Nope, the performances in '72 stand above everything we've seen in recent years. It's sadly just overshadowed by the worldcup in '74, when the German mentality won over the wonderful entertaining Dutch football. The German team in '72, built around Netzer, is easily in the top 5 of the most entertaining nationalteams of all time.
Germany at World Cup 2014
- Thread starter maze
- Start date
Löw is not even good enough for the step before the last step ...
Löw is not bad, he is just seen that way because the german team is extremely overrated in germany.
What's to overrate? They're simply at least second best national team in the world. That's a fact. Only Spain can rival with Germany in terms of talent.
I don't agree, but most importantly, talent alone is not enough. Even talent and internationally proven players don't suffice if you have such a failure as manager.
Michael Ballack expects Löw to resign after the WC; boy do I hope he's right!
Must be terrible having a manager that only gets you to the SF's most times.
I just pity the players - i.e. those for whom it may be the last WC tournament (including Lahm, Schweinsteiger, Mertesacker, Podolski) - who again won't win anything and who will be bashed by German media although the underlying problem is Löw. Almost every other manager would better exploit the talent and abilities of current German players, not to talk about his total absence of soft skills.
well, thats not realy an argument. Surley games that weren't played cannot used to assess a teams performance.
To put it in a nutshell:
* Some poster claimed that Germany have failed recently
* Some German fans then said how they haven't
* I gave my opinion that they haven't managed the last step now for a while. You say Spain and Germany didn't meet since 2010, but Germany met Italy in 2012 and didn't have a chance and Spain then in the final hammered Italy. Now it's all if and buts, but considering Spain gave their best performance of the tournament in the final, I really don't think how they wouldn't have beaten Germany, too.
Of course, spain would have been favorite, but since 2010 a lot has happend.
2012 our squat was more experienced and stonger. But you are right in saying that we underachieved that year.
Since than our squat depth got even better and a lot of the players gathered experience and won things to lift their self-confidence, which was clearly lacking in 2010.
Bayern beat Barca, so the bayern players have a better idea of how to beat a possesion based teams like barca or spain. Also we have a few players from Dortmund, which are used to playing dangerous counterattacking football.
I say we are now a lot better equipped to encounter spain than 2010. This years world cup is the perfect moment to transform our mixture of experience and youth into a trophy. Unfortunately the team lost its organization and a lot of important players are not fit due recent injuries. So, in all likelihood we will play a solid tournament and fail in the semi as always
But there is no denying that our squad got better in quality and depth.
Update to Neuer's injury and potential successor as GK:
According to the DFB presser today, Neuer is doing well and his doc Müller-Wohlfahrt confident that he'll be fit for the WC: However, as a precaution Marc-Andre ter Stegen is notified that he should stay tuned in case Neuer does not make it for the WC.
According to the DFB presser today, Neuer is doing well and his doc Müller-Wohlfahrt confident that he'll be fit for the WC: However, as a precaution Marc-Andre ter Stegen is notified that he should stay tuned in case Neuer does not make it for the WC.
I guess you could argue that they now need someone to help them take that last step.
we can cross lars bender from the list. won't make it to the WC. harrrr.
this makes christoph kramer, as young and inexperienced as he is, a proper contender for a promotion to the squad.
feck me, we're gonna see sami khedira so much on the pitch.
this makes christoph kramer, as young and inexperienced as he is, a proper contender for a promotion to the squad.
feck me, we're gonna see sami khedira so much on the pitch.
Last edited:
Of course you are, he's their most important midfielder, and Low knows it, so will use as much as possibly.
no, not realy. He was injured the majority of the season. It would be a miracle if he got in top shape just in time for the world cup.
And even so, I'm not a big fan of him. He is not a very good fit for our type of passing game.
If he's fit. That's a real shame for Lars Bender though. Poor chap.
It looks increasingly likely that our system for the WC will end up being a 4-1-4-1 with Lahm or Schweinsteiger if he gets fit as the only 6 and Reus--Özil--Götze--Müller in front of them. Let's hope our pressing works well until the WC or else we won't get very far.
would be my prefered system anyway.
------------------------Neuer
Großkreutz-----Boateng---Hummels---Schmelzer/Durm
-------------------------Lahm-------------------------------
----------------Özil------------Kroos------------------------
Müller--------------------------------------------------Reus
--------------------------Götze------------------------------
Hoping for a draw in the first match agains Germany because the first match is always the trickiest one otherwise I'd expect Germany to beat us.
http://www.rewe.de/rambazamba/?module=layer&action=open&id=webisode-eselsbruecke
For the ones that know German... 11 little videos about Bavaria meets Brazil - or Müller meets Ailton Kugelblitz...
Some of them are fun to see.
For the ones that know German... 11 little videos about Bavaria meets Brazil - or Müller meets Ailton Kugelblitz...
Some of them are fun to see.
cant believe Bender is out too...daaaaamn
- L.Bender out
- S.Bender out
- Gündogan out
- Khedira was injured for 6 months
- Schweinsteiger has been average all season and keeps picking up injuries
Only Kroos left basically
- L.Bender out
- S.Bender out
- Gündogan out
- Khedira was injured for 6 months
- Schweinsteiger has been average all season and keeps picking up injuries
Only Kroos left basically
neuer
lahm - boateng - mertesacker - schmelzer
Schweinsteiger - Khedria
Müller - Özil - Podolski
Klose
Neuer, Schweinsteiger, Khedira and klose not being fit. Reus is being ignored: "Podolski is an integral part of the team".
After the first match Löw replaces Schmelzer with durm, just to use him again in the quarters, while battering both in the media. Khedria will run around like a headless chicken and Schweinsteiger sets a new record: crawling a whole kilometer during a match. His public announcement, that he is injured and wants to be benched, is ignored. Löw uses both of them every match.
After a "convincing" 1:0 win against Portugal and Ghana, Löw will praise the performance of the team and the quality of the opponents. He also announces, that the prospect of surviving the "group of death" is the ultimate achievement. At this point PaddyPower replaces "Cristo Redentor" with a 111-foot statue of "Jogi". Women want to be with him, men want to be him.
The last match of the group is the clash of titans. Student against master. Löw vs Klinsmann. The master master prevails. "Jürgen is a world-class manager and the USA are one of the strongest teams in the tournament; losing isnt a problem anyway - its all about goals and excitement". Still somehow Germany finishes top of the group.
In the round of 16 germany faces Russia. The Cold-war is resurrected. Gerhard Schröder and Putin celebrating russia´s halftime lead. Löw is eating his bogeys. Delicious. Finally Reus gets his first chance. He scores 4 goals and secures the victory just to get benched again: "Podolski is an integral part of the team".
Bosnia-Herzegovina (won against france in the round of 16) is already waiting in the quarter-final. The german team "batters" them 5:4. Löw is raving about the performance. Its ON! Now we are surely favorite, arent we?
The semis are against Brazil. No problem. Löw has a plan. He subs Schmelzer for Kroos, who has the job to man-mark Neymar. For 90 minutes, Kroos isnt seen. Neymar is. He scores 3 goals and the Reus´s late goal isnt enough.
Löw announces that he did a fantastic job; everybody should thank is genius. Singlehandedly he carried the team in the semis - a staggering success. The german FA agrees and extends his contract for an unlimited amount of years.
lahm - boateng - mertesacker - schmelzer
Schweinsteiger - Khedria
Müller - Özil - Podolski
Klose
Neuer, Schweinsteiger, Khedira and klose not being fit. Reus is being ignored: "Podolski is an integral part of the team".
After the first match Löw replaces Schmelzer with durm, just to use him again in the quarters, while battering both in the media. Khedria will run around like a headless chicken and Schweinsteiger sets a new record: crawling a whole kilometer during a match. His public announcement, that he is injured and wants to be benched, is ignored. Löw uses both of them every match.
After a "convincing" 1:0 win against Portugal and Ghana, Löw will praise the performance of the team and the quality of the opponents. He also announces, that the prospect of surviving the "group of death" is the ultimate achievement. At this point PaddyPower replaces "Cristo Redentor" with a 111-foot statue of "Jogi". Women want to be with him, men want to be him.
The last match of the group is the clash of titans. Student against master. Löw vs Klinsmann. The master master prevails. "Jürgen is a world-class manager and the USA are one of the strongest teams in the tournament; losing isnt a problem anyway - its all about goals and excitement". Still somehow Germany finishes top of the group.
In the round of 16 germany faces Russia. The Cold-war is resurrected. Gerhard Schröder and Putin celebrating russia´s halftime lead. Löw is eating his bogeys. Delicious. Finally Reus gets his first chance. He scores 4 goals and secures the victory just to get benched again: "Podolski is an integral part of the team".
Bosnia-Herzegovina (won against france in the round of 16) is already waiting in the quarter-final. The german team "batters" them 5:4. Löw is raving about the performance. Its ON! Now we are surely favorite, arent we?
The semis are against Brazil. No problem. Löw has a plan. He subs Schmelzer for Kroos, who has the job to man-mark Neymar. For 90 minutes, Kroos isnt seen. Neymar is. He scores 3 goals and the Reus´s late goal isnt enough.
Löw announces that he did a fantastic job; everybody should thank is genius. Singlehandedly he carried the team in the semis - a staggering success. The german FA agrees and extends his contract for an unlimited amount of years.
Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! Memories of Kroos supposed to man-mark Pirlo in an - of course unsuccessful - effort to beat Italy still give me severe pain!neuer
lahm - boateng - mertesacker - schmelzer
Schweinsteiger - Khedria
Müller - Özil - Podolski
Klose
Neuer, Schweinsteiger, Khedira and klose not being fit. Reus is being ignored: "Podolski is an integral part of the team".
After the first match Löw replaces Schmelzer with durm, just to use him again in the quarters, while battering both in the media. Khedria will run around like a headless chicken and Schweinsteiger sets a new record: crawling a whole kilometer during a match. His public announcement, that he is injured and wants to be benched, is ignored. Löw uses both of them every match.
After a "convincing" 1:0 win against Portugal and Ghana, Löw will praise the performance of the team and the quality of the opponents. He also announces, that the prospect of surviving the "group of death" is the ultimate achievement. At this point PaddyPower replaces "Cristo Redentor" with a 111-foot statue of "Jogi". Women want to be with him, men want to be him.
The last match of the group is the clash of titans. Student against master. Löw vs Klinsmann. The master master prevails. "Jürgen is a world-class manager and the USA are one of the strongest teams in the tournament; losing isnt a problem anyway - its all about goals and excitement". Still somehow Germany finishes top of the group.
In the round of 16 germany faces Russia. The Cold-war is resurrected. Gerhard Schröder and Putin celebrating russia´s halftime lead. Löw is eating his bogeys. Delicious. Finally Reus gets his first chance. He scores 4 goals and secures the victory just to get benched again: "Podolski is an integral part of the team".
Bosnia-Herzegovina (won against france in the round of 16) is already waiting in the quarter-final. The german team "batters" them 5:4. Löw is raving about the performance. Its ON! Now we are surely favorite, arent we?
The semis are against Brazil. No problem. Löw has a plan. He subs Schmelzer for Kroos, who has the job to man-mark Neymar. For 90 minutes, Kroos isnt seen. Neymar is. He scores 3 goals and the Reus´s late goal isnt enough.
Löw announces that he did a fantastic job; everybody should thank is genius. Singlehandedly he carried the team in the semis - a staggering success. The german FA agrees and extends his contract for an unlimited amount of years.
On a more serious note: How sad for Lars Bender! The only consolation: He's perfectly in sync with his twin.
I actually doubt that Schweinsteiger and Lahm will be fully fit for the WC, with many questions marks around Khedira as well. Nevertheless Jogi will play all three - or will he take either Kramer or Ginter to Brazil? If you remember the "30 player nomination" presser, he stressed that Ginter can play as defensive midfielder, too. (Actually, that's what he learned; IIRC it was Streich who converted Ginter into a CB).
@PedroMendez: i would give you all my gold for this brilliant post. spot on. cheers!
overwhelmed with frustration. The situation in the central midfield is becoming a problem. I guess at least Khedira and Lahm will play regardless of injuries/fitness. I also doubt that he´ll bench Schweinsteiger. Ginter would be a solid choice as DM. At least he is a player who would put his focus on defening.
Actually, I put my money on Cramer now.
The situation in the central midfield is becoming a problem. I guess at least Khedira and Lahm will play regardless of injuries/fitness. I also doubt that he´ll bench Schweinsteiger. Ginter would be a solid choice as DM. At least he is a player who would put his focus on defening.
They're the team I always get behind because of the potential talent that could be on show. I don't rate Low as a manager at all though, and it's an inevitable odd decision from him that seems to feck things up tournament-wise.
Götze/Müller
Reus - Ozil - Müller/Götze
Bastian - Kroos
Boateng - Hummels - Mertesacker - Lahm
Neuer
Reus - Ozil - Müller/Götze
Bastian - Kroos
Boateng - Hummels - Mertesacker - Lahm
Neuer
Bastian and Kroos dont work together as cm/dm. Every single manager tried that and it was every time the same: very dull and average. If you want to use both, you have to use Kroos as 10.
Kroos is not a very good number 10 either, he's too slow.
He's destined for a system with 2 cm's and 1 dm.
Like: Kroos - Schweinsteiger
Lahm/Khedira
But that won't happen because Löw will play Özil.
And if you have Kroos on the 10 you need a lot of energy to make the attack working... Because Kroos + Schweinsteiger is more like playing without a 10 and 2 no. 8s without dynamic.
Schweinsteiger and Kroos is not the perfect thing on any central midfield position...
If we lead by a goal or two we can play the two together - but not before...
The most important is that Löw does not mess with either Müller or Reus. Give that two as much self confidence as possible. At Reus I just hope he starts to be a big match player or atleast that he delivers the set-pieces as assists for it.
just because Kroos usually doesnt dribble a whole lot, doesnt mean that he is a bad #10. He is actually pretty brilliant on this position on should be a starter, but most people wont understand that anyway. Heynckes used him on this position whenever possible (ahead of müller). I guess His FIFA speed rating is too low to use him on this position.
Anyway I wont even argue about that anymore, because Löw will never drop Özil. Ever.
My point is, that van gaal, löw, Heynckes and Pep all used Schweinsteiger + Kroos as CM and it always sucked; I actually doubt that we survive our group if löw uses Kroos, a injured Schweinsteiger and Özil as midfielder. It might happen, because löw is löw, but it would be beyond stupidity.
Anyway I wont even argue about that anymore, because Löw will never drop Özil. Ever.
My point is, that van gaal, löw, Heynckes and Pep all used Schweinsteiger + Kroos as CM and it always sucked; I actually doubt that we survive our group if löw uses Kroos, a injured Schweinsteiger and Özil as midfielder. It might happen, because löw is löw, but it would be beyond stupidity.
Neuer
Boateng as LB? Never. Löw will either pick Schmelzer, Großkreutz, or Durm if the latter makes it to Brazil. Lahm will play in defensive midfield and Boateng, Höwedes (if he makes it to Brazil), or Großkreutz will play RB.
I wonder if Draxler will make it into the final squad. There are an abundance of attacking midfielders - eight to be exact - competing for 3 spots:
Draxler
Götze
Kroos
Müller
Özil
Podolski
Reus
Schürrle
Considering that Volland feels most comfortable as RAM, you could even add him to the list. IMHO, Draxler needs to be dropped, along with Podolski. The latter one won't happen though.
Draxler
Götze
Kroos
Müller
Özil
Podolski
Reus
Schürrle
Considering that Volland feels most comfortable as RAM, you could even add him to the list. IMHO, Draxler needs to be dropped, along with Podolski. The latter one won't happen though.
You mean the combo or Kroos in general?
@ManniKaltz
I mean the Combo.
One of Schweinsteiger and Kroos - with a more defensive partner or Schweinsteiger with a box-to-box-partner are ok. Kroos can function very well in combination with a more defensive partner that has a high workrate.
Kroos on no. 10 was never a very good solution either. Atleast not in combination with Bayern's wingers. Seldom have seen a decent match of Robben with it. That might work with a very fit Schweinsteiger and if Müller plays a parttime hanging striker - the way Heynckes did it in 2012/13 when they often shifted Lahm forward even if I am not sure that that still would have been smart against Juve and Barca - but without that, between Robben and Ribery and with the usual striker, it seldom produced goals out of open play. We even have the real blueprint for that - 50 % of the matchees in the final stages of the CL 2011/12 were played with that combination and two halves against Dortmund - one goal out of open play, a 7:0 against Basel. I know that the combination brings a lot of ball possession and you might win a lot midfield duels with it - but it makes it very hard in attack. The dynamic they lack has to come from other sources. And we have the climate to think about.
I do not rule out that that might be a fine solution for one special match - against Argentina or Brazil that could work out fine - but even Kroos-Schweinsteiger in defensive midfield can work out fine in some matches...
I somehow really put my hope in Khedira. I think he is very underrated. When it really got tough before Khedira was always a very big asset. And if not - Lahm in midfield and Großkreutz or Boateng as fullbacks. Maybe even play with a Großkreutz-Mertesacker-Hummels-Boateng backline.
I have anyways my special idea against some opponents. Against Italy I e.g. would put Müller as a hanging striker behind Klose and put Götze or Özil onto the right. And let Müller partly mark out Pirlo.
The media talks about a striker problem - that is a part I do not see much problems. You need one or two offensive players in every tournament that have a run. But in that team that does not have to be the striker...
I mean the Combo.
One of Schweinsteiger and Kroos - with a more defensive partner or Schweinsteiger with a box-to-box-partner are ok. Kroos can function very well in combination with a more defensive partner that has a high workrate.
It is not about dribblings.
Kroos on no. 10 was never a very good solution either. Atleast not in combination with Bayern's wingers. Seldom have seen a decent match of Robben with it. That might work with a very fit Schweinsteiger and if Müller plays a parttime hanging striker - the way Heynckes did it in 2012/13 when they often shifted Lahm forward even if I am not sure that that still would have been smart against Juve and Barca - but without that, between Robben and Ribery and with the usual striker, it seldom produced goals out of open play. We even have the real blueprint for that - 50 % of the matchees in the final stages of the CL 2011/12 were played with that combination and two halves against Dortmund - one goal out of open play, a 7:0 against Basel. I know that the combination brings a lot of ball possession and you might win a lot midfield duels with it - but it makes it very hard in attack. The dynamic they lack has to come from other sources. And we have the climate to think about.
I do not rule out that that might be a fine solution for one special match - against Argentina or Brazil that could work out fine - but even Kroos-Schweinsteiger in defensive midfield can work out fine in some matches...
I somehow really put my hope in Khedira. I think he is very underrated. When it really got tough before Khedira was always a very big asset. And if not - Lahm in midfield and Großkreutz or Boateng as fullbacks. Maybe even play with a Großkreutz-Mertesacker-Hummels-Boateng backline.
I have anyways my special idea against some opponents. Against Italy I e.g. would put Müller as a hanging striker behind Klose and put Götze or Özil onto the right. And let Müller partly mark out Pirlo.
The media talks about a striker problem - that is a part I do not see much problems. You need one or two offensive players in every tournament that have a run. But in that team that does not have to be the striker...
Khedira rather invisible tonight excluding his yellow card and losing the ball before the 0-1 ... Under no circumstances he'll get fit but Löw will play him anyway. Löw will also play Neuer, Lahm, and Schweinsteiger irrespective of their fitness. Löw will do a U turn and do exactly what he said he wouldn't: Taking players to Brazil who aren't fit. This guy is the worst German manager ever.
Who would you leave on the bench out of Kross and Schweinsteiger?
Your full backs look weak, for me. If Lahm plays in midfield you will be weak at both LB and RB.
Your full backs look weak, for me. If Lahm plays in midfield you will be weak at both LB and RB.
It is still time until the World Cup - and the hardest matches should not be the first ones. Germany's first match is in 3 weeks - the quarter finals in about 5. Khedira still needs some matches to come into it again. But he is fit. I doubt he needs as much time as e.g. a Schweinsteiger.
Who I would let on the bench of Schweinsteiger and Kroos? When both are really fit - Kroos. But we do not know how Schweinsteiger will be. The system in the German team might fit him better than Pep's. And I have seen both Kroos and Schweinsteiger on tours to different continents with a hotter climate - Schweinsteiger seemed to take the conditions better than Kroos did (Could be different when you have time to get used to the climate), he is more versatile and tracks back, is a better fighter and more experienced. When Schweinsteiger is not fully fit - for sure Kroos.
The fullbacks - maybe I would take Boateng and Großkreutz as fullbacks, especially for the first match against Portugal. It is a more defensive solution but it might be better when we go more offensive in central midfield. Boateng has made great matches against Robben and Ronaldo in the Euros as a right fullback. And Großkreutz is better defensively than Schmelzer.
But Großkreutz might be on "parole" right now... Bild has a story tonight from the night after the Cup loss. He has used a column in the lobby of a hotel as his toilet at 6 o'clock in the morning and has started a fight with a hotel guest... Things like this ain't really appreciated from the German FA but as we already have injury problems they play it down...
Last edited:
Id definitely rather play Kroos in all honesty. But Schwein might be the better leader.
kevin großkreutz with his second indecency incident in less than 2 months. attaboy.
There is a couple of reasons why I would take a fit Schweinsteiger in combination with Lahm/Khedira and Ozil. Experience and Leadership is one of it. He knows better to track back and is the more dynamic. With Ozil you have a playmaking 10 - the balance would shift more to Kroos with Reus or Müller on a hanging striker position, then Kroos extra in passing would come handy. And - he is a good header of the ball - if we play without Klose that might be important in both directions.