How do you rate part 1 of the ETH rebuild?

Very happy about the number of players, caliber of players and the positions they fill. Less happy about how long it took and about how much we paid, but thats probably not as important.
 
Todd said:
Being able to compete now is just as important as building a team to compete in the future. Every season we miss out on Champion's League is a disaster. It's going to become very difficult to sign world-class talent if this keeps happening...why would any elite player come to United to play in the Europa League when they could go to City, Madrid, Bayern etc and essentially be guaranteed Champion's League football every season of their prime?

Malacia, Martinez and Antony seem to be very promising players for building a good future. Casemiro and Eriksen are very good players for the short-term.

My concern is that we need goals right now and we haven't done anything so far to address that.
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Right but it's the manner in which we are signing these players that concerns me.

First and foremost, why are we still rushing to sign players four games into the season? It seems reactionary. Would we have signed Casemiro if we had won all four of our games? If we really, really wanted Antony at any cost, why didn't we get it done right at the start of the window?

Secondly, it's the fact that all of these players are known to the manager that concerns me. Eriksen, former Ajax. Malacia, former Feyenoord and an ETH target at Ajax. Martinez and Antony, ex-ETH players...Casemiro...OK not 'known' to ETH but a name every man and his dog knows and we've therefore paid a premium for an older player.

If we were signing players who were 30+ right at the start of the window to plug gaps for bargain fees I'd say that was clever. I think the Eriksen signing was actually a very good one and we need to do this more....but why haven't we looked to bring in, say, a 28+ RB or starting GK? Again, it seems a bit scattergun and ill-thought out.

It also worries me when the manager has too much influence and the reason is simple...managers come and go! What happens if, for example, worst-case scenario ETH doesn't make a success of it at United and is sacked next season? That leaves us with a load of his ex-players and personal choices that we have spent £200m+ on for the new manager to inherit. This is why clubs have moved away from that model and appointed DoFs who can ensure continuity of the squad from one manager to the next.

Again, I actually think we have signed five good players...but can we say the manner in which we have recruited them is 'good' or 'efficient'....I would say definitely not. Now, again, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt this window and this window only because ETH is new to his role, Murtough is new to his role, Arnold is new to his role, we sacked three of our Chief Scouts last year and Judge and Woodward have gone, so in effect, it's a brand new recruitment team.

From the next window onwards, I want to see proper planning. Identify targets early. Move swiftly and decisively. Actually do some scouting! Address problem positions in the squad strategically rather than just signing whoever might be available.
 
I’ll know come the end of the January transfer window how happy I am. Some players start well and get found out. Some struggle. Some hit the ground running and smash it. Some improve. We really don’t know when it comes to our new signings yet.

I’m pleased by the apparent maturity and work ethic of the new players so far. This seems a vast improvement and I’m pleased to see some of the same old faces out of the lineup. That had to happen.
 
Rebuilds always look good at the beginning. This is the optimism phase with lots of hope for the future and notions of a clean slate, it'll be a year or two before we know whether we've bought well or not. Today's promise is tomorrow's deadwood.
 
One thing I like about the players he’s signed is their attitude. Martinez, Casemiro, Antony and Malacia all seem to have a real grit and determination about them. Something the team as lacked and something Ten Hag probably wanted to change with his signings.
 
There's no point rating the rebuild until the end of the season. A theoretically great window means nothing.
 
Trigg said:
One thing I like about the players he’s signed is their attitude. Martinez, Casemiro, Antony and Malacia all seem to have a real grit and determination about them. Something the team as lacked and something Ten Hag probably wanted to change with his signings.
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I agree with this. Attitude seemed terrible last season and we really needed some strong characters with a winning mentality.

I also really like that you can see that we are looking to sign players based on profiles in a system. That has definitely not always been the case.

I find it silly that a team in this day and age seems to rely on the manager for identifying talent but hopefully that will change in the future.
 
It's been really promising that we seem to be signing players that the manager wants, would be perfect if we can get a striker in because Martial seems to be going through his injury crisis and we can't trust Ronaldo at the moment regarding his efforts to remain with us
 
I think the recruitment team/DOF thing is a bit over stated. Both Pep and Klopp brought in plenty of their own players and I don't believe at all that Liverpool or city are signing players without Pep and Klopp having the final word, probably even more than just the final word. Same with spurs and Conte, Spurs signings are Contes signings.

The manager is the key person and having the right manager who can identify players like Malacia and Martinez is fine with me.

I'm very pleased with part one of the rebuild, still a few areas to be addressed but we should be making top four and winning EL with this squad - our bench, let alone our first team, is now stocked with players who were bought for 40m or more such as DVB, Maguire, AWB, Lindelof, Shaw at 30m and so on. Two or three more quality additions next summer and we will be well on our way. ETH now needs to deliver.
 
Zen86 said:
Rebuilds always look good at the beginning. This is the optimism phase with lots of hope for the future and notions of a clean slate, it'll be a year or two before we know whether we've bought well or not. Today's promise is tomorrow's deadwood.
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This.

Solkjaer's rebuild was looking good right? We saw how that turned out.

Wasn't everyone calling Bruno the new Cantona, now 50% of the fan base wants him out.

We wont know until we achieve success.
 
romufc said:
This.

Solkjaer's rebuild was looking good right? We saw how that turned out.

Wasn't everyone calling Bruno the new Cantona, now 50% of the fan base wants him out.

We wont know until we achieve success.
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Maguire, AwB, Bruno.. all "obvious" signings at the time. Such was the certainty of these guys that the transfers were beyond praise.

Pretty sure Mourinho's first summer of Ibrahimovic, Bailly, Mkhitaryan, Pogba was viewed the same, likewise LVGs first window.
 
Yep, tl;dr we've been burned too many times. Stick with the manager no matter what happens for a couple of seasons and let him see his vision through.

I'm expecting more of an Arteta at Arsenal season than Klopp at Pool season this year.
 
Zen86 said:
Maguire, AwB, Bruno.. all "obvious" signings at the time. Such was the certainty of these guys that the transfers were beyond praise.

Pretty sure Mourinho's first summer of Ibrahimovic, Bailly, Mkhitaryan, Pogba was viewed the same, likewise LVGs first window.
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Yep, all big name signings. We make the same mistakes over and over again. Best window since SAF, best window this that.
 
Aside from the massively inflated fees we've paid, just looking at the recruits, it is clear this is akin to what Rangnick was suggesting. Half a first XI bought and the people who we overly relied upon last few years are now squad players. Some holes to fix still of course, but a great effort so far. And the mentality of those two defenders he's bought is very refreshing to see.

Very promising. Just wrap up Frenkie over the next 24 hours and we're completely different.
 
Iron Stove said:
I agree with this. Attitude seemed terrible last season and we really needed some strong characters with a winning mentality.

I also really like that you can see that we are looking to sign players based on profiles in a system. That has definitely not always been the case.
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Totally agree. Mentality is so important as we've seen over the last season or two. He seems to have a really clear idea of the right character of player required, which is really promising start.
 
I'm quite excited for the season and to see how the new players gel with a new manager and new style. It will take time for sure but it looks like we have quality around the field. Its a good feeling to go into games at least thinking you can compete let alone win. The likes of Malacia, Antony, Casemiro, Martinez along hopefully with a rejuvinated Bruno, Dalot, Varane. I think we can expect an exciting campaign. Don't know about any silverware though.
 
Right now we are just trying to get results. There is nothing much to rate outside of ETH having found a solid defensive back 4 and getting the team to fight for each other. I still trust in him and his process. I hope by mid September to see some of the patented football we saw at Ajax against weaker EPL opposition like Leeds and Crystal Palace and especially in Europa League. October is a tricky month, so outside of Europa league I expect some pragmatic (results) football.
 
Lentwood said:
Right but it's the manner in which we are signing these players that concerns me.

First and foremost, why are we still rushing to sign players four games into the season? It seems reactionary. Would we have signed Casemiro if we had won all four of our games? If we really, really wanted Antony at any cost, why didn't we get it done right at the start of the window?

Secondly, it's the fact that all of these players are known to the manager that concerns me. Eriksen, former Ajax. Malacia, former Feyenoord and an ETH target at Ajax. Martinez and Antony, ex-ETH players...Casemiro...OK not 'known' to ETH but a name every man and his dog knows and we've therefore paid a premium for an older player.

If we were signing players who were 30+ right at the start of the window to plug gaps for bargain fees I'd say that was clever. I think the Eriksen signing was actually a very good one and we need to do this more....but why haven't we looked to bring in, say, a 28+ RB or starting GK? Again, it seems a bit scattergun and ill-thought out.

It also worries me when the manager has too much influence and the reason is simple...managers come and go! What happens if, for example, worst-case scenario ETH doesn't make a success of it at United and is sacked next season? That leaves us with a load of his ex-players and personal choices that we have spent £200m+ on for the new manager to inherit. This is why clubs have moved away from that model and appointed DoFs who can ensure continuity of the squad from one manager to the next.

Again, I actually think we have signed five good players...but can we say the manner in which we have recruited them is 'good' or 'efficient'....I would say definitely not. Now, again, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt this window and this window only because ETH is new to his role, Murtough is new to his role, Arnold is new to his role, we sacked three of our Chief Scouts last year and Judge and Woodward have gone, so in effect, it's a brand new recruitment team.

From the next window onwards, I want to see proper planning. Identify targets early. Move swiftly and decisively. Actually do some scouting! Address problem positions in the squad strategically rather than just signing whoever might be available.
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I does show one thing. He likes technical playing football players. Erikson did play gor ajax ages ago. Malacia played for the rival feyenoord and was never going to play for ajax. Target made by the media not by erik.

i only think it is right they are doing everything erik wants ( the board)that is one critical succes factor. If he needs to change the system, he needs to get whomever he deems acceptable. without that you are prepared to fail
 
florisW said:
I does show one thing. He likes technical playing football players. Erikson did play gor ajax ages ago. Malacia played for the rival feyenoord and was never going to play for ajax. Target made by the media not by erik.

i only think it is right they are doing everything erik wants ( the board)that is one critical succes factor. If he needs to change the system, he needs to get whomever he deems acceptable. without that you are prepared to fail
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He needs to establish a new culture quickly and he needs players who can play his style. I’m not surprised he’s gone for players he knows and trusts, especially when our scouting is by all accounts in flux. What else could he do? If it’s still like that next season, then fair criticism but now’s not the time.
 
Nothing to rate as of yet. Can show promise early on and be complete failures by the end of the season, or go the opposite way.
Let them have time to settle and show what they are worth.
 
Ødegaard said:
Nothing to rate as of yet. Can show promise early on and be complete failures by the end of the season, or go the opposite way.
Let them have time to settle and show what they are worth.
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True but we have some fighters in our team again which cheers me up.
 
BluesJr said:
Protests forced the owners to actually do something. There’s always a pattern with these guys.
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I agree.

There was only a £120m budget to work with according to the tier 1 sources. And the strategy changed after the two losses to Brighton and Brentford which forced the Glazers to release more funds for the football department to work with. Below are direct quotes from ten Hag confirming the shift in strategy. If the Glazers had provided the full iota at the start of the summer window, then everything would've gone smoother than it did imo.



 
Adnan said:
I agree.

There was only a £120m budget to work with according to the tier 1 sources. And the strategy changed after the two losses to Brighton and Brentford which forced the Glazers to release more funds for the football department to work with. Below are direct quotes from ten Hag confirming the shift in strategy. If the Glazers had provided the full iota at the start of the summer window, then everything would've gone smoother than it did imo.



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Yeah, that's damaging. So after Arnold confessed we've flushed a billion down the toilet the club carries on with spending way above what is needed because of bad planning and penny pinching.
 
Big concerns with how we've gone about it.

- No real plan,
- wasting time with the farcical chase for De Jong,
- heavily overpaying for others,
- bizarre two week spell chasing Rabiot and Arnautovic among others,
- still left glaring holes in the starting XI.

I think there will be a catch to come yet with what we have spent. It won't be coming from the Glazer's pocket.

But, I think we have improved the starting XI with half of it changed from what was out most used last season. Better than what I expected in the end, but still not enough for top 4 in my opinion.
 
Bastian said:
Yeah, that's damaging. So after Arnold confessed we've flushed a billion down the toilet the club carries on with spending way above what is needed because of bad planning and penny pinching.
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Ten Hag mentioned in the press conference about himself and the football department quickly identifying the problems, and were on the same page on how to rectify the problems. But unfortunately I don't believe Joel Glazer was on the same page and it got to a point where significant pressure was placed on him, that then resulted in him releasing extra funds near the end of the window.

We did spend a significant amount of money, but the players we've brought in are are all a fit for the way ten Hag wants to control the game with and without the ball. And I haven't said that for a very long time.
 
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I think the 0-4 loss to Brentford was a wakeup for the Glazers. The fear of how low things might go and what it would do to their cash cow's value galvanized them.
 
I think we have bought well, and there are still rumours of Depay trying to force a move to us.
The main problem for me is the money we spent, and what could happen if we dont get top 4.

Also, and this has nothing to do with Ten Hag, but even after these handful of very good buys, we are still miles away from having a title challenging team and sqaud, and top 4 will be hard enough.
It just puts it into persepective how bad we have been the last few years.
 
Exceptional window. One of the best ever imo. We have strengthened each of attack, midfield, and defense, which will expedite repurposing the squad towards how ETH wants us to play, which in turn will yield better results than many predicted.
 
In general, i'm happy with the transferts , as they are all quality in their own individual way .BUT, i'm not happy with how the ownership and boards led to theses deals being done way later than they should have been.
 
Good window but absolutely no plan going on whatsoever it took 2 shit results to get things going.
 
City pay less for Haaland and Alvarez than we did for Antony. Pretty much sums up the incompetence behind the manager. Again.
 
He got his players. So now up to ETH to show progress over the course of the campaign. I don't expect him to move mountains, but there needs to be development.
 
I hope to God he gets it going because if we dont get CL next year we are going to start losing money to sponsors. Also, I fear we have spent a large chunk of next year's transfer budget this summer so there may not be a Phase 2 of the rebuild until Summer '24
 
charlenefan said:
Rangnick said we needed 10 new players so far in ETH's first window in charge we've brought in 4 with a 5th all but done and over the last 2 games you can already see a massive change from the side regularly fielded by Solskjaer just 18 months ago. Injuries permitting we can probably expect this to be our first choice XI in the near future

-----------------De Gea-----------------
Dalot--Varane--Martinez--Malacia
---------------Casemiro---------------
----Fernandes------Eriksen----
Antony---------CF---------LW

No AWB, No Lindelof, No Maguire, No Shaw, No McFred. CF/LW to be contested between Martial/Rashford/Sancho/Ronaldo

Expect part 2 of the rebuild to involve a new GK, new RB, an undeniable new CF and probably another attempt to bring in FDJ

How do you rate things so far?
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I think he's done ok especially with our defense,early days but it doesnt look as fragile the way the team is setup, he also took initiative to drop under performing players.
Recruitment has been good in key areas.
 
Hard to say this early as we don't know how the new signings are going to pan out obviously but it's very encouraging I think.

If United can nick a top 4 finish this season, I think there's every chance they can pretty much complete the rebuild in 2 seasons. If the signings pan out, Varane can stay healthy and the likes of Fernandes, Shaw, Rashford rediscover their form - United are a GK, RB, another CM and a CF away from competing I think which can be achieved in one summer.
 
Transfer window done and here's how the squad looks until Jan at the earliest

PL XI
------------------De Gea------------------
Dalot--Varane--Martinez--Malacia
-----------------Casemiro-----------------
----Fernandes----------Eriksen----
Antony-------Ronaldo-------Sancho

Cup XI
---------------Dubravka---------------
AWB--Lindelof--Maguire--Shaw
----McTominay----Fred---
Elanga--------VDB--------Rashford
-----------------Martial-----------------
 
Tbh if we take the board and their incompetence out of it, we’ve done about as well as we could have hoped. Six players in, they all improve us in key areas including the much neglected right wing and DM positions.

Our back four looks settled and together and I’m confident we can at least pick a midfield three that can compete. We are, however, just a couple of injuries away from that looking completely different.

I’m heartened by Ten Hag this evening saying that “we are done, for now!” when asked about transfers, which makes me believe we may get another one or two reinforcements in January.
 
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