Fecking hell, just knew it in an instant that idiots somehow would blame him for Henderson's goal. Goalies these days should be able to pick a pass 100/100 times in situations like that. It was a simple pass to Lindelof, or he could have just booted it the feck out. It's like blaming Telles for making the tackle that led to the corner and that second goal.
5
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He was charged down because he dithered on it too long, that’s painfully obvious to see. Keepers are expected to deal with far worse than that, and rightly so.
“clever”.
And yeah, 99 times out of 100 hundred and the next 99 times, Henderson takes a touch and clears. He doesn’t need to be Leo fecking Messi.
Is it screenshot time yet to show up this utter idiotic idea that Maguire was somehow partially at fault? Let see how impossible it was for Dean to touch and clear.
“clever”.
And yeah, 99 times out of 100 hundred and the next 99 times, Henderson takes a touch and clears. He doesn’t need to be Leo fecking Messi.
Is it screenshot time yet to show up this utter idiotic idea that Maguire was somehow partially at fault? Let see how impossible it was for Dean to touch and clear.
But there were other options instead of the keeper as he got the ball. Why choose the keeper when he knew there was a man on the keeper? The danger was higher than normal.
Anyway there's no need for a screenshot, there's a whole video on it a few pages up. I didn't know about that video though, I had the same opinion even before I saw that.
He's not a leader. He is not a bad defender, just needs to read the game better.
Why? Because Dean had two passes on or a clearance...
This screenshot is AFTER his touch:
He had a chance to Matic to play a triangle with Maguire, Pogba (worst choice), or clear upfield, he took another second to think, then opted for Pogba (worst) choice.
The next 99 times he plays Matic, Matic plays Maguire, forward looks an idiot and is completely out of the play and we move upfield.
That screenshot actually shows that Henderson was in no way in a posture ready to kick the ball with his right foot before Burke got to him. Could be a bad first touch I don't know, but the point is why put him under that sort of pressure in the first place.
He had three passes on. Could have just rolled it to Lindelof down the line as well. There's really no exuse for a professional goalkeeper to feck it up in a situation like this.
What? He can make that Matic pass with ease.
Just look at the space Harry has ... If the plan from Harry was to get Henderson to boot it up, he should have cleared it up himself. Henderson should have whacked it upfield and that was his mistake but then the pass from Harry was pointless to say the least.
No he can't do anything with his right he's leaning all his weight on it. You have to keep in mind that it takes Burke less than half a sec to cover the remaining distance to the keeper so he has no time to adjust.
Regardless of the minute detail, any time there's a man on the keeper it's never a safe pass for me.
I totally agree, if he wanted Henderson to take a touch and boot it he should have taken that responsibility himself.
Exactly, of course Henderson should have dealt with it better. But that backpass was just as bad call from our captain.
Decent performance bar their goal, but more importantly, does absolutely nil as captain of this team.
If anything, the armband is a fashionable item more than anything else.
If anything, the armband is a fashionable item more than anything else.
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You seem to be ignoring the fact the body doesn't work like lines drawn on an image. He has to move his feet to adjust to the ball, and Burke was at full pelt.Why? Because Dean had two passes on or a clearance...
This screenshot is AFTER his touch:
He had a chance to Matic to play a triangle with Maguire, Pogba (worst choice), or clear upfield, he took another second to think, then opted for Pogba (worst) choice.
The next 99 times he plays Matic, Matic plays Maguire, forward looks an idiot and is completely out of the play and we move upfield.
What happened there is exactly why the ball to the keeper was never on. The keeper could very well deal with it, but it is too risky. There's every chance the ball doesn't arrive in a way that allows a quick clearance, and that puts the keeper in a duel with the man on, right in front of the goal.
Henderson's error is so magnified that it is easy to point the finger at him and rightly so, but Maguire should not be making that pass.
Back to the mean.
Should have done better on the Hendo one. He did have better options.
Captaincy seems muted.
Defending better.
Overall, needed but much improvement to come.
Should have done better on the Hendo one. He did have better options.
Captaincy seems muted.
Defending better.
Overall, needed but much improvement to come.
Why? Because Dean had two passes on or a clearance...
This screenshot is AFTER his touch:
He had a chance to Matic to play a triangle with Maguire, Pogba (worst choice), or clear upfield, he took another second to think, then opted for Pogba (worst) choice.
The next 99 times he plays Matic, Matic plays Maguire, forward looks an idiot and is completely out of the play and we move upfield.
Any chance you have a screenshot that shows Maguire receiving the ball facing Henderson and playing it straight back? When he should actually be on the half turn and ready to keep the ball moving out to Telles or playing it forward himself.
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If Maguire wasn't such a right footed player could have easily avoided this. He stops the ball with his left foot and has vision on the left side
Stupid mistake from him too for their first goal.
There's no one in our defence who takes command or has a composed presence about them and that's what keeps leading to goals like this.
It isn't specifically Maguire's fault but for £80m and being given the role of club captain, you'd expect a defender to be able to bring that to the table. Although saying that I struggle to think of many defenders at all who can bring that with them. Silva has a little bit at Chelsea but even so the only real difference to their defence is that they've stopped picking Kepa, and even then it's still a bit shtie. In the same way Maguire has more composure and presence than say, Jones, but setting the bar that low doesn't really solve the problem.
I don't mean that as a criticism specifically of Maguire either. Just generally where I think our defence is at. Most of them I think would look ok if there was a leader back there to instill some actual confidence and make us more pro-active. At the moment we back off and back off and hesitate and hesitate and then inevitably in nearly every game, something stupid happens.
It isn't specifically Maguire's fault but for £80m and being given the role of club captain, you'd expect a defender to be able to bring that to the table. Although saying that I struggle to think of many defenders at all who can bring that with them. Silva has a little bit at Chelsea but even so the only real difference to their defence is that they've stopped picking Kepa, and even then it's still a bit shtie. In the same way Maguire has more composure and presence than say, Jones, but setting the bar that low doesn't really solve the problem.
I don't mean that as a criticism specifically of Maguire either. Just generally where I think our defence is at. Most of them I think would look ok if there was a leader back there to instill some actual confidence and make us more pro-active. At the moment we back off and back off and hesitate and hesitate and then inevitably in nearly every game, something stupid happens.
How is Maguire at fault for that goal? Any goalkeeper worth their salt clears it within an instant or widens their body to make a quick 1 touch pass. Maybe Maguire shouldn't pass back but that doesn't make him culpable.
I thought he was fine today, and miles better than Lindelof who had an absolute mare. Against the worst team it in the league. Realise that's probably unpopular opinion, but didn't really do much wrong imo.
He's our only defender who can head the ball, which seems a pretty big problem.
He's our only defender who can head the ball, which seems a pretty big problem.
The gif posted shows that Henderson had plenty of time. He dawdled - probably through nerves early on. You can possibly say that Maguire should have maybe taken that into account early on in the match but, in general terms, there was nothing wrong with his pass back to Hendo. Really isn’t anything to blame him for here.
Can't see how that's a mistake. Sure it's not a good pass, but the keeper should be clearing it or moving it on to someone else quickly - he had enough time.
I'm interested in how Sheffield scored from a corner though with their man beating both our CBs to score.
I'm interested in how Sheffield scored from a corner though with their man beating both our CBs to score.
One of the united biggest issue with ball retention is the careless nature of our passing. Most of the time, the player passing is just happy that their pass reaches their intended target. They dont care about how the person has to deal with it.
Theres a video of Xavi talking about how he memorised how each of his team Spanish mates liked to receive the ball. Its that kind of attention to detail that we just dont have.
I'm honestly not sure, I actually think it might come down to Deano not playing the ball to Harry in the first place, once he did harry should have been adjusting his body better to play it to Telles or Matic, but maybe he's thinking Deano is readier than he was to receive the ball back.
I'm critical of everyone, and take no sides, and I honestly think it's one of those things, that we have to work on it on the training ground, and make sure to keep an eye on to see if it happens again.
I'm critical of everyone, and take no sides, and I honestly think it's one of those things, that we have to work on it on the training ground, and make sure to keep an eye on to see if it happens again.
The issue with Maguire is the perception of who he is and it is that he's identified as a leader. Thus far his performances and conduct to organise the defence has been appalling. I will not denote him to the extent to say he's a bad player as that's simply not true but if the club thought the defence was sorted for the next few years they are clearly mistaken. He needs to be the worse off between his central defensive partner, meaning, we need to buy a better centre half to play alongside him to solidify the back line. It's no different to VVD along with a Matip the class of one defender will eradicate the insufficiencies of another.
The issue we have is mobility and whoever is purchased needs to be mobile enough to track the movement that Maguire is often incapable of coping with which narrows down the parameters.
The issue we have is mobility and whoever is purchased needs to be mobile enough to track the movement that Maguire is often incapable of coping with which narrows down the parameters.
Why? Because Dean had two passes on or a clearance...
This screenshot is AFTER his touch:
He had a chance to Matic to play a triangle with Maguire, Pogba (worst choice), or clear upfield, he took another second to think, then opted for Pogba (worst) choice.
The next 99 times he plays Matic, Matic plays Maguire, forward looks an idiot and is completely out of the play and we move upfield.
The picture doesn't contrast the reality of the situation. Henderson's body language is inappropriate to spray a ball out to those players. The ball doesn't just float to a team mate he needs the relevant back-lift and spread in his kick to distance the pass. Add the fact that he's conscious from his peripheral view that an opposition player is quickly closing him its a unnecessary situation to be in from the jump.
Its another relevant example of poor judgement from Maguire, this is a question that highlights Harry's poor choice who put Henderson under more pressure the pass from Harry or the player closing him down ? It's common cause and effect. I'm bemused at fans sugarcoating his terrible form. If Pogba has been considered a failure given his profile and price tag, Maguire is fast becoming the latest example because he's awfully inconsistent.
How the feck is it Maguire's fault?
Henderson was too lax and it was a bad first touch to stop the ball, should move the ball away to the right and pass. Simple.
If you're a professional goalkeeper and cannot spatially sense where his other CB is (Lindelof) it's the bigger issue.
It was a disaster the second he got that ball he should already know he can pass it to the Lindelof who opened the other side of the field! Instead of taking his time and looking at his other options besides Lindelof.
Henderson was too lax and it was a bad first touch to stop the ball, should move the ball away to the right and pass. Simple.
If you're a professional goalkeeper and cannot spatially sense where his other CB is (Lindelof) it's the bigger issue.
It was a disaster the second he got that ball he should already know he can pass it to the Lindelof who opened the other side of the field! Instead of taking his time and looking at his other options besides Lindelof.
It was super stupid and so unimaginative for Maguire to back pass to keeper in that situation. Once again shows we were just mugged with all the overhype in media.
But that goal is entirely on Henderson. He had ample time to clear it long, in worst situation. But he couldn't make up his mind, and made an absolute mess of it at the end.
But that goal is entirely on Henderson. He had ample time to clear it long, in worst situation. But he couldn't make up his mind, and made an absolute mess of it at the end.
The problem is that the minute Ole gave him the captaincy he became undroppable in his eyes
No one is saying it's completely Maguire's fault. Henderson indeed made the error. The thing is Maguire should learn to not pass the ball to the keeper there, especially to feet.
Everyone keep saying Henderson had plenty of time to clear, making it a reasonable pass by Maguire, but what they seem to ignore is that Burke was accelerating. He approached Maguire at much less speed and didn't break a stride before approaching Henderson. He was going to be at top speed by the time he got to Henderson.
Henderson had to wait for the ball, and since he is a right-footer, he had to wait for the ball to move across him as well. Burke barely needed half a second to close the gap by the time the ball got to him. He needed the ball to arrive perfectly for him to clear, or otherwise, a perfect touch to get the ball out of his feet. Neither happened, and it's a goal everyday. That is what Maguire didn't consider, the margin for error was too small.
This doesn't absolve Henderson of course, shit happens, but it was dumb and school boy from Maguire to say the least. He had cover from Henderson, but Henderson had no cover. You don't pass the ball to feet for the keeper right on the goal mouth with a man on. He had to go wide.
Glad it didn't cost us at the end, and hope it doesn't affect Henderson as well.
I get that, but there are some posters here claiming it was his fault for doing that pass.
I totally disagree, if we're committed with building from the back, they have to do that. Regardless of what foot Henderson favours he shouldn't make that error.
Henderson obviously made by far the biggest mistake and rightfully takes the blame for the goal.
That doesn't mean it wasn't poor play from Maguire as well. His positioning wasn't great, his decision to take a touch and come back inside was wrong (the main thing he did wrong) and he was quite slow to actually make the pass which allowed the attacker to get closer to him and Henderson. If you want to be harsh the pass also forced Henderson to take a touch instead of being slightly in front of him so he could hit it first time. That doesn't make the goal his fault - it wasn't. He put Henderson under unnecessary pressure but Henderson still should have done better so it ultimately comes back on him. That doesn't mean we should ignore the fact Maguire should have done better in that play.
That doesn't mean it wasn't poor play from Maguire as well. His positioning wasn't great, his decision to take a touch and come back inside was wrong (the main thing he did wrong) and he was quite slow to actually make the pass which allowed the attacker to get closer to him and Henderson. If you want to be harsh the pass also forced Henderson to take a touch instead of being slightly in front of him so he could hit it first time. That doesn't make the goal his fault - it wasn't. He put Henderson under unnecessary pressure but Henderson still should have done better so it ultimately comes back on him. That doesn't mean we should ignore the fact Maguire should have done better in that play.
But then you're asking from Henderson to do that? It's obviously Henderson's mistake first, but Maguire's decision to make that pass was a poor one, especially since he should know strengths and weaknesses of his partners (and we don't have Neuer or Chilavert in goal). The fact that someone else made a mistake (and, again, Henderson is mostly responsible for that goal) doesn't clear anyone else of blame.
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If Maguire wasn't such a right footed player could have easily avoided this. He stops the ball with his left foot and has vision on the left side
To me this is so basic, he should have opened his body up, controlled that on his left and turned out towards Telles. Henderson shouldn't take a touch liked that, he should also be on the half turn so he can turn out right and play it to Lindelof or AWB when he receives it.
Or he should put his boot through it and give Maguire an earful for playing that pass back in like that.
It's a much, much bigger problem than just "why can't maguire learn to pass", which is the typical idiotic take by some of the Caf. Our movement with the ball is generally rubbish in our half of the pitch, it's only when we get the ball to the attack-minded players further up the pitch that we seem to move it properly, and even then it's high-risk stuff with flicks and 1-2's.
Everyone in our squad is perfectly capable of passing the ball to another player, the problem at the back is that the number of passing options open to them rapidly decreases as soon as the opposition starts putting pressure on because we have no method of dealing with it. A lot of the time this results in panic at the back and either a hoof up field or a **** up.
The fact it was **** up, rather than hoof upfield, is entirely on Henderson in this instance.
He & Lindelöf are basically undroppable because they are our only center backs that can stay fit for more than 2 games in a row. I'm not a fan of his, but I don't see how you can complain about him playing when we literally have no other option (Tuanzebe is injured again, I think? I'm not even going to go into the Bailly/Jones/Rojo mess).
It’s calamitous from Henderson and Maguire. Both look like rabbits in a headlight popping it about in their own box..... and for what? It drives me crazy this nonsense.
Get yourself and the ball up the pitch away from trouble ASAP unless you do happen to have an outstanding ball playing GK and two centre halves of which we have none!!
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