It's the same all over. The local fella who canvassed to get on the local council, he'd be out walking everyday, stop to talk and get as many people onside as possible. Go round to each pub on weekends and chat more. Got elected and has disappeared since, and isn't contactable. He has fecked off on a number of holidays aswell during town events, just no interest at all. And that is just the shitty ass local council.
Irish Politics
- Thread starter JakeC
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It's the same all over. The local fella who canvassed to get on the local council, he'd be out walking everyday, stop to talk and get as many people onside as possible. Go round to each pub on weekends and chat more. Got elected and has disappeared since, and isn't contactable. He has fecked off on a number of holidays aswell during town events, just no interest at all. And that is just the shitty ass local council.
I've heard similar things alright, seems to have started believing he's "important".
This is the kinda thing that really annoys me. I don't mind when politicians have different views to me or pursue policies I don't like, that's the way the world is. I don't even mind that much when they're a bit stupid, I just figure "feck it, what can ya do if people are stupid enough to elect them?". This kinda cynicism and hypocricy though? This is the stuff that makes people disillusioned with politics. Even worse coming from a guy who makes a big point of portraying himself as a defender of the ordinary people.
I don't get why so many of these useless bastards are needed. feck half of them into a ditch as they can do nothing anyways.
Ihni binni dimi diniwiny anitaime Flanagan.
So that's honest Mick evading tax, yer wan drink driving and now Ihni binni dimi diniwiny anitaime having his points wiped - the technical group are really starting to show they have what it takes to be a proper party.
EDIT: Jesus, is he seriously trying to set this up as some sort of inside job to blow the lid off the penalty point corruption? Careful Ihni binni dimi diniwiny anitaime, the mob will be on your ass next trying to silence you.
So that's honest Mick evading tax, yer wan drink driving and now Ihni binni dimi diniwiny anitaime having his points wiped - the technical group are really starting to show they have what it takes to be a proper party.
EDIT: Jesus, is he seriously trying to set this up as some sort of inside job to blow the lid off the penalty point corruption? Careful Ihni binni dimi diniwiny anitaime, the mob will be on your ass next trying to silence you.
Did Mick Wallace ever get done for tax evasion in the end, or did he get away with it? One of my friends is actually very close friends with his two sons in Dublin, and there's a proper cult of personality thing going on with Mick and the people of County Wexford.
I had a bit of time for him myself too.
Next time I see him at one of the 'Save Irish bogs' protests I might give him a belt of a sod of turf across the head or something!
I think your right to be honest. If I remember correctly he only decided to run very close to the actual election, and in that short space of time managed one of the biggest election drives I've ever seen here. He had people all over the Main Street in Wexford handing out flyers etc (more akin to a student election type strategy). He had the man power and money to wipe anybody out, but more importantly he held off running for so long that he wasn't properly scrutinised for his financial feckery. It comes down to a lot of people worshiping what he did for soccer in the county and that he is seen as a salt of the earth type of guy down here.
Failed developer, not that he could have been looking for a handy number or anything, I mean he has long hair and doesn't wear a suit, therefore he's one of us.......
It actually is that simple, people are that fecking stupid.
I doubt he'll run next time to be honest, I hope he'd be told to feck right off by voters but nothing would surprise me when it comes to Irish politics.
It actually is that simple, people are that fecking stupid.
I doubt he'll run next time to be honest, I hope he'd be told to feck right off by voters but nothing would surprise me when it comes to Irish politics.
Really wouldn't be surprised to see him scrape in again down here pops. He should be seen as a villanuous character but he isn't. 'Good ol' Mick sticking it to the boys in Dublin'......childish bullshit and myth seem to follow this bloke everywhere! People seem to think he actually cares, all because he set up a football club ffs.
Sure if Michael Lowry can get elected...
Anyone in the Meath East area?
Luke Flanagan just admitted that he twice had penalty points "sorted out", once by a Garda and once by a county official.
I'm actually amazed by what I'm hearing, he's actually decrying the corrupt system where "important" people like himself are being offered a reprieve from there penalty points. So why did he bloody accept the offer?! He takes advantage of corruption and then has the nerve to give out about it!
I'm actually amazed by what I'm hearing, he's actually decrying the corrupt system where "important" people like himself are being offered a reprieve from there penalty points. So why did he bloody accept the offer?! He takes advantage of corruption and then has the nerve to give out about it!
Irish politician in 'being a massive fecking hypocrite' shocker!!
Trying to frame it as him blowing the lid on the whole thing.....
slimy fecking bastard. I hope every Guard in the country follows the fecker around and pull him up at every opportunity.
His career over.
Pity.
Pity.
What a complete sell out wanker.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0313/376479-st-patrick-ministers-travel/
Nineteen ministers will travel to 21 countries over the coming week as part of a "Promote Ireland" programme around St Patrick's Day.
Taoiseach Enda Kenny will meet US President Barack Obama in the White House.
Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs Eamon Gilmore will also travel to the US where he will meet US Secretary of State John Kerry.
Mr Gilmore said the costs of the visits will be kept as low as possible.
He said the Patrick's Day events are a very cost effective way of promoting Ireland around the world.
Six ministers in total will travel to the US over the St Patrick’s festivities.
Meanwhile, Minister for Enterprise, Jobs and Innovation Richard Bruton will visit Germany, while Minister for Education Ruairi Quinn will go to China.
Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport Leo Varadkar will visit Japan and Korea.
Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform Brendan Howlin will visit Singapore, Indonesia and the Philippines.
Minister of State Jan O'Sullivan will go to Saudi Arabia, while Minister for Justice Alan Shatter is visiting the Middle East.
Minister for Health James Reilly will visit Birmingham and London.
Nineteen ministers will travel to 21 countries over the coming week as part of a "Promote Ireland" programme around St Patrick's Day.
Taoiseach Enda Kenny will meet US President Barack Obama in the White House.
Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs Eamon Gilmore will also travel to the US where he will meet US Secretary of State John Kerry.
Mr Gilmore said the costs of the visits will be kept as low as possible.
He said the Patrick's Day events are a very cost effective way of promoting Ireland around the world.
Six ministers in total will travel to the US over the St Patrick’s festivities.
Meanwhile, Minister for Enterprise, Jobs and Innovation Richard Bruton will visit Germany, while Minister for Education Ruairi Quinn will go to China.
Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport Leo Varadkar will visit Japan and Korea.
Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform Brendan Howlin will visit Singapore, Indonesia and the Philippines.
Minister of State Jan O'Sullivan will go to Saudi Arabia, while Minister for Justice Alan Shatter is visiting the Middle East.
Minister for Health James Reilly will visit Birmingham and London.
Poor James Reilly.
Yeah Ming was wrong, but so what? Just another thing for faux outrage and no action. He's not the only hypocrite.
Overall Ming has done more good than bad, and that is the bottom line for judging his character.
Let's hound a basically good bloke out of politics for a speeding ticket quoshing and re-elect Fianna Fail who destroyed the lives of a whole generation of homeowners.
I'm not defending him, he has to be sacked.
Overall Ming has done more good than bad, and that is the bottom line for judging his character.
Let's hound a basically good bloke out of politics for a speeding ticket quoshing and re-elect Fianna Fail who destroyed the lives of a whole generation of homeowners.
I'm not defending him, he has to be sacked.
Yeah kill him, he might taint the other TDs.
This country sucks, you try and do anything out of the ordinary and you are held to some bizarre high standard. Yes Ming had a parking ticket sorted, and that is wrong. And he should go, and he probably will. If only he was a member of a political party, where you can do anything you like and stay in the Dail.
That's it exactly! He was wrong, but there's much worse in there that get away with it.
I'd have 1000 Mings ahead of the Ihni binni dimi diniwiny anitaime in there.
He has been at the grass roots of politics since I was in UCD in 1991. For years he did it for no pay and has a police record the length of your arm due to action and protest. He stood up to be counted for years. He has put much more into his political career than he has received as recompense and renumeration. But hey ho, we get to look down on a do-gooder, and that's the important thing. Apparently.
The thruth is we as a nation are much more comfortable with heinous fecks in power, as we are just content to bitch then. Any feck who challenges us on any level is just an inconvenience, and we lynch em given the chance.
The amount of working class folk so willing to hang Joe Higgins a few years back ended my participation in Irish politics. We'd gladly kill Jesus if he put his head above the parapet reminding us we weren't perfect.
Give us Stalin, so we can rightfully complain, which is all we want of our leaders.
Mencken said it well. "People deserve the government they get, and they deserve to get it good and hard."
He could fecking cure cancer but once he leaves the village to do it he's 'billy big bollocks'.
He did wrong, no doubt. I just wish this level of outrage could be mustered when any politician got a ticket killed.
This selctive outrage is one of the reasons we will never have a government with a moral or social conscience. If they show any leanings towards decency we will fecking revel in hanging them on a triviality to show they are no better than us.
Possibly true, but the lad that gave me that opinion isn't usually one for amateur dramatics.
It's not amateur dramatics as much as inevitable in rural Ireland.
Get a new car/girlfriend/house/hairstyle or any job in Dubliin = billy big bollocks.
Moses, I don't know what's worse. The fact that you're a cynical bastard, or the fact that you're right!
An even more obvious example of this seems to be the abuse Labour have (rightly, in most cases) gotten, whilst mostly ignoring Fine Gaels much worse crimes.
I'm no fan of labour, but the fact that they're getting more stick than Fine Gael is a farce.
As a country, have we ever had a Government the vast amount of people liked?
An even more obvious example of this seems to be the abuse Labour have (rightly, in most cases) gotten, whilst mostly ignoring Fine Gaels much worse crimes.
I'm no fan of labour, but the fact that they're getting more stick than Fine Gael is a farce.
As a country, have we ever had a Government the vast amount of people liked?
Labour's crimes while arguably less than FG are still shocking in my opinion. They are an example of why people are right to do a hardline on hypocrisy. Like Ming, Labour should be fecked out, but not before FG are. Consistency is all I'm talking about, not fecking part time and subjective outrage.
Here's the thing though: I think Ming should be getting criticized more than other politicians who killed their ticket.
The corruption is bad, any politician caught like this should lose their job, regardless of their political beliefs or any other good work they did. Like I said in a previous post, I can forgive bad policies and stupidity but not this kind of cynicism. So any and all politicians who are corrupt should face the consequences, I think we'd all agree on that point.
However, the fact that it was a politician like Ming makes this even worse for me. Ming has made a big point of portraying himself as "man of the people", someone who doesn't stand for the normal bullshit of Irish politics, someone who will call out the chancers and crooks. He got elected largely because of this image he has created for himself and since he got elected he has continued to portray himself in this light. So for him to be caught out as a blatant liar and hypocrite is even more disappointing for those who actually believed he was different. So why wouldn't he recieve more criticism?
I have to admit though, I've never liked Flanagan. I've always suspected that the image he portrays of himself is something of an act (and an effective one at that). Things like the way he dresses in the Dail have always seemed like cynical political panto to me, an easy way to gain support as a "true" independent. That should be the most disappointing for his supporters, cynics and doubters like myself now seem to have been proven right.
Let me firstly say again he should lose his job.
Secondly, all politicians are men of the people pre-election, yet it is such a bullshit and transparent stance we just ignore it. Ming's actual crime here is being nearer to us than the others are.
As for more criticism, what's the point? Just sack him, no? Or does that take away the pleasure of you being 'right'? A half a lifetime in non paid grassroots politics all counts for feck all because of a parking ticket getting sorted? Madness.
Critricism is the zenith of most people's political activism, so that's why it's so important to people.
Ming is not perfect, but he's not acting. He lives his life the way he lives it. He lives it quite similarly to how I live mine. I am not acting when I recycle, or when I grow my own food or all the time I spent on protests outside the Daíl (often in the company of Ming) and when I do transgress it's no worse than anyone elses transgression.
The only way to justly treat a crime is to apply punishment equally. And this reaction shows the people are as inconsistent in their application of justice as the elite are.
He should be sacked, and so should every other politician that has had a ticket sorted.
If Ming is sacked on the grounds of hypocrisy then that too should apply to all election speeches. Which it doesn't.
If only we as a nation were really this upset by double standards and hypocrisy, we wouldn't have gotten this far submerged in shite if we were.
Secondly, all politicians are men of the people pre-election, yet it is such a bullshit and transparent stance we just ignore it. Ming's actual crime here is being nearer to us than the others are.
As for more criticism, what's the point? Just sack him, no? Or does that take away the pleasure of you being 'right'? A half a lifetime in non paid grassroots politics all counts for feck all because of a parking ticket getting sorted? Madness.
Critricism is the zenith of most people's political activism, so that's why it's so important to people.
Ming is not perfect, but he's not acting. He lives his life the way he lives it. He lives it quite similarly to how I live mine. I am not acting when I recycle, or when I grow my own food or all the time I spent on protests outside the Daíl (often in the company of Ming) and when I do transgress it's no worse than anyone elses transgression.
The only way to justly treat a crime is to apply punishment equally. And this reaction shows the people are as inconsistent in their application of justice as the elite are.
He should be sacked, and so should every other politician that has had a ticket sorted.
If Ming is sacked on the grounds of hypocrisy then that too should apply to all election speeches. Which it doesn't.
If only we as a nation were really this upset by double standards and hypocrisy, we wouldn't have gotten this far submerged in shite if we were.
"Sure he was wrong, but there are others who do much worse and never get caught. Look at all the good he's done! I tell ya, I'd sooner vote for him than the rest of that shower!"
That's the kinda thing people who voted for Lowry, Ahern, Flynn and the rest use to justify themselves. It's exactly the kind of thinking that leads to the corruption and bullshit we have to put up with. We should refuse to vote or support anyone guilty of this kind of thing, even if we agree with their views on other issues. It's the only way things will change.
We've all heard stories where fellas got penalty points 'sorted'. It didn't cause me too much upset then and it doesn't cause me too much now. On the scale of what these cnuts get up to it's well down there. I don't know the guy like moses does, but he seems to me to genuinely care about not just what we do in this country, but how we do it, and that puts him ahead of most of the other gobshites in my eyes. A greater shame would be if he was lost to this country on foot of this.
As long as politicians are human they'll be fallible and subject to making errors of judgement. That shouldn't be a shock.
As long as politicians are human they'll be fallible and subject to making errors of judgement. That shouldn't be a shock.
That's not what Jake was saying I don't think. He is saying worse is going on and less of a fuss in being made because of the people involved.
And even if it was a case of weighing up good done v bad done, you really think this undermines his political life thus far? Most of which you know noting about because it is so far removed from what newspapers would report. It being so low key and unglamourous.
But we couldn't sack them for billions involved, but by jaysus lets make the hippy swing for 60 quid. That'll show we're not to be taken lightly as an electorate. Feck me you'd swear we never had corruption until now.
To even equate what is going on here to that lot is insane.
I find it hard to compare fixing penalty points, to Aherns mishaps.
ffs I thought he was the sole bright spot in that beige factory known as the dail, Ming the Pointless he shall be known as from now on.
As a side note how much money do you think the south would rake in if it legalized pot?
As a side note how much money do you think the south would rake in if it legalized pot?
Okay, point by point:
1. We agree he should be sacked.
2.Ming's crime isn't being nearer to us than the rest. It's claiming to be nearer to us while in fact being just another corrupt politician.
3. What's the point in more criticism? Maybe there is no point, maybe it's just a natural response. What was the point in criticising other corrupt politicians? Should we not criticise them once they've been sacked? As for the pleasure of me being right, I'd genuinely have preferred to find out I was wrong and that he was as honest as he claimed to be. Should his lifetime of work count for nothing? I don't think it counts for nothing, but I also don't think it should reduce the impact of corruption either. Ahern did great work in NI, doesn't stop him being a crook.
4. You're probably right there. Criticism is important in and of itself too though.
5. I don't know Ming so I can't say argue this point, he may indeed be a genuine person. I can only judge him by his actions.
6. Agree with equal punishment. Equal punishment isn't the same as equal criticism though.
7. Agree
8. I don't want him sacked on the grounds of hypocricy, i want him sacked on the grounds of corruption. I think it's okay for me to criticise him more because of his hypocricy though, in the same way I criticise other hypocrites.
9. Double standards and hypocricy are exactly what Ming is guilty of, no? Not sure what you mean by this point, surely the current criticism of Ming is what you want, except you want it to apply to every politician who is corrupt and a hypocrite?
And the others that were sacked or you wanted sacked for this level of corruption are?
I didn't say don't criticise him. I'm caling for appropriare criticism, and equating him to Lowry or Bertie is not that.
It was you who accused him of acting, on no basis whatsoever.
And you are not judging him by his actions, the bloke has been politically active since the late 80's and you are having a go at his lifestyle being an act and judging him on one action.
Like who before him?
Exactly, I want to apply universally.
Look. Ming is an outsider of sorts. Look how the media treats other elected representatives.
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/fraud-trial-farmer-cashed-money-orders-innocently-26062630.html
That guy was involved in a massive scam that ran to millions. And in the article they decide him being an elected rep isn't even worth mentioning. They decide not to print his association with The Beef Tribunal, Larry Goodman or Fianna fail either.
Had you heard of him? What are your thoughts on him?
That is my point.
All three of you seem to be arguing that a) there's a huge amount of serious corruption that goes unpunished and b) what Ming did was nowhere near the level of that other corruption.
I'm saying that the only way to fix the corruption from point a) is to punish all corruption equally, even the minor corruption Ming is guilty of. I also think it's okay for me to reserve extra critism for hypocrites like Ming as they get voted in by people who genuinely believe they are helping to solve this very problem.
I think any punishment he gets is perfectly fair. What I think is unfair is that that other corrupt politicians won't get that punishment too. That's not unfair on Ming though, it's unfair on the citizens who deserve honest politicians.
Wow, that would only be not mental if we didn't have a continuous line of utter criminals running the country into billions of debt for the last 3-4 decades.
You are equating Charlie and Bertie to a quoshed ticket that wouldn't have even made the news had it been someone else?
Yes. But that's not the point, just the context. The context of the huge overreaction to this individual offence. This is not the norm and that does make it unfair on Ming. To get harrangued and punished where your peers didn't is unfair in my opinion. Punishing him is not unfair, punishing him alone is.
If this sets a new standard going forward I take my words back, but it won't and we all know that.
The sad reality is in your own words, based on nothing, but still a commonly held view.
Gway moses, I don't blame him for getting his points quashed, pretty much anyone would do the same if they could. What I have a problem with is him behaving like every other politician, bullshitting and treating the public like their idiots, with the story he's dreamed up, just stand up and admit it, don't lie about it and don't stand on a soapbox preaching about the very thing you're guilty of yourself, that sort of hypocrisy is either the result of incredible arrogance or incredible stupidity.
And you're right, they're all guilty of it, so it's particularly damaging when someone who holds themselves up as an example of some realistic alternative behaves in the exact same way.
Same applies to honest mick but most people with brains saw that one coming a mile off.
My issue is with the sudden national low threshold for corruption. In Ireland a quoshed parking ticket getting this much coverage? What?
If that's the new way, then happy days, but it's not, it's because people don't like him. Sully said it himself.
Unlike Michael Clarke I posted above. The man was involved in The Beef Tribunal and has done time for fraud against the Dept Of Agriculture, but the papers don't even print it. And nobody hereabouts mentions it. He is a man of the people around here is a real way. He plays the game. And that corruption keeps him above this scrutiny. That's the context I'm talking about.
Ming is a fecking spa for doing that after what he has said and deserves to be sacked. But if he is sacked for it and he alone is sacked for this level of corruption, but the previous guy wasn't and if the next guy isn't then it's worse than we had all feared.
If that's the new way, then happy days, but it's not, it's because people don't like him. Sully said it himself.
Unlike Michael Clarke I posted above. The man was involved in The Beef Tribunal and has done time for fraud against the Dept Of Agriculture, but the papers don't even print it. And nobody hereabouts mentions it. He is a man of the people around here is a real way. He plays the game. And that corruption keeps him above this scrutiny. That's the context I'm talking about.
Ming is a fecking spa for doing that after what he has said and deserves to be sacked. But if he is sacked for it and he alone is sacked for this level of corruption, but the previous guy wasn't and if the next guy isn't then it's worse than we had all feared.