[Dve]

I find it sort of strange how much he’s been criticized for his defensive faults this preseason. I’d be more surprised if he didn’t have defensive issues considering he’s 17 going up against senior attackers at big clubs.

Give me a prospect that has elite on ball ability going forward but some positioning flaws all day over some teenage defensive stalwart that panics on the ball at the senior level. The former can be taught and developed much easier than the latter

I think you are missing the point. The question is not if he's doing well for a 17 years old, the question is if he's ready to start games in the PL. The moment we concede goals because of his rawness, no one will say "oh, that's ok, he's only 17 years old".

 

[limerickcitykid]

I find it sort of strange how much he’s been criticized for his defensive faults this preseason. I’d be more surprised if he didn’t have defensive issues considering he’s 17 going up against senior attackers at big clubs.

Give me a prospect that has elite on ball ability going forward but some positioning flaws all day over some teenage defensive stalwart that panics on the ball at the senior level. The former can be taught and developed much easier than the latter

Tbf give me either of those options over shite like Wan-Bissaka who is poor in possession and oblivious to off the ball movement from opponents.

 

[Carl]

I think you are missing the point. The question is not if he's doing well for a 17 years old, the question is if he's ready to start games in the PL. The moment we concede goals because of his rawness, no one will say "oh, that's ok, he's only 17 years old".

Exactly. It's so high profile if you make a mistake for United. Especially if it leads to a goal or, worse, a defeat. He'd be slaughtered in the press and also on social media by "fans".

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

I think you are missing the point. The question is not if he's doing well for a 17 years old, the question is if he's ready to start games in the PL. The moment we concede goals because of his rawness, no one will say "oh, that's ok, he's only 17 years old".

Sure, but… did anyone really think he’s ready to start games in the PL? He’s not even going to turn 18 until the spring time and physically looks like it as well.

Like I was never watching Amass with a view of whether he could be our backup LB this year. Personally think that would be a bit pointless/wreckless given where he’s at in his development and how young he is. I was more interested to see his natural ability, and after watching I think it’s huge. Really impressive player.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

Tbf give me either of those options over shite like Wan-Bissaka who is poor in possession and oblivious to off the ball movement from opponents.

We are on the same page with that for sure

 

[Blood Mage]

I hope he continues this form and isn't just a pre-season Roberto Carlos.

 

[AltiUn]

Thing is, he went from defending against U23s to defending against Salah, who is a very tough customer. He was thrown into the deep end and swam like Michael Phelps. Expectations should be tempered, he will get opportunities, but I think we have bigger fish to fry than another fullback. Our midfield needs sorting, for instance, and while Højlund is injured we have zero goal scorers.

He wasn't even an U23 really, he's straight from the U18s.

 

[lex talionis]

I think you are missing the point. The question is not if he's doing well for a 17 years old, the question is if he's ready to start games in the PL. The moment we concede goals because of his rawness, no one will say "oh, that's ok, he's only 17 years old".

Let's explore this train of thought.

Say Amass does make a mistake, then what? Should we send him back to the U23 squad, never to be seen again this season? Martinez made some mistakes in his first few appearances for United, as did Evra and Vidic. Every young player, whether that young player is 22 or 17, has room to grow as a professional footballer and there's no better way to grow than to play.

If we're going to commit to a promising young player, he has to be given a chance to play and learn from his mistakes. That doesn't make him an automatic starter, but it does mean holding him to the same standard as everyone else. If he makes a mistake, don't fukk with his head by benching him for a long spell. If he makes a number of mistakes, then back to the bench behind whoever it needs to be or back to the U23. No double-standards for anyone is the only way we're going to progress as a squad.

 

[Dve]

Let's explore this train of thought.

Say Amass does make a mistake, then what? Should we send him back to the U23 squad, never to be seen again this season? Martinez made some mistakes in his first few appearances for United, as did Evra and Vidic. Every young player, whether that young player is 22 or 17, has room to grow as a professional footballer and there's no better way to grow than to play.

If we're going to commit to a promising young player, he has to be given a chance to play and learn from his mistakes. That doesn't make him an automatic starter, but it does mean holding him to the same standard as everyone else. If he makes a mistake, don't fukk with his head by benching him for a long spell. If he makes a number of mistakes, then back to the bench behind whoever it needs to be or back to the U23. No double-standards for anyone is the only way we're going to progress as a squad.

That's not the way Ten Hag operates. You don't get game time because you need to practise. You get game time because you are already good enough. You don't start a teenager if he's not ready - unless you want to destroy his confidence.

 

[Devil_forever]

If Amass can kick on (and Malacia recovers), we could move Shaw to CB.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Let's explore this train of thought.

Say Amass does make a mistake, then what? Should we send him back to the U23 squad, never to be seen again this season? Martinez made some mistakes in his first few appearances for United, as did Evra and Vidic. Every young player, whether that young player is 22 or 17, has room to grow as a professional footballer and there's no better way to grow than to play.

If we're going to commit to a promising young player, he has to be given a chance to play and learn from his mistakes. That doesn't make him an automatic starter, but it does mean holding him to the same standard as everyone else. If he makes a mistake, don't fukk with his head by benching him for a long spell. If he makes a number of mistakes, then back to the bench behind whoever it needs to be or back to the U23. No double-standards for anyone is the only way we're going to progress as a squad.

He is neither Evra, nor Vidic, he is a kid with zero experience at the senior level. Not even Fergie would just throw a 17 year old defender into the first team.

 

[lex talionis]

He is neither Evra, nor Vidic, he is a kid with zero experience at the senior level. Not even Fergie would just throw a 17 year old defender into the first team.

No, he's not Evra or Vidic, the latter being the PL POY twice and I hold no expectation that he will ever reach Vidic's level. But the point is that we can't put him on so short a leash that he's banished if he makes a single mistake. Every player makes mistakes. Ronaldo at 18 was brilliant for his age but a mess with the ball with his wild crosses and overly elaborate stepovers but Ferguson let him flourish and the rest is history.

And no, Harry Amass is no Cristiano Ronaldo.

 

[mu4c_20le]

No, he's not Evra or Vidic, the latter being the PL POY twice and I hold no expectation that he will ever reach Vidic's level. But the point is that we can't put him on so short a leash that he's banished if he makes a single mistake. Every player makes mistakes. Ronaldo at 18 was brilliant for his age but a mess with the ball with his wild crosses and overly elaborate stepovers but Ferguson let him flourish and the rest is history.

And no, Harry Amass is no Cristiano Ronaldo.

My concern with those mistakes is that if they start costing us points, then we can no longer afford to keep playing him. I'm trying to think of exceptions where a teenage defender gets lots of minutes at a top club. The club itself has to be stable enough to afford these opportunities, ie city

 

[Jerom]

Of ETH thinks he's ready, then I think he's ready.

 

[TwoSheds]

My concern with those mistakes is that if they start costing us points, then we can no longer afford to keep playing him. I'm trying to think of exceptions where a teenage defender gets lots of minutes at a top club. The club itself has to be stable enough to afford these opportunities, ie city

Luke Shaw...ok Mourinho fecked with him later on but he got loads of minutes as a teenager. He was always solidly built of course.

 

[lex talionis]

My concern with those mistakes is that if they start costing us points, then we can no longer afford to keep playing him. I'm trying to think of exceptions where a teenage defender gets lots of minutes at a top club. The club itself has to be stable enough to afford these opportunities, ie city

Let’s say a single mistake by Amass costs us two points, a win to a draw. Do we immediately send Amass back to the U23? If the answer is yes, do we hold other players to the same standard?

 

[FlyingTrotter]

He will get minutes now we have Malacia and Shaw both out for start of season - may see Dalot start on Friday as LB and the new boy MazR in as RB but Amass has an opening

 

[saik]

He will definitely be getting some minutes in some cup games and Europa games. It is too soon for him as I felt he could do with another year of development before being thrust into the senior team but such is our dire situation at LB with a couple of perma crocks in there.

 

[Remember the geese]

I wouldn't invest in a left back. Until Shaw returns, I'd use Amass as deputy to Mazraoui. I have a strong belief that this kid will be our left back long term.

 

[saik]

I wouldn't invest in a left back. Until Shaw returns, I'd use Amass as deputy to Mazraoui. I have a strong belief that this kid will be our left back long term.

I believe that too but we have to get another as we need 2 good options for each position. It's the way to go forward as City have already shown and Arsenal are on the way doing the same.

 

[ThanksBoss26]

I wouldn't invest in a left back. Until Shaw returns, I'd use Amass as deputy to Mazraoui. I have a strong belief that this kid will be our left back long term.

Agreed, just seems like the view is it's at least a few months/a season too soon. Why I can see us going for a short term or even loan left back signing.

 

[Remember the geese]

I believe that too but we have to get another as we need 2 good options for each position. It's the way to go forward as City have already shown and Arsenal are on the way doing the same.

I wouldn't want to block Amass' path. Our four fullbacks can be Shaw, Amass, Dalot and Mazraoui.

 

[Remember the geese]

Agreed, just seems like the view is it's at least a few months/a season too soon. Why I can see us going for a short term or even loan left back signing.

Wouldn't be completely against a short term loan. Though would much prefer it if we used Amass as cover for Mazraoui, until Shaw returns.

 

[saik]

I wouldn't want to block Amass' path. Our four fullbacks can be Shaw, Amass, Dalot and Mazraoui.

I'm not counting Shaw here, so yea we need another. Dalot and Mazraoui for the right, Amass and someone else for the left.

 

[Remember the geese]

I'm not counting Shaw here, so yea we need another. Dalot and Mazraoui for the right, Amass and someone else for the left.

Shaw is only out for a few weeks though.

 

[MDFC Manager]

Shaw is only out for a few weeks though.

To be fair, we've heard that before. Didn't always turn out that way.

 

[saik]

Shaw is only out for a few weeks though.

Yea but we can't rely on him. What good is he if he's only available for 15 games a season? So yea, in my opinion we should look into replacing him as our top priority next summer.

 

[dubplate warrior]

Shaw is only out for a few weeks though.

He's too unreliable over the course of a season.

 

[Remember the geese]

To be fair, we've heard that before. Didn't always turn out that way.

I think we will need to think very carefully about what type of left back we wish to pursue long term. For example, I'm not so sure how smart it would be to go for an 'all bells and whistles' Theo Hernandez type when we have Harry Amass waiting in the wings.

 

[BabySinclair]

I wouldn't want to block Amass' path. Our four fullbacks can be Shaw, Amass, Dalot and Mazraoui.

Dalot and Mazraoui are fine for a couple of matches but we need the overlapping and crossing from a real left-back.

You can't trust Shaw to stay fit!!!

Who knows what happens with Malacia.

The stupid Martinez experiment must stop too.

Either we trust Amass or we must sign a new left-back!!!

 

[Remember the geese]

Yea but we can't rely on him. What good is he if he's only available for 15 games a season? So yea, in my opinion we should look into replacing him as our top priority next summer.

I'm fine with replacing Shaw, but not with someone who will block Harry Amass.

 

[MDFC Manager]

I think we will need to think very carefully about what type of left back we wish to pursue long term. For example, I'm not so sure how smart it would be to go for an 'all bells and whistles' Theo Hernandez type when we have Harry Amass waiting in the wings.

Oh I agree with you. I'm ok with the current situation as is, not particularly burning to add an LB.

 

[saik]

I'm fine with replacing Shaw, but not with someone who will block Harry Amass.

Yea someone like Ferdi who can cover multiple positions to a high level or a better version of Hermoso who can play at CB too. City do just fine with Ake and Gvardiol. It doesn't necessarily need to be someone to block Amass's path but to compete with him.

 

[Bondi77]

I wouldn't want to block Amass' path. Our four fullbacks can be Shaw, Amass, Dalot and Mazraoui.

That is plenty.

 

[AjaxCunian]

I'm fine with replacing Shaw, but not with someone who will block Harry Amass.

Why? Just like players blocking Rashford? Or Januzaj? Or Welbeck? We'll never win stuff with that mindset, if he's good enough he will be able to fight for a place. I see the same happening with Mainoo, because of Mainoo don't sign a metronome midfielder..

One thing I hope, is that Amass doesn't keep Shaw as his example. It's time to get an actual world class LB who performs over the course of a season at the club. Theo Hernandez would be a dream signing next summer.

 

[ThanksBoss26]

I think we will need to think very carefully about what type of left back we wish to pursue long term. For example, I'm not so sure how smart it would be to go for an 'all bells and whistles' Theo Hernandez type when we have Harry Amass waiting in the wings.

I'd imagine the club will be of that exact mindset. If, and I'm not convinced we will, we do add another I think it will be a loan or squad player on a 1/2 year deal.

 

[Kostov]

Play the kid, he’s ready.

 

[Remember the geese]

Why? Just like players blocking Rashford? Or Januzaj? Or Welbeck? We'll never win stuff with that mindset, if he's good enough he will be able to fight for a place. I see the same happening with Mainoo, because of Mainoo don't sign a metronome midfielder..

One thing I hope, is that Amass doesn't keep Shaw as his example. It's time to get an actual world class LB who performs over the course of a season at the club. Theo Hernandez would be a dream signing next summer.

No, that is completely the wrong approach. You don't sign De Jong when you already have Mainoo and you don't sign Theo Hernandez when you have Amass. If we wish to sell Shaw, he should be replaced by a player who isn't going to block Amass' opportunity to a future with us. It's sensible long term planning.

 

[AjaxCunian]

That is plenty.

Two of them not left backs. Though they can do a job

No, that is completely the wrong approach. You don't sign De Jong when you already have Mainoo and you don't sign Theo Hernandez when you have Amass. If we wish to sell Shaw, he should be replaced by a player who isn't going to block Amass' opportunity to a future with us. It's sensible long term planning.

It is what stops you from competing. You'd stop signing Odegaard because of Emile Smith-Rowe. Amass is far away, maybe even years away and might never be good enough. You don't gamble the future because of him, if he's good enough he will play.
If not (which is quite likely looking at even the recent top prospects who have never made the step to become genuinely world class), you buy a player who can be.

Huge fan of Mainoo, and he was a ray of light in a dark season but he's nowhere near top class or world class yet. If we spend the coming years waving away every midfield signing because of him, we could be in for a huge shock.

However good he may be on the ball in his dribbling, short link-up play, there's a plethora of midfield aspects that he's not up to standard with as of now (shock, he's 18/19). But to put all of our hope in him if he doesnt develops would be a huge act of stupidity.

Well unless you actually don't want to compete.

 

[Adisa]

Play the kid, he’s ready.

Coach literally said he’s not.