but i 'd like to know how humilating Palestinians in check points by Israel's army officers can contribute to Israel's security.?!....
How can not allowing pregnant Palestinian women from going to a hospital can contribute to Israel's security ?!
both sides to blame,yes,,but Israel is getting the results of miss treating Palestinians 4 the last 35 years or so.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Have you ever wondered why they are in the Occupied Territories in the first place...Perhaps it was because someone invaded them... I wonder who...
I see the European Paliament approved a resolution calling from trade sanctions against Israel (or the suspension of preferential trade terms). This was a non-binding action, which also called for a weapons embargo on both Israel and Palestine.
Brilliant Good thing its non-binding.
Brilliant
Good thing its non-binding.I think that Sharon is doing what should be done. Israel has a right to defend itself against terrorism. But in private conversations with Sharon, Bush has probably asked him to withdraw when Powell gets there.
Terrorists should get no leniency at all, and that's what the Palentinians are, including Arafat. If anyone has rebuffed Bush, it's the Arab nations. Bush asked that the leaders "stop terrorist activities, disrupt terrorist financing and stop inciting violence by glorifying terror in state-owned media or telling suicide bombers that they are martyrs." To date nothing has happened, in fact, the recent Islamic conference called for the Palestinians to continue their "legitimate resistence" against Israel.
It seems to me that by "legitimate resistence" it is meant the continues targeting of civilians that's happening every day. Look at what's been bombed: religious dinners, kids' birthday parties, supermarkets, pizza shops, restaurants, clothing stores, even women standing with their babies. The perpetrators of these deeds aren't martyrs, they are murderers. And Arafat says he wants to be a martyr too. Well, if he's promoting this conduct, maybe that's a good idea. Arafat is irrelevant anyway, either he can't stop the murderers or he doesn't want to stop them.
And now Powell is going there to ask Israel to stand back and not defend itself, just like in 1991, until the US has its way with Saddam. Sometimes it's harder being a friend of the US than an enemy.
Terrorists should get no leniency at all, and that's what the Palentinians are, including Arafat. If anyone has rebuffed Bush, it's the Arab nations. Bush asked that the leaders "stop terrorist activities, disrupt terrorist financing and stop inciting violence by glorifying terror in state-owned media or telling suicide bombers that they are martyrs." To date nothing has happened, in fact, the recent Islamic conference called for the Palestinians to continue their "legitimate resistence" against Israel.
It seems to me that by "legitimate resistence" it is meant the continues targeting of civilians that's happening every day. Look at what's been bombed: religious dinners, kids' birthday parties, supermarkets, pizza shops, restaurants, clothing stores, even women standing with their babies. The perpetrators of these deeds aren't martyrs, they are murderers. And Arafat says he wants to be a martyr too. Well, if he's promoting this conduct, maybe that's a good idea. Arafat is irrelevant anyway, either he can't stop the murderers or he doesn't want to stop them.
And now Powell is going there to ask Israel to stand back and not defend itself, just like in 1991, until the US has its way with Saddam. Sometimes it's harder being a friend of the US than an enemy.
I find interesting when American public tackles the middle east crisis,,perhaps the only country they know outside America is Israel,,,& hundereds of miles away they give liecence to Sharon to everything he wants to.....very clever indeed espeicailly when you know that there r Israeli ppl who condem Sharon & feel embaressed of his actions.
/Nice to have u here giggsy,,
Reasonable post Raoul,,but Americans should realize that occupation is a form of terorrism,,,Israel is having those suicide boomers since 1995,,,the palestinians r having their land occupied since 1967 .
I told a palestinian friend early this year that those boomers r harming the palestinian issue.....he told me : we don't have tanks or F16 or Apache,,,,what shall we do ?
I told a palestinian friend early this year that those boomers r harming the palestinian issue.....he told me : we don't have tanks or F16 or Apache,,,,what shall we do ?
Originally posted by tareq abd albari:
<strong>Reasonable post Raoul,,but Americans should realize that occupation is a form of terorrism,,,Israel is having those suicide boomers since 1995,,,the palestinians r having their land occupied since 1967 .
I told a palestinian friend early this year that those boomers r harming the palestinian issue.....he told me : we don't have tanks or F16 or Apache,,,,what shall we do ?</strong><hr></blockquote>
Tareq,
It's my understanding that the West Bank/Gaza/Golan Heights are considered disputed territories. The problem as I see it, is that Israel doesn't want to go back to the pre 67 map, and groups like Hamas will not settle for anything less than the total annihilation of Israel. The solution lies somewhere between those two positions.
Raoul : We can't leave to extremists o both sides, to determine the future of the whole middle east, i belive that peace will come & blossom when the israeli occupation ends & UN resoluations r applied...the Us always talks about International legitimacy & human rights & the niccessity of applying Un resoluations on Iraq
but there never any word on Israel....there r so so so many double standereds here & that undermines yr credability.
but there never any word on Israel....there r so so so many double standereds here & that undermines yr credability.