Erik ten Hag | 2024/25 | Sacked

Erik ten Hag

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Next six league fixtures are: Brentford (H), West Ham (A), Chelsea (H), Leicester (H), Ipswich (A), Everton (H). It's five teams from the bottom half of the table, as well as four home games in that streak.

If we want to go anywhere in the table, we have to take four wins here.
The timing is perfect to let him go
 
Ineos make a decision we don't agree with so they are automatically the glazers MK2. Have a day off.

In fairness, keeping him on in the summer was a horrendous first mistake to make, given we're now about to write off yet another season with more expensive signings that aren't looking too promising so far. It's fair to say they've made a grave mess of their start to ownership.
 
Ineos make a decision we don't agree with so they are automatically the glazers MK2. Have a day off.

No, I said that's what they look like. Everyone agrees they made a mess of things in the summer with ETH, and now their decision to keep him looks a disastrous one. Everyone knew he needed to go then.

And he needs to go now. Like, right now.
 
Didn’t we have an international break where literally everyone thought Solskjaer was toast and he survived it somehow, then first league game back was that 4-1 Watford loss and then they sacked him?

The club is full of fecking incompetence like that and it wouldn’t surprise me if they did the same here if we lost to Brentford in two weeks.
 
I agree that the idea that he should only be sacked after a loss is illogical. Notwithstanding this, it may be possible that given the number of changes to the backroom staff and players, the hierarchy have decided to give him a bit longer to sort out this enormous mess.

The players are his and the staff are his, if you sack the man - there will need to be yet another rebuild. The cycle may go on and on...
I'm not sure about that. Is it really that much of a big deal? Managers in the PL are sacked all the time, and the coaches/backroom staff are shifted around as a result. I don't think that should be something to cause a delay. Not if we're intending to become a serious club again.

As for the players, well, they shouldn't be entirely "his", since INEOS arrived, they have taken ownership of the footballing structure. ETH should have had input in this sure, but not total control. The players we've signed since INEOS' arrival should be fitting their long term plans which any new manager should be able to come in and manage. The days of scattergun signings controlled by a manager should have ended the moment they took control and if it didn't, we're in the same deep shit as we were prior to their takeover, almost like there was no point.

100%.

To beat City, who have set the benchmark in recent years (vomits in my mouth), the way we did would give anyone cause to think: Could this guy get this level of performance out of these players more often in the right circumstances?

However, they have given it a go and its clear that he can't.


Even if Garnacho hadn't f'd up the 3 on 2 in stoppage time and we had stolen it, what would that have told us? There's quite a body of evidence to suggest the best Ten Hag can do with our squad is set up to counter. Worse, we are even more reactive now than we were when he first took over. Instead of looking something like Jose Mourinho's Madrid we are looking like late stage Mourinho Man Utd. Is that worth persisting with until 2026?
That's my reading of it too. The way we defeated city was very impressive, it wasn't a smash and grab lucky victory, we genuinely deserved to win and were better on the day. If you look at the context, most of the players had come back from being injured too - injuries were a major hinderance last season. So it's not beyond comprehension that INEOS might have looked at it as though he deserves a chance. A lot of fans thought the same.

He has now had that chance, the proof is in the pudding, he has not succeeded and it's time for a change. We are not on an upward trajectory, we are regressing.

As for if we had got the win v.s. Villa, it wouldn't have told us anything, the performance was still very poor, we are toothless and allergic to scoring. The only positive if we're clutching at straws is we weren't as easy to score against... but is that genuine or a one-off? We just shipped 3 to Porto and they scored easily.
 
Yeah or it goes the same way as with RR where the players knew he was going to go at the end of the season and didn't give a shit. Or somebody comes in, smiles a lot, gets a few decent results and the "hopeful" fanbase is ready to give it a shot with a transfer window. It's all been there.

On a serious note - I am with you, if there is a serious candidate out there, go for it. Just don't repeat the mistakes of the past.

I think that's a bit of a myth to be honest. There was already a serious problem in that dressing room that season probably centred around Ronaldo's ego. Ralf obviously didn't help matters by throwing the players under the bus on a weekly basis and moaning about everything else under the sun. An Interim manager should be focusing on lifting morale and confidence after a bad period under the previous manager, in that respect Ralf was like a breath of putrid air.
 
If they didn't do it last summer, or now, then they're not doing it any time soon. In fact, if we can string 3 or 4 wins together, no matter the opponent, they'll probably give him a new contract. For reasons unknown to everyone, they're seemingly all in on this guy. Perhaps they're relying on Gary Neville for advice, SJR does have a penchant for nostalgia by the looks of it (eg hiring RVN).
Ratcliffe didn't hire RVN.
 
So what brought him the success at Ajax? Was it the quality of the team that was given to him along with a weaker league?

Many of those players have gone on to have successful careers in stronger leagues, so were they a few levels above the rest of the league?
 
Didn’t we have an international break where literally everyone thought Solskjaer was toast and he survived it somehow, then first league game back was that 4-1 Watford loss and then they sacked him?

The club is full of fecking incompetence like that and it wouldn’t surprise me if they did the same here if we lost to Brentford in two weeks.

Yes because why make a decision that you obviously need to make now when you can leave it until much later.
 
Be fairly amusing if Thomas Frank became our manager and had his first match against Brentford
 
Next six league fixtures are: Brentford (H), West Ham (A), Chelsea (H), Leicester (H), Ipswich (A), Everton (H). It's five teams from the bottom half of the table, as well as four home games in that streak.

If we want to go anywhere in the table, we have to take four wins here.

Piss easy run. I envisage that we'll scrape a few wins and draws by playing absolutely terrible football, and this dance will continue.
 
This is the time to change. Proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, how bad a coach he is. The players look confused, with even the new signings already tainted and outcast by his bizarre setup.

Two full weeks to breathe and, at the very least, have the optimism that the worst manager in our modern history and his arrogant personality is gone.

The run of games should be good for anyone half competent, with those players. We should be in the top half looking up and much more comfortable in the EL.

Don’t throw the season away over stupid pride under the guise of patience. Thousands and thousands of minutes and a plethora of terrible decisions have proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that he isn’t the man and it’s actively hurting the club.
 
I think that's a bit of a myth to be honest. There was already a serious problem in that dressing room that season probably centred around Ronaldo's ego. Ralf obviously didn't help matters by throwing the players under the bus on a weekly basis and moaning about everything else under the sun.
I agree. He shouldn't have done that. But does it really matter where the dressing room issues originated from? What we now know is, that the interim time was another waste of time. We might as well could have sticked to Ole and have him see out the season. Wouldn't have been more drama than with the whole RR situation.
An Interim manager should be focusing on lifting morale and confidence after a bad period under the previous manager, in that respect Ralf was like a breath of putrid air.
While I can see your point, I wouldn't sign that as a global truth. An interim manager is supposed to take over to make the team functional and, in a best-case-scenario, support the takeover to the new coach. I think, there aren't any templates for that, given that clubs will find themselves in very different situations when an interim comes, one is finding himself hunting European football places, another fights against relegation and another one fights for nothing because the team hovers around 9th to 13th place. I personally don't really get your sentiment of salvaging a season. Because I personally do not want to hunt international places only to play EL next year. Or Conference League or whatever. The objective for this season should be the same as for ETH - improve the fecking team by improving their level of organisation. Granted, most likely ETH isn't going to achieve that but the interim should have exactly the same objective. There is simply no point in taking two steps back, going back to "keep it compact and counter" only for the sake of some results, as if a 5th or 6th place would be less hurtful to the ego than a 10th or 11th place is. Whoever the manager is, we have to get a pressing scheme in place and we have to improve the team as a functional unit. Delaying that once again will have the next manager (if we go interim and next manager in the summer) face the exact same challenge as ETH faces right now.
 
Holy shit, he's really still here. For all the talk of INEOS improving things, this is the worst its ever been. No sane minded regime would seriously have this manager continue with these results and performances. Not even Brighton would persist with this.

It's properly mental.

As you say, no other "major" club in world football would accept this sort of form/standard of football
 
I thought he should have gone after the cup final. The football was absolutely horrible to watch all last season. Ineos bottled it.

He should have gone last winter after the CL embarrassment. We still had the opportunity to rescue our season had we changed Manager at that point. That was the moment I was done.
 
It's properly mental.

As you say, no other "major" club in world football would accept this sort of form/standard of football

Standards have been slowly eroding for 11 years. I thought Ole was the peak of rock bottom standards, but this is in a whole new stratosphere.

INEOS haven't started their tenure in encouraging fashion whatsoever.
 
Tuchel or Frank would do nicely. I just pray we don't go down the interim route with the likes of Ruud, It's only October and the season doesn't need to be a write off.
 
The cost to sack him is a nonsensical argument because the cost of not sacking him is threefold:

1) Missing out on CL revenue
2) Sponsorship revenue being cut due to not being in CL
3) 1 and.2 combining to leave us in a precarious PSR position and facing a possible points deduction.

And remember all this stand by your manager nonsense - not even Fergie believes it as he showed when Moyes was cut adrift.
 
Deeply agree with Paul Scholes who is shocked by the way ETH has built up the squad since last season, especially the attack.

ETH was a very risky appointment; had proved nothing at this level before. Now he is the worst manager we’ve had after SAF. Off course he has to be sacked
Allowing somebody who didn't build a sqaud at Ajax freehand to build a squad here was hellishly risky.
 
Tuchel yes. Frank no.

Frank's football would be fancier but not more effective.

Could see the fanbase turn on him fast, not to mention, the players when he stops smiling at them. Mind, Tuchel may alienate people with his Quantum of Solace bullshit, so it's a tricky one.

Tuchel because he has managed serious clubs before.

It's the apathetic prawn sandwich munchers at OT who sit there in a stupor applauding back to back 3-0 home defeats.

If these phantom fans were truly 'apathetic' then they wouldn't care to applaud or boo.

I wouldn't mind giving Frank a go, certainly plays gung-ho football and is a far superior manager to ETH

We are sacking EtH, in spite of his winning trophies, because he has made us a mid-table manager.

Is there much sense in hiring someone who has won nothing and highest achievement is itself mid-table?

'Gung-ho football' is what EtH attempts, after all.

He wouldn’t have survived after last season even with the FA Cup win.

He'd have survived winning nothing but keeping the Glazers in dividend money finishing fourth to a distant second.

Let's not review the Glazers, chief.
 
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