Fred is usually better than what he has been serving up this season, but his inconsistency and lack of cutting edge lets him down. Was frustrated at the attacks that broke down because of him and this was capped off by a very poor miss at the end. Had a bad game yesterday but we didn't have any midfield options to replace him with Eriksen and McTominay out.
17
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If he’d shot you’d be in here screaming at him for missing it with a player on the six yard line with an east chance. You’re just grasping for any stick to beat the lad with and talking shite doing it.
I love it when the fans get things wrong and then pretend like they never asked for it.
The Casemiro Fred partnership is absolutely rubbish.
Lost the game because of the differences between Fred and Eriksen from progressive passing.
The Casemiro Fred partnership is absolutely rubbish.
Lost the game because of the differences between Fred and Eriksen from progressive passing.
No he's not. He just played more and people ignored it by saying he's not a defensive midfielder, he's been played out of position.
He's just not good enough, he really just needs to go.
I really dont get why everyone has gone in so hard on Fred. I think its because everyone expects him to play like Erikson but thats not him. Im not saying he was great and Im not saying we should have a better players but Fred was by far not the main reason for the draw with Newcastle. I find it confusing that on one hand people say Fred was the main reason for failure and on the other say defensively we were good. Yeah we were good defensively and that in part was because of Fred/Casemiro partnership. Will that partnership bring you attacking prowess? Nope. But it will bring you stability and allow the forwards to do their thing. Newcastle didn't really get anywhere near us and we dominated the midfield. You cant say we do that much even when winning with Eriksen. We had 60 percent possession. Again thats not something we do often. The main problem was our front 4 didnt deliver. Thats why we drew. Not because of Fred. Even if Fred was a 0/10 and Casemiro just carried him. His job was to shut out Newcastle and that was done with him or without him. So how was he a problem? We dont need 2 DM's? Well thats what Aresnal and Bayern do and they do ok. Its a ok tactic IF your forwards actually produce. And our second problem was our RB/LB offered fk all going forward. Our third problem was Fred.
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Where does this idea come from that he's a good DM and/or good at breaking-up attacks?
It should be one of the easiest jobs on a football pitch to do to a reasonable standard. There's very little technical ability required, moreover its about physical attributes and reading the game.
In essence, its an easy job to do reasonably well and a hard job to do very, very well. This is why you see many players touted as great DMs at clubs with lower expectations or who have less of the ball but they never get a big move and/or they struggle if they do.
In Fred's case, I'm not sure he even does the job reasonably well at times. He's small, he's weak, he's not especially quick. He's far too lightweight. He's easily shrugged off and loses most of his 50:50s. I can think back to four or five goals we conceded on the counter last season which he should have stopped at source.
Now, we all know he's not good with the ball at his feet. There's the odd little bit of flair but in general, he looks very awkward in possession and he isn't aware of what is happening around him most of the time. It's all very desperate, last-minute and scruffy whenever the ball goes into his feet.
In short, at best, you could argue he is a base-level reasonable DM (maybe, sometimes). However, the fact he barely ticks the boxes in that respect and can't use the ball either means I struggle to think how he makes it into many PL XIs. I mean, yesterday we're playing Newcastle...not Chelsea/Liverpool/Arsenal anr yet they have at least two CMs I would start all day long over Fred. That's a poor reflection on him and the club.
Its not a witch-hunt, he seems a nice, likeable guy....but he isnt very good!
Totally agree. But he wasnt the problem. You say Newcastle have a better midfield? Well they did jack shit yesterday.
he was so bad at times…. It’s funny how he is even a professional footballer…. It was comedic at time…..
but he wasn’t the only one…..
But but Fred starts for Brazil. Honestly both of our CM looked like levels bellow Bruno G. That's a top player there.
Stability and Fred don't go in the same sentence.
He needs to go in the summer. If we renew him it's utter madness.
Despite being the 4th best Brazlian central midfielder on the pitch
The problem is who do we keep as backups?
Fred is not, and has never been a DM. United have played him as a holding midfield player, but, like McTominay, he doesn't seem to grasp what is needed to be a DM. Fred's best work is always done in the opponents half, and before anyone goes overboard, yes he wastes some opportunities due to a poor touch, or pass, and struggles with 1 on 1 plays physically, but he also can come up with some great little pieces of football occasionally, but he is not Ericsen.
On the chance he missed, if he'd have used his right foot, he would have scored I believe, but he was there in the right position.
Newcastle did get near us several times, once for the penalty that was not given, and the Joelinton missing that open goal, so we could have been two down at the break.
It wouldn't surprise me if Fred was moved on in the summer, as I hope that Hannibal will take his place in the squad.
I disagree with this.
It’s like saying a goalkeepers role is easy because he hardly uses his feet.
I don't really follow your logic...
My point was that a DM in a side who play without the ball can get away with being a good athlete and a good reader of the game even if they're not fantastic on the ball...because their job is really to destroy and disrupt the opposition.
I then went on to say in a better side, you have to do more than just 'destroy' and that's why very good 'elite' DMs are hard to find.
I don't understand how that equates to your point about goalkeeping being easy because they don't use their feet much
Can't believe how useless he is with his shooting. Even Anderson managed to hit the target now and then but Fred is terrible with either feet. Really frustrating to see him get into advanced positions in attack just to mess up the final part.
what exactly apart from low block us which is the easiest attribute to do? Did they contribute more than Fred attacking wise? Joelinton missed an open/easy goal just like Fred did. I didnt see us being overun in midfield. And I didnt see Newcastle have the majority of possesstion. Would I take either over thoe two over Fred? Yup. But in this game they defended well but never did much else and are getting loads of praise. If they were so good and Fred was so useless and Bruno was useless, then they must be sht if Casemiro was holding the midfield on his own.Guimaraes and Joelinton did plenty
He's rubbish and has never been good. I've consistently said you cannot be a good midfielder with a shit first touch.
His greatest strength is always being involved in the match, you won't ever watch a game and forget Fred is playing because he's everywhere. This in itself is a problem because you have a wildly erratic player having a high number of actions in a game. The averages will dictate that he will have good moments but he's a net negative once you factor in all his negatives.
Eriksen for example can be a bit conspicuous at times in midfield but you notice far less errors and a lot more quality which leads to a more efficient running midfield. Even Mctominay who has precious little quality, keeps a fairly low profile which is why he's accused of hiding because he only does what he's good at. Fred by contrast will take shots from outside the area, attempt chipped through balls with his right foot and first time passes which he totally isn't capable of. Poor poor player.
His greatest strength is always being involved in the match, you won't ever watch a game and forget Fred is playing because he's everywhere. This in itself is a problem because you have a wildly erratic player having a high number of actions in a game. The averages will dictate that he will have good moments but he's a net negative once you factor in all his negatives.
Eriksen for example can be a bit conspicuous at times in midfield but you notice far less errors and a lot more quality which leads to a more efficient running midfield. Even Mctominay who has precious little quality, keeps a fairly low profile which is why he's accused of hiding because he only does what he's good at. Fred by contrast will take shots from outside the area, attempt chipped through balls with his right foot and first time passes which he totally isn't capable of. Poor poor player.
His lack of strength on the ball is infuriating, as high energy and hussle are his main attributes so to see him get brushed of the ball so easily is poor.
He wasn't great offensively or in possession that's for sure. Will he ever be? Probably not. However, one thing everyone should remember is, Fred is a momentum player and has always been. Only ever played well with consistent game time and has always struggled when drip fed minutes as he has this season.
When he plays consistently, he's a 7 out of 10. When coming off the bench, he's a 4 to 7 out of 10.
This is probably the main reason we shouldn't keep him. He won't be good enough for us as a starter, and can't be relied upon as a sub. What we need is a bench player that comes in and mainly drops 6 to 7s. I think whichever team gets him is still getting a good player, so long as he plays week in week out.
When he plays consistently, he's a 7 out of 10. When coming off the bench, he's a 4 to 7 out of 10.
This is probably the main reason we shouldn't keep him. He won't be good enough for us as a starter, and can't be relied upon as a sub. What we need is a bench player that comes in and mainly drops 6 to 7s. I think whichever team gets him is still getting a good player, so long as he plays week in week out.
Fred frustrates me to death. He's a player in some ways I love as he really does fight and gives everything but ultimately, he's just not very good.
On the ball he's very very limited.
On the ball he's very very limited.
Probably doesn't need 10 but maybe three would be fair?
Joelinton hit the bar and post, Fred missed the goal entirely. He ran the ball forward, had Newcastle's most shots and their most tackles
Bruno G was better with his passing
Still missed so end result still the same. I havnt seen the stats but I bet they arent any better than Freds or else you would have wrote more shots and and tackles then Fred instead of best for Newcastle.
They were more than Fred's
Fred 0 tackles
Both Fred and Joelinton had 0 shots on target, 4 for Fred and 3 for Joelinton. Joelinton hit the bar and post, Fred hit the corner flag
I dont know what your stats are trying to prove? Casemiro had 1 shot and 0 on target. So was Casemiro worse for not even shooting or was it Fred for missing the target and Joelinton the best because at least he hit the post and bar?
The other stats read as Fred had 81 touches with 88 percent accuracy. Joelinton had 47 touches with 67 percent accuracy. Bruno G had 38 touches with 80 percent accuracy. Fred had 0 tackles but Bruno G had only 1 and Fred had 2 interceptions to his 1. Joelinton had 3 but thats not that much better since all they did was low block. If we are talking stats wise I would say Fred had the better game or at least as good a game as those , yet they aregetting loads of praise and Fred is being ridiculed across the land. Makes no sense to me.
Again my point is not that Fred is the greatest player ever or he had a great game. My point is that people giving him 0/10 and saying he wouldnt even get into the bottom teams in the prem etc is a bit much.
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He wasn't good on the ball yesterday but put in his usual shift. When Mctominay did that for a few games he was called the second coming. Strange place the caf
Clear as day this guy isn't good enough and should be moved on at the earliest opportunity
Because mctom had a positive impact on the game, Christ he scored the winning goal in his last match
Fred is like playing with 10 vs 12
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He's bi? Not sure what that has to do with his performance against Newcastle.
3 or 10 I'm sure you know what I mean.
His midfield play has improved massively since the start of the season. I understand why people think he isn't good enough and I don't disagree but it's a very good sign about the manager that both Fred and McTominay have been able to quiet their internal panic just enough to do a job in midfield against a decent club when Eriksen or Casemiro aren't fit.
He's good at helping control the game and with Casemiro we have been doing just that, which IS an improvement. We've only conceded 1 goal so far when they've started together. What he lacks is the ability of Eriksen going forward and it just doesn't work with Bruno ahead of him. Without him we lose control of midfield but with him we are neutered in attack, especially so when our strikers are so static and poor.
We have four players in Casemiro, Fred, Eriksen and Bruno who should occupy 3 spots. Casemiro is currently the only one who should be guaranteed to start. Fred isn't good enough going forward, Eriksen isn't good enough defensively, and Bruno makes it harder for all of them.
We have four players in Casemiro, Fred, Eriksen and Bruno who should occupy 3 spots. Casemiro is currently the only one who should be guaranteed to start. Fred isn't good enough going forward, Eriksen isn't good enough defensively, and Bruno makes it harder for all of them.
Haha god knows what that sentence was going to be
Mate you are wasting your time. The vultures are always circling some players and end of the last season Fred finished our best midfielder including Scott and Bruno. He was terrible yesterday but when he plays well, its quiet on here.
He is always the most committed player on the pitch. Nobody runs and puts more effort in than him. His problem is consistency. When he's bad, he's usually the worst player on the pitch and very detrimental to the team. When he's good, he's the best player on the pitch. It's weird. I've always liked Fred, and felt like he gets too much abuse from our fans, but I wish he was more consistent.
I do agree with this. The same excuse gets used with VDB as well. People keep saying he needs multiple games to show ability. You're not going to get that. You have to play well when you get a chance.
He has to do better. He hasn't played well this season. He won't get many more starts if he plays like that when our other midfielders are fit.
The angle for Rashford is tougher than you're giving it credit for. He is very wide. Rashford was never going to shoot from that angle. As soon as he passed Pope, he looked to the box to find a runner. I think passing was the correct decision. If Rashford shoots there and hits the side netting, everybody criticises him and says he should pass to Fred.
Fred has to score that chance. If he goes with his right, he at least gets it on target.
A much more difficult task, I think we can agree. I'd like to see Joelinton try to hit the corner flag. Another case of Fred getting zero credit. Sickening.
I mean it's clearly the hairstyle, right? Has he had a single decent game since he changed?
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