That sounds like a perfect description of Bobby Moore
most over-rated player in history
Hargreaves vs. Carrick, Feadingseagulls vs. Noodle, Chief (Bayern Fan!) vs. Logic
- Thread starter anything about now
- Start date
- Status
That sounds like a perfect description of Bobby Moore
most over-rated player in history
You should look at who was missing in the three losses we have with Hargreaves playing. That might lead you to a better view on why we were rather impotent in those matches offensively.
owen hargreaves is the next owen hargreaves stop slating the boy trust fergies judgement
Who was the first Owen Hargreaves then?
I don't care one iota if we win or lose with him. I judge him on his own performance not on some imagination matches.
Why do you think people hate Hargreaves? I rarely see one here.
True. Makelele is basically Bobby Moore in midfield.
You really are a joke Noodle. I said Kaka was totally kept out of the game by Hargreaves to the extent Kaka gave up trying to make an impact. Resulting in Hargreaves ending up as an attacking midfielder late in that game. It isn't a stretch or a contradiction therefore to say Hargreaves' work, kept Kaka out of the game through out.
That isn't what you said at all, and it still doesn't make any sense. Hargreaves ended up as an attacking midfielder because Bayern got desperate for a goal. That's what happens when a team is two goals down with very little time left.
So now because I've been getting support from someone like Instant Karma who "allegedly" hates Rooney it can't be valid?
That isn't what I said either, and there's no "allegedly" about it. Though having said that, you two are a pair of loons, whom I haven't been able to take seriously since long before this thread
Milan easily beat Bayern, only you and IK saw the alternative game, which you keep banging on about, despite being wrong.
The only time I've mentioned Carrick in this thread is to say I think he's better than Hargreaves. But yes, I'm the one telling lies.
Why wont you die?
37 pages !
I'm not reading all that
Can anyone sum up whats going on in here ?
I'm not reading all that
Can anyone sum up whats going on in here ?
It's what I said and it makes a lot of sense. IJust not to you, unsurprisingly. If Milan had been as on top or had it as easy you keep claiming. Such a luxury would never have arisen. Whether Bayern need to chase the game or not. They'd have been better served taking of a defender and keeping Hargreaves deep. Instead the didn't do that at all.
It what you've implied. Also it pretty much alleged. IK famously said Rooney and Ronaldo are our only match winners. You can't say that about someone you hate blindly
How can you expect to take us serious when you are never serious? Judging from your now infamous match day thread anticsYou are wrong. That is why you got match day thread rhetoric to back your stance on that game. When the stats alone don't agree with you. Which is damning enough
Of course you are. Carrick has never been superior to Hargreaves and never will be. You've never ever produced on shred of concrete proof to prove otherwise. Just lousy excuses. Besides, I'm not just talking about this thread. Every one else has read your over the top views on Carrick. Plus how you think he basically has no weakness and can do no wrong ala one Mozza. It is not surprising both your views on Hargreaves are in fact identical.
31 pages of "who is the better defensive midfielder?"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Years of threads on "we need a defensive midfielder"
Pleases me
Stop arguing and enjoy having that strength in the squad
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Years of threads on "we need a defensive midfielder"
Pleases me
Stop arguing and enjoy having that strength in the squad
31 pages of "who is the better defensive midfielder?"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Years of threads on "we need a defensive midfielder"
Pleases me
Stop arguing and enjoy having that strength in the squad
I'm really happy with the squat
But a question still remains though: who's the better defensive midfielder? Carrick or Hargreaves? I'd say Carrick just edges it. This may provoke some disagreement though
Preach that to the Hargreaves hating brigade31 pages of "who is the better defensive midfielder?"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Years of threads on "we need a defensive midfielder"
Pleases me
Stop arguing and enjoy having that strength in the squad
What squat
It can't. Carrick isn't even a defensive midfielder in the first place.
Chief, no one apart from Mozza hates Hargreaves on here and even he's probably doing it to wind you up. Correctly pointing out Carrick is better than Hargreaves doesn't make someone a 'Hargreaves hater'.
Because your stupidity can't kill me. I'd probably drop dead from shock if you came up with something sensible for a full month.
Plenty hate Hargreaves. Just check out match day & match rating threads. Mozza being the extreme example along with Noodle hair. They are others too like Mu77 who just blindly say his shit yet can never back it up with anything. Be sure of on thing Psmith, Mozza Hargreaves hatred has never been to wind me up. Not by a long shot. It's simply because Hargreaves' presence jeopardises the chances of his god, Carrick, from playing all the time. He would be after Anderson too if Anderson wasn't so outstanding a talent to be touched for making Carrick bench.
It is not even correct. Besides, a person is clearly a Hargreaves hater if he wants to disregard what Hargreaves has achieved in his career in comparison to Carrick, prior to arriving at United. Yet hold up Carrick's winning his one and only league title as something that makes him "superior" to Hargreaves, who hasn't even completed a season with United yet.
Furthermore, they often love to dismiss Hargreaves achievements at Bayern as equivalent of that of fecking David May or Phil Neville. When it wasn't just luck that he signed for Bayern as a youngster. Neither was it luck that he out played the famous Galacticos, with Makelele present, in a champions league semi final. Or make it a fact that he helped Bayern to win trophies as some sort of peripheral figure. It was all down to his talent and solid contribution to Bayern that he helped them be successful.
Just like Carrick's failure to be signed by a big club or to win anything till he was 26 not just down to luck. But down to his level of talent. Which kept him at a side like West Ham till they reached the Championship. Which didn't help a single team he was in achieve anything, till he came to a side like United, where he found success only due to being surrounded by the cream of the crop. Not due to being overly vital as some claim.
Humiliated and dominated don't mean the same thing. Do they?
Well, first the Earth cooled, then the Dinosaurs came, but they were big and stupid....................................
Hargo is ace.
Have some of that.
Have some of that.
good one
No. But in this case they're pretty similar. Humiliation probably suggests more than just being dominated.
.less thread.
Not enough evidence to be conclusive yet.
Not enough evidence to be conclusive yet.
Let us not forget that we played most of that match with ten men after Paul Scholes got himself sent off. A very good result in the circumstances.
Have you ever noticed that we, like most teams, win more games at home than we do away?
Erm, are you sure you don't have me confused with someone else?
Exactly.
Give it another few hundred pages, and they'll probably both have changed their minds completely, whilst seemlessly arguing throughout.
Thats from someone like you who hates Fergie and takes every opportunity to slate his tactics and formation. And all of that anti SAF tirade about how we will drop points because he fecked up and doesnt play the team or formation you think is right is launched even before the game gets underway.
So the fact that we missed Rio, Vidic, Neville and Saha wasn't a factor? It's like saying missing Nesta, Maldini, Oddo and Seedorf wouldn't have affected Milan. The fact that we played a tiring game against Eveton on teh weekend while Milan rested all their big guns for the clash wasn't a factor? If Hargreaves would've made the difference as you suggest, Bayern wouldn't have conceded twice at home, in fact he was shit in that game. You're running out of excuses.
So the fact that we missed Rio, Vidic, Neville and Saha wasn't a factor? The fact that we played a tiring game against Eveton on teh weekend while Milan rested all their big guns for the clash wasn't a factor? If Hargreaves would've made the difference as you suggest, Bayern wouldn't have conceded twice at home, in fact he was shit in that game. You're running out of excuses.
Bayern and United have similar quality of players around Hargreaves do they?
Somehow when we lose, our fans come up with excuses about tiredness and not having a first choice defender. When Chelsea were missing Terry, Carvalho, Cech, Cudicini and had to play Essien in defence, we laugh at Jose's excuses.
The reason we laughed at Chelsea was because they had an unlimited source of money, and yet still ran out of players, despite spending £150 million +. Can you seriously not see this ?
Having your best defender missing, you other best defender unfit, no right back, a defensive unit that has not played together, on top of all the other things, is not an excuse for why we lost, it's a major factor that cannot be argued with. Hargreaves or no Hargreaves, Milan would have still torn our defence apart. Even if he had a great game, they would have got past him sometime or another, and scored. And him playing could not have stopped the basic errors from Heinze or Vidic either.
Yes. We beat Milan at OT without them. Only because Gattuso left thee pitch. If we had someone to neutralise him in the second leg we would have beaten them again. I'm certain.
So the fact that we missed Rio, Vidic, Neville and Saha wasn't a factor? The fact that we played a tiring game against Eveton on teh weekend while Milan rested all their big guns for the clash wasn't a factor?
That's just daft. Bayern went out because they missed chance after chance and Milan took there's. He kept both Kaka and Gattuso quiet through out. Save for Kaka's goal, Kaka had little influence on proceedings as did Gattuso. Which was Hargreaves' job. Which no one did for us at the San Siro. Which is why we lost badly there. Our midfield allowed itself to be over powered. Which never happened for Milan against Bayern because of Hargreaves. That is where he would have made the difference for us. His job was not stopping Bayern from conceding at all or taking their numerous chances. He was there to stop their 2 most crucial players from controlling the game which he did.
Oh please
He was never shit in that game, at any one point in time. Neither has anyone said with him we wouldn't have conceded. At any one point. ll we said was that he would have neutralised Gatusso who is the one and only reason we were humiliated at the San Siro. for he took over the midfield, isolating our midfield from our forwards, leaving our weak defence exposed to all sorts of pressure. Not tiredness, or our missing players. You are just spewing the same tired bullshit again and again in the hope it will one day be true.Oh.. that's true. He loves to through rocks when his house is the biggest glass house around
Thats from someone like you who hates Fergie and takes every opportunity to slate his tactics and formation. And all of that anti SAF tirade about how we will drop points because he fecked up and doesnt play the team or formation you think is right is launched even before the game gets underway.
You are back to your crazy logic about no midfielder on earth would have made a difference because Vidic and Heinze made basic errors. Having Keane at his best would not have made any difference per your silly logic.
They made basic errors because most of the time that Milan had the ball, they had a free run against our defence, our midfield offered no support and were brushed aside. Even the greatest defenders can only face withstand so much of sustained pressure if they have feck all cover in front of them.
There is maybe one, or two that could, and they'd have to be world class and play out of their skin. Even then, when you're playing Milan, away, with a bloody weak defence, after a long hard season, while they've had a relatively mild season, and are at full strength, the chances are slim to nothing, at best. If you seriously can't see this, you are either incredibly stupid, or just lying to save face. I think it's a bit of both.
So the fact that we missed Rio, Vidic, Neville and Saha wasn't a factor? It's like saying missing Nesta, Maldini, Oddo and Seedorf wouldn't have affected Milan. The fact that we played a tiring game against Eveton on teh weekend while Milan rested all their big guns for the clash wasn't a factor? If Hargreaves would've made the difference as you suggest, Bayern wouldn't have conceded twice at home, in fact he was shit in that game. You're running out of excuses.
So in your opinion if a team concedes is all clearly fault of the DM. Thats a pathetic thing to say. In the second leg Bayern had a lot of players injured and playing out of position. I remember they used Salihamidzi on RB and he is a Right winger, Lell was left winger and he is a RB and Ottl was playing at Right wing and he is a Defensive midfielder.
Here is the team they put against Milan.
http://www.uefa.com/competitions/ucl/fixturesresults/round=2359/match=300129/report=tl.html
The Chief wasnt wrong, Bayern got many chances and didnt score, even chances cleared off the line, lucky saves and Milan just didnt waste theirs.
Hargreaves and Van Bommel did their job pretty good keeping Kaka out of the game but you cant break easily a team like Milan and Seedorf had a major influence on the game scoring one and creating the second for Inzaghi that many believes was a clear offside goal.
FFS...no one out here is suggesting we would have beaten Milan with Hargreaves. Even if we had a full strength side and were on form, they are still good enough to beat us.
The point is that Hargreaves would have done a far better job of protecting our defense than what our midfielders did. Would we have won? Its the Champions league and they are a great side. But we would have had a far better chance of not being exposed every time they attacked. Thats the reason why SAF went ahead and bought him. Maybe he is incredibly stupid too
- Status