Get stuffed
Gonçalo Ramos
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) and Jamie (@Vault Dweller) get the depressing job of reviewing United's 3-0 loss at Old Trafford to Liverpool. They discuss what went wrong, Casemiro's day to forget, and the pressure now on Erik Ten Hag. They also take some time to give McTominay a proper farewell, and give their overall thoughts on the Summer Transfer Window.
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Get stuffed
Ok, thanks for clarifying. It's just that when you link a striker to a Lyon-Benzema, people are going to think he's something very, very special indeed as that Benzema would've been even more coveted in this day an age of barely any striking talent than he was in his own where he was a literal sure thing to go, exclusively, to one of the true giants of the game.
As @amolbhatia50k pointed out, it was only Real and us in genuine contention and United fans were mostly hugely on board with wanting him here, and I was no different. Haven't seen anything in this player that evokes feelings of that kind of talent, so it was a curious name to see plucked out of the ether: a 'next Lyon Benzema' thread would be awash with frenzy and excitement because of the type of player he was - maybe it's Sesko or someone like that who may emerge with Lyon-Benzema's skilset, I dunno, but can Ramos?
I mean, as an example of what Benzema of that time was regarded as, this video was the first to come up when typing in 'Benzema lyon':
And just the first few clips, I think, display talent on another level?
Here's another:
I think that's a talent level that would currently sit in the bracket Haaland would go for, despite not being as prolific - the technical acumen and vast array of different types of finishing on display, plus the ball carries and being effective across the entire final third no matter the starting position. I guess it make sense to compare Ramos to a rounded footballer in that sense, but Benzema was also a special athletic specimen, too. Basically, he had everything at his disposal to become a best of his generation (at least) level striker before any other superlatives are attached.
I saw you mention him not featuring in certain lists, but that was down to him sorting out his head at Real, not what he had done to be there in the first place - he was streaky there, but he was also a very immature, moody kid who was growing up in the spotlight under immense scrutiny... there was one man who knew just how to handle such growing pains... and you do wonder what we'd have harnessed from that Lyon-Benzema had he come here instead.
Any chance to wax lyrical about that version of Benzema is going to get a long-winded post out of me; not being preachy or anything, just highlighting that connecting the young Benzema to any upcoming striker is going to illicit a lot of eyebrow raises and curiosity... certainly triggered me enough to post in this thread for the first time!
If we’re gonna blow 100+mil on a striker then it should be the one we all know can perform and bang goals in the PL already.
Yeah, he was. He was an outstanding talent. Looked like the closest thing to Ronaldo I'd seen come through. He was heavily linked to United too. Sign of how careers can go either way that Hatem Ben Arfa in the same team might have looked even better at that age.
I mean if 31 goals in all comps at 20 /21 isn't out of this world good, you have very high standards.
Also on the eye test, he looked physically well rounded, whilst being extremely technical. There were very few talents that at the time or since, come through that have come close to him.
Benzema and Ben Arfa were 2 special generational talents to come out of Lyon at the same time. While one fulfilled the potential another one just went to become mediocre.
Ok, thanks for clarifying. It's just that when you link a striker to a Lyon-Benzema, people are going to think he's something very, very special indeed as that Benzema would've been even more coveted in this day an age of barely any striking talent than he was in his own where he was a literal sure thing to go, exclusively, to one of the true giants of the game.
As @amolbhatia50k pointed out, it was only Real and us in genuine contention and United fans were mostly hugely on board with wanting him here, and I was no different. Haven't seen anything in this player that evokes feelings of that kind of talent, so it was a curious name to see plucked out of the ether: a 'next Lyon Benzema' thread would be awash with frenzy and excitement because of the type of player he was - maybe it's Sesko or someone like that who may emerge with Lyon-Benzema's skilset, I dunno, but can Ramos?
I mean, as an example of what Benzema of that time was regarded as, this video was the first to come up when typing in 'Benzema lyon':
And just the first few clips, I think, display talent on another level?
Here's another:
I think that's a talent level that would currently sit in the bracket Haaland would go for, despite not being as prolific - the technical acumen and vast array of different types of finishing on display, plus the ball carries and being effective across the entire final third no matter the starting position. I guess it make sense to compare Ramos to a rounded footballer in that sense, but Benzema was also a special athletic specimen, too. Basically, he had everything at his disposal to become a best of his generation (at least) level striker before any other superlatives are attached.
I saw you mention him not featuring in certain lists, but that was down to him sorting out his head at Real, not what he had done to be there in the first place - he was streaky there, but he was also a very immature, moody kid who was growing up in the spotlight under immense scrutiny... there was one man who knew just how to handle such growing pains... and you do wonder what we'd have harnessed from that Lyon-Benzema had he come here instead.
Any chance to wax lyrical about that version of Benzema is going to get a long-winded post out of me; not being preachy or anything, just highlighting that connecting the young Benzema to any upcoming striker is going to illicit a lot of eyebrow raises and curiosity... certainly triggered me enough to post in this thread for the first time!
in 2008 and 2009 seasons were when he was still at Lyon, man. He's not on the Ballon d'Or list after a season at Madrid. Rightfully.
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Around the same age, Gonzalo Ramos has 24 goals (and counting) already in his first season as a main striker, and i don't think he's close to generational talent.
Huh? Where did I state otherwise?
"I saw you mention him not featuring in certain lists, but that was down to him sorting out his head at Real, not what he had done to be there in the first place - he was streaky there, but he was also a very immature, moody kid who was growing up in the spotlight under immense scrutiny... there was one man who knew just how to handle such growing pains... and you do wonder what we'd have harnessed from that Lyon-Benzema had he come here instead."
I'm not sure what you're trying to say - do you mean Benzema wasn't touted as a potential superstar whilst at Lyon?
Anyway, folks. My posts don't mean that I don't rate Benzema's Lyon. The reason I used him as example, because i rated Benz Lyon, and first thing comes to mind when comparing young striker. Not saying Ramos is at the same level, but his style reminds me of Benz Lyon.
That's your post I quoted. He's not on the Ballon d'Or list after a season at Madrid. He ranked lowest (rank last with several others, with zero point) on both 2008 and 2009 seasons when at Lyon. That's not a strong sign of "generational talent".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Ballon_d'Or
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Ballon_d'Or
I mean if you look at who the 7 goals he's scored in the CL were against, you can clearly see there's a difference.
Anyway, I do get your point, I just am surprised you don't remember as Benzema as a generational talent.
Yeh. Maybe it's just my memory turns to shite. Hahha..
Talent is not always measurable by goals. Benzema looked special - his ability with the ball at feet, power, athleticism etc was just brilliant.
Generational is a stupid term which seems to just about mean anything/ nothing.
Agreed. That's why I used Benz at Lyon as reference. He's not a bog standard player from 10-15 years ago.
Sickener he wasn't Ronaldo's replacement
Agreed. I'd even say that, despite everything he has achieved, Benzema never reached the level that I thought he would while he was at Lyon. Out of every single player we've been linked with over the last two decades or so, he was the one that I wanted more than any other.
The thing I always remember when thinking of Benzema at Lyon was how in the match against us, there were times that he physically dominated Vidic, then beat Rio with pace and skill. Literally took on the two best defenders in the world at the time and beat them at the things they were strongest at. Based on what he was doing at the time, I'd say he looked the best striking talent since the Brazilian Ronaldo.
The Benzema we've been seeing ,close to 4 years now, is the one we all thought we'd be seeing much more consistently had Madrid not signed that bum Ronaldo.joke
But Benzema was without any doubt a super, super talent at his age. Reminded me alot of Ronaldo ( Luís Nazário de Lima ) when I first noticed him.
But Benzema was without any doubt a super, super talent at his age. Reminded me alot of Ronaldo ( Luís Nazário de Lima ) when I first noticed him.
A €100m price tag being mentioned is about what I'd expect given they sold Nunez for €75m + €25m last season.
Yeah but is he better than Nuñez? He's still more potential than the finished article isn't he?
Well Ramos hasn't appeared as evidently technically flawed as Nunez did when I've seen him. And while he's faring worse than Nunez did last season in terms of goal returns per 90 in their league (0.89 vs 1.00) he's better in terms of expected returns (0.92 vs 0.69), with the latter usually having more predictive value.
People who watch him more will know better, but I'd say they're comparable enough for Nunez to be a fair reference point in terms of price. Especially as I don't think Nunez is the finished article yet either.
Benzema was class at Lyon. In the YouTube channel, Rio also picked Benzema in the list of Benzema, Aguero, Suarez, Zlatan as his toughest striker to play against. And he specifically referred to the games against Lyon and France.
Agreed. Nobody said that he's not class.
Depends how you define class. In my definition class is out of this world good.
That would be world class for me. So yeah, it all depends. For instance, Grealish is class for me, but not world class.
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If Rio himself thinks Benzema at Lyon was harder opponent than Zlatan at inter, Suarez at Liverpool, and Aguero at City, then that was world class or at least generational talent.
This is laughable now. Benfica is just slapping 100 mil prices on every above average player and clubs falling into that trap.
He is 30 mil attacker at best.
He is 30 mil attacker at best.
Ok mate. You're probably right.
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The likes of Ramos and Muani aren't better than Toney or even Watkins. They are worth more than 30m but I wouldn't come near them for those quoted prices.
Sigh, the benezema talk is now official boring lads
My point was that all what is needed is one good half season and Benfica jlwill slap huge price on that player. And clubs still fall on that bs.
Enzo for 120 mil after few months in club was perfect example.
I swear; every time they sell a player, their president thinks; "ok, lets see who is next 100 mil player? Maybe someone from the bench?"
Yeah, I agree with that and I'm not exactly sure why clubs keep meeting those insane valuations.
Yeah that's my thoughts about them too
The Benfica fan in the office claims the reason that Ramos hasn't signed the new contract is because they want to increase the buyout. Apparently the buyout in the existing contract was performance related too, and increased with various milestones, which he has now achieved so it's at the max of €120m. He also claims that Ramos really does not wants to move to England, or Germany (Munich interested too). He wants Spain.
That's fine so go all in for Kane/Oshimen
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