Gio/Theon VS Cal - All time 3 yr peak - Auction Draft

Who would win based on 3 yr peak?


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Annahnomoss

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TACTICS

A balanced and complimentary 4-3-3 designed around the legendary Franz Beckenbauer in defence, who Captained Bayern Munich and West Germany to the '74, '75 and '76 European Cups, the '72 European Championships and the '74 World Cup, and was voted a record five times in the Top three of the Ballon d'Or.
Is there a better stopper/more complimentary partner to a libero than Kohler? I can't think of one.

To the left of Beckenbauer, Jurgen Kohler is arguably the greatest 'stopper' in the history of the game - Kohler was a physical brick wall of a defender and ruthless man-marker.

Winner of the Bundesliga, Serie A, UEFA Cup, Champions League, '90 World Cup and '96 European Champions - Kohler has won it all domestically and internationally and remains the gold standard for this role.

Berti Vogts provides similar security on the right - a former teammate of Beckenbauer, Vogts was twice voted German Footballer of the Year and between 1974-1977 Kicker rated him as the best player in Germany.

There are no better players to compliment Beckenbauer than Vogts and Kohler – they provide Beckenbauer the freedom to marshal the game and move forward in possession.

He was the puppet master, standing back and pulling the strings which earned West Germany and Bayern Munich every major prize."

MIDFIELD

Desailly plays his AC Milan holding midfield role and provides a secure base for an offense which is bursting with creativity. Offering unmatched physicality, workrate and positional discipline, Desailly was the gold standard for this role in the mid-1990s and the highest ranked midfielder in Europe in the '94 '95 and '96 Ballon d'Or.

His partner Matthaus is well regarded as the greatest box-to-box midfielder of all time thanks to his unparalleled combination of defensive nous (see his successful man-marking job on Maradona in the '86 final) and goal threat (one in two at his peak). Ballon D'Or winner in 1991 when he scored 23 goals in 46 games for Inter: impressive for a central midfielder, even moreso in the uber-defensive Serie A of the time. Often tasked with the grunt work in fantasy teams, here he is unleashed with Desailly to win the ball back and, when recovered, surge past the gifted but relatively lightweight opposition midfield.



ATTACK

In attack three all-time great Brazilian legends offer pace, dribbling and an outrageous goal threat - at their peak Ronaldo scored 101 in 106 games, Zico scored 188 in 198 games and Ronaldinho scored 85 goals in 141 games for Barcelona.

As the third highest goalscoring Brazilian ever, Zico's goal threat as a no10 was almost unmatched. Throw in the sensational dribbling, defence-splitting passing and vision that will dovetail beautifully with Ronaldo, and we've got a set-up that will maximise his considerable talents.

Socrates
"Zico was the king. He was much better than everyone else. When there is a king, the rest fight to be close to the king. So it was Zico who should lead. It was Machiavellian, but I was the prince and Zico the king."

Rounding off the attack is George Best - Manchester United's greatest ever player and arguably the best winger in the history of the game.

With the addition of Best the attack possesses the balance and width to hit the opposition from all angles - Ronaldo's pace will stretch the pitch vertically, whilst Best, Ronaldinho and Roberto Carlos stretch the pitch horizontally, creating gaps between the lines for Zico, Matthaus and Beckenbauer to play in.

Pele
''George Best was the greatest player in the world.''

Denis Law
''From 1964 to 1969 he was the best player in the world''

John Giles
''He had the lot: balance, pace, two good feet, he was brave, strong and a good header of the ball. Pele wasn’t as gifted as George Best and I would put George above Cruyff because he had more heart''



BETTER BACKLINE

- Both attacks are excellent but Cal? is facing a better defence built to compliment Beckenbauer and proven at the highest level - Vogts, Kohler, Beckenbauer and Roberto Carlos are all World Cup winners with 429 international caps.

- Moreover the defence is better suited to the game's individual battles - Berti Vogts is perfect tucking in next to Beckenbauer and killing space for Cristiano, whilst Kohler is a natural covering the left/central area of defence against Messi.

- The backline also has significantly better protection from midfield - Matthaus was irrepressible in that box-to-box role, whilst Desailly is arguably the most effective midfield destroyer of the last 40 years - physically imposing with wonderful stamina and graft.

COUNTER ATTACKS FROM DEFENCE

- With Beckenbauer's technical ability and accurate passing in defence we have a greater ability to release swift counter attacks.

- When possession turns over Beckenbauer can release the ball and launch rapid counter attacks to Best or Ronaldinho on the flanks - or through the lines to Zico.

ZICO VS SCHWEINSTEIGER

- As impressive as Schweinsteiger has been as an all-rounder in recent years, we have to question how well he will cope with the irrepressible Zico buzzing around him, darting into the gaps between Cal's midfield and defence, creating angles for Ronaldo.

RONALDINHO/CARLOS FLANK VS ALVES

- At his exceptional peak for Barcelona Ronaldinho was unstoppable, backed up by non other than Roberto Carlos (with Messi offering little or no defensive support) - he is too quick and too skillful for Alves (or even Lahm).



RONALDO V FERDINAND AND VIDIC

- Peak Ronaldo is sure to get the best over Ferdinand and Vidic over the 90 minutes. Everyone remembers Ronaldo destroying Nesta in the UEFA Cup Final while his pace and close control will cause Vidic problems.

- Ronaldo also has previous in outstretching Ferdinand:

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THEON/GIO
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Tactics - Cal?
How do you improve on possibly the greatest side ever in Barca 2009? The Sextuple and all... here it is, the key players of the original Barca 09 side and a few more all time greats thrown into the mix and 3 of the best 4 players in the world ever in the same team. :D

GK
Schmeichel (96-99)
, probably the best keeper ever.

DF
Maldini (91-94)
, no doubt the best LB ever, winning everything there is to win with Milan in a career that span more than 2 decades, 5 time CL winner.
Rio and Vidic (both 06-09), needs no introduction here, our best CB pairing ever and probably the best in Europe over the last decade.
Dani Alves (08-11), a key part of the Barca Sextuple.

MF
Schweinsteiger (11-14)
, key player for the Bayern side which halted Barca's reign, winning the Treble in 2013 and the World Cup in 2014.
Xavi & Iniesta (08-11), the best midfield partnership ever? Basically won everything there is to win in those 3 seasons, the World Cup, the Euro, 2 CLs, 3 La Ligas, including that Sextuple in 2009.

FW
Cristiano Ronaldo (11-14)
, 166 goals for Real Madrid during those 3 seasons, Ballon d'Or 13 & 14, La Liga in 12 and finally La Decima in 2014, possibly the greatest player ever.
Messi (08-11), Ballon d'Or in all 3 years, winning everything with Barca, also possibly the greatest player ever.
Pelé (68-71), Widely accepted as one of the 2 best players ever until around 2010. 1283 goals in 1363 games, a ratio unseen over prolonged periods until the other 2 of my forwards came onto the scene.

SUBS
Lahm (11-14)
, 3 players where he won everything there is to win as a key player for Bayern & Germany.
Zinedine Zidane (99-02), one of the greatest players ever, only missing out due to the understanding Xaviesta have with each other.
Claude Makélélé (00-03), a rare breed of players that has a position named after him, selling him was probably Perez's greatest mistake ever (and he's made a few) as Real spent hundreds of millions to finally win La Decima.
Andriy Shevchenko (01-04), one of the best strikers of the 00s in his Milan days, Ballon D'Or winner in 2004.
Robben (11-14), some believe to the the 3rd best player in the world, a key player for Bayern's recent domination in Germany and also Treble winner in 2013.

Opposition
I'm not entirely sure how Theon's going to fit all those Brazilians with names beginning with "R" into his side, but suffice to say, whoever he fields, it'll be quite an impression attack but not quite as good as my front 3, which features probably the best 3 players in those positions ever in human history.

The midfield, Xaviesta will be looking to do what they do best, keep the ball and starve the opposition whilst Scheweinsteiger provides the steel in midfield against Zico.

Beckenbauer is a great reader of the game and a great leader, but I don't think he's that great in handling outright pace. If they try to defend deep, it'd only play allow my side to dominate possession even more.
 
Bobby Carlos and Dani Alves will get skinned alive and made to look ordinary.

No point arguing about it, the only question is how well covered they are and what they can contribute going forward.

...And who can best exploit that. I can't fail to notice that with two outstanding aerial threats as Pelé and Cristiano (and the proven link with Messi and that midfield) Alves is well worth the risk.
 
Bobby Carlos and Dani Alves will get skinned alive and made to look ordinary.

No point arguing about it, the only question is how well covered they are and what they can contribute going forward.

...And who can best exploit that. I can't fail to notice that with two outstanding aerial threats as Pelé and Cristiano (and the proven link with Messi and that midfield) Alves is well worth the risk.
Carlos may be cut from a similar cloth to Alves but he's a cut above him in every sense. As for the aerial argument, sure they're both great in the air, but the likes of Kohler, Beckenbauer, Desailly, Vogts, Matthaus are no mugs in that aspect either.
 
KEY BATTLE: RONALDINHO V ALVES

They've met before a few times...

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Carlos may be cut from a similar cloth to Alves but he's a cut above him in every sense. As for the aerial argument, sure they're both great in the air, but the likes of Kohler, Beckenbauer, Desailly, Vogts, Matthaus are no mugs in that aspect either.
You wouldn't expect mugs at this stage. Rio and Vidic aren't either, but Cristiano and Pelé pose a distinct threat there which you don't offer. It's nuances like this that make the difference.
 
Both his fullbacks are 1.68m tall, even Beckenbauer is only 1.81m, this will no doubt happen time and again during the match:

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Also, Zico isn't exactly going to provide that much help to his midfielders, as good as Desailly was a a destroy and Matthaus was, they will get absolutely murdered by Schweinsteiger, Xavi and Iniesta, resulting in very little possession for his forwards.
 
Both his fullbacks are 1.68m tall, even Beckenbauer is only 1.81m, this will no doubt happen time and again during the match.
The size thing is a red herring - there are countless examples of shorter-than-average defenders who were fantastic in the air. See Daniel Passarella, Roberto Ayala, Fabio Cannavaro, Ivan Cordoba, etc. Both Vogts and Roberto Carlos are cut from the same cloth: springy and powerful and unlikely to be beaten in the air.

Vogts in particular had a great leap on him. He was also a ruthlessly efficient man-marker. When you combine those qualities, with the support of Kohler, Beckenbauer and Desailly, Cristiano will struggle to get space for any heading opportunities.
 
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MANUEL NEUER (2012-2015)

World Cup: 2014
Bundesliga: 2012–13, 2013–14, 2014–15
UEFA Champions League: 2012–13
Germany Footballer of the Year: 2011, 2014
IFFHS World's Best Goalkeeper: 2013, 2014
FIFA World XI: 2013, 2014
UEFA Team of the Year: 2013, 2014
Ballon d'Or: 2014 (3rd)

FRANZ BECKENBAUER (1972-1976)

European Cup: 1973–74, 1974–75, 1975–76
Bundesliga: 1971–72, 1972–73, 1973–74
FIFA World Cup: 1974
FIFA World Cup All-Star Team: 1974
UEFA European Championship: 1972
UEFA Euro Team of the Tournament:: 1972, 1976
Germany Footballer of the Year: 1974, 1976
Ballon d'Or: 1972 (1st), 1973 (4th), 1974 (2nd), 1975 (2nd), 1976 (1st)

JURGEN KOHLER

Bundesliga: 1989–90, 1995–96, 2001–02
Serie A: 1994–95
Coppa Italia: 1994–95
UEFA Cup Winner: 1992–93
UEFA Champions League Winner: 1996–97
Intercontinental Cup Winner: 1997
FIFA World Cup Winner: 1990
UEFA European Football Championship Winner: 1996; Runner-up: 1992
German Footballer of the Year: 1997

BERTI VOGTS (1974-1977)

FIFA World Cup: 1974
Bundesliga: 1974–75, 1975–76, 1976–77
UEFA Cup: 1974–75
Germany Footballer of the Year: 1971, 1979

ROBERTO CARLOS (1998-2002)

Ballon D'Or: 2002 (2nd)
FIFA World Player of the Year: 1997 Silver Award
UEFA Defender of the Year: 2002, 2003
UEFA Champions League: 1998, 2000, 2002
FIFA World Cup: 1998 (2nd), 2002 (1st)
FIFA World Cup All-Star Team: 1998, 2002
Copa América: 1997, 1999
 
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MARCEL DESAILLY (1993-1996)

UEFA Champions League: 1992–1993
Serie A (2): 1993–94, 1995–96
UEFA Champions League: 1993–94
Supercoppa Italiana (2): 1994, 1996
UEFA Super Cup (2): 1993, 1994
Ballon D'Or 1994 (9th), 1995 (11th), 1996 (8th)

LOTHAR MATTHAUS (1988-1991)

Bundesliga 1984-85, 1985-86, 1986-87, 1993-94, 1996-97, 1998-99, 1999-00
Serie A: 1988–89
Supercoppa Italiana: 1989
UEFA Cup: 1990–91
DFB-Pokal: 1985–86, 1997–98, 1999–2000
DFB-Supercup: 1987
Fuji-Cup: 1987, 1988, 1994, 1995
UEFA Cup: 1995–96
DFB-Ligapokal: 1997, 1998, 1999
UEFA Champions League Runner-up: 1986–87, 1998–99
World Cup Winner: 1990
World Cup Runner-Up: 1982, 1986
UEFA European Championships: 1980
Ballon D'Or: 1991

ZICO (1978-1982)

Rio State Championship: 1972, 1974, 1978, 1979, 1979 (extra), 1981, 1986
Brazilian Série A: 1980, 1982, 1983, 1987
Copa Libertadores: 1981 (best player and top scorer)
Intercontinental Cup: 1981
World Footballer of the Year 1981 - Guerin Sportivo, El Mundo, El Balon, Placar Magazine
South American Footballer of the Year 1981, 1982
1982 FIFA World Cup Bronze Boot
1982 FIFA World Cup All-Star Team

1978: 22 games, 19 goals
1979: 51 games, 65 goals
1980: 45 games, 40 goals
1981: 54 games, 39 goals
1982: 48 games, 44 goals
 
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GEORGE BEST (1966-1969)

First Division: 1964–65, 1966–67
European Cup: 1968
FWA Footballer of the Year: 1967–68
Ballon D'Or winner: 1968

RONALDINHO (2003-2006)

FIFA World Cup: 2002
FIFA Confederations Cup: 2005
La Liga: 2004-05, 2005-06
Supercopa: 2005, 2006
UEFA Champions League: 2005-06
FIFA World Player of the Year: 2004, 2005
UEFA and ESM Team of the Year: 2003-04, 2004-05, 2005-06

RONALDO (1996-1999)

FIFA World Player of the Year: 1996, 1997, 2002
Campeonato Mineiro: 1994
Copa do Brasil: 1993
KNVB Cup: 1996
Copa del Rey: 1997
UEFA Cup Winners' Cup: 1997
Supercopa de España: 1996
UEFA Cup: 1998
La Liga: 2002–03
Intercontinental Cup: 2002
Supercopa de España: 2003
Campeonato Paulista: 2009
Copa do Brasil: 2009
FIFA World Cup: 1994, 2002
FIFA World Cup: Runners-up 1998
Copa América: 1997, 1999
Copa América: Runners-up 1995
FIFA Confederations Cup: 1997
 


This happens when Beckenbauer come up against Pele.

Also what some of your very own players said about him:

"This debate about the player of the century is absurd. There's only one possible answer: Pele. He's the greatest player of all time, and by some distance I might add." Zico

"Pele is the greatest player of all time. He reigned supreme for 20 years. All the others - Diego Maradona, Johan Cruyff, Michel Platini - rank beneath him. There's no one to compare with Pele." Franz Beckenbauer
 
Pele was a pure striker, lightning quick and a ruthless finisher but is that the sort of striker compatible with CR7 (rather than a more complete forward in the sense of Tevez/Benzema/Rooney) as CR7 from 11-14 effectively does same thing as Pele but cutting inwards from the left right?
 
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Look at team Theon/Gio - this should be easy. Scroll down to Team Cal - feckkkkk
 
Pele was a pure striker, lightning quick and a ruthless finisher but is that sort of striker compatible with CR7 from 11-14 who effectively did the same thing but cutting inwards from the left?

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I think he is using this version of Pele - should work brilliantly, he is the best player that you can want here to link up Cristiano and Messi.
 
Two great sides but I'm not convinced of both their set-ups.

For Cal? CR7 and Vidic clearly don't suit a high line high possession team. R9 vs Vidic with space in behind is a clear goal route for Theon/Gio. If he wants approaching the best out of both he should bench Xaviesta and bring in Zidane (and I thought I'd never say this) and Makelele. Play Schwiensteiger RCM and play a much more direct style.

On Theon/Gio's, his midfield is a bit lightweight or will leave his defence exposed especially with Roberto Carlos playing so attacking and Beckenbauer having freedom to move forward. So Zico who was very much goalscoring 10 isn't the best fit. I'd drop either Ronaldihno or Zico and bring in Suarez at DLP and play Matthaus in his peak Inter position.

All that said Theon/Gio's side seems much more cohesive side. Still going wait and see though the managers arguments.

Re-Pele from what I've seen of Pele even in 1958 he was far from a pure striker, he constantly dropped deep and Vava was the real striker positionally speaking.
 
Player for player, Cal's team dominates. Only two or three I'd consider from the other side.
 
Two great sides but I'm not convinced of both their set-ups.

For Cal? CR7 and Vidic clearly don't suit a high line high possession team. R9 vs Vidic with space in behind is a clear goal route for Theon/Gio. If he wants approaching the best out of both he should bench Xaviesta and bring in Zidane (and I thought I'd never say this) and Makelele. Play Schwiensteiger RCM and play a much more direct style.

On Theon/Gio's, his midfield is a bit lightweight or will leave his defence exposed especially with Roberto Carlos playing so attacking and Beckenbauer having freedom to move forward. So Zico who was very much goalscoring 10 isn't the best fit. I'd drop either Ronaldihno or Zico and bring in Suarez at DLP and play Matthaus in his peak Inter position.

All that said Theon/Gio's side seems much more cohesive side. Still going wait and see though the managers arguments.

Re-Pele from what I've seen of Pele even in 1958 he was far from a pure striker, he constantly dropped deep and Vava was the real striker positionally speaking.
When you field the best attackers in the world, it's difficult to find defenders who can cope with the pace regardless of who you have, even if you try Maldini & Baresi at CB you could still argue Ronaldo, Pele & co will have a clear route to goal against any high line. Pele, C Ronaldo and Messi will just as easily outpace any of their defenders.

The idea is to starve his forwards of possession due to the midfield dominance that my side should have, especially with Zico venturing so far forward, I just don't see Matthaus and Desailly coping with Xavi, Iniesta and Schweinsteiger.
 
When you field the best attackers in the world, it's difficult to find defenders who can cope with the pace regardless of who you have, even if you try Maldini & Baresi at CB you could still argue Ronaldo, Pele & co will have a clear route to goal against any high line. Pele, C Ronaldo and Messi will just as easily outpace any of their defenders.

The idea is to starve his forwards of possession due to the midfield dominance that my side should have, especially with Zico venturing so far forward, I just don't see Matthaus and Desailly coping with Xavi, Iniesta and Schweinsteiger.
It's clear that we'll be a better unit off the ball than you will be. Matthaus and Desailly are as physically imposing, dynamic and defensively robust partnership you could hope for at this level. And we'll also get good shifts out of Zico and Best who were both known for being hard-working team players. Whereas Cristiano, Messi, Pele, Xavi and Iniesta will offer very little when the ball is in our hands.
 
Is this the final? It was almost impossible for me to pick a winner but I went for gio/theon. Cals midfield would be susceptible defensively against this quality of opposition IMO.
 
It's clear that we'll be a better unit off the ball than you will be. Matthaus and Desailly are as physically imposing, dynamic and defensively robust partnership you could hope for at this level. And we'll also get good shifts out of Zico and Best who were both known for being hard-working team players. Whereas Cristiano, Messi, Pele, Xavi and Iniesta will offer very little when the ball is in our hands.

I agree with this also. I think it's bit unfair to lump Pele in with those names though but then again I'm not really the biggest Pele expert out there...
 
When you field the best attackers in the world, it's difficult to find defenders who can cope with the pace regardless of who you have, even if you try Maldini & Baresi at CB you could still argue Ronaldo, Pele & co will have a clear route to goal against any high line. Pele, C Ronaldo and Messi will just as easily outpace any of their defenders.

That's true but Vidic vs pace with a high-line exposes his few weaknesses. Deeper he'd do much better. I can see you want to starve him of possession but it doesn't help CR7 nor Alves on counters vs Ronaldinho. Being more direct would give you a better chance to breach his defence
 
It's clear that we'll be a better unit off the ball than you will be. Matthaus and Desailly are as physically imposing, dynamic and defensively robust partnership you could hope for at this level. And we'll also get good shifts out of Zico and Best who were both known for being hard-working team players. Whereas Cristiano, Messi, Pele, Xavi and Iniesta will offer very little when the ball is in our hands.
You're not supposed to get that much of the ball, how much possession do you see yourself getting if this game is actually played?

Also, Xavi, Iniesta & Messi have all been part of the ultra-successful Barca pressing high-up tactic, why would they suddenly "offer very little when the ball is in your hands"? :confused:
 
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I think he is using this version of Pele - should work brilliantly, he is the best player that you can want here to link up Cristiano and Messi.

Precisely my thoughts on that. I would be one of those usually wondering whether Messi and Cristiano could work, whether they would play for each other... But when you have them on either side it isn't that big an issue, the bigger one is who is good enough to play between them that they will defer play to him and he will orchestrate and choose between one or other option objectively, with no emotional bollocks involved but a stone-cold calculated goal-orientation.

No one like Pelé for that job, he is the best player on the pitch, and given the sort of role surrounded by geniuses which gave him that edge to stake claim to being GOAT of all GOATS.
 
Two great sides but I'm not convinced of both their set-ups.

For Cal? CR7 and Vidic clearly don't suit a high line high possession team. R9 vs Vidic with space in behind is a clear goal route for Theon/Gio. If he wants approaching the best out of both he should bench Xaviesta and bring in Zidane (and I thought I'd never say this) and Makelele. Play Schwiensteiger RCM and play a much more direct style.

No way, it's the high possession that would give him an edge here. If worried about anyone not fitting it, drop them, not the tactics. Theon/Gio's would be a better team if tactically they were on equal terms, but they aren't, they face a tactic they are ill-suited to live with. Their front four will be passengers without the ball and even Matthäus/Desailly won't be able to stop him.
 
No way, it's the high possession that would give him an edge here. .
Or the high possession will make them vulnerable to:
  • Ronaldo stretching clear of Ferdinand and Vidic on the break
  • The space becoming squeezed in midfield for Matthaus and Desailly to win it back
  • Putting them in prime position to break and run over the top of Cal's midfield, feeding the likes of Zico, Best and Ronaldinho
It's a similar sort of dynamic that saw Desailly squeeze and dominate Cruyff's dream team in the 1994 Champions League Final:
 
No way, it's the high possession that would give him an edge here. If worried about anyone not fitting it, drop them, not the tactics. Theon/Gio's would be a better team if tactically they were on equal terms, but they aren't, they face a tactic they are ill-suited to live with. Their front four will be passengers without the ball and even Matthäus/Desailly won't be able to stop him.

In that case Maldini has to replace Vidic at LCB and Lahm moves to LB. Then CR7 would need to be dropped for Robben, but who plays on the left of the front 3 of Pele, Robben and Messi. Oddly it would have to be Pele but it would leave him narrow on the left as Lahm won't bomb forward at LB. Cal has a great team but shoehorning in CR7 and Vidic has messed him up.
 
Their front four will be passengers without the ball and even Matthäus/Desailly won't be able to stop him.

On what planet would Best or Zico be passengers off the ball? Have you ever seen Best play?

Both Best and Zico had fantastic mentalities for such talented players.

And the work rate in midfield between the two sides isn't close - Desailly and Matthaus provide significantly better work rate, physicality and defensive cover than anyone in Cal's side.
 
On what planet would Best or Zico be passengers off the ball? Have you ever seen Best play?

Both Best and Zico had fantastic mentalities for such talented players.

And the work rate in midfield between the two sides isn't close - Desailly and Matthaus provide significantly better work rate, physicality and defensive cover than anyone in Cal's side.
You can basically say that about every attacking player in the match (except maybe Ronaldinho). In what world would Messi, Ronaldo, Xavi, Iniesta & co lack "work rate"? 3 of them are key players for that Barca 09 side that is based on pressing high-up the pitch to retrieve possession.
 
For Cal? CR7 and Vidic clearly don't suit a high line high possession team. R9 vs Vidic with space in behind is a clear goal route for Theon/Gio.

On Theon/Gio's, his midfield is a bit lightweight or will leave his defence exposed especially with Roberto Carlos playing so attacking and Beckenbauer having freedom to move forward.

All that said Theon/Gio's side seems much more cohesive side. Still going wait and see though the managers arguments.

We were toying with the idea of playing Romario and Ronaldo in this game as Romario is Vidic's absolute kryptonite - probably even more than Ronaldo. In the end we felt that Alves would leave a lot of space in behind which Ronaldinho would be well placed to exploit.

But aye, Vidic is very ill suited to dealing with a prime Ronaldo - the combination of pace, strength and dribbling Ronaldo possessed at Barcelona is IMO unmatched even amongst the other greats. Vidic was an excellent box defender but he's ill suited to a high line and has shown himself vulnerable to pace in behind - from players far inferior to a pre-injury Ronaldo.

Respectively disagree on the midfield workrate though - IMO our midfield is by an absolute clear distance better defensively, more physical and has more work rate than Cal's midfield.

Matthaus in particular was an absolute titan at his peak and widely considered the best midfielder ever to play the game. I think he'll run riot.
 
You can basically say that about every attacking player in the match

Indeed, to a large extent I agree with you - but I never said otherwise.

If you look at the post I was responding to it was antohan who said that Best and Zico would be passengers off the ball - which is complete and utter nonsense.
 
Player for player, Cal's team dominates. Only two or three I'd consider from the other side.

Beckenbauer, Kohler, Vogts, Matthaus and Desailly would absolutely walk into that side - Zico as well depending on how highly you value Iniesta's partnership with Xavi. That's six players.

You could then make very serious arguments for George Best and Luis Ronaldo. I would pick Best very definitively over Cristiano for our side.
 
I wasn't feeling particularly talkative :lol:. I can't vote anyway but I'll elaborate a bit more later.

EDIT: Dead even so far!

:lol: Was just a film reference joke. I hadn't said anything either going to read it through it now.
 
Beckenbauer, Kohler, Vogts, Matthaus and Desailly would absolutely walk into that side - Zico as well depending on how highly you value Iniesta's partnership with Xavi. That's six players.

You could then make very serious arguments for George Best and Luis Ronaldo. I would pick Best very definitively over Cristiano for our side.

Just Vogts, Beckenbauer and Matthaus for me.

*Zico was a better player than Iniesta, but I'd have Iniesta in that side because I massively value his partnership with Xavi. Best is one of the all time greats, can't get into that side though -- would have to dislodge Ronaldo. As for L. Ronaldo, would have to dislodge Pele.