Glazers / Woodward out! (One down)

Red Dreams said:
Its one thing being owned by business people who don't give a damn about the football club.
Its another being owned by murderers who think they can whitewash their crimes/blood with money.

It goes to the heart of what this club is about.
It was built by the community which went through so much and built a club whose call went out to the world and harvested all those souls.
Its not the manager or team. Its the supporters who built the club.

Someone else above said we already are only Manchester United in name only.
Perhaps he is right.
But the Saudis will be the final nail for me.
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This for me - perhaps I should have gone with the lads to FC United but have lived in hope.

Loathsome as the Glazers are, and I want them gone, there is no evidence they have been implicated indirectly or directly in murders in the Middle East. However, this Saudi prince’s intelligence officers were filmed and recorded killing a representative of the fourth estate by the Turkish government - do we really want to be associated with that attitude towards free speech?

Comes a time when the violence has to end and we all learn to get along, but giving a world stage before this murder receives justice is not the means to moving on and will in the end tarnish us with that reputation. Even if it is done through holding companies it will be blood money and I refuse to support that by any and all means.

If his takeover means my giving up membership of this club after 60 years, plus the STs and the rest so be it - some things are more important than transfers.
 
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Cockney Phil said:
This for me - perhaps I should have gone with the lads to FC United but have lived in hope.

Loathsome as the Glazers are, and I want them gone, there is no evidence they have been implicated indirectly or directly in murders in the Middle East. However, this Saudi prince’s intelligence officers were filmed and recorded killing a representative of the fourth estate by the Turkish government - do we really want to be associated with that attitude towards free speech?

Comes a time when the violence has to end and we all learn to get along, but giving a world stage before this murder receives justice is not the means to moving on and will in the end tarnish us with that reputation. Even if it is done through holding companies it will be blood money and I refuse to support that by any and all means.

If his takeover means my giving up membership of this club after 60 years, plus the STs and the rest so be it - some things are more important than transfers.
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I agree. This in no way gives The Glazers a free pass. They have killed this club. Located the MUFC PLC in The Cayman islands to avoid tax and donated to Donald Trumps campaign. But Saudis are worse. Direct murder of dissenting voices.

Still, Glazers out, but first Woodward out.
 
https://www.independent.ng/man-utd-...r-rumours-of-takeover-by-mohammed-bin-salman/

A delegation of Manchester United top brass are set to visit Saudi Arabia as rumours of a take over by the Gulf state’s Crown Prince refuse to disappear.
Discontent surrounding United’s ownership by the American Glazer family has been apparent since their takeover in 2005, paving the way for reports of a possible takeover by 34-year-old Mohammed Bin Salman.
Although they have attended in the past, an appearance by United officials at the Future Investment Initiative organised by the Saudi Royal Family’s sovereign wealth fund later this month will do little to quash rumours of a purchase.
There has been reports of a possible takeover by Mohammed Bin Salman at Manchester United
According to The Transfer Window podcast’s Duncan Castles, the Glazers themselves have attended in the past and United are set to be represented again at the conference in the Ritz Carlton in Riyadh in just over two days time.
Manchester United is valued at £2billion by the New York Stock Exchange and Mohammed Bin Salman could use part of the Saudi Royal Family’s £1 trillion wealth to become a major player on the football ownership scene.
 
A proposed takeover is the only plausible reason why Woodward and the board's decision making has been noticeably baffling and erratic at best the past year, from penny pinching despite tooting their horn about how much money they make to bi-polar managerial decisions (Give Mourinho a new contract but don't back him for transfers)
 
Chairman Steve said:
A proposed takeover is the only plausible reason why Woodward and the board's decision making has been noticeably baffling and erratic at best the past year, from penny pinching to bi-polar managerial decisions (Give Mourinho a new contract but don't back him for transfers)
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If they're penny pinching that's coming from the owners and not Woodward.
 
Probably also explains why Woodward is out here preaching managers and football men are making football decisions. He might be trying to keep his CEO job. Don’t blame him.. as he would be the second person out the door if I took over.
 
Mainoldo said:
Probably also explains why Woodward is out here preaching managers and football men are making football decisions. He might be trying to keep his CEO job. Don’t blame him.. as he would be the second person out the door if I took over.
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I would laugh if the Glazer's sell and Woodward stays on.
 
Mainoldo said:
Probably also explains why Woodward is out here preaching managers and football men are making football decisions. He might be trying to keep his CEO job. Don’t blame him.. as he would be the second person out the door if I took over.
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i wouldn't want to fail as grand as he does if they were our new owners
 
They’ve been to Saudi of Arabia regularly it has nothing to do with selling the club.

The Glazers are too greedy to sell now, value will be lower and they will just see it as losing money.
 
Roboc7 said:
They’ve been to Saudi of Arabia regularly it has nothing to do with selling the club.

The Glazers are too greedy to sell now, value will be lower and they will just see it as losing money.
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The one thing you can pretty much guarantee is that they won't ever sell for the market value. They're no doubt going to be demanding more money for their cash cow than it has ever been valued at, and if they don't get an absolutely ludicrous offer I think this link will once again come to nothing. The question is whether or not the Saudi's would be crazy enough to give them what they want.

I don't really get the fascination with buying us if these stories are through, they could buy pretty much any other club in the Premier League for a fraction of the price necessary and compete with City and Liverpool within a few years anyway, with less public scrutiny on their negative actions to boot.
 
A lot of the big players of the financial world are going to Saudi next month. The Glazer's going may have nothing to do with United.

However, when rumours were at its highest last year, the journalist hot murdered and everything went very quiet. It would have been a massive PR no no to have taken over us then.

A year on though, things maybe picking up pace again...
 
Valar Morghulis said:
The one thing you can pretty much guarantee is that they won't ever sell for the market value. They're no doubt going to be demanding more money for their cash cow than it has ever been valued at, and if they don't get an absolutely ludicrous offer I think this link will once again come to nothing. The question is whether or not the Saudi's would be crazy enough to give them what they want.

I don't really get the fascination with buying us if these stories are through, they could buy pretty much any other club in the Premier League for a fraction of the price necessary and compete with City and Liverpool within a few years anyway, with less public scrutiny on their negative actions to boot.
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They want 600m united supporter around the world to like them, that is worth much more than only football success with a small club can give them.
 
Giggsyking said:
They want 600m united supporter around the world to like them, that is worth much more than only football success with a small club can give them.
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I suppose but a smaller club like Liverpool, Arsenal or Chelsea with big followings wouldn't be too much of a step down in my opinion, our fanbase is blown widely out of proportion by the club.

You know something I was also thinking, I remember that lad El Turki or something that came out and disspelled rumours of a Saudi Takeover last year. Nobody from Saudi Arabia has commented on the rumours at all this year. Wonder if anything should be read into that.
 
Valar Morghulis said:
I suppose but a smaller club like Liverpool, Arsenal or Chelsea with big followings wouldn't be too much of a step down in my opinion, our fanbase is blown widely out of proportion by the club.

You know something I was also thinking, I remember that lad El Turki or something that came out and disspelled rumours of a Saudi Takeover last year. Nobody from Saudi Arabia has commented on the rumours at all this year. Wonder if anything should be read into that.
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I watched a debate on an arabic channel about that. One person were sitting in Paris and the other in Riadh KSA. The one in Paris said, If Saudia wants to do it would be only to gain small propaganda not to have big diplomatic effect. The Saudi political analyst said the news about MBS buying united is not true, he does not need that and has a country to lead and has no time for sports. He said I dont know if businessmen from the Saudi investment fund is willing to do that, but if that is the case it will be totally separated from MBS.
 
Giggsyking said:
I watched a debate on an arabic channel about that. One person were sitting in Paris and the other in Riadh KSA. The one in Paris said, If Saudia wants to do it would be only to gain small propaganda not to have big diplomatic effect. The Saudi political analyst said the news about MBS buying united is not true, he does not need that and has a country to lead and has no time for sports. He said I dont know if businessmen from the Saudi investment fund is willing to do that, but if that is the case it will be totally separated from MBS.
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Hmmm interesting and makes sense, all the rags are plastering pictures of MBS all over their articles and doing stupid comparison graphs featuring the guy but were it to happen he'd likely have next to no input on any of our operations as a football club. Can't see even that happening though really, feck the Glazers.
 
There are Saudis who own Sheffield United, they are never linked with MBS. I'm guessing we would be bought through the consent of MBS, but will probably distance himself from us.
 
Fluctuation0161 said:
I agree. This in no way gives The Glazers a free pass. They have killed this club. Located the MUFC PLC in The Cayman islands to avoid tax .
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Ok.so let's start with some really basic facts
1. We are not a plc... That stands for publicly listed company
We are no longer listed on the Stock market as the glazers brought the company and delisted making it a private company again
So that's incorrect
2. We are not registered in the Cayman isles
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/00095489 as shown clearly here
3. The accounts show the tax we pay in the uk
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/00095489/filing-history

There is plenty of factually correct things to blame the glazers for without 3 clear lies
 
sun_tzu said:
Ok.so let's start with some really basic facts
1. We are not a plc... That stands for publicly listed company
We are no longer listed on the Stock market as the glazers brought the company and delisted making it a private company again
So that's incorrect
2. We are not registered in the Cayman isles
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/00095489 as shown clearly here
3. The accounts show the tax we pay in the uk
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/00095489/filing-history

There is plenty of factually correct things to blame the glazers for without 3 clear lies
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The Glazers have relocated Manchester United’s company registration from Sir Matt Busby Way in Old Trafford to the Cayman Islands tax haven
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https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/oct/17/glazers-legacy-manchester-united-liverpool

United are also on the NYSE and are listed as a PLC there?

https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/Man Utd/
 
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SirAF said:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/oct/17/glazers-legacy-manchester-united-liverpool

United are also on the NYSE and are listed as a PLC there?

https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/Man Utd/
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The club are not a plc and are not listed on the stick exchange or in the Cayman isles

That's a holding company

To suggest the club are and to suggest it's to avoid tax in a printed medium is actually illegal and can get you in a lot of legal trouble... Especially when the accounts show the tax paid in the UK...

The structure of the holding company does not avoid tax on UK operations
 
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sun_tzu said:
The club are not a plc and are not listed on the stick exchange or in the Cayman isles

That's a holding company

To suggest the club are and to suggest it's to avoid tax in a printed medium is actually illegal and can get you in a lot of legal trouble
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Legal trouble? You are a weird person. I’ve just linked you a quote from The Guardian! And I have not suggested they are registered on Cayman Islands to avoid tax, again that’s from The Guardian.

While on the subject, why are the holding company registered in the Cayman Isles?
 
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Fahad Jawaid said:
I actually hate glazere and their ties with Israel, therefore how much different it is going to be actually with Saudi owners. The current owners have the blood of Palestine children on their hands anyway and we stilk support the club.

Plus they have not only bought us through debt and then putting thay debt on us and paying themselves huge dividends. Now their investment in the squad has also reduced aswell. They have dismantled our beautiful club into the most pathetic ran club.

I want manchester united to be the same as before competing for best players and managers and watching attractive football. Hopefully saudi takes over and make us competitive again.
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If this murderers become United's owners and it's tolerated over here by the majority, i will for sure sign off of this forum.
 
SirAF said:
Legal trouble? You are a weird person. I’ve just linked you a quote from The Guardian! And I have not suggested they are registered on Cayman Islands to avoid tax, again that’s from The Guardian.

While on the subject, why are the holding company registered in the Cayman Isles?
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Not you... But the person who suggested that the club had changed their registered address to avoid tax
Somebody said that about my company they would have a letter from our legal team the next day
 
Valar Morghulis said:
The one thing you can pretty much guarantee is that they won't ever sell for the market value. They're no doubt going to be demanding more money for their cash cow than it has ever been valued at, and if they don't get an absolutely ludicrous offer I think this link will once again come to nothing. The question is whether or not the Saudi's would be crazy enough to give them what they want.

I don't really get the fascination with buying us if these stories are through, they could buy pretty much any other club in the Premier League for a fraction of the price necessary and compete with City and Liverpool within a few years anyway, with less public scrutiny on their negative actions to boot.
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FFP makes it harder now. If they takeover our club, we're bringing in more than enough money to help them camouflage their spending plans as being within the permitted profit/loss limits.
 
sun_tzu said:
Not you... But the person who suggested that the club had changed their registered address to avoid tax
Somebody said that about my company they would have a letter from our legal team the next day
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Fair enough, but it sort of read that way.

I don’t want to put words in anyones mouth, but why would they register the holding company in Cayman Islands then? What would be the purpose of that? Lower admin costs?
 
SirAF said:
Fair enough, but it sort of read that way.

i don’t want to put words in anyones mouth, but why would they register the holsing company in Cayman Islands? What would be the purpose of that? Lower admin costs?
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I suspect regulatory and taxation considerations
There are minimal operational activities with a holding company so you can effectively base it anywhere
Doing so does not change the legal requirement of a subsidiary to pay relevant taxes in their own jurisdiction though... The accounts show the club paid over 9 million in tax (plus of course additional like vat and PAYE)
 
sun_tzu said:
I suspect regulatory and taxation considerations
There are minimal operational activities with a holding company so you can effectively base it anywhere
Doing so does not change the legal requirement of a subsidiary to pay relevant taxes in their own jurisdiction though... The accounts show the club paid over 9 million in tax (plus of course additional like vat and PAYE)
Click to expand...

Cheers.
 
sun_tzu said:
Ok.so let's start with some really basic facts
1. We are not a plc... That stands for publicly listed company
We are no longer listed on the Stock market as the glazers brought the company and delisted making it a private company again
So that's incorrect
2. We are not registered in the Cayman isles
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/00095489 as shown clearly here
3. The accounts show the tax we pay in the uk
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/00095489/filing-history

There is plenty of factually correct things to blame the glazers for without 3 clear lies
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We may not be a PLC. But don't play dumb. You know the structure of the club is much more than just one linited company on companies house. I suggest you read the "reorganisation" map, registration document filed with the NYSE for example.

The Glazers are selling shares in a Manchester United company registered in the Cayman Islands. Which is a tax haven. So they can sell shares without giving up control of the club.

It's easy to shout "lies" (like a tabloid headline again btw). But if you have such a strong grasp of MUFC finances and company structure then please go ahead and share your pearls of wisdom on the "factually correct" things to blame the Glazers for?
 
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