Gary Neville - Pundit

I'm not going to get down into the details of it but what was clear in the video was the discomfort that Souness showed when the subject came up. He and others wanted to move to a different topic.

I think Micah forgot one of the unwritten rules in England, namely the England Captain always gets preferential treatment on and off the pitch.

As England captain he manages quite a bit of the media handling and can offer an "exclusive interview" with his choice of media outlet. So no one criticises the England captain.

We have seen the whole England FA get into total meltdown in the past when events involving John Terry created such a mess the Team lost it's Manager in the row.

I think Micah accidentally broke this golden rule and was actively being shut down by Souness and others to steer away from this controversy.
 
AFC NimbleThumb said:
See below. . .

I also remember him saying something like, he doesn’t feel comfortable at United in comparison to playing for France but him explicitly saying ‘I want out’ & on multiple occasions is another exaggeration his own fanbase appear to have drummed up to beat him with; days after he got 4 assists for the club.

You really couldn’t make it up.
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I'm pretty sure that he didn't say that, from memory he answered a question about the atmosphere in the french group and how french call ups were a chance to see some of his close friends. It wasn't about him not being comfortable with United but having a difference type of relationship with certain french players.
 
If the Neville brothers were foreigners then they wouldn't have had a chance in hell in being signed for SAF's Manchester United or any top club for all that matters. They were given the time and the patience simply because they were English/homegrown talent who costed the club zilc. Also when people think of who were the players mostly responsible of our success then the Neville brothers tend to fall waaaay down in that list. Don't take me wrong these players gave us their 100%. However its quite evident that you don't win trophies with a team of Gary and Philip Nevilles. We won what we won thanks to the likes of Keane, Scholes, Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney and co ie players who also gave us their 100% but happened to be world class players as well.

Thus the likes of Gaz expect the club to keep insisting on us having a British core and it also expects top players to carry lesser players to success. If they suggest that we should deviate from that then they would sound a teeny weeny hypocritical. Which is why Gaz sometimes engage himself into some solid brain farts. The last being that we should spend some 140-150m on a 28 year old Harry Kane.
 
devilish said:
If the Neville brothers were foreigners then they wouldn't have had a chance in hell in being signed for SAF's Manchester United or any top club for all that matters. They were given the time and the patience simply because they were English/homegrown talent who costed the club zilc. Also when people think of who were the players mostly responsible of our success then the Neville brothers tend to fall waaaay down in that list. Don't take me wrong these players gave us their 100%. However its quite evident that you don't win trophies with a team of Gary and Philip Nevilles. We won what we won thanks to the likes of Keane, Scholes, Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney and co ie players who also gave us their 100% but happened to be world class players as well.

Thus the likes of Gaz expect the club to keep insisting on us having a British core and it also expects top players to carry lesser players to success. If they suggest that we should deviate from that then they would sound a teeny weeny hypocritical. Which is why Gaz sometimes engage himself into some solid brain farts. The last being that we should spend some 140-150m on a 28 year old Harry Kane.
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Why does Phil always get dragged into your posts? The man has done nothing wrong regarding United. :lol:
 
JPRouve said:
I'm pretty sure that he didn't say that, from memory he answered a question about the atmosphere in the french group and how french call ups were a chance to see some of his close friends. It wasn't about him not being comfortable with United but having a difference type of relationship with certain french players.
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That why I said, ‘something like’. I can’t remember the words exactly.

I remember words to the affect of what you’ve said, my point was people saying he’s explicitly asked to leave on multiple occasions is pure fan fiction.
 
JPRouve said:
Why does Phil always get dragged into your posts? The man has done nothing wrong regarding United. :lol:
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Where have I said that the Nevilles had done anything wrong for us?. The two represent a certain type of player/mentality. They were dedicated/homegrown talent, who were not particularly good but who somehow carved a great career with us. You can add other players to that category such as OShea and McT as well. Gaz tend to liken himself to these sort of players quite regularly.
 
devilish said:
Where have I said that the Nevilles had done anything wrong for us?. The two represent a certain type of player/mentality. They were dedicated/homegrown talent, who were not particularly good but who somehow carved a great career with us. You can add other players to that category such as OShea and McT as well. Gaz tend to liken himself to these sort of players quite regularly.
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Gary Neville was top 5 right backs in the world and best right back in the prem for a decade. To say he was not particularly good is insane. The guy is an average pundit and he was poor near the end of his career but lets not get silly.
 
Rightnr said:
But that's the point. Most of us on here might not care but for the general public and larger audiences, they still have a huge sway.

Once you build a narrative, people love to parrot it. It's dangerous what they've done today and how they've shown they're so willing to shut down an open discussion with dissenting opinions.

To me, it's indicative of what goes on behind the scenes. We've long suspected it but this is pretty clear evidence.
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I disagree. I think with certain pundits, especially Neville and sourness, they love to hear their own voice and would argue in an empty room. I don’t think sky have given them instructions to do it, but I don’t think they tell them to shut up either
 
Desert Eagle said:
Gary Neville was top 5 right backs in the world and best right back in the prem for a decade. To say he was not particularly good is insane. The guy is an average pundit and he was poor near the end of his career but lets not get silly.
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He himself admits that he was never a great player. As Carragher once said no one wanted to be a fullback back then and those who ended in that role were usually failed CBs. However there were still some full backs who were miles better then Gary Neville. I am referring to the likes of Zanetti, Zambrotta, Alves and Thuram.
 
devilish said:
He himself admits that he was never a great player. As Carragher once said no one wanted to be a fullback back then and those who ended in that role were usually failed CBs. However there were still some full backs who were miles better then Gary Neville. I am referring to the likes of Zanetti, Zambrotta, Alves and Thuram.
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Most of Alves career is post Neville and you are literally listing some of the best right backs of all time. I think that makes my point. Neville was top 5 for a decade and best in the prem for a decade. What he and Carragher says doesn't change any of that. People often put those two in the same level of player when the reality couldn't be further from the truth. Carragher was average and usually a mistake prone back up, Neville was mr.consistent and locked down his position for club and country for a decade.
 
Desert Eagle said:
Most of Alves career is post Neville and you are literally listing some of the best right backs of all time. I think that makes my point. Neville was top 5 for a decade and best in the prem for a decade. What he and Carragher says doesn't change any of that. People often put those two in the same level of player when the reality couldn't be further from the truth. Carragher was average and usually a mistake prone back up, Neville was mr.consistent and locked down his position for club and country for a decade.
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Carragher was right though. You have to see football for what it was at the time especially in the EPL. Fullbacks were the Cinderella of football. Sure you had players like Zanetti, Maldini and Irwin who were WC and would walk in any team both during that generation and now but they were the clear exception. Most fullbacks were either failed CBs or failed wingers. Its as simple as that. FFS Philip Neville played nearly 60 times with England and that was during the golden generation.

And no Gaz was not Mr Consistent. The likes of Irwin, Maldini and Zanetti were not Gaz. Gary struggled to reach the near WC level he reached in his late 20s. Gaz's success was down to two key factors ie his determination to make it and Sir Alex's insistence in playing him no matter what. Its that simple.
 
devilish said:
Carragher was right though. You have to see football for what it was at the time especially in the EPL. Fullbacks were the Cinderella of football. Sure you had players like Zanetti, Maldini and Irwin who were WC and would walk in any team both during that generation and now but they were the clear exception. Most fullbacks were either failed CBs or failed wingers. Its as simple as that. FFS Philip Neville played nearly 60 times with England and that was during the golden generation.

And no Gaz was not Mr Consistent. The likes of Irwin, Maldini and Zanetti were not Gaz. Gary struggled to reach the near WC level he reached in his late 20s. Gaz's success was down to two key factors ie his determination to make it and Sir Alex's insistence in playing him no matter what. Its that simple.
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Sorry but you're just wrong.

Gnev was Mr consistent. He had a great career at almost 7/10 every game. History has clouded your judgement.

SAF wouldn't have put up with him if he was tripe!
 
Widow said:
Sorry but you're just wrong.

Gnev was Mr consistent. He had a great career at almost 7/10 every game. History has clouded your judgement.

SAF wouldn't have put up with him if he was tripe!
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I never said that he was tripe didn't I? Gaz had a steep learning curve and only really became the player we know after David Beckham left. As said in the previous post that was down to his determination and Sir Alex insisting on him. Sir Alex had a habit of sticking to his guns regarding players he liked. Fletcher, Oshea and Philip Neville are among those players who kept featuring regularly despite not being great on a consistent basis. You wouldn't see Zanetti or Maldini getting their arse handled to them from the likes of Edmundo as Gary did.
 
devilish said:
Where have I said that the Nevilles had done anything wrong for us?. The two represent a certain type of player/mentality. They were dedicated/homegrown talent, who were not particularly good but who somehow carved a great career with us. You can add other players to that category such as OShea and McT as well. Gaz tend to liken himself to these sort of players quite regularly.
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Just to add on here, Gary Neville was an incredible RB, who was capable of playing crosses that we haven't seen down that flank since Ronaldo.
Strong in the tackle, and was readily available. We haven't had a better RB than him since he retired, it's not even close.
Watching our old games on MUTV particularly in the 2000's you see him ping balls into the box and at times you'll think it was Beckham (at least I did)
You're doing him a disservice here, he was much, much better than "not particularly good".
 
villain said:
Just to add on here, Gary Neville was an incredible RB, who was capable of playing crosses that we haven't seen down that flank since Ronaldo.
Strong in the tackle, and was readily available. We haven't had a better RB than him since he retired, it's not even close.
Watching our old games on MUTV particularly in the 2000's you see him ping balls into the box and at times you'll think it was Beckham (at least I did)
You're doing him a disservice here, he was much, much better than "not particularly good".
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My choice of term was not right. I should have chosen not WC.
 
Neville's loyalty really does determine his views.

Backing oil clubs spending because Salford have spent their way up the football tree. Not calling out Kane because he has a great relationship with him and has no emotional attachment to Spurs. Calling out Pogba because he feels he's disrespected Ole and United.

If Kane was a United player and doing this, he would have a completely different view. Same if Pogba was doing what he's doing at Spurs.
 
devilish said:
I never said that he was tripe didn't I
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1. Almost a coherent sentence, well done.

2. I never said you did, you interpreted as such, I can't control that.

You did say "not particularly good".

I'm not claiming he's world class but to say he wasn't consistent is doing him a disservice.
 
Tom Van Persie said:
devilish downplaying Gary Neville's career. Shocker.
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I am not downplaying anything. Gaz struggled to reach the high levels he reached after Beckham left and while being the best RB in the EPL he was never really WC. That's something he admits himself. In fact talent wise he sees a better player in AWB then he was. Not everyone was born a child prodigy and the fact that Gaz was able to carve a great career by not being so is admirable. Such experience influence his arguments as a pundit which is why he can be quite protective towards the likes of McT who are on that same boat.
 
The problem with him is his opinions come in extremes. If a player gets turned its often embarrassing or hel say "he's getting torn apart". If a player does something that's not seen to be model professionalism, he'll call it a disgrace. And the same goes with the footballing infrastructure be it FFP or Uefa etc.

Because he has so much conviction in his opinion, he has opened himself up to hypocrisy because often football is not so obvious. He hasn't worded himself carefully enough a lot of the time, which is why I prefer Charrager as a pundit.
 
devilish said:
My choice of term was not right. I should have chosen not WC.
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World class is often subjective, I'd have him a tier below but I view WC players as unique, rare & offering more than is expected of them. Neville didn't do more than was expected of him (like score goals for example) but what was expected of him, he did to a very high standard and was consistent for a long period of time too.
Going back to your main point, if McT offers us the same level of ability & consistency and doing what is expected of him, in a competitive team - I fail to see how he can be judged as anything other than great.
 
devilish said:
Carragher was right though. You have to see football for what it was at the time especially in the EPL. Fullbacks were the Cinderella of football. Sure you had players like Zanetti, Maldini and Irwin who were WC and would walk in any team both during that generation and now but they were the clear exception. Most fullbacks were either failed CBs or failed wingers. Its as simple as that. FFS Philip Neville played nearly 60 times with England and that was during the golden generation.

And no Gaz was not Mr Consistent. The likes of Irwin, Maldini and Zanetti were not Gaz. Gary struggled to reach the near WC level he reached in his late 20s. Gaz's success was down to two key factors ie his determination to make it and Sir Alex's insistence in playing him no matter what. Its that simple.
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Like I said the fact that you have to bring up the likes of Maldini and Zanetti as examples of players better than Neville says it all. Yeah Fergie played him for the lulz not because he contributed to winning at the highest level.

@Isotope can't quote your message for some reason but 1995 to 2005. If you disagree name a pl right back who was better than him over the same period and 5 right backs who were better than him over the same time span.
 
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villain said:
World class is often subjective, I'd have him a tier below but I view WC players as unique, rare & offering more than is expected of them. Neville didn't do more than was expected of him (like score goals for example) but what was expected of him, he did to a very high standard and was consistent for a long period of time too.
Going back to your main point, if McT offers us the same level of ability & consistency and doing what is expected of him, in a competitive team - I fail to see how he can be judged as anything other than great.
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that's fair enough and we agree on that.
 
Dante said:
Micah is joining the dots between different events, on different timelines, and with different outcomes. He's totally wrong in the way he's painting the narrative here.

Pogba got abuse when he said he wanted to move club. Not only one time, but on several occasions over the last few years.

And the agent he employs has said the same thing numerous times as well. If Raiola had done it just once, you could claim it was him going rogue. But he's parroted his client's same message over and over. A tactic that's not being repeated with Haaland, by way of comparison. So there's something deeper at play.

If it's a deliberate ploy by Pogba to put himself in the window, there's nothing wrong with fans being upset about it. Football isn't just a business for supporters, it's an emotional connection. So when that connection isn't reciprocated with commitment, players are going to be judged accordingly.

Also, Neville hasn't defended Kane for skipping training. Quite the opposite. He's been highly critical. And if Micah hadn't noticed, Kane was getting abuse by the Tottenham crowd as well today. Something that hasn't been done at OT for Pogba.

The 'saint' comment is getting overblown due to bad faith pundits changing the order of events. Neville said he was a saint up until 3 weeks ago. Not after.
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Come off it, he literally said kane is an angel
 
villain said:
World class is often subjective, I'd have him a tier below but I view WC players as unique, rare & offering more than is expected of them. Neville didn't do more than was expected of him (like score goals for example) but what was expected of him, he did to a very high standard and was consistent for a long period of time too.
Going back to your main point, if McT offers us the same level of ability & consistency and doing what is expected of him, in a competitive team - I fail to see how he can be judged as anything other than great.
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Perfectly put
 
I'm surprised they haven't yet gone with the "Kane is only doing this because he's influenced by Pogba's actions" narrative.

I think Nev and Souness were excellent players in their time and Nev is also a good pundit when actually talking about the football but both of their views on most things need to be taken with a huge shovel of salt.
 
Desert Eagle said:
Like I said the fact that you have to bring up the likes of Maldini and Zanetti as examples of players better than Neville says it all. Yeah Fergie played him for the lulz not because he contributed to winning at the highest level.

@Isotope can't quote your message for some reason but 1995 to 2005. If you disagree name a pl right back who was better than him over the same period and 5 right backs who were better than him over the same time span.
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I brought Zanetti and Maldini because they represented top tier fullbacks at the time. I also brought up Philip Neville as well who had nearly 60 caps with England despite being erm Phil. Which kind of gives a clear picture of the state of fullbacks in the EPL at the time

Sir Alex didn't play him for the Lulz. He played him because he saw in him a determined player who would punch himself to the heights he actually reached in his mid/late 20s. That sheer determination coupled by the fact that he was surrounded by determined/top talent made Manchester United extremely successful. It also influences Gaz's argument when discussing Pogba (ie a top player who he believes he doesn't do half the workrate the likes of Keane and Scholes did) and McT (whom he probably see a lot of young himself in). In Gaz world's top talented players are there to elevate the rest of the team and cover up for any lack of talent elsewhere just as the likes of Keane and Scholes used to do.
 
VP89 said:
The problem with him is his opinions come in extremes. If a player gets turned its often embarrassing or hel say "he's getting torn apart". If a player does something that's not seen to be model professionalism, he'll call it a disgrace. And the same goes with the footballing infrastructure be it FFP or Uefa etc.

Because he has so much conviction in his opinion, he has opened himself up to hypocrisy because often football is not so obvious. He hasn't worded himself carefully enough a lot of the time, which is why I prefer Charrager as a pundit.
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This is absolutely true. Gary Neville thrives on extremes. Yesterday he said "Mendy cannot defend". I get that there is an agenda against Mendy and the player doesn't help himself, which is the same with Pogba, but to just say that on air is unfair. These players have families, friends watching. I hope some day he meets someone just as extreme as he is who'll tell him "Gary, you are not a good pundit, pack it in!" on live TV. I live for that day. We almost got it on the Overlap with his Harry Kane worship but someday soon, I hope it happens.
 
Joeace2020 said:
This is absolutely true. Gary Neville thrives on extremes. Yesterday he said "Mendy cannot defend". I get that there is an agenda against Mendy and the player doesn't help himself, which is the same with Pogba, but to just say that on air is unfair. These players have families, friends watching. I hope some day he meets someone just as extreme as he is who'll tell him "Gary, you are not a good pundit, pack it in!" on live TV. I live for that day. We almost got it on the Overlap with his Harry Kane worship but someday soon, I hope it happens.
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You need to get out more mate.
 
Paxi said:


Think there is definitely double standards from Gary regarding Pogba and Kane which was put to him earlier in the week in that season preview.
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But has Pogba come out and told his agent to shut the feck up? no... at no time. not much difference between him and kane if you ask me (other than the fact tht Spurs will get small fortune for kane and we'll get bugger all when Pogba runs down his contract)
 
mitchmouse said:
But has Pogba come out and told his agent to shut the feck up? no... at no time. not much difference between him and kane if you ask me (other than the fact tht Spurs will get small fortune for kane and we'll get bugger all when Pogba runs down his contract)
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Even if there’s not much difference between what Pogba’s done and what Kane’s done, do you not see the issue of painting one as an ultimate professional, and the other as a trouble maker?
 
Neville is really starting to grate on me lately. He should stick to analysing the actual game instead of his over the top controversial BS to get likes and I’m attention.

honestly bring back Keys and Gray
 
Stumpy said:
Neville is really starting to grate on me lately. He should stick to analysing the actual game instead of his over the top controversial BS to get likes and I’m attention.

honestly bring back Keys and Gray
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Keys is a madman. No thanks.
 
mitchmouse said:
But has Pogba come out and told his agent to shut the feck up? no... at no time. not much difference between him and kane if you ask me (other than the fact tht Spurs will get small fortune for kane and we'll get bugger all when Pogba runs down his contract)
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When was the last time his agent piped up?
 
Lot of soft headed folks in here.

Pogba is getting criticised in exactly the way that Hazard did. Namely ‘You’ve got all this talent. You are head and shoulders above everyone. Why are you not maximising it’.

You can have a discussion about the differences in media treatment of Kane/Pogba. But you can’t go near an argument that suggests people branding Pogba infuriating/flaky/lazy are off their head. He’s all of those things. Pointing them out doesn’t have even a tinge of bias or prejudice.
 
We have to remember 'punditry' and those that practice it are 'entertainers' on a show! The length of time now devoted prior to the match, during half time and post match to ex-players/managers talking about 'the game'/etc. is almost as long as the time devoted to the actual match.

Over the years a number of such people have made appearances in such positions, but its only some, like Gary Neville who excel, because they say the most astonishing things almost with a straight face. So they keep getting 'return gigs'

Its a TV show folks, none of what is said is accidental, its all planned or at least 'sanitized' before it appears on the screen...just watch the game, turn the sound down on the pundits... you will enjoy it more!
 
devilish said:
If the Neville brothers were foreigners then they wouldn't have had a chance in hell in being signed for SAF's Manchester United or any top club for all that matters. They were given the time and the patience simply because they were English/homegrown talent who costed the club zilc. Also when people think of who were the players mostly responsible of our success then the Neville brothers tend to fall waaaay down in that list. Don't take me wrong these players gave us their 100%. However its quite evident that you don't win trophies with a team of Gary and Philip Nevilles. We won what we won thanks to the likes of Keane, Scholes, Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney and co ie players who also gave us their 100% but happened to be world class players as well.

Thus the likes of Gaz expect the club to keep insisting on us having a British core and it also expects top players to carry lesser players to success. If they suggest that we should deviate from that then they would sound a teeny weeny hypocritical. Which is why Gaz sometimes engage himself into some solid brain farts. The last being that we should spend some 140-150m on a 28 year old Harry Kane.
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Neville was world class and we absolutely should spend £150m on Harry Kane.
 
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