That is very impressive. Wonder what that table would like without peno’s, I guess he’d be nearer the top since I imagine Aguero, Salah and Auba have also had 1 penalty this season at least.This thread was predictably pathetic after the Spurs game. Anyway here's an update on the top scorers in England this season:
Aguero - 23
Salah - 21
Sterling - 21
Aubameyang - 20
Martial - 19
Rashford - 19
Vardy - 19
Mane - 19
Ings - 19
Jimenez - 18
Jesus - 18
Kane - 18
Abraham - 15
Calvert-Lewin - 15
Only one of those 19 have come from penalties - he's a goalscorer. Can't wait to watch him lead the line for us next season
Has Martial done enough to be backed as our long-term #9?
- Thread starter MyOnlySolskjaer
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Sheffield didn’t look slower than us by the way. The difference is that we had players all over the pitch that were great on the ball (first touch/dribbling/passing) which made Sheffield’s attempt at pressing us futile. They were tired from this. We also looked slow at times with our movement but because we had players in midfield and defense capable of passing the ball fluidly from one end to another it didn’t show.
Martial provides a better performance when you switch out less technical players like dan James and lingard for greenwood/mata and Bruno. It makes a whole world of difference when you have comfortable players on the ball on either wing providing you. I think you in particular need to stop with your over critical approach to Martial. Van persie and Ruud will both struggle in a team that creates 2 chances for their forwards on a regular basis. Those two forwards were also on penalty duties whether they won it or not.
Martial is only 24 and in his defence I can't say I blame his inconsistency if we want to call it that. We know theres a player there but he's been here 5 years..and in that time we've been so poor. Yeah we've won a few trophies but you just feel he's underrated. He can play well. We know his quality and scoring goals will give him confidence. If he was missing all the time, that's different. We need to get him involved and hungry and now we've got a bit of quality and are developing to a point where players can find him, he can move more freely because we have the quality now to find him on a more regular basis. It's up to him to meet the standard but for me he's untransferable. Because we can create for him but we know he can score goals out of nothing. So this form we're in and this season is great for him! Because he can be that type of player and he can play that kind of game and be assured that the players behind him are not bleeping useless.
I made a point yesterday I think, he don't take pens. If he took pens, he'd probably be on 25 goals already...and so it's a perceptual thing. If he scores 20+ this season without taking pens or free kicks and with missing a bit of the reason, that's a good return. Of course we want to see him more confident and show what he can do and I feel we're close to giving him that platform. Much more so then at any time since he's been here. And I have confidence in him. That chance against Spurs. He could have been sharper for sure but he's just so composed. I think if you guide it first time you wrong foot the keeper but he is the kind who don't miss that many of those kind of chances and the fact he's getting in positions like that, show that as long as we create chances he'll score goals. But can you imagine, now he's got good movement around him? More space because now we've goal threats from various parts of the pitch. Him and Ighalo will get plenty of opportunities.
I made a point yesterday I think, he don't take pens. If he took pens, he'd probably be on 25 goals already...and so it's a perceptual thing. If he scores 20+ this season without taking pens or free kicks and with missing a bit of the reason, that's a good return. Of course we want to see him more confident and show what he can do and I feel we're close to giving him that platform. Much more so then at any time since he's been here. And I have confidence in him. That chance against Spurs. He could have been sharper for sure but he's just so composed. I think if you guide it first time you wrong foot the keeper but he is the kind who don't miss that many of those kind of chances and the fact he's getting in positions like that, show that as long as we create chances he'll score goals. But can you imagine, now he's got good movement around him? More space because now we've goal threats from various parts of the pitch. Him and Ighalo will get plenty of opportunities.
Hmm. You told him to calm his knickers off .. and he's the rude non banter like an adult type? Not sure mate.
He certainly has the potential to be our number 9...With Bruno and Pogba in the team,he obviously doesn’t need to drop deep to get involved in the game.He can just stay in the final third for the entire match and I”m pretty sure that him and Rashford will score loads of goals in the future...
I did have a discu
I don't understand why people call Martial inconsistent. How is a player meant to be consistent when a manager doesnt believe in him? How often did Jose play him on a regular basis? He seems the player that needs the confidence of the manager.
We saw when LVG started him, his numbers were up there.
This season, he has performed really well, I hope he can get 20 PL goals, I know it means another 6 more but that should be his aim and all the Martial haters can suck it.
I don't understand why people call Martial inconsistent. How is a player meant to be consistent when a manager doesnt believe in him? How often did Jose play him on a regular basis? He seems the player that needs the confidence of the manager.
We saw when LVG started him, his numbers were up there.
This season, he has performed really well, I hope he can get 20 PL goals, I know it means another 6 more but that should be his aim and all the Martial haters can suck it.
Consistency in that he's not had a constant stream of chances from game to game - to have the numbers to give people the confidence and in terms of being visible on the pitch. We can see when Martial is involved, he looks more lively just like anyone would because no one wants to make runs if you don't feel you'll be found. I think there is a 25 + goal striker there, and that we'll see that if the team continues to play this way
We can’t fully judge him (or any striker) until we get our right side sorted. If he’s consistently taking up those positions closer to goal and scoring scrappy goals then he’s evolving. He’s going to score over 20 in the league this season in a season where he’s been injured, the squad has had bad injuries, he’s not taking penos and most of his assists have come from the left side. Hes bought himself another season as our 9. Yes there will be frustrating days ahead but he’s clearly a good player. If we can find a system to suit our players there’s no reason why he can’t have a very long and successful career here. What I will say is at a club of our size there should be someone there competing with him for the spot who offers something different. Ighalo is fine as stopgap but that will need to be addressed ASAP.
I'm not, I just think there are others that do it better than him and we shouldn't expect it or judge him on it.
I'm not trying to be argumentative here by any means but who would you say is better than him in that regard?
I think Ighalo is better at holding the ball up and bringing others into play and Rashford is better running at defenders for example. I don't think we should judge Martial on those skills as we wouldn't judge someone like Hernandez on those things either. Nothing wrong with it though.
Martial is nothing like Hernandez though? Martial is probably the second (alongside Bruno) most technically gifted player behind Pogba. He can dribble, links up play, plays short quick one-two's, generally composed on the ball and has very good close control. On top of that the vast majority of his goals (especially before this season) haven't been the type of goals you'd associate with poachers - he scores from outside the box, scores from solo runs etc.
It would be nice if Martial does score 10+ extra goals a season from learning top level positioning in the box and scoring goals similar to the first 2 he got against Sheffield but I'd also like to think he'd remain a player who can score the type of goal he scored against Watford this season or City away where he created something out of nothing, its a rare quality to have as a striker.
In all competitions non-penalty goals:
Sterling - 21
Aguero - 20
Aubameyang - 19
Mane - 19
Martial - 18
Salah - 18
In the League non-penalty goals:
Aubameyang - 16
Ings - 16
Mane - 15
Vardy - 15
Martial - 14
Aguero - 14
Salah - 14
Four players in England have more non-penalty goals in all competitions than Martial. In League only terms, the top scorer without penalties is only 2 goals ahead of Martial.
Not a striker though apparently.
Good player, but not an out and out goalscorer for me. I grew up with Van Nistlerooy; my dad with Denis Law; my grandad with Tommy Taylor. They were out and out scorers; utterly single minded. I don't think Tony is so ruthless; I would play him as a support to such a striker.
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Madness. This is as untrue an observation as you could possibly make about Martial. He has brilliant all round game - link up play, passing, dribbling, hold up play all outstanding. In fact, if you played him just as a ‘fox in the box’, he’d be middling at best.
Agree with you.
We all know that he can become world class, but I have the gut feeling that Martial took a massive step towards what we all want him to become yesterday. Of course, playing in front of such a potent four (Fernandes, Pogba, Greenwood and Rashford) helped him get the ball in the first place, but in the past when we had players like Mkhitaryan, Zlatan and a younger Mata, he never made those runs, which resulted in him getting less chances.
Of course, his finishing is already well-known around the Premier League for being brilliant, but I believe that it is still improving and will continue to do so in the future. It seems as if every chance he gets now ends up at least as a shot on target. However, with an improved Rashford, Fernandes and now Pogba, he has vastly and noticeably improved in not just finishing, but every facet of his game from movement to link-up play.
To be honest, I have wanted him dropped for Greenwood or Ighalo in the past after some utterly anonymous matches. After the past 5 months, I realise the error on my part as he is a quality striker who prefers to play with quality suppliers and is more productive as a result. All in all, he is having a fantastic season and with possibly 16 games to go, I truly believe he will be the first player since RvP to break the 30 goal mark for a season.
Of course, his finishing is already well-known around the Premier League for being brilliant, but I believe that it is still improving and will continue to do so in the future. It seems as if every chance he gets now ends up at least as a shot on target. However, with an improved Rashford, Fernandes and now Pogba, he has vastly and noticeably improved in not just finishing, but every facet of his game from movement to link-up play.
To be honest, I have wanted him dropped for Greenwood or Ighalo in the past after some utterly anonymous matches. After the past 5 months, I realise the error on my part as he is a quality striker who prefers to play with quality suppliers and is more productive as a result. All in all, he is having a fantastic season and with possibly 16 games to go, I truly believe he will be the first player since RvP to break the 30 goal mark for a season.
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There isnt a single player at the club better than martial running at defenders. Rashford is quicker than martial which might be what you meant.
He isn't fox in the box, asking him to play that role would negate his biggest strengths. He is very good playmaker, dropping deep and moving wide is part of playing in fluid system, whenever he drops deep or move to wings, we have players like Rashford, Greenwood, Bruno and other midfielders making runs into box.
Watch his Brighton game, you will see what he brings to the team, he is more than just a pure finisher.
Martial is such an interesting player because you really don’t know what level he could become. He seems quite settled with his family, he has a coach who believes in him, a long term contract, & he’s playing the position he wants to play... in Rashford, Pogba, & Fernandes, he now even has a supply line.
I’m not comparing him in any way to Ronaldo except that Ronaldo wasn’t much younger when he became really efficient, & I imagine Ole never shuts up about Ronaldo when he’s talking to Rashford & Martial. As much as I love the “goal from nothing” potential they both possess, the hardest and most valuable thing a forward can provide is goals. I love how Martial is now finding space in crowded penalty areas. If we were to add an assist machine like Sancho (no disrespect to Greenwood, his time is coming quickly) Martial could become the striker we’ve needed for a long time.
I’m not comparing him in any way to Ronaldo except that Ronaldo wasn’t much younger when he became really efficient, & I imagine Ole never shuts up about Ronaldo when he’s talking to Rashford & Martial. As much as I love the “goal from nothing” potential they both possess, the hardest and most valuable thing a forward can provide is goals. I love how Martial is now finding space in crowded penalty areas. If we were to add an assist machine like Sancho (no disrespect to Greenwood, his time is coming quickly) Martial could become the striker we’ve needed for a long time.
Van Persie and Ruud would not struggle the same because of their conversion rate: find me more than two big chances both those missed during a season... but if you think this team is capable of getting close to Liverpool, well enjoy your fantasy. And, by the way, we still don't have a winger capable of what you say
Absolutely agree about the need for a winger (or two). We are always better with real wide men. Silly rumours abound that we will bid for Haland again but it would take a totally crazy bid for Dortmund to even answer the phone. I'd love to see either Martial or Rashford do for us what Aguero does at City or Drogba did at Chelsea or Salah at the other place but can't say I'm hugely confident that he can but I agree part of the reason for that is the passing ability of those behind him, so there is more pressure on him to finish any half (quarer) chance that comes along
I think you're wrong on both counts. Martial and Hernandez have very little in common other than they're both strikers and have bother played for us.
In the past he wasn't used as a striker, so he wasn't going to make these runs and something that people tend to ignore is the fact that wide players and strikers don't see the game the same way, they don't see the same runs, don't have the same instincts. You can't just move a player in a different position and expect him to act like the position archetype. For me Martial has always been a lot more natural in the middle, he has always been more involved and played with more variety, that's one of the reasons why I have always thought that he was a striker than can play wide but not an actual wide player. If you take Rashford it's the opposite, he struggles when he starts from the middle while he does the defensive job, offensively his game becomes limited, but wide he is lively and dangerous.
You won't find many strikers like Martial who can contribute a lot more to build-up, world class finishing and have a very good close control, he seems to develop a killer instinct in box as evidenced from Sheffield United. Ole is a very perfect coach for Martial who can develop his game with coachings from Ole, it wouldn't be possible without him. It saddens me to know that he could be more like that if it wasn't for Jose to feck up Martial's development and pissed it for 2 years.
As I said in previous that you won't find many strikers like Martial because there are not many elite strikers who have attributes like Martial, it'd be difficult to find them when many of them are already at top clubs. If Martial developed killer instinct and score more scrappy goal in box, he will be scoring more goal as long as we give him better service
Selling Lukaku doesn't seem so bad, Lukaku scored 16 goals for us in his first season and Martial is 2 goals away from equaling Lukaku's tally goal with 7 games left. Martial have a lot of things in his game to offer more than Lukaku would for us.
I still think we need a new different striker who can help us out when we chase for a goal.
As I said in previous that you won't find many strikers like Martial because there are not many elite strikers who have attributes like Martial, it'd be difficult to find them when many of them are already at top clubs. If Martial developed killer instinct and score more scrappy goal in box, he will be scoring more goal as long as we give him better service
Selling Lukaku doesn't seem so bad, Lukaku scored 16 goals for us in his first season and Martial is 2 goals away from equaling Lukaku's tally goal with 7 games left. Martial have a lot of things in his game to offer more than Lukaku would for us.
I still think we need a new different striker who can help us out when we chase for a goal.
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When it comes to Martial, people just ignore the context and continue to go with just raw numbers. People go on and on about how he didn't more goals in the past when he was playing around 50% of the available mins. So he used to score at least 20 goals + assists in 50% of the mins but somehow people blamed him for lack of end product.
C'mon man, how can you say that Ighalo is better in bringing others into play? It's just not true.
Anthony Martial Has Been Class in 2020
He's miles better than Ighalo. If anything, Ighalo just lacks skills to make some of these passes.
And Martial's hold-up play is far better than people give him credit for.
Ofcurse you doCare to add what you think Martial's best position or skill set is or are you just going to jump in mid-conversation with nothing to add?
Every player’s game becomes limited when playing out of position, as we could tell Martial was under Mourinho. However, surely a player as talented as Martial must make those runs in behind even from the wing.
Take this for example, last season when Shaqiri started on the right for the Scousers, Firmino moved to #10 and Salah went up top. Of course, this was an opposite scenario, but Salah, who we need Martial to at least match (well on his way though) to become title contenders again, continued his regular runs in behind and kept plundering goals.
No because players aren't robots they have a certain environment where they are comfortable and that's generally it because it takes years of training and repetitions generally during their teenage at academy level. Some players are able to adapt and change but most don't, regardless of their level. And you can use Klose as an example:
Over the years Martial improved on the left but he isn't the same player than centrally and maybe with a lot more time he would have become good enough but that's not a given.
. Some say he was monitoring their breathing too, just to see whether Tony remained calm or if he in fact, snatched at his chance due to panic.I honestly didn't notice it was him and thought some of these moves was Pogba because my stream was not so clear. Anyways his strength has always been dropping deep, getting the ball on his feet and linking up play. It's a joy to watch when he's on form. He has chemistry with some of our players - Rashford, Bruno, Pogba and Mata. Or maybe he just likes being around good players.
If we were using him sort of like a false 9 or a second striker I would say all he needs to do is find consistency and he would be class. But he should be leading the line because he's one of the best finishers. So I think he needs to get better at positioning and have that appetite for goals. He showed this in the Sheffield game so he's definitely improving.
People including me don't rate him yet as a United striker quality compared to what we've had but when you perform consistently people's perception would change and he would start looking like a name that can be placed alongside Van Nistelrooy, RVP, Rooney etc. Wish him the best
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He's begun to do things which are not natural to him, such as getting in the 6 yard area, and if he can turn that into a habit he will score so many goals, and it's then worth having a right-footed player like James on the right sometimes because he will have someone to finish moves when he gets down the line, so it improves others too. I just want Martial to be looking constantly to score by being in good areas. He drifts out too much, it's not as effective, to be Man Utd's centre forward he needs to be a goal machine and I think he's getting it now that he has a manager playing him in his proper position, and a manager who can give him useful advice on the art of goal-scoring. Mourinho destroyed Martial's development, delighted for him now.
I think he needs to be abit more selfish.
Signing Sancho is mandatory.
A front three of Sancho-Martial-Rashford (with Bruno right behind) + James and Greenwood as reliable subs/competition would work to challenge for Top3.
A front three of Sancho-Martial-Rashford (with Bruno right behind) + James and Greenwood as reliable subs/competition would work to challenge for Top3.
Time to bump it again?
Improve on James and I agree
This guy is going to be a star!!!
How old is he now?