Glazers / Woodward out! (One down)

lysglimt said:
I see one real possibility to stop this - and that is that the managers and the players of these 12 clubs say no.

Solskjær, Klopp, Tuchel, Guardiola, Arteta, Conte, Pioli etc - finish the season and if things haven't been resolved by then, managers resign and the players basically say they refuse to play for the club anymore. Basically force the owners out of the clubs
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Highly doubt they do that if they get increased wages.
 
McGrathsipan said:
You need to look at the business not the football to understand how this is happening.
Manchester United is an elite business. The brand is what they sell. The actual football isn't really important is it. 8 season with no major titles tells you that.
It's about the brand and it sells.

The sooner the majority of people see it for what it is the better. This romantic vision of Busby and Fergie and the like is over. Its dead. Gone.
The game as we knew it is gone.

It's vile what's happening and I'm sad. For the genuine fans I'm sad. Its a sad day and this is only the start of it.
One way or another this isn't going to be pretty.
The very fabric of the game has been torn to shreds at the seams and it would appear that the players are pawns in all of this.
Strap in. This is going to get absolutely mental.
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This isn't accurate. Brands do not exist in a void. They exist on the shoulders of fans (consumers). Brands die out all the time. Who cares about Kodak, Polaroid, Nokia, Palm, and many, many others, anymore? They used to be huge "brands". Brands are still there, fans are gone and those brands are dead now.

Manchester United is not just a brand, it is a legacy. People have stuck with it after Fergie because there is history here, there are memories and there is hope that still lives; because there were glimpses of promise, even in the past 8 years, to return to the old glory. Ole started turning things around and that is what keeps us glued to screens, but make no mistake - if United becomes just Glazers' abused, shitty wallet and fans move on - that brand won't be worth anything
 
redmanx said:
To be honest Id imagine that this super league is right up Guardiolas alley, with games played during the summer months on pitches like billiard cloths, no relegation to worry about, no real competition so his teams can play tikki takki football to his hearts contentment without the worry of teams like Burnley spoiling the party with their harrassing, chasing, fighting and biting and making a game of it. Im sure he'll be delighted by it all.
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Burnley was not a good example in this case, City almost always destroys Burnley. City is the only team that seems almost completely immune to Burnley's shithousing, physicality, kick and rush and so on...

But I get your overall point
 
oreon said:
I guess I'm the only one who doesn't a 100 % hate it. At the moment I wouldn't support it for two reasons. The relegation, every member should be able to be relegated there should be no permanent members. And two, the revenue sharing should be the same as it is with UCL. A significant part of the revenue should flow down to the lower leagues.
But I find it rich that UEFA and FIFA have the balls to criticize this because of the 'fans'. They are the 2 most corrupt organizations. They are just mad because they are not getting slice of the pie.
These two so called gatekeepers of football. What have they done to protect clubs against bad owners, inflated transfer fees , inflated agent fees, increased financial disparity between smaller clubs and bigger ones. What about competition. The bundesliga and ligue 1 is a one team league. La Liga is a 3 team league. The italian league finally became competitive.
What about the players ? If you are an international player, you are play way too many games. Instead of lightening the load, UEFA adds the dumb 'National league'. And FIFA is thinking the same thing about a global national league. And lets talk about the Qatar world cup. People are dying from building the stadiums. They are screwing over the national league schedule to host this.


Not saying the super clubs are right. They also doing this for the money. But we are here because UEFA/FIFA have done nothing to protect football. They have only cared about the money. Now the super clubs what more for themselves. UEFA is getting what it deserves
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Two wrongs don't make a right. As a nation, we the people must be united under one idea and one God. I remember posting in a thread about closing borders and people have these ideas and dismissed me and others arrogently... And then what happens? A pandemic .......People need to stop and use their brain. Someone said that these rich owners have distorted the market and thats right. For me the way forward is to look from within which counters the external threat of meglomanical owners stealing from a nations people. Nationalism is not racist full stop. These people call us 'legacy' fans.....because they create these words to manipulate the way people think. I'm pro youth anyway and i think there needs to be radical changes but the opposite way so we can fix this intentionally distorted market. We cannot continue being stupid. Im sorry and not calling you stupid, but people let liars control the narrative of things and dont see the patterns. Those behind this look at patterns and trends to infiltrate and influence. They say reasonable things knowing they true but they use that to convince people whose head is in the clouds. Again two wrongs.....dont make a right. We Know.....you must know......they will sweet talk you and be on the offence but you willing to listen? People need to get this has been going on for a long long time and does not stop at sport but in all areas of the culture
 
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Striker10 said:
Two wrongs don't make a right. As a nation, we the people must be united under one idea and one God. I remember posting in a thread about closing borders and people have these ideas and dismissed me and others arrogently... And then what happens? A pandemic .......People need to stop and use their brain. Someone said that these rich owners have distorted the market and thats right. For me the way forward is to look from within which counters the external threat of meglomanical owners stealing from a nations people. Nationalism is not racist full stop. These people call us 'legacy' fans.....because they create these words to manipulate the way people think. I'm pro youth anyway and i think there needs to be radical changes but the opposite way so we can fix this intentionally distorted market. We cannot continue being stupid. Im sorry and not calling you stupid, but people let liars control the narrative of things and dont see the patterns. Those behind this look at patterns and trends to infiltrate and influence. They say reasonable things knowing they true but they use that to convince people whose head is in the clouds. Again two wrongs.....dont make a right. We Know.....you must know......they will sweet talk you and be on the offence but you willing to listen? People need to get this has been going on for a long long time and does not stop at sport but in all areas of the culture
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The world has it problem, always will but that's got nothing to do with football.
So back to the topic. People who ran the game care about money and not the game. There's a lot of problem in football that are not being addressed.
The proposal is an obvious money grab. But the outrage from people who ran the game is not about principles its about the money being taken away from them. That's what UEFA & FIFA care about. I guarantee if the super teams didn't propose a super league, FIFA was at some point going to propose one themselves so they can get the money.
Now the anger from the fans is legitimate. But what are fans really angry about. If it's about money taking over them game, then start pointing fingers at UEFA & FIFA.
If its about the super league, are fans completely a 100 % against it. I'm not. I think there's a format for the super league that can work and would be a lot interesting. I don' t think the idea should be dismissed quickly.
I think the current proposal is unacceptable. But it can work if there's 3 things.
1.Revenue sharing to the lower leagues.
2. Any team can be relegated & a high number of teams are relegated each season so that's there's turnover and the wealth shared around. I'd do 8 teams relegated and min 5.
3. Some changes to the rules in terms of finance. There should be a cap on the value of a transfer. Agent and players should be banned from getting a part of the transfer fees.

I don't think the super league will succeed. There's too much negative press about it. But I'd like to see a serious and fair attempt at it. Even if it goes, you still have incompetent people running FIFA& UEFA.

A lot of this could have been stopped had FIFA/UEFA had serious rules about club ownership. And if they were serious about curbing agent power and limiting the transfer madness that went on. But no, they were too busy accepting bribes and trying to line their own pockets
 
lsd said:
It's the mindless hysteria and " together we can change the world if we fight " posturings i love knowing that in a years time when it all starts you will all still be here posting "Ole is a horrible coach and will never win the Super League"

This is happening and there's nothing that will stop it so why the delusion?
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its better to have the numbers of people even if some are dumb as a box full of rocks. Its not hysteria. Do you think the owners didnt know people would be angry? But they still lie and think they can force it through. People can do many things
 
Leethal said:
Bless him for thinking the club might actually give a shit about the fans thoughts.
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TBF, Woodward boasted about retweets when it suits his agenda. In this case, they know what is coming if they tweet this.
 
lsd said:
It's the mindless hysteria and " together we can change the world if we fight " posturings i love knowing that in a years time when it all starts you will all still be here posting "Ole is a horrible coach and will never win the Super League"

This is happening and there's nothing that will stop it so why the delusion?
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It is not happening.
 
16 years ago these owners signed the club into £570m of debt. Almost all of which is still owed despite £1.5 billion been stripped from the club to service the debt. Nobody should be surprised by the actions of these cnuts.
 
I’m done with these guys.. They’ve managed to break me, I’m out.
Always backed them and point at all the perceived good things they have done. I was supporting this club before they came in and I’ll be here when they leave.
I love football more than United and I stand with football and all it represents.
 
KikiDaKats said:
I’m done with these guys.. They’ve managed to break me, I’m out.
Always backed them and point at all the perceived good things they have done. I was supporting this club before they came in and I’ll be here when they leave.
I love football more than United and I stand with football and all it represents.
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Honestly? Too little and too late.
 
NewGlory said:
This isn't accurate. Brands do not exist in a void. They exist on the shoulders of fans (consumers). Brands die out all the time. Who cares about Kodak, Polaroid, Nokia, Palm, and many, many others, anymore? They used to be huge "brands". Brands are still there, fans are gone and those brands are dead now.

Manchester United is not just a brand, it is a legacy. People have stuck with it after Fergie because there is history here, there are memories and there is hope that still lives; because there were glimpses of promise, even in the past 8 years, to return to the old glory. Ole started turning things around and that is what keeps us glued to screens, but make no mistake - if United becomes just Glazers' abused, shitty wallet and fans move on - that brand won't be worth anything
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The brands you mentioned died because they had no market or didn't stay competitive.

the United crest well, It's a brand that is vigorously marketed so it won't just fade away and the marketeers are using the romantic notion of legacy and history. It's marketing gold.
As long as there is some investment in the team then there can be a place in the current market.

If this business was just local fans with no romantic appeal the glazers wouldn't have touched it but instead we've global sponsors and millions of "fans" (customers) outside Manchester that have bought into this romance created by the brand marketing. You're one of them obviously. United exist to generate cash from customers and that's it. Yesterday's announcement is further proof.

This is not Manchester United. Its a multinational company owned by Americans and that's the way its run.
 
Neo_Mufc said:
Can the fans genuinely rally together to get the Glazers out?
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We need to adopt the approach of ... my enemy's enemy is my friend. Put past suspicions behind us. Be united. Park all the divisions between us... Between match-going supporters and others. British and others. Europeans and others. Americans and others. Asians etc etc. Between FIFA/UEFA/FA and fans (around this topic). Ex players and fans. Other clubs supporters and ex players (including Liverpool) and United fans. That's the first step.
 
Hashtags are important. Keep it lit on Twitter. #GlazersWoodwardOut #GlazersOut
 
Tincanalley said:
We need to adopt the approach of ... my enemy's enemy is my friend. Put past suspicions behind us. Be united. Park all the divisions between us... Between match-going supporters and others. British and others. Europeans and others. Americans and others. Asians etc etc. Between FIFA/UEFA/FA and fans (around this topic). Ex players and fans. Other clubs supporters and ex players (including Liverpool) and United fans. That's the first step.
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Yep thats exactly whats needed.
In Germany we applaud it when rival supporters boycott games of "their club" to pushfan interests.
We gotta show the Glazers (and others) that if we are treated as customers, then they have to respect us as customers.
 
Surely if the ESL goes tits up (I think it will) Woodward will have to resign? Every cloud.....
 
lsd said:
It's the mindless hysteria and " together we can change the world if we fight " posturings i love knowing that in a years time when it all starts you will all still be here posting "Ole is a horrible coach and will never win the Super League"

This is happening and there's nothing that will stop it so why the delusion?
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Why do anything, at any time, ever?

Your post is the worst post in redcafe history.
 
always_hoping said:
16 years ago these owners signed the club into £570m of debt. Almost all of which is still owed despite £1.5 billion been stripped from the club to service the debt. Nobody should be surprised by the actions of these cnuts.
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You think they couldn't harm the club any more, they come up with something new. I can't say how much I despise them
 
All you angry people can you please head to the poll thread and cast your vote. You can be sure this stuff is being monitored. Have your say people.
 
As sad as it sounds, it may take the Scousers to oust their owners for something to rally up our fans to try and do the same. How and who would take over them, I have no idea. However, if something doesn't happen soon enough, can see the next step being that the club is moved to another location in a few years time.
 
Eddy_JukeZ said:
Highly doubt they do that if they get increased wages.
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There are all types as managers - OGS and Klopp are firmly stuck on one side - I just get the feeling Tuchel isn't happy about this either even if he says otherwise. He is German and will be hated in his own country where no teams will participate. Arteta and the rest I have no idea about
 
If none of the players or managers of the other 5 English clubs say nothing, they will look weak compared to Klopp and Milner.

Ole will need to say something similar to Klopp, otherwise Ole will get a battering, especially from his own fans.
 
Irwin99 said:
The fans will be the only ones to stop I think (maybe supported by players and managers?) but if there's a global protest against this and no one tunes into watch then surely the whole thing tanks? Genuinely think even the fans of the big clubs would welcome some kind of punishment for their clubs being involved in this shameless attempt to create a footballing aristocracy.
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There will always be fans who will accept this - and clubs can decide to ignore them. You can't ignore your own players and manager.
Klopp and Guardiola are so popular amongst the fans and players at their clubs that the owners wouldn't dare to touch them - and even OGS has a strong position at United now. So if these 3 managers and their players revolt - this will fall. It might cost them their job, but it will also make them the most popular persons in world football. And despite popular belief, i don't even think OGS would have a hard time finding a new job
 
red thru&thru said:
If none of the players or managers of the other 5 English clubs say nothing, they will look weak compared to Klopp and Milner.

Ole will need to say something similar to Klopp, otherwise Ole will get a battering, especially from his own fans.
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What Klopp said doesn't help. All the managers and players (as many as possible) must unite and say we don't accept this. What Klopp said was nothing more than we knew - as many as possible of the top managers must basically threaten to walk
 
the_answer said:
Yep thats exactly whats needed.
In Germany we applaud it when rival supporters boycott games of "their club" to pushfan interests.
We gotta show the Glazers (and others) that if we are treated as customers, then they have to respect us as customers.
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Have a follow. I am going to follow all the positive people in here who resist this. All shills on ignore, regardless. Welcome to rival club fans. #GlazersOut
 
red thru&thru said:
If none of the players or managers of the other 5 English clubs say nothing, they will look weak compared to Klopp and Milner.

Ole will need to say something similar to Klopp, otherwise Ole will get a battering, especially from his own fans.
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Or risks to get fired. It is a shitty situation for managers (and also players) to be fair. It is easy for the armchair fans to say that they should say and what not
 
lysglimt said:
What Klopp said doesn't help. All the managers and players (as many as possible) must unite and say we don't accept this. What Klopp said was nothing more than we knew - as many as possible of the top managers must basically threaten to walk
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It took guts for Klopp to speak up. He said as much as he could. Likewise James Milner. Ole needs to grow a pair of balls.
 
lysglimt said:
What Klopp said doesn't help. All the managers and players (as many as possible) must unite and say we don't accept this. What Klopp said was nothing more than we knew - as many as possible of the top managers must basically threaten to walk
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That just won't happen. Same for players to unite and protest, just won't happen. They'll keep quite and hope it is over soon
 
lysglimt said:
There will always be fans who will accept this - and clubs can decide to ignore them. You can't ignore your own players and manager.
Klopp and Guardiola are so popular amongst the fans and players at their clubs that the owners wouldn't dare to touch them - and even OGS has a strong position at United now. So if these 3 managers and their players revolt - this will fall. It might cost them their job, but it will also make them the most popular persons in world football. And despite popular belief, i don't even think OGS would have a hard time finding a new job
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Great points
 
Eddy_JukeZ said:
Highly doubt they do that if they get increased wages.
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The last player I think who played more for the sheer fun, enjoyment and love of playing football rather than the money he could make from the game was Paul Gascoigne; sadly, it seems, many players today get more fun and enjoyment from the size of their bank balances. Honours, medals and trophies matter less than flashy cars, mansions and social media; these are the trappings of success in football today.
 
lysglimt said:
What Klopp said doesn't help. All the managers and players (as many as possible) must unite and say we don't accept this. What Klopp said was nothing more than we knew - as many as possible of the top managers must basically threaten to walk
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I'm not expecting them to walk away. They'll just get replaced. But saying they don't agree with the ESL or want it, is enough...for now.
 
lysglimt said:
What Klopp said doesn't help. All the managers and players (as many as possible) must unite and say we don't accept this. What Klopp said was nothing more than we knew - as many as possible of the top managers must basically threaten to walk
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The point is he had the balls to say it. Let’s see if Ole (fat chance) or any of the other managers have the guts to speak out against it.
 
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