How do you rate part 1 of the ETH rebuild?

This was our 11 for the last game of last season -

DdG

Telles
Maguire
Lindelof
Dalot

Fred
McTominay
Hannibal

Elanga
Cavani
Bruno

This is our most likely 11 at the end of this season's window -

DdG

Malacia
Martinez
Varane
Dalot

Casemiro
Fred
Eriksen

Sancho
Martial
Antony

It's a massive improvement in my opinion.

The only glaring weak spot is DdG between the sticks. I'm quietly encouraged by Dalot's performances so far and I'm looking forward to seeing a revitalised Martial.
 
I’m annoyed we appear to be neglecting the right back issue, but I like the players we’ve added.

De Gea will be replaced next summer, either by Henderson or more likely another. I’d expect us to go back in for De Jong or another player of his profile in order to improve upon our midfield options.

The big money will go towards a striker.
 
antohan said:
There's a much simpler explanation for Ten Hag to go for players he knows and it has nothing to do with our scouting being good, bad or average. Nor is this something we really know anything about, is it?
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Explain Rabiot then!
 
We're looking decent for top six at this point. So that's an achievement. We probably still need to lose Ronaldo and DdG and bring in quality high press friendly replacements if we want to get top four.
 
Poborsky's hair said:
My only fear is that for some reason he doesn't turn out to be that progressive manager we all hoped, struggling to settle in the EPL. We have seen Ole playing some decent progressive football with Molde, Van Gaal Total football before as well and ETH dominate the Eredivise, but what do you expect with the biggest budget and the best academy (possibly in the world).

You can get away with play youngster here and there and develop him. Here you can see he's already safe with McTominay, but that will change with Casemiro and new reinforcements, just hope he doesn't go back into counterattacking football because he will not be able to tell the players to carry out his instructions. Few more losses and the pressure builds up. So just hope he is this dominant manager who will want his team play one way and doesn't back of like some previous managers.
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So far I think he's done as much as can be expected in the regard. He's hamstrung by the players at his disposal, and it's clear the likes of Fred, Rashford, McTominay, Elanga, AWB, Bruno and Maguire all suit a counter attacking style, and Ronaldo doesn't suit a high pressing style. But all of the signings he has brought in pave the way forwards for progressive football, he's one by one replacing the players who don't suit. Still a few more to go. And progressive, possession heavy football isn't limited to tiki taka, Liverpool for example often go direct and aerial. I'd much rather he be adaptable and not an ideologue, so I'm very happy with what he has shown so far.
 
He gets points off me just for shitcanning 3 out of the most calamitous back 4 we’ve ever had. Wan Bissaka, Maguire and Shaw are decent squad options but never good enough to be starters.
 
Too early to judge.

When we bought Shaw, Maguire, Pogba, etc, those seemed good buys too.
 
This is the club's best hire since Jose. And Jose's biggest drawback, which is his ego, is not going to be an element with this manager. I am sure EtH has an ego, and probably a much larger one than he allows for in his words and action, but it does not define him.

It is still too early to make sweeping judgment but so far it's been mostly good with some bad...

Good

Transfer market. There has been no end of criticism on the transfer targets. Jokes about the team being clueless etc. But look at the players who were brought in and you see culture change being enabled by their addition. These are year one locker room changers. Guys like Martinez and Malacia who come in and leave everything they have on the pitch. Ericksen was intended to be a depth mid-to-forward piece that challenges Bruno and gives them depth of table setters, and it looks like he'll be functioning in that ball carrier type role which is not ideal but it's a good thing they added him. Another classy player who gives you full effort and does his best to execute the manager's priorities. Thankfully Antony looks like he will get done. I am over the moon on that one.

Poise and effort on the pitch. Starting from preseason on you can see these things, and the effect of the manager. It has not been consistent and there are pieces that do not fit but the direction looks clearly pointed upwards in both those critical elements. This is not a manager who lets players run around and do what they want. He is a disciplinarian who is a very good teacher and tactician and that is precisely what this club needed.

Also I will credit him with a good start overall in spite of shit ownership. He seems very good at taking the party line, though I am sure he wants to choke the Glazers and probably Murtough already.

Bad

Not making an early call on keeper. This one is a no-brainer and while it may be that he thought he could improve DDG how often does a keeper at that point in his career dramatically improve an area of his game. I will not say this is impossible but DDG has already cost us one game of the first four and I am sure if he could do it again keeper would be addressed right out the gate. Also he should have sat Dean down and had a heart-to-heart with him and taken a real look at his game but he didn't and now he's trying to fix that in the transfer window.

Not making an early call on Christiano. This is another no-brainer. I am sure his rationale was seeing those goals walk out the door and not trusting to get a replacement but Christiano's status changes the rules. He should have given him the green light to choose his next club. As it stands he might be forced to juggle Christiano and his ego as a non-fit on the roster which will not be comfortable for anyone.
 
Which part. The transfer window isn't even closed yet. FFS. Assess this in February.
 
At the moment I would say somewhere around 7 out of 10. Still very early days but I like the signings of Martinez, Malacia and Eriksen. Casemiro finally gives us the DM we've been needing for years and Antony seems to have good potential.

I still have concerns about the RB position and CF especially if Ronaldo leaves. Our options in both positions are thin. We also need one more CM to partner Casemiro in my opinion and I guess that player was going to be FDJ but since Casemiro plays with Fred in the national team there is a chance we can get it to work for us too.
 
nickm said:
Explain Rabiot then!
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Our usual pissing in the wind?

I'm yet to be convinced that has anything to do with our scouting being bad or not. It's the usual pattern of singular target not going well and a series of erratic late stabs at anything that moves.
 
Aren't we supposed to rate not Ten Hag, but Murtough, and not now, but in next 3 days?

Has Erik done enough to rate him yet? I see some positives and some negatives but seems it's still far too early.
 
If varane can stay fit u feel that the major issue has been "sorted" a defence we can trust and a Shield in front.

So now it's offensive wise, we've food strength out wide now, the issue now being a good cf
 
daveskimufc said:
If varane can stay fit u feel that the major issue has been "sorted" a defence we can trust and a Shield in front.

So now it's offensive wise, we've food strength out wide now, the issue now being a good cf
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Shaw's been dropped mate
 
Still too early to tell but we signed a DM, show signs of having a solid defense and acquired a potential superstar at RW. We beat Liverpool and won an away game all in the same week. A lot of positives right now and actually fun being a United supporter for once, hehe.

That said, the football needs to be better. That will take some time. I love to see us win games, but I think the manner of how we do it is equally important. Right now ETH is doing the most with what he's got, but I hope we get to see the team imposing their will on the opponent more the longer the season goes on and especially next year when they will hopefully target a RB, ST, CM and a GK that's good with his feet.

It's time that the thought of having to play against United strikes fear into opposing teams hearts again :devil:.
 
For me, EtH has already proven that he is a fantastic manager. We are very lucky - this club run by Glazer muppets doesn't actually deserve somebody as good as him. I really hope he stays long.

It is even more clear just how incompetent Arnold, Murtough and the recruitement department are. It will continue to be a major problem, unfortunately.
 
We had a bunch of issues and 4 of the 5 signings were glaring issues going into the summer. Left footed aggressive ball playing CB for the build up, no longer playing Telles, a strong, world class DM in, and a left footed right winger. Eriksen is the only one, but on a free and being able to be a deep playmaker makes that a no brainer as well.

Next priorities for me are:
  1. Striker to compete with Martial who can hold up the ball and link up well and press
  2. Our next goal keeper (still could be Henderson but I doubt)
  3. Right back (either rotation for Dalot or to replace Dalot, depending on his season)
  4. Deep playmaker (next year)
The striker we can get a stop gap in given there are limited options out there and we more so need certain profiles rather than just any goalscorer. Why I think Morata would be perfect for a couple of years.
Don't expect much next year, but don't need an aggressive window. As long as we address the 4 above, that should lead to a "complete" squad next season. And then it's just working on transition players for the next decline guys. Looking at the targets identified and the players brought... Ultimately can't complain, very good signings and ten hag must be happy they backed him eventually.
 
De gea (to replace)

Dalot (ok for the next 10 years)
Varane (ok for the next 4 years)
Martinez (ok for the next 10 years)
Malacia (ok for the next 10 years)

Casemiro (ok for the next 4 years)
Eriksen (ok for the next 2 years)
Bruno (ok for the next 6 years)

Antony (ok for the next 10 years)
Sancho (ok for the next 10 years)
Martial (to replace)

The squad is almost complete
Only the GK and CF position needs to be fixed asap
The rest of line up is fine for the next 2/4-10 yrs
 
I really hope we are patient with Ten Hag. He needs to rebuild over 3+ summers (or 4-5 solid transfer windows). He also needs time to stamp his system into the players' brains.

So far so good though. Martinez has been man of the match for the past 2 matches, and I've been impressed with Malacia, and pleasantly surprised by Eriksen. With Casemiro and Anthony to come, it feels a bit better than after Brentford.
 
Couldn't help be apprehensive when he first came in talking about giving everybody a chance, it especially seemed to have backfired given how quickly he dropped the problem players and we suddenly saw panic in the market. Given those circumstances though its been pretty positive since, even if the club has had to overpay for certain players.
 
DDG DDG - transfer for a future window

AWB Dalot - no brainer
Lindelof Varane - needs to stay fit
Maguire Martinez - I cannot believe my eyes
Telles Malacia - massive upgrade, even to Shaw

Mctominay Casimiro - Hallelujah
Fred Erikson - would rotate both
Bruno Bruno - needs to up his game

Elanga Antony - first proper RW in years
Ronaldo Ronaldo - GOAT
Sancho Sancho - needs to improve this year

ETH has addressed two areas we have suffered from since the Fergie days, CDM and RW. He has also got rid of the reliance of McFred. Shaw sure is talented, but hebis a lazy and injury prone player for me. Malacia looks like he will improve every game. Keeping Varane fit will be key for our defence stability whilst Martinez is just refreshing. Not seeing Maguire in a line up makes me very happy.

I think its a start but I had hoped for a few more signings, we wasted time and money in this window. We probably could have got Antony for 60m in July, Martinez looks expensive but worth it. It took two defeats to get Casimior and Antony in. I dont think ETH is that happy. I wish we had got another midfielder, a right back and a striker. A back young talented keeper would have also been great.
 
It's taken him 2 games to realise he needed to address the defence (specifically Maguire and Lindelof) which was our biggest issue last season. So that's a good start. He's also at least recognised that we have no central midfield which again is encouraging.

Too early to judge how well he can implement a playing style, motivate the players etc. Which are vitally important factors. He says all the right things which is obviously a plus point, but actually convincing the players to do it is different.

Biggest concern so far was that weird line up he picked for the opening game. Can't expect him to iron out or recognise all the problems with the players before they even play a competitive game under him, but picking a midfielder up front and screwing around with everything he'd spent all pre season getting the players to work on was strange and a bit too LVG...but all in all I'm about as encouraged as I can be considering we lost 4-0 to Brentford 2 games in.

I really liked the story about him forcing all the players to run the distance they didn't cover but then doing it with them. Don't know how much truth is in it, but I hope it was true because its simple but genius team management.
 
::sonny:: said:
De gea (to replace)

Dalot (ok for the next 10 years)
Varane (ok for the next 4 years)
Martinez (ok for the next 10 years)
Malacia (ok for the next 10 years)

Casemiro (ok for the next 4 years)
Eriksen (ok for the next 2 years)
Bruno (ok for the next 6 years)

Antony (ok for the next 10 years)
Sancho (ok for the next 10 years)
Martial (to replace)

The squad is almost complete
Only the GK and CF position needs to be fixed asap
The rest of line up is fine for the next 2/4-10 yrs
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You’re kidding yourself if you believe those numbers, we’re sorted to fight top 4 but there is still a lot of rebuilding down the line.
 
Trequarista10 said:
Part one isn't even finished yet.

Of the signings we've made so far, they're all very good. Only potential criticism really is that the signings have largely been very Ajax/Dutch based, which isn't necessarily a problem but more broadly you'd hope to see signs that our management can identify players to suit ETH's desired style of play that aren't connected to Ajax or Holland. We can only speculate but the optics do kind of suggest that our scouting/recruitment network hasn't really pulled their weight and so ETH has just chosen players he knows well. That said, it may simply be something that will take some time to change, as our scouting/recruitment team adjust to ETH's criteria.

One thing missing this window so far is the arrival of a cheap, largely unknown, young gem from a less high profile league. Those sorts of signings are usually the most exciting and satisfying when the work, like Chicharito, Vidic, Da Silvas, Solskjaer etc. I'm hoping we see such a signing before the window closes.
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Malacia?
 
Here are my thoughts for what its worth:

Will Singh said:
I think by far the best window we’ve had in a long time
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Well, you have spent over £200 million, so I would hope that is the case. There are two issues with it though: i) almost all the transfers in have some previous connection with the manager. That on the face of it should be a good thing, he knows them and they know him, but the downside is, if there is a dodgy run of results in the winter, there might be people above him critical of all these Erevidersie players coming in on his say-so (the Dutch league being relatively small compared to the bigger ones). ii) what is going to happen with the 'Glazers out campaign?' It seemed logical when you were chasing Aurnautovic and Rabiot and trying to sell James Garner for £15million, but now it looks a little odd because you have spent so much on such big names. I assume the protests will continue, but just shouting Glazers Out isn't enough, you need to explain to the fans of smaller clubs who may have struggled to spend 20 million, let alone 200 what the underlying problems really are.

Which brings me to this:

Crashoutcassius said:
On the pitch it has been disappointing. Don't think that is up for debate. Usual signs of new manager bounce effort and small changes.

Transfer business I think has been disappointing too. Overpaying for unproven or aging players who will be the next managers job to be rid of, not signing players for the club but instead for this manager. I understand why all of this is happening though - the panic of how bad last season. And our start to this season was.

Still think the top two people at the club are better than we have had since Gil and Ferg. Has to be a good thing over the coming 3 years
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This confuses me. I think there is a power struggle going on which possibly accounts for all the flip-flopping recently: You have your new manager, you have your DoF plus Arnold and Murtough and you also have a 'think tank' of advisors including two of the people you make a comparison with from yesteryear. There are also the Glazer owners whom I believe are behind the retention of Ronaldo for commercial reasons. Fortunately it seems the manager is currently winning the power struggle - in fact in a few months time you might look back at the Brighton game and the Brentford game with pleasure and not so much pain as those 2 matches have empowered the manager to take total control, drop Ronaldo and demand the action in the transfer market that has been seen this last week or so.

DevilRed said:
We've brought in alot of characters first and foremost. That should go a long way to helping us get back into the top four.
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Well I agree with this, and the manager himself has impressed me a lot with his strength of character: e.g. blanking the Sky tw$t reporter and getting the players in after the Brentford game for extra running, which I believe he also did himself. He needs to stay strong to fight the battles ahead as there will be lots going on behind the scenes that we can only guess at now Lingard and Henderson have gone Lol!
 
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Joseunited said:
Sort out those 2 positions and that's a proper fecking football team.
I like the look of Matt O'Riley of Celtic as an option for the midfield.
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I've seen O'Riley live a few times last season and he's looked excellent.
Over the years I've found it very hard to judge whether a player he looked good in the SPL would make it in the EPL and would admit to be being a poor judge of these things. For example, there was a time when I absolutely thought United should buy Brian Laudrup.

I don't know how I'd judge EtH so far. What I am sure of is that I like him and he absolutely has my backing for what it's worth. He's got a big task on his hands undoing the damage of the past few years.
 
There’s a massive difference in quality in our team now compared to last season. Finally have a DM, finally have a specialist right winger! Got plenty of creative options. A solid back 2. Promising young full back. Alls we need now to complete it is a natural goal scoring striker, a rb and a keeper.
 
Awful.

I suspect he's just created a new set of problems.

Buying a 30 year old DM that Real Madrid had decided to fade out. If we are lucky we get 2 good seasons from Casemiro before we get a repeat of Matic's last few years. Huge wages. Typically favours simple passes. Does he have the speed to get back if we are playing a high line ?

A short CB and a short left-back is just inviting trouble. Look at how Southampton's keeper launched the ball towards the left side of our defence again and again. Every team in the PL will be making plans to exploit our lack of height at corners, free-kicks, even long throw-ins, route one balls from keepers and CBs.

Eriksen another that we might get one good season from given his health issues. So far he's looked decent creating chances, rubbish at finishing them, poor defensively and a liability in possession in our defensive third.

I'm bewildered at how we came to the conclusion that Antony is worth £80m+.

Paid insane fees for 3 of these players. United's business can sustain about £110m net spend per year (in a non-Covid year). The only player we've sold is Andreas Pereira.
 
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Joseunited said:
Sort out those 2 positions and that's a proper fecking football team.
I like the look of Matt O'Riley of Celtic as an option for the midfield.
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O’Riley is an interesting prospect. Starting to linked to some big teams.
 
How are we at the point to rate anything as “Part 1” right now ? We’re four matches in and his first transfer window hasn’t even gone yet.

Bizarre thread.
 
EtH: 10/10
Each signing is filling either a hole in the team or replacing underperforming stars like Maguire and Shaw. He has a clear idea of what the team needs, and he is going about it ruthlessly. I have full confidence in this man. His players/targets are aggressive and winners.

The Club: 1/10
Dilly-dallying as usual. Going for players who might not want to come at all (de Jong). Massively overpaying for others (Antony). Just what does our scouting department do when they either buy established stars or rely solely on the manager's recommendations? Absolutely shambolic. Glazers out.
 
Boondog said:
Also he should have sat Dean down and had a heart-to-heart with him and taken a real look at his game but he didn't and now he's trying to fix that in the transfer window.

Not making an early call on Christiano. This is another no-brainer. I am sure his rationale was seeing those goals walk out the door and not trusting to get a replacement but Christiano's status changes the rules. He should have given him the green light to choose his next club. As it stands he might be forced to juggle Christiano and his ego as a non-fit on the roster which will not be comfortable for anyone.
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Dean Henderson left the club on loan before ETH took over, both of them never met, watch Henderson interview he will explain how and why he left and didn't want to new manager to see him play. Ronaldo as per reports back in May when it was certain we wouldn't get UCL confirmed that he would stay, his late July bomb came as a surprise to everyone at the Club. From reports privately club and manager would like Ronaldo to leave but so far he hasn't got a club in for him. If a reasonable bid came in, I'm sure club will accept it.
 
DevilRed said:
One common theme is we've signed fighers/warriors. Guys that have a no nonsense mentality and are hard as fecking nails. Martinez obviously. Casemiro is a warrior. Antony is a firebrand who actually has a high work rate for a so called "flair" winger. Malacia is also solid for someone so young. Eriksen is another whos personality/leadership is the polar opposite to clowns like pogba/lingard.

We've brought in alot of characters first and foremost. That should go a long way to helping us get back into the top four.
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Agree. It's cost us a ton but this is one of the best windows we've had post SAF due this is exact reason.

little.triangles said:
The Club: 1/10
Dilly-dallying as usual. Going for players who might not want to come at all (de Jong). Massively overpaying for others (Antony). Just what does our scouting department do when they either buy established stars or rely solely on the manager's recommendations? Absolutely shambolic. Glazers out.
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There's only so much you can do to convince a club that does not want to sell. ETH wanted specific players & they cost money. We've probably paid 35m more for Antony, 15m more for Martinez and 30m more for Casemiro but these type of players aren't abundant in the market and even the ones who are available prefer not to come to a club that plays in Europa league. This 80m is the penalty we pay for being crap all along. As far as I'm concerned, we've got quality players in. More than the money spent, they will help improve us to make it to top 3 or top 4. Given our revenues, I'd say this window is equivalent to the window when we purchased Veron & RVN.


Season​
Revenue​
Net Trf​
% of Revenue​
2001-02​
145​
40​
27.59%​
2022-23​
700​
200​
28.57%​

Not long ago, we spent a similar amount bringing in Maguire, AWB, Daniel James and Bruno in 1 season.
 
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Rabiot and Arnautovich a couple weeks ago to what he have now Is vertigo inducing. Can't wait to see Antony playing with Casemiro. We will be unrecognizable. Already one of the best windows I can remember.
 
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