I heard this on the World Service at the weekend and thought i would pas sit on.
The History Thread
- Thread starter SteveJ
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Vietnam's past is a particularly tragic one in many ways. After the French there was the American involvement with all the consequences for the young men on both sides. One of the most moving photo essays I've ever seen was in Time : 'Sudden Death in Vietnam: ‘One Ride With Yankee Papa 13′- the web version is on the link below and amazing and sad description of an operation during the war, and some stunning photography
Vietnam Photo Essay: Larry Burrows’ ‘One Ride With Yankee Papa 13′ | LIFE.com http://life.time.com/history/vietna...s-one-ride-with-yankee-papa-13/#ixzz3138PNuzh
Well worth a look
Vietnam Photo Essay: Larry Burrows’ ‘One Ride With Yankee Papa 13′ | LIFE.com http://life.time.com/history/vietna...s-one-ride-with-yankee-papa-13/#ixzz3138PNuzh
Well worth a look
For those interested in the extent of the secret, illegal bombing campaigns the US unleashed on Cambodia and Laos, both "neutral" countries during the Vietnam War. Together with the carpet bombing campaigns of North Vietnam, often on urban areas, it would put the Amerika of Nixon/Kissinger just a notch below Hitler's Nazi regime, Stalinist Soviet Union, Maoist China and the Cambodia of Pol Pot in genocidal policies, and considering their bombing campaign on Cambodia directly gave rise to Pol Pot, you could possibly put them up side by side in that elite genocidal company.
Though it is comforting to know Kissinger won a nobel peace prize (that his Vietnamese co-winner refused), and continues to advise Amerikan foreign policy, and is often found with young models on his arm.
http://peterslarson.com/2010/12/15/us-bombings-in-laos-1965-1973/
http://www.yale.edu/cgp/Walrus_CambodiaBombing_OCT06.pdf
Though it is comforting to know Kissinger won a nobel peace prize (that his Vietnamese co-winner refused), and continues to advise Amerikan foreign policy, and is often found with young models on his arm.
http://peterslarson.com/2010/12/15/us-bombings-in-laos-1965-1973/
http://www.yale.edu/cgp/Walrus_CambodiaBombing_OCT06.pdf
And their enemies in Vietnam took him down, even.
I probably also should've mentioned East Timor and Operation Condor in South America in Kissinger's greatest hits. Although he and Amerika weren't pulling the trigger, they were certainly pointing the gun, amply funding them, and giving the ol' wink and nod to carry on.
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Kissinger/East_Timor_TOHK.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Kissinger/East_Timor_TOHK.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor
Laos and Cambodia were 'neutral' countries whose governments didn't control their own territories.
The Ho Chi Minh trail, flowing through both Laos and Cambodia, was under the control of North Vietnam, and functioned as the main supply route for Northern forces in the South, enabling the NVA (North Vietnamese Army) to outflank the American and South Vietnamese defensive line along the DMZ (Demilitarized Zone, the border between North and South, aka the 17th parallel) and strike deep into South Vietnam, inflicting huge casualties on American and South Vietnamese forces.
A country that can't enforce its neutrality, but allows its territory to be used by one of the combatants as a strategic asset, can't expect that 'neutrality' to be respected.
So I guess that justifies carpet bombing these countries halfway around the world, countries posing zero threats on the US itself, countries the US had never declared war on, killing upwards to a million innocents . . . jeez, what was I thinking? Might makes right, right?And when you say "huge" casualties on the US, what do you mean? They lost about 55.000 troops in ten years. How many were lost because of these supply lines? Those carpet bombing campaigns took between 500,000 to one million lives, almost all innocent civilians. I love this way of thinking.
And remember these genocidal carpet bombing campaigns were done behind the US congress' backs, illegally, thus making it a war crimes act.
Now if the US could only control its own border with Mexico.
And remember these genocidal carpet bombing campaigns were done behind the US congress' backs, illegally, thus making it a war crimes act.
Now if the US could only control its own border with Mexico.
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You really dislike the US, eh Nobby? The 'k' in America seems rather unnecessary.
I think the spelling with a "k" is quite apt when talking about the Amerika of Kissinger/Nixon/Reagan/Cheney/Tea Party/Fox News et al. I don't necessarily hate America, just right wing Amerika. I'm half American as well. Some of the people I most admire in the world are in California.
Came across as more KKKish. Fair play.
Kissinger gets a freebie in my view - he loves football and was a big factor in the US world cup bid. just joking
Kissinger gets a freebie in my view - he loves football and was a big factor in the US world cup bid. just joking
Spelling it Amerika is just a little childish and pointless.
It's like when people say Manure instead of Man Utd.
It's like when people say Manure instead of Man Utd.
If there's a hell, Kissinger will be there.
I suppose it could be childish, but I don't get the "pointless" part. The K obviously adds a nazi-ish fascist connotation which in the United States' case is well deserved when you look at so many of these right wing kooks, and its aggressive military and police tactics and all the gun bollocks. Distinguishes it from the very cool America that doesn't watch Fox News or vote Republikan.
But these very cool Americans voted for John Kennedy and Lyndon Johnson, who committed America to Vietnam, and sent a 1/2 million troops there, respectively.
What were they thinking?
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It's interesting, the Kissinger I read about in college is more likely to be in heaven @Eboue . Tell me more.
Strange, I think France's war against Algeria was more scarring on the national conscience than Vietnam.
Strange, I think France's war against Algeria was more scarring on the national conscience than Vietnam.
But it's a connotation that is pointless to add, because it's completely unnecessary. The content of your post will show what you think about Fox News and the American right, we don't need visual cues. It also cheapens any possible debate.
Go past a Korner Kafe or two. It's wank, just write bleeding English.
Invasion of Cyprus, genocide in East Timor, apologist for Great Leap Forward, bombing of Cambodia, encouraging Pakistan into war with India, support for Pinochet, complicit in assassinations of South Americans, coup against democratically elected Allende, etc
And this little gem
The man is the devil.
Cambodia is what I remember....
so many lives...
so many lives...
Don't know if anyone is interested in this?
"The story of the British Army on the Western Front during the First World War is waiting to be discovered in 1.5 million pages of unit war diaries. We need your help to reveal the stories of those who fought in the global conflict that shaped the world we live in today". It's a joint project between Zooniverse, the Imperial War Museum and the National Archives. Basically it's reading a page of an official war diary and making notes (like tagging) of info on issues such as location, training, casualties etc.. Really interesting and the kind of thing you can do for an odd hour or so. Really will help in collating the info as well.
If anyone is then they just follow the link below
http://www.operationwardiary.org/?u...m_content=ROB&utm_campaign=WAR DIARY LAUNCH#/
"The story of the British Army on the Western Front during the First World War is waiting to be discovered in 1.5 million pages of unit war diaries. We need your help to reveal the stories of those who fought in the global conflict that shaped the world we live in today". It's a joint project between Zooniverse, the Imperial War Museum and the National Archives. Basically it's reading a page of an official war diary and making notes (like tagging) of info on issues such as location, training, casualties etc.. Really interesting and the kind of thing you can do for an odd hour or so. Really will help in collating the info as well.
If anyone is then they just follow the link below
http://www.operationwardiary.org/?u...m_content=ROB&utm_campaign=WAR DIARY LAUNCH#/
First days excavating for quite some time but very pleasant. Simply cleared back the base of the chimney stack, and although I can't make it again until next week I think this is going to be a good community project to be involved with. The site originally looked like this:
Today is the 70th Anniversary of D-Day. Among the nations who had troops involved in the landers were Great Britain, Canada, United States, France, Australia, Belgium, Czechoslovakia, Poland, Greece, Netherlands, Norway, New Zealand and Poland, my apologies for any I have left out, no slight is intended.
On the other side were of course the Germans and their roles included soldiers from some of their occupied territories.
Well known enough event, don't need to say alot about it.
Still have not managed my trip over to see the beaches. Utah, Omaha, Gold, Juno and Sword, but that trip is on my bucket list.
On the other side were of course the Germans and their roles included soldiers from some of their occupied territories.
Well known enough event, don't need to say alot about it.
Still have not managed my trip over to see the beaches. Utah, Omaha, Gold, Juno and Sword, but that trip is on my bucket list.
My Grandad was one of those involved in the Normandy Landings but never spoke of his experiences so God knows what he and the other allies went through and saw that day.This will be the last big anniversary that any survivors are around to speak of their experiences so it is quite moving hearing some of the old soldiers speak today.
RIP to those soldiers of both sides who perished all those years ago.
RIP to those soldiers of both sides who perished all those years ago.
Yes, my dad was one of them in the Canadian army. Never spoke about the war to us as kids, occasionally opened up when we were in our twenties but it was just so distressing for him - only time I ever saw him cry was when he talked about it. They were all so young and so frightened - and brave. Very, very brave.
First days excavating for quite some time but very pleasant. Simply cleared back the base of the chimney stack, and although I can't make it again until next week I think this is going to be a good community project to be involved with. The site originally looked like this:
How'd this go? Will the report be publicly available?
First day at Ness today, just uncovering the site, sand bags have destroyed my puny arms.
Still ongoing and report will eventually be published I think by OA North. Will let you know if it is. First day is always a killer - this is an industrial site that's now a nature reserve so it's working around huge tree roots. Last time I was in Scottish Isles I was almost eaten alive! What's the site like you're on? - they always appeared so isolated to me, but then I'm no prehistorian. Photo is the base of one of the coke ovens.
The Ness is in a decent open space. There's the barn and house beside it which the team is given use of and then the public generally are allowed to view the site and there are guided tours which can be a hindrance sometimes if they attempt to stray onto the site itself. Just spent today cleaning over the site again with our trowels, was working in Structure 21 and 1 myself. Should get fully stuck in to it tomorrow, will probably get some pictures of the site and general structures i'm working in.
Just finished my two weeks at the Ness, gutted that i can't stay for longer as the 'structure' i've been working in is just starting to get interesting.
Mystery over massive Alexander-era tomb unearthed in Greece
http://news.yahoo.com/mystery-over-massive-alexander-era-tomb-unearthed-greece-214827708.html
http://news.yahoo.com/mystery-over-massive-alexander-era-tomb-unearthed-greece-214827708.html
A perfectly-preserved wooden toilet seat has been found during excavations on Hadrian's Wall in Northumberland - believed to be the only one of its kind ever discovered, they were usually made of stone. I know it's a bit prosaic, but I find this kind of evidence of daily life more interesting than the big discoveries!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-28956328
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-28956328
Ship from the lost Franklin expedition found:
www.thestar.com/news/canada/2014/09/09/ship_from_lost_franklin_expedition_found.html
www.thestar.com/news/canada/2014/09/09/the_star_with_the_franklin_search_keeping_secrets_in_the_high_arctic.html
www.thestar.com/news/canada/2014/09/09/franklin_expedition_5_things_to_know_about_the_ultimate_cold_case.html
A great thread by Zeb from RAWK about the discovery & exploration of what may be Alexander the Great's tomb (as per Raoul's post above):
Amphipolis - Macedonian Tomb from c.310 BC:
http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=316214.0
Amphipolis - Macedonian Tomb from c.310 BC:
http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=316214.0
I recently undertook some photography for the University of the finds from the excavation that took place in Whitworth Park on Oxford Road. Fascinating. Most (although not all) of the materials found were from the Edwardian period when the park was in its early heyday.
To start with some of the glass remains found. There was a strict no alcohol policy originally, but the archaeological evidence would appear to indicate it was widely ignored (not the only site this is proved at):
The remains of a large number of clay pipes were, not surprisingly, found:
and finally some of the glass bottles:
To start with some of the glass remains found. There was a strict no alcohol policy originally, but the archaeological evidence would appear to indicate it was widely ignored (not the only site this is proved at):
The remains of a large number of clay pipes were, not surprisingly, found:
and finally some of the glass bottles:
I want to read a history of sports. I assume they evolved from various rituals, right? Do ya'll have any recommendation?
Basketball supposedly came from the Aztecs, and supposedly involved death for the losing side.
There's tons of stuff - it really depends what you're interested in. Ancient societies often used sport as a means of training their young men (and women in some societies) for war (Sparta, Rome, Greece, Babylonia, Egypt etc.) as did more modern societies (for example between 1st and 2nd world war in The States and Europe). Others were involved in sports for pleasure. Then there's sport being used to inculcate social values and behavioural patterns. Plus the history of individual sports or the history and application of sports science. Then there's the history of individual clubs and societies, or the involvement of groups - so for example I'm currently researching load of stuff about worker's sports organisations.
So it really depends what you want to read about. There are whole libraries, magazines and research institutes linked to the history of sport. What kind of thing were you after?