Frenkie de Jong | The last muppeting lap

Frenkie to United?


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De Jong isn’t open to moving currently

If that changes then United will be in and possibly Chelsea

Looks more likely he stays at this point though, especially with the B.Silva update
 
Would be classic Chelsea to let a quality academy product like Gallagher leave and spend a ridiculous amount on De Jong.

Gilmour is another that’s hardly got a look in.

Sad state of affairs really.

I am pretty sure we have the most of our academy players on the pitch every week of all the top six teams.
 
I am pretty sure we have the most of our academy players on the pitch every week of all the top six teams.

Guehi, Tammy, Livramento, Tomori, Lamptey all say hi!

You’ve been a disaster with this for some time. Just wasting money when good players are sat right in front of you.

Signing De Jong would be another prime example. Fully expect Gallagher to seek a move before the end of the window if he doesn’t start to get minutes.
 
Guehi, Tammy, Livramento, Tomori, Lamptey all say hi!

You’ve been a disaster with this for some time. Just wasting money when good players are sat right in front of you.

Signing De Jong would be another prime example. Fully expect Gallagher to seek a move before the end of the window if he doesn’t start to get minutes.

Not everyone is going to make the first team. We have an academy that is really producing players, much at the same positions. Is your team putting more academy graduates on the pitch?
Such a childish and uninformed attempted Wum. Have a great day!
 
Chased this guy all summer when it was clearly not on. Now getting linked to every mediocre, over-paid, transfer listed player out there.

Imagine finally getting rid of Ed and putting in place a ‘proper’ recruitment setup and they delivered the worst summer in years for a brand new manager.
 
Not everyone is going to make the first team. We have an academy that is really producing players, much at the same positions. Is your team putting more academy graduates on the pitch?
Such a childish and uninformed attempted Wum. Have a great day!

Why are you so triggered? Even your own fans are disappointed with how the club has been dealing with such things.

All of the players I mentioned could still be at the club now and contributing. You’ve spent massive amounts on full backs yet had Lamptey and Livramento.

You are looking to buy Fofana for a world record fee, and have been picking up centre backs each season, yet you had Tomori and Guehi.

You are crying out for a CF yet you had Tammy and let him go. Now chasing Auba after wasting £150m on Lukaku and Werner.

If you think that’s to be commended then fair enough but to me it looks quite stupid and shows a total lack of forward planning.

You have/keep getting away with it cause the club has more money than sense.

Selling Gallagher, who was superb last season, and spending a fortune on another midfielder like De Jong, would be classic Chelsea.
 
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Why are you so triggered? Even your own fans are disappointed with how the club has been dealing with such things.

All of the players I mentioned could still be at the club now and contributing. You’ve spent massive amounts on full backs yet had Lamptey and Livramento.

You are looking to buy Fofana for a world record fee, and have been picking up centre backs each season, yet you had Tomori and Guehi.

You are crying out for a CF yet you had Tammy and let him go. Now chasing Auba after wasting £150m on Lukaku and Werner.

If you think that’s to be commended then fair enough but to me it looks quite stupid and shows a total lack of forward planning.

You have/keep getting away with it cause the club has more money than sense.

Selling Gallagher, who was superb last season, and spending a fortune on another midfielder like De Jong, would be classic Chelsea.

:lol:
I’m not the one getting irritated! I am loving this transfer window and all its craziness. Boehly looks to be implementing a Dodger strategy that will surely have you wanking about shortly. The Dodgers buy up all the young talent they can and send them to the minor leagues with long contracts so they can sell them for profit in a few years. You should get on board early with throwing a fit about that!
 
Chelsea aren't getting him and neither are we.

Chelsea are prepared to pay the whole deferred salary + transfer fee to get him and he hasn't budged.

There's going to be one last drama push/flurry of news before it results in him staying.
 
Romano on youtube:
Nothing has changed. It all depends on the player. Agreement in place with us for a month, but player wants to stay, Chelsea are ready to pay should he change his mind about them. There is nothing any of the buying clubs can do with new bids or improved offers. The idea that our offer has expired is a lie
 
The only remaining glimmer of hope is that we are at the "I'm walking away!"......"I'm Leaving the store now!" part of the transfer window where potential buyers go through the pantomime of saying a deal is off and link themselves with other targets for a day or so....before coming back with a "best and final offer"

We've seen Ed do it many times and I can't say I have a strong degree of confidence in it actually working but it's the last best hope for a piece of de Jong!
 
The only remaining glimmer of hope is that we are at the "I'm walking away!"......"I'm Leaving the store now!" part of the transfer window where potential buyers go through the pantomime of saying a deal is off and link themselves with other targets for a day or so....before coming back with a "best and final offer"

We've seen Ed do it many times and I can't say I have a strong degree of confidence in it actually working but it's the last best hope for a piece of de Jong!

I'm pretty sure we've thrown everything we have at de Jong. We have likely offered to make him the highest paid midfielder in the league.

And there is nothing to agree with Barca, as we already have a deal with them.
 
Why are you so triggered? Even your own fans are disappointed with how the club has been dealing with such things.

All of the players I mentioned could still be at the club now and contributing. You’ve spent massive amounts on full backs yet had Lamptey and Livramento.

You are looking to buy Fofana for a world record fee, and have been picking up centre backs each season, yet you had Tomori and Guehi.

You are crying out for a CF yet you had Tammy and let him go. Now chasing Auba after wasting £150m on Lukaku and Werner.

If you think that’s to be commended then fair enough but to me it looks quite stupid and shows a total lack of forward planning.

You have/keep getting away with it cause the club has more money than sense.

Selling Gallagher, who was superb last season, and spending a fortune on another midfielder like De Jong, would be classic Chelsea.

Guehi and Tomori I definitely agree with, they should be part the first team squad now. The former never even got his chance and the latter somehow faded away after a very promising start to his Chelsea career and immediately looked a top player after moving to Milan. Losing Tomori is singlehandedly Frank Lampard's fault because he's the one who fell out with the player for a reason that's never been disclosed to the public. His loan to Milan was already signed off by the time Tuchel joined the club, and it included a buy-option for the summer of 2021 which Milan quickly activated.

In a way I understand the club and Tuchel's reasoning behind Guehi transfer away though. The club had just won the UCL title with the defenders already at the club and at the time everyone thought it would be more or less a formality to extend the contracts of Rüdiger and Christensen if the club so wished so there wasn't a clear pathway to the starting XI for a new defender last year. There was a place in the squad for a rotational CB after Zouma sale and instead of Guehi that was given to another academy graduate in Trevoh Chalobah, who ended up playing 30 matches last season. If Guehi had known he'd get to play ~30 matches over the season I doubt he'd have wanted to move to Palace so Chalobah would probably have been sold instead. Guehi was always the more talented of the two.

Livramento and Lamptey leaving is 100% down to the academy lad Reece James nailing down the RB/RWB spot to himself for the foreseeable future. The club have spent massive amounts on full-backs but only on the left side where it's been slimmer pickings as far as the homegrown youth is concerned. Here I'd say it's just a case of being unlucky that the club have produced so many good right-sided FBs or WBs in a short amount of time, there's just literally no chance to promise them all a big role.

Tammy's sale I agreed with. The price was decent and he was an awkward fit for the game system. In hindsight Lukaku was just as bad a fit, but that doesn't make the sale of Tammy Abraham any less the right move. He's a good striker and always seemed a likeable guy but there's just something missing with him to really make him a top player. That's not to say he couldn't improve in the future though, and getting to Roma where he's their first choice striker was a great career move for him.

I won't even get into the Gallagher / De Jong discussion as they're completely different kind of players. If De Jong were to join, he'd be the long term replacement for Jorginho as someone who controls the tempo of the play at the heart of midfield while Gallagher is a more of a box-to-box midfielder with a tireless engine and good for pressing. I could see Gallagher slotting into Kante's role next year but for now he'll likely have to accept either a slightly smaller role or even a loan deal away if he wants to be a sure starter.

Either way despite the players mentioned above I'd say Chelsea have done a good job in integrating youth graduates into the squad in recent years. Mount and James are the very first names on the team sheet and the likes of Hudson-Odoi, Loftus-Cheek, Chalobah and Christensen (who left) have been good squad fillers. Now it remains to be seen whether Armando Broja will stay as a rotational striker this season. I'd definitely be in favor of keeping him instead of paying obscene money for someone like Aubameyang but we'll have to see how it goes.
 
Guehi and Tomori I definitely agree with, they should be part the first team squad now. The former never even got his chance and the latter somehow faded away after a very promising start to his Chelsea career and immediately looked a top player after moving to Milan. Losing Tomori is singlehandedly Frank Lampard's fault because he's the one who fell out with the player for a reason that's never been disclosed to the public. His loan to Milan was already signed off by the time Tuchel joined the club, and it included a buy-option for the summer of 2021 which Milan quickly activated.

In a way I understand the club and Tuchel's reasoning behind Guehi transfer away though. The club had just won the UCL title with the defenders already at the club and at the time everyone thought it would be more or less a formality to extend the contracts of Rüdiger and Christensen if the club so wished so there wasn't a clear pathway to the starting XI for a new defender last year. There was a place in the squad for a rotational CB after Zouma sale and instead of Guehi that was given to another academy graduate in Trevoh Chalobah, who ended up playing 30 matches last season. If Guehi had known he'd get to play ~30 matches over the season I doubt he'd have wanted to move to Palace so Chalobah would probably have been sold instead. Guehi was always the more talented of the two.

Livramento and Lamptey leaving is 100% down to the academy lad Reece James nailing down the RB/RWB spot to himself for the foreseeable future. The club have spent massive amounts on full-backs but only on the left side where it's been slimmer pickings as far as the homegrown youth is concerned. Here I'd say it's just a case of being unlucky that the club have produced so many good right-sided FBs or WBs in a short amount of time, there's just literally no chance to promise them all a big role.

Tammy's sale I agreed with. The price was decent and he was an awkward fit for the game system. In hindsight Lukaku was just as bad a fit, but that doesn't make the sale of Tammy Abraham any less the right move. He's a good striker and always seemed a likeable guy but there's just something missing with him to really make him a top player. That's not to say he couldn't improve in the future though, and getting to Roma where he's their first choice striker was a great career move for him.

I won't even get into the Gallagher / De Jong discussion as they're completely different kind of players. If De Jong were to join, he'd be the long term replacement for Jorginho as someone who controls the tempo of the play at the heart of midfield while Gallagher is a more of a box-to-box midfielder with a tireless engine and good for pressing. I could see Gallagher slotting into Kante's role next year but for now he'll likely have to accept either a slightly smaller role or even a loan deal away if he wants to be a sure starter.

Either way despite the players mentioned above I'd say Chelsea have done a good job in integrating youth graduates into the squad in recent years. Mount and James are the very first names on the team sheet and the likes of Hudson-Odoi, Loftus-Cheek, Chalobah and Christensen (who left) have been good squad fillers. Now it remains to be seen whether Armando Broja will stay as a rotational striker this season. I'd definitely be in favor of keeping him instead of paying obscene money for someone like Aubameyang but we'll have to see how it goes.

Hudson-Odoi is another player fading in to obscurity along with Billy Gilmour. Both have hardly been given the opportunity for a prolonged period and should move on.

As I say it would be a classic Chelsea move to spend heavily in an area you don’t need to (De Jong) as you’ve been doing that for ages.

You are good at producing and initially integrating young players but after that you struggle in terms of forward planning which is pretty evident in terms of the record you have in losing top young players.
 
Most of the players don't read the media. They would be stupid to do it, because 95% is klick baiting rubbish. Why should they waste their time and good mood on it while living the perfect life?
The lawsuit is also very old news, that just got published now for drama purposes. Barca informed the players agents they will look into the last Barto contract extensions months ago, so there will be no surprises. A possible lawsuit is also very far away because the lawyers still review the case, but it just reads better in the press. And Barca is totally open about it that only Bartomeu is to blame here if they find criminal charges.
There will be no charges because there is nothing wrong with the contracts.

What is wrong is making up bullshiit charges to pressure players to leave or take another wage cut, who have done nothing wrong and helped the club with accepting wage deferrals.

Absolutely goatfecking abysmal behaviour.
 
:lol:
I’m not the one getting irritated! I am loving this transfer window and all its craziness. Boehly looks to be implementing a Dodger strategy that will surely have you wanking about shortly. The Dodgers buy up all the young talent they can and send them to the minor leagues with long contracts so they can sell them for profit in a few years. You should get on board early with throwing a fit about that!
Isn’t that what you were doing under Roman anyway with the army of players sent on loan who’ll never play a single minute for your team.
 
I don't find it embarrassing. Utd have gone big and didn't get what they wanted, but they agreed a deal with Barcelona and just waited the situation out.

The stupid part is they didn't have an alternative ready to go.
 
:lol:
I’m not the one getting irritated! I am loving this transfer window and all its craziness. Boehly looks to be implementing a Dodger strategy that will surely have you wanking about shortly. The Dodgers buy up all the young talent they can and send them to the minor leagues with long contracts so they can sell them for profit in a few years. You should get on board early with throwing a fit about that!
Isn't that what you've been doing before? Anyways it's about spending smart, not just big. Will be interesting to see if American sports strategy actually works here.
 
I don't care about the optics. What's awful is how this is impacting our other activity.
 
Hudson-Odoi is another player fading in to obscurity along with Billy Gilmour. Both have hardly been given the opportunity for a prolonged period and should move on.

Gilmour was a big favorite of Lampard and looked really promising in his few appearances. But even with Lampard being a big fan of his there was no clear pathway for him to be a regular starter with Kante, Jorginho, Kovacic and Mount already there. When Tuchel arrived he didn't seem to think as highly of him as Frank and the lad got sent down to Norwich on loan to get regular minutes. Even so, has to be said that with Gilmour gone the squad spot went back to another homegrown player in Ruben Loftus-Cheek, who had spent the previous season out on loan to fully recover from his achilles surgery and Tuchel seems to like him so even without Gilmour the number of homegrown lads in the squad stayed the same.

Gilmour's loan at Norwich was not great so he didn't really help his own chances of making it at the club. When considering the youth prospects, Gallagher went miles ahead of him in the pecking order based on their performances out on loan last season and even Conor isn't very close to being a sure starter now so probably best if Gilmour went somewhere he can play regularly. Would love to see him playing under Lampard again at Everton to see if they can rekindle their past player-manager relationship.

Hudson-Odoi is a tricky one to assess. When he first burst onto the scene under Sarri he looked a top prospect and destined for great things. Like Loftus-Cheek he then had his achilles snapped in two and hasn't quite looked the same since. Callum definitely lost a yard of his pace after the surgery and being able to beat his man 1 on 1 was one of his biggest qualities prior to the injury. That was three years ago now and he hasn't really developed any further, neither under Lampard nor under Tuchel. The lad has played around 130 games for Chelsea (half starts and half subs) so I wouldn't exactly say he's not been given a fair shot. Maybe he would have developed better if given an unconditional starting role without competition but that's just not how things are done at clubs aiming for the top spots. Hudson-Odoi has had a few periods where he's started 5-10 games in a row to see if he'll start picking up some form but he just never has done enough to justify continuing to pick him when others simply performed better. I do agree that with Callum it's probably time to move on.

I don't think there's many clubs top10 clubs in the PL who have more academy graduates in their squads than we have in the last few seasons so I don't think your criticism is entirely fair. But I've learnt not to expect you to have anything positive to say about Chelsea so fair enough.
 
Gilmour was a big favorite of Lampard and looked really promising in his few appearances. But even with Lampard being a big fan of his there was no clear pathway for him to be a regular starter with Kante, Jorginho, Kovacic and Mount already there. When Tuchel arrived he didn't seem to think as highly of him as Frank and the lad got sent down to Norwich on loan to get regular minutes. Even so, has to be said that with Gilmour gone the squad spot went back to another homegrown player in Ruben Loftus-Cheek, who had spent the previous season out on loan to fully recover from his achilles surgery and Tuchel seems to like him so even without Gilmour the number of homegrown lads in the squad stayed the same.

Gilmour's loan at Norwich was not great so he didn't really help his own chances of making it at the club. When considering the youth prospects, Gallagher went miles ahead of him in the pecking order based on their performances out on loan last season and even Conor isn't very close to being a sure starter now so probably best if Gilmour went somewhere he can play regularly. Would love to see him playing under Lampard again at Everton to see if they can rekindle their past player-manager relationship.

Hudson-Odoi is a tricky one to assess. When he first burst onto the scene under Sarri he looked a top prospect and destined for great things. Like Loftus-Cheek he then had his achilles snapped in two and hasn't quite looked the same since. Callum definitely lost a yard of his pace after the surgery and being able to beat his man 1 on 1 was one of his biggest qualities prior to the injury. That was three years ago now and he hasn't really developed any further, neither under Lampard nor under Tuchel. The lad has played around 130 games for Chelsea (half starts and half subs) so I wouldn't exactly say he's not been given a fair shot. Maybe he would have developed better if given an unconditional starting role without competition but that's just not how things are done at clubs aiming for the top spots. Hudson-Odoi has had a few periods where he's started 5-10 games in a row to see if he'll start picking up some form but he just never has done enough to justify continuing to pick him when others simply performed better. I do agree that with Callum it's probably time to move on.

I don't think there's many clubs top10 clubs in the PL who have more academy graduates in their squads than we have in the last few seasons so I don't think your criticism is entirely fair. But I've learnt not to expect you to have anything positive to say about Chelsea so fair enough.

The problem is I wasn’t criticising the amount of academy graduates you have was I?

It seems none of you are able to accept any critique of your club what so ever and immediately jump to defend it. Reading the nonsense spouted in the Roman Abramovich thread when the war started up until he left as Exhibt A of said blinkered behaviour.

Well I say none of you. @WeePat and @TheMagicFoolBus have both been vocal and shared their disappointment in how the club has handled recruitment and, as relevant here, the long term planning in terms of academy players. They seem to get where I’m coming from.
 
I don't care about the optics. What's awful is how this is impacting our other activity.

Well, the next 2 weeks will be interesting times. Roller coaster of emotions. But regardless of who we get, there will be accusations of 'overpaid', and 'panic buy' regardless of who we get.
 
There will be no charges because there is nothing wrong with the contracts.

I'm sorry. I didn't know you are one of the players agents or worked for Bartomeu's board with inside information about the contracts. An outsider could think off-market high contract extensions during the last week of his presidency, which cost he club considerably more than they saved on it, could be a case of self benefit to blur the disastrous balance that damaged the club, because a barca president is liable with his own money for a considerable loss. A shame there are some laws against such a thing.
But if you are an insider of course, maybe you can call Laporta and tell him to stop wasting the lawyers time.
 
Big eh...

So amazingly big that they haven't actually done anything yet and are concentrating their efforts elsewhere. But yeah, big!
But to be fair, like your club are finding out, us doing anything like bid etc would be completely pointless. That's the part people miss out on. So although we'd be prepared to do something bid, it's only in the scenario that FDJ leaves.

We haven't bid, because he hasn't given even so much as a remote hint that he will leave. If he had done so, then we would have.

Hypothetically if he announced tomorrow he wants to go, and we also know Barca would sell him, then within days you'd see us bid, as Utd have done already
 
But to be fair, like your club are finding out, us doing anything like bid etc would be completely pointless. That's the part people miss out on. So although we'd be prepared to do something bid, it's only in the scenario that FDJ leaves.

We haven't bid, because he hasn't given even so much as a remote hint that he will leave. If he had done so, then we would have.

Hypothetically if he announced tomorrow he wants to go, and we also know Barca would sell him, then within days you'd see us bid, as Utd have done already

United’s had agreements with club and agent. Chelsea have had nothing.

It seems the player will stay at Barca but we know if he does decide to move Chelsea will have a heck of a lot to do to make it happen whilst United are already ahead of the game in that regard.
 
The problem is I wasn’t criticising the amount of academy graduates you have was I?

It seems none of you are able to accept any critique of your club what so ever and immediately jump to defend it

You kind of were though? You were, without considering any sort of context if I might add, cherry picking all the decent graduates who've left in recent years and slating the club for not being 'forward thinking' enough while totally ignoring all the ones who have been integrated into the squad and have been playing regular minutes.

I don't think I was being 'defensive' or 'unable to accept any critique' at all when writing those long replies to you. I was merely trying to look at the bigger picture and provide some of the much-missed context behind some of those moves that you so conveniently ignored when again replying with a one-liner that focused on one small point in a post of many topics discussed. Not a great way to have a proper conversation btw.

Don't get me wrong, I too have definitely done my fair share of criticism of the club for the very same issues with some even surrounding the very same players you mentioned with most recent one being the Levi Colwill fiasco. Would I like to have players like Livramento/Lamptey and Tomori/Guehi still at the club? Absolutely but I also understand that everything is not as black and white as you seem to make it out to be. Not every youth prospect can make it at their clubs. With some the club/manager are definitely to blame for their shortsightedness, with some it can just be bad timing and with others it's just a good old case of bad luck (ie. long-term injuries).

I for one would still rather choose to be happy that my club are at long last using their academy graduates in the first team to begin with instead of only focusing on the negatives that there have been some who have fallen through the cracks. After John Terry there was a LONG time where not even one of them got a proper chance to show what they can do and that's where the club culture has changed a lot in the last 4-5 years. It hasn't happened overnight and is probably still a work in progress but even though the situation regarding academy graduates in the first team could be even better, overall I don't have many complaints.
 
United’s had agreements with club and agent. Chelsea have had nothing.

It seems the player will stay at Barca but we know if he does decide to move Chelsea will have a heck of a lot to do to make it happen whilst United are already ahead of the game in that regard.
Yup I imagine if de Jong gave the green light to move then United won have it done quick. I still think we're going to put in another offer, better than what we had, covering wages, and if that doesn't work, then who knows
 
Chased this guy all summer when it was clearly not on. Now getting linked to every mediocre, over-paid, transfer listed player out there.

Imagine finally getting rid of Ed and putting in place a ‘proper’ recruitment setup and they delivered the worst summer in years for a brand new manager.
You could not make it up, I honestly am not sure how they could have done a worst job than they have done, they really deserve some credit for how bad they have been
 
I don't find it embarrassing. Utd have gone big and didn't get what they wanted, but they agreed a deal with Barcelona and just waited the situation out.

The stupid part is they didn't have an alternative ready to go.

That's difficult to pull of though. I'm not sure how any club could keep another desirable player warm for a couple of months while they wait around to find out if that club can sign their preferred option
 
Isn't that what you've been doing before? Anyways it's about spending smart, not just big. Will be interesting to see if American sports strategy actually works here.

I think there are new rules in the PL that limits the amount of players that can be loaned. The Roman system was to keep signing them and loaning making a profit on fees. I think this time it will be selling the players after a few years, but honestly, I am just guessing based on what they do with the Dodgers.
 
That's difficult to pull of though. I'm not sure how any club could keep another desirable player warm for a couple of months while they wait around to find out if that club can sign their preferred option

Then they probably should have set a hard deadline by the start of the season. Ultimately they can't let De Jong determine their transfer business, if he's not willing to come on a timescale that would work for Utd then they need to be more ruthless in moving on.

If it is driven by Ten Hag, then he needs to be more realistic and find a way to work with an alternative player.
 
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