Has Maguire/Murtough fecked our chances up/made it harder for top 5?

Skills said:
We finished 3rd last season and have spent another £150m on the squad. The 3 teams behind us haven't spent as much.

If we fail to finish top 4, it wouldn't be because of the lack of spending.
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How about that team that finished 12th though...
 
Christ on a bike, the knee jerk reactions on this forum are insane. We lost the first 2 games last season and finished 3rd. We won our first game this season, so we are already in a better position.
 
Chairman Steve said:
I’d blame Woodward for allowing these ridiculous contracts in the first place and the Glazers for not coughing up the money to pay him off.
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This .. This .. This...
All day every day... The real culprit is Ed Woodward and the Glazers for allowing these silly contracts with ludicrus wages to drag down the players resell value. Absolute shit deals and we will deal with this fallout for at least another season.
 
Aretak said:
That's ignoring Chelsea though. If they don't at least make the top four this season after the money they've spent, it'll be one of the biggest failures in the history of football.
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It will happen though. They still don't even have that good of a squad after all that ridiculous money. Our first 11 is better than their first 11, which they probably won't even know what is their best for ages yet anyway. Next season will be when they are much better.
 
Maguire is 5th choice and unlikely to play many games so he shouldn’t have much of an impact. We would also have at best been breaking even on FFP terms on his transfer as well.

The biggest mistake is not selling Mctominay, can debate all day about how good/bad he is but anything he contributes on the pitch is insignificant compared to benefit of his fee being pure profit. Not selling Henderson compounds that as well.
 
We will be okay, either way. This is a better squad than last season. I'm not saying last season was all sweetness and light, much of the time we didn't play extremely well - but we got the job of a respectable finish and being in contention for silverware done. This squad is undoubtedly stronger with a better goalkeeper and an out and out striker that isn't called Wout Weghorst. We can all have opinions on Hojlund and whether he's ready but he offers much more hope than last season's strikeforce did, even if it is hope at this stage. Mount was a strange one, I think many are scratching their heads on including myself but he'll improve from what he has shown in preseason and one football match.

We're not ready to compete for titles. Maybe we could, should be - but we simply ain't due to the standards required for that. We are spending money but everyone spends money, there is nothing unique in what we do compared to the old days. So I think it is going to be incremental progress. If you're panicking because we didn't get rid of Maguire for Pavard because you think it secures a title shot etc, well, back to reality I think. This season will be another scrap and that's where we're at.
 
Given how often our players slip on the field, the kitman is absolutely to blame. Completely inept at his job.

Quite disappointed Fletcher, his sons, and the kitman have not been included in OP’s witch hunt.
 
Dion said:
We agreed to pay Maguire what we did, there's nothing greedy about a man wanting his contract honoured.
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… also, the man has never done anything of note to fulfill his part of the contract and actually be a player who’s worth even half of what we paid/pay him.

Works both ways, but a contract is sadly a contract. We can blame Woodward for this one.
 
Would rather keep Maguire than have Pavard in all honesty.
Wages would probably be similar and in my opinion Pavard isn't that much of an improvement on Maguire.

Maguire wanting money that's essentially owed to him isn't being greedy, also it appears that the decision makers at the club didn't really mind keeping him anyhow.

But I guess we can always blame the other scapegoats Mount and McTominay.
 
I mean, its not really Maguire's fault that the club has managed its transfer/wage finances badly. It's not really Murtough's fault either. He's still battling with the mess left by Woodward.

I think it would have been better for Maguire to move on for all parties if he found the right club, but if United are paying him something stupid that he wont get elsewhere, and the alternative is West Ham/David Moyes, then if I was him I wouldn't exactly be rushing out the door either.
 
ROFLUTION said:
… also, the man has never done anything of note to fulfill his part of the contract and actually be a player who’s worth even half of what we paid/pay him.

Works both ways, but a contract is sadly a contract. We can blame Woodward for this one.
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He played almost every game for 2 years and has been available for selection far more than most players. This is nonsense.
 
Champ said:
Would rather keep Maguire than have Pavard in all honesty.
Wages would probably be similar and in my opinion Pavard isn't that much of an improvement on Maguire.

Maguire wanting money that's essentially owed to him isn't being greedy, also it appears that the decision makers at the club didn't really mind keeping him anyhow.

But I guess we can always blame the other scapegoats Mount and McTominay.
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Fully agree Maguire hasn't done anything wrong, and at the end of the day the alternative is West Ham. I mean I'd ask for compensation to go and play for them too.....but wouldn't exactly say the decision makers are happy to keep him. He's had the captaincy taken off him and then the club agreed a fee with another club to sell him. Kind of like saying to a lodger "I'm happy for you to stay, but I have moved Bruno into your room so you'd have to sleep in the cupboard, also there's a taxi outside that I've paid to take you away to this other person's house I found"
 
noodlehair said:
I mean, its not really Maguire's fault that the club has managed its transfer/wage finances badly. It's not really Murtough's fault either. He's still battling with the mess left by Woodward.

I think it would have been better for Maguire to move on for all parties if he found the right club, but if United are paying him something stupid that he wont get elsewhere, and the alternative is West Ham/David Moyes, then if I was him I wouldn't exactly be rushing out the door either.
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Annoys me when people go on about players being on ridiculous wages which is why they won’t move to another club. Even when they move club they’ll still be on thousands a week and getting more game time. They need to take a look at them selves and think about people that do 12 hour shifts or people that work for minimum wage and struggle to get by. Pure greed in football and I think they should put a cap on wages and stuff and give bonuses due to performances… maybe we’ll see decent games then.
 
I wasnt on about Maguire the player here I was on about the fee for him and Mctom would have enabled us to bring in Amrabat at least as we all saw the gaping hole in midfield. We finished 2nd under Mourinho and 2nd, 3rd under Ole. Why do you think that means anything for the season after?
 
Dion said:
He played almost every game for 2 years and has been available for selection far more than most players. This is nonsense.
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Any regular player could do this. Doesnt take 80m to be just available and not perform. He has underperformed big time, there’s no other way around it.
 
Maguire isn't at fault for this, but his refusal to move on isn't going to be good for either party. It's very frustrating.
 
wolvored said:
Looking back to last week when we were moving on Maguire and Pavard and especially Amrabat were coming in, to now where its looking bleak. Maguires greediness and Murtough not pushing him and McTom for £60 mill to West Ham, could have seen us swapping those two with much better players.
After the Wanderers game and the way they just ran through the centre midfield, shows we need reinforcements in that area badly.
If we play like we did last week we will lose more than we win. Do you see any light at the end of the tunnel? Will Mainoo and Gore have to step up, with no real proof they can, apart from a couple of pre season games?
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Swapping those with much better players? What makes you believe it?
The prices you saw from any tweet are simply garbage. If we bid, the price will double at least. We most likely end up with nobody or some stop-gap loan signings again.
 
Let's hope Maguire is not on this forum. These threads blaming the guy for everything wrong with the club are just going to make him dig in his heels even more.
 
Harry and Scott not getting moved this window has killed our chances for Amrabat and Pavard... we are truly fecked now. Pray for top 4 again I guess...
 
Skills said:
We finished 3rd last season and have spent another £150m on the squad. The 3 teams behind us haven't spent as much.

If we fail to finish top 4, it wouldn't be because of the lack of spending.
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Kaos said:
If we feck up getting into the top 4 this season then that'll be down to ETH and Arnold/Glazers for not bringing in the right players. Not because Slabhead decides he wants to sit on the bench and collect an inflated paycheck.
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GazTheLegend said:
@wolvored you are on one here. We finished 3rd last season and Maguire wasn't even a first XI player anymore, and since then we've added a striker, a goalkeeper and a midfielder. If anything having Maguire as a backup CB improves our chances.
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Just a selection of people who are missing the point that if we’d sold Maguire and McTominay we’d have been able to bring in two more players who are infinitely more suited to what we need. Now, we are not many injuries or tired players from having to start Maguire and McTominay.
 
Sparky Rhiwabon said:
Just a selection of people who are missing the point that if we’d sold Maguire and McTominay we’d have been able to bring in two more players who are infinitely more suited to what we need. Now, we are not many injuries or tired players from having to start Maguire and McTominay.
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That is speculation at best. West Ham claim they never made a bid for McTominay and the fee that was agreed for Maguire would have resulted in at best a tiny profit on the accounts due to amoritization. I am not convinced our owners would have sanctioned a replacement for Maguire anyway and when you see what Bayern are now asking for Pavard it is clear that the belief he could be bought on the cheap was very much misplaced.

Selling Scott could finance a move for a new midfielder but who knows if they would actually be a better fit for the team that what we currently have. We are relying on the same crack recruitment team that delivered Wout Weghorst, Tyrell Malacia and Antony and expecting them to get it right, not something I would be willing to bet on.
 
The Urban Goose said:
Top 5? Am I missing something?
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The Swiss Model is coming in:

Two places are reserved for the clubs with the highest UEFA coefficient who fail to qualify for the Champions League. However, the club must have qualified for the Europa League or the Europa Conference League.
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I think this means if Brighton finish 5th, they probably won't get in the CL because their UEFA coefficient is too low.

But if Liverpool or United finished 5th, they would qualify because their coefficients would be amongst the highest of all the other non-qualifiers in Europe.
 
Sparky Rhiwabon said:
Just a selection of people who are missing the point that if we’d sold Maguire and McTominay we’d have been able to bring in two more players who are infinitely more suited to what we need. Now, we are not many injuries or tired players from having to start Maguire and McTominay.
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That's jumping to a LOT of conclusions. For a start the thread doesn't even mention McTominay. And it assumes that we couldn't or won't buy those players anyway.

That said, transfer deadline day hasn't passed yet and I can imagine there's more twists and turns on the player sales/signings front.
 
Devil You Know said:
The Swiss Model is coming in:



I think this means if Brighton finish 5th, they probably won't get in the CL because their UEFA coefficient is too low.

But if Liverpool or United finished 5th, they would qualify because their coefficients would be amongst the highest of all the other non-qualifiers in Europe.
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That's wildly unfair but it makes sense as per UEFA avoiding the super League
 
Is this equivalent to “are we going to get relegated” thread of last year? If yes then we have already made progress under ETH
 
Sparky Rhiwabon said:
Just a selection of people who are missing the point that if we’d sold Maguire and McTominay we’d have been able to bring in two more players who are infinitely more suited to what we need. Now, we are not many injuries or tired players from having to start Maguire and McTominay.
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Cheers for understanding what point I was making.
 
GazTheLegend said:
That's jumping to a LOT of conclusions. For a start the thread doesn't even mention McTominay. And it assumes that we couldn't or won't buy those players anyway.

That said, transfer deadline day hasn't passed yet and I can imagine there's more twists and turns on the player sales/signings front.
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It does.
 
The clubs activity in the transfer market is always restricted by the glazers. Getting rid of the so called deadwood is very difficult once talk moves to compensation/payoffs.

I'm sure EtH would love to bin half a dozen players and get some good quality squad players in...but that's not possible with the current owners.

Sadly the reality is spending £100-150 million every summer in the premier league doesn't even guarantee you stay still.
 
Devil You Know said:
The Swiss Model is coming in:



I think this means if Brighton finish 5th, they probably won't get in the CL because their UEFA coefficient is too low.

But if Liverpool or United finished 5th, they would qualify because their coefficients would be amongst the highest of all the other non-qualifiers in Europe.
Click to expand...

If the English clubs in all three European competitions gather enough points to have the nation's overall coefficient among the top two by the end of the (single) season, the 5th club on the the PL's final table will qualify for next season's CL. Whether that club is United, Chelsea or Luton is of no significance. What you quoted was the initial proposal that got scrapped because most FAs were against it.
 
Gandalf said:
That is speculation at best. West Ham claim they never made a bid for McTominay and the fee that was agreed for Maguire would have resulted in at best a tiny profit on the accounts due to amoritization. I am not convinced our owners would have sanctioned a replacement for Maguire anyway and when you see what Bayern are now asking for Pavard it is clear that the belief he could be bought on the cheap was very much misplaced.

Selling Scott could finance a move for a new midfielder but who knows if they would actually be a better fit for the team that what we currently have. We are relying on the same crack recruitment team that delivered Wout Weghorst, Tyrell Malacia and Antony and expecting them to get it right, not something I would be willing to bet on.
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Exaxtly. All the players being linked as the replacement for McTominey and Maguire are at best... backups. I might be a little more annoyed if they were supposed to finance a replacement for Casemiro or Varane. But, that's not the case.
 
Skills said:
We finished 3rd last season and have spent another £150m on the squad. The 3 teams behind us haven't spent as much.

If we fail to finish top 4, it wouldn't be because of the lack of spending.
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We finished 3rd but that was very lucky

Joint 7th in goals scored.

6th in goal difference.

When you win games 3-0 you can afford the odd thing going wrong. When you win 1-0 or 2-1 small hiccups ruin your day.

We were just about getting through matches last season.

The team that scores the most goals usually wins the league

We'll finish 5th or 6th this year
 
baskinginthesun said:
Exaxtly. All the players being linked as the replacement for McTominey and Maguire are at best... backups. I might be a little more annoyed if they were supposed to finance a replacement for Casemiro or Varane. But, that's not the case.
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But much better back ups than Maguire and McT. Back ups end up playing at the end of the day
 
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