Grenfell Tower Fire | 14th June 2017

11101 said:
Some people have nothing better to do. That's about as accurate as it's possible to be.

The question is whether the building regs were adhered to and if so why an oversight like this one was made in them. There's nothing political in that and the regs were set years ago under a different government.

The people displaced have every right to question the response but the ones kicking off have nothing to do with them. Just kids looking for a bandwagon.
Click to expand...

Yes anyone politically objecting to the Tories ignoring calls for sprinkler systems in all towerblocks from a coroners report, lying about sprinkler systems increasing fire safety and the general Tory attack of safety legislation, are just 'kids looking for a bandwagon'. Nevermind the austerity and Tory hatred of the poor that played it's role in this tradegy.

Disgusting post on your part
 
Poor people dead due to political decisions that ignored the evidence and expert advice. Hard to get more political than that.
 
GloryHunter07 said:
How is it crazy?
A) The fire clearly spread from the outside of the building (cladding) inwards and upwards. Sprinklers wouldnt have stopped this.
B) Sprinklers are generally only used in the communal areas (hallways) anyway not in individual flats.
Click to expand...
Would it have been worth it if it had slowed the fire's progress down and allowed emergency services to save another life?
 
Wibble said:
Poor people dead due to political decisions that ignored the evidence and expert advice. Hard to get more political than that.
Click to expand...
Poor people burned alive in their homes because the council decided to cut costs and stick flammable cladding on their building so it didn't offend the eyes of their rich neighbours, with the work carried out by a private company part-owned by an offshore Tory donor, despite the repeated warnings of the residents, who were threatened with legal action, while a council tax rebate was given to the well off, but firefighters have to risk their lives dragging people from the burning building after suffering massive cuts and no pay rise in years, as the council can't even be bothered to help the survivors, and the prime minister is too scared to meet the victims, and hundreds of surviving poor residents will be rehoused outside the borough, which was last week won by a Labour MP with just a 20 vote majority...

What could possibly be political about that?
 
Carlsen19 said:


just to give you an idea of how the fire crews were feeling on the way to the scene.
Click to expand...

Jesus that footage is chilling. I can not imagine the horrors inside that building during the flames. Feck feck.
 
11101 said:
Some people have nothing better to do. That's about as accurate as it's possible to be.

The question is whether the building regs were adhered to and if so why an oversight like this one was made in them. There's nothing political in that and the regs were set years ago under a different government.

The people displaced have every right to question the response but the ones kicking off have nothing to do with them. Just kids looking for a bandwagon.
Click to expand...
Takes a special kind of troll to do it at a time like this.

Social housing is inately political and effects all of us in one way or another.
 
11101 said:
Some people have nothing better to do. That's about as accurate as it's possible to be.

The question is whether the building regs were adhered to and if so why an oversight like this one was made in them. There's nothing political in that and the regs were set years ago under a different government.

The people displaced have every right to question the response but the ones kicking off have nothing to do with them. Just kids looking for a bandwagon.
Click to expand...

There inherently is though when the current party of government have been boasting for years about their plans to kill off 'safety culture' and push for deregulation.
 
Mozza said:
If you look at Corbyn's interview on Peston this morning he said exactly what you have, put the people in hotels until suitable accommodation can be found.
Click to expand...

I just googled it and cant find anything him saying that, just his thing about airplane cancellations and hotels. If he did say it, its what he should be saying along, but he trys to politicise everything. I can see hes still going on about requisition of houses again and even occupying them, whatever he means by that..
 
Carlsen19 said:


just to give you an idea of how the fire crews were feeling on the way to the scene.
Click to expand...


fecking hell that view from the distance as it first comes into sight for them is chilling.
 
starman said:
I just googled it and cant find anything him saying that, just his thing about airplane cancellations and hotels. If he did say it, its what he should be saying along, but he trys to politicise everything. I can see hes still going on about requisition of houses again and even occupying them, whatever he means by that..
Click to expand...
Total nonsense.

If he wanted to politicise it, he'd wipe the floor with May's lot.

I've not seen him politicise it at all - as leader of the opposition he's entitled to show up there and talk about the matter but I've really not seen attempt to make political capital out of it.
 


Scenes Lowkey witnessed from the outside and thoughts on the matter.



A good witness account from a bloke who lived on the 15th floor, stayed put for 3 hours and still managed to escape.

RIP to all the victims, may god rest their souls. It's hard to grasp what people suffered through and even harder to grasp that it was probably avoidable had the government spared a thought to anything other than money for once in their miserable lives and put peoples safety before £. It seems the survivors aren't having it much easier, as far as getting help and sensible relocation is concerned. Normal people are getting sick of being treated like cattle, somethings got to change.
 
Last edited:
T
MikeUpNorth said:
Poor people burned alive in their homes because the council decided to cut costs and stick flammable cladding on their building so it didn't offend the eyes of their rich neighbours, with the work carried out by a private company part-owned by an offshore Tory donor, despite the repeated warnings of the residents, who were threatened with legal action, while a council tax rebate was given to the well off, but firefighters have to risk their lives dragging people from the burning building after suffering massive cuts and no pay rise in years, as the council can't even be bothered to help the survivors, and the prime minister is too scared to meet the victims, and hundreds of surviving poor residents will be rehoused outside the borough, which was last week won by a Labour MP with just a 20 vote majority...

What could possibly be political about that?
Click to expand...


And who had this say about the tragedy -

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...labour-mp-vents-fury-over-grenfell-tower-fire


While forgetting to mention this bit -

Dent Coad is an opposition member of Kensington and Chelsea London Borough Council, which owns Grenfell Tower, and was formerly a council-appointed board member of KCTMO, which manages the council's housing stock. In 2013/4 she was a member of the council's Housing and Property Scrutiny Committee.[11][12] She has been a member of the Council's Planning Applications Committee since May 2013, and a member of the main Planning Committee since June 2014.[13]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emma_Dent_Coad
 
Nuts said:
Total nonsense.

If he wanted to politicise it, he'd wipe the floor with May's lot.

I've not seen him politicise it at all - as leader of the opposition he's entitled to show up there and talk about the matter but I've really not seen attempt to make political capital out of it.
Click to expand...

Creating a false narrative about empty homes is not politicising it, ok..
 
Badunk said:
http://michaelrosenblog.blogspot.co.uk/2017/06/a-firefighter-who-attended-grenfell.html?spref=tw&m=1
Click to expand...
I turn to go but with that he hands me something I'd not seen initially.
Wait!
What!
Im handed a firefighters helmet!
This can't be good!!
Why does he have this?
Where is the firefighter it belongs too!

As I turn round and go back up one turn of the stairs I see him.
He's missing his helmet but he's with my BA partner.
He's got no helmet and no breathing apparatus.
Are you ok? Where's your BA set!?

He's given it to a casualty.. he's coughing as he tells us, he's delirious from the heat and smoke.
Click to expand...
Absolute heroes.
 
My elderly & disabled mum had a fall recently and, despite me being physically able to pick her up, the resultant pain was too bad. Ages later, we agreed that our last resort was the fire service. This was very late on a sunday night. Literally five minutes after calling, three service staff arrived and everything was sorted. These people not only solved the 'problem' but treated my mother as if she were their own; such was their care and kindness. And this was a very minor incident, relatively speaking. The ending paragraphs of Michael's blog post are worth bearing in mind.
 
Full bodied red said:
And who had this say about the tragedy -

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...labour-mp-vents-fury-over-grenfell-tower-fire


While forgetting to mention this bit -

Dent Coad is an opposition member of Kensington and Chelsea London Borough Council, which owns Grenfell Tower, and was formerly a council-appointed board member of KCTMO, which manages the council's housing stock. In 2013/4 she was a member of the council's Housing and Property Scrutiny Committee.[11][12] She has been a member of the Council's Planning Applications Committee since May 2013, and a member of the main Planning Committee since June 2014.[13]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emma_Dent_Coad
Click to expand...
She was on the London version of Sunday Politics on the BBC this morning and went in to some detail about her role on the committee. As was Jim Fitzpatrick who was Fire Minister under Labour. They were both pretty insightful and open about the failings. If you're looking for a cover-up, I doubt it's going to come from either of them.
 
MikeUpNorth said:
She was on the London version of Sunday Politics on the BBC this morning and went in to some detail about her role on the committee. As was Jim Fitzpatrick who was Fire Minister under Labour. They were both pretty insightful and open about the failings. If you're looking for a cover-up, I doubt it's going to come from either of them.
Click to expand...


Not a cover up.....

If I understand correctly, she could have blown the whistle about the fact that KCTMO had gone ahead with using inflammable materials as a cost cutting measure....But obviously didn't.

And ( again if I understand correctly ) was on the K&C Planning Committee when the use of these inflammable materials could have ( should have ?? ) been identified and questioned and then rejected.
 
Full bodied red said:
Not a cover up.....

If I understand correctly, she could have blown the whistle about the fact that KCTMO had gone ahead with using inflammable materials as a cost cutting measure....But obviously didn't.

And ( again if I understand correctly ) was on the K&C Planning Committee when the use of these inflammable materials could have ( should have ?? ) been identified and questioned and then rejected.
Click to expand...

http://emmadentcoad.blogspot.co.uk/2016/

Seems like she has continually banged on about the failings of social housing. Far more likely to campaign against shoddy building than attempt to cover it up in my estimation.
 
Last edited:
Nuts said:
How is it a 'false narrative'?
Click to expand...

Because its not true.

A lot of these homes deemed empty are being used in the holiday rental market. They may not have be occupied 365 days of the year and owners have never even lived in them, but does mean they just sit empty

If he wants to go after the home sharing market, thats a different issue, but hes creating up falsities and riling up people with his "occupy" them comments
 
Full bodied red said:
Not a cover up.....

If I understand correctly, she could have blown the whistle about the fact that KCTMO had gone ahead with using inflammable materials as a cost cutting measure....But obviously didn't.

And ( again if I understand correctly ) was on the K&C Planning Committee when the use of these inflammable materials could have ( should have ?? ) been identified and questioned and then rejected.
Click to expand...
She seemed to say in the interview she left the housing committee before any of the renovation work had been considered and had continually raised the issue of substandard public accommodation, but I hope the inquiry looks into the council committees and the conduct of all councillors.
 
Cheesy said:
There inherently is though when the current party of government have been boasting for years about their plans to kill off 'safety culture' and push for deregulation.
Click to expand...

But the regulations that led to this were set under a previous government. It's not a Tory v Labour thing. Even the parties themselves are avoiding that line.

The people out on the streets protesting Theresa May, storming council meetings etc have nothing to do with the residents. Those people will be out again crying rich v poor over something else in a few weeks.
 
I know 118, when will people stop wetting their pants over something as benign as inequality and poverty? It affects my golf swing.
 
11101 said:
But the regulations that led to this were set under a previous government. It's not a Tory v Labour thing. Even the parties themselves are avoiding that line.

The people out on the streets protesting Theresa May, storming council meetings etc have nothing to do with the residents. Those people will be out again crying rich v poor over something else in a few weeks.
Click to expand...
Labours last fire regulation were around 2006, that's way too long ago. As it happens though, the chancellor said yesterday that the cladding isn't legal on buildings taller than 15 metres.
 
11101 said:
The people out on the streets protesting Theresa May, storming council meetings etc have nothing to do with the residents. Those people will be out again crying rich v poor over something else in a few weeks.
Click to expand...

Gee, maybe we should do something about the vast income inequality gulf then, instead of just crying about those nasty poor people not knowing their place?
 
Silva said:
Labours last fire regulation were around 2006, that's way too long ago. As it happens though, the chancellor said yesterday that the cladding isn't legal on buildings taller than 15 metres.
Click to expand...

If that's the case then whoever installed it will go to prison for a very long time. That's not party politics though and it's tiresome when every last piece of news is made out to be.
 
Silva said:
Labours last fire regulation were around 2006, that's way too long ago. As it happens though, the chancellor said yesterday that the cladding isn't legal on buildings taller than 15 metres.
Click to expand...

If that's the case then whoever in the council signed off on the work and materials is in huge trouble.
 
11101 said:
If that's the case then whoever installed it will go to prison for a very long time. That's not party politics though and it's tiresome when every last piece of news is made out to be.
Click to expand...
Fergies Gum said:
If that's the case then whoever in the council signed off on the work and materials is in huge trouble.
Click to expand...
Government is still in charge of enforcement though, by giving the appropriate inspectors enough time and resources to do their job properly. Hopefully people do get held to account for their choices, but the government needs to take its share of responsibility here.
 
11101 said:
If that's the case then whoever installed it will go to prison for a very long time. That's not party politics though and it's tiresome when every last piece of news is made out to be.
Click to expand...

A favourite Tory policy is to have a 'bonfire of regulations', they'll rephrase it but the desire will stay
 
Neutral said:
Dead or missing presumed dead has risen to 79 - police
Click to expand...

According to the LBC's correspondent, this figures is not expected to rise significantly higher.

5 people have also since come forward to say that they managed to escape, and the police hope that there might be a few more such cases.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.