This is not just based on the last two three matches but over a longer period of time. When goals are conceded it is quite common that there has been a problem with positioning. And the reason we had least conceded goals in open play of all PL teams last season is partly because they’re good at positioning.
@El Jefe And I'm asking if you can provide a list of these 'moments of madness' for us all?
Where have you seen any of the bolded recently? A good few of our recent conceded goals are because he's lacking exactly those qualities and letting people run in front of him.
3
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 21
- Clean sheets
- 9
- Goals
- 0
- Assists
- 1
- Yellow cards
- 4
- Status
I must agree on Maguire taking hours to release it and Bailly being too injury prone. However, I do not think Lindelof is superior to Bailly at any of those things you listed. In fact, Lindelof has been caught out in behind more than Bailly. Maybe Bailly’s speed helps him recover more to make it less noticeable, but it’s quite clear that Lindelof is more unaware and poor positionally than Bailly.
If Bailly is fir, he has to start.
He’s Maguire is slow on the ball and his passes are often a bit slow as well. If there’s going to be any purpose with passing around at the back, there must be speed. What Maguire does well imo is he is completely calm to pressure and his long balls to the FB or winger are good.
Bailly often leaves his position and an attacking player can run in behind. That’s one example of what I mean. Lindelof has probably been caught out more times, but that’s not strange. He 1) played so many more matches, and 2) Bailly mostly played against weaker teams.
In that case, even if Bailly messes up, it’s no different to VNL. What’s more, he much faster than Maupay (and Lindelof for that matter), so shouldn’t be caught out in behind.
Start him.
Yes Bailly is faster, that’s one of his advantages. Looking at not just the last match or two, Lindelof does not make many mistakes. If he screw up often or was poor, we would not have least conceded goals in open play, simple as that.
The only thing Lindelof is superior to Bailly, is his injury record, which makes Bailly very unreliable partner for anyone to play alongside. For building stable defenses you need continuity in order to understand and cover each weaknesses. Maguire and Lindelof benefited from that last year. Bailly struggles to stay fit and it obviously makes him rusty when he plays the occasional game. Talent and ability wise, I'd take Bailly easily.
No doubt Baily has talent and physically hes a top player, but he really needs to improve his positioning and tactical nous. Hes the kind of player who will sprint back and do an impressive last ditch tackle, but thats because he often was poorly positioned to start with.
And his injury record has not helped either. Worth mentioning hes still only 26, which is quite young for a CB. If he can stay injury free and improve his tactical skills, he'd be a damn good CB
Just give this guy a run alongside Maguire before he breaks down in 3..,2..,..1.
Can somebody show me a video of all these Bailly mistakes? people talk like they're plentiful but I don't remember many recently at all.
Lindelof on the other hand...
Lindelof on the other hand...
Either way mistakes or not the Maguire/lindelof partnership has a glaring weakness that teams know they can exploit. Teams have to come up with more creative ways to score instead of the use the space behind them tactic.
They are greatly exaggerated as well as his supposed poor positioning. He had a couple o poor games, psg comes to mind, but they were always after a long time out injured. I'm sure that if by same miracle he stays fit for a season most of these problems will go away through simple confidence and match sharpness.
IMO he has the potential to be an absolute monster of a center back that will make us forget about Dayot or anyone else, just needs to stay fit.
Lindelof rarely switches off. He is weak and gets outmuscled sometimes but Bailly is a disaster waiting to happen. Individually he is a much better player than Lindelof but collectively as a team he is not. Maybe because he has no regular partner. He was good with Rojo when they played together but one of them got injured and that was that. I do not mind seeing him play with Maguire and see how it goes.
Woah Lindelof thrown under the bus.
All we need now is for Bailly to not fall apart with his fragile body.
All for him getting a run over Lindelof, at least when he fecks up it's usually quite funny, Lindelof's are just boring.
Is Baily's reputation for getting constantly injured fair?
He's been healthy for a while now. He deserves a chance and yes he is clearly much better than Lindelof, it isnt even close.
He might perhaps even challenge Maguire at his best, at his best he's an elite CB.
Makes no sense to play Lindelof over him. Never did. Not only is Baily much better, has a much higher ceiling but he also complements Maguire really really well.
I do agree with Ole, there were times when we looked fantastic defensively last season.
He's been healthy for a while now. He deserves a chance and yes he is clearly much better than Lindelof, it isnt even close.
He might perhaps even challenge Maguire at his best, at his best he's an elite CB.
Makes no sense to play Lindelof over him. Never did. Not only is Baily much better, has a much higher ceiling but he also complements Maguire really really well.
I do agree with Ole, there were times when we looked fantastic defensively last season.
Lindelof is a decent defender but not for the highest level. He is either too shy, too weak, too slow.
If i was a mid-table team, i would take him for sure
If i was a mid-table team, i would take him for sure
Not surprised Ole is trying to push for a Bailly-Maguire partnership. I always defend Lindelof and never been a fan of people being overly negative about our players but If anyone were to be in Ole's shoes they'd be thinking about doing something about Lindelof right now. I personally feel like Victor for the most part had been solid throughout all of last year but the mistakes he's made lately have come in consecutive games and in very important games, especially for Ole.
Victor's mistake against Chelsea to allow Giroud to get away from him. That was in a semi final and that was costly. He then made a costly mistake in another cup final(Sevilla game) which was again costly. Mistakes like that leaves a man sour and I can only assume Ole must have been bummed since he felt he had a chance to go on and win both cups but was let down mostly by defensive mistakes and Lindelof featured quite heavily in them. Then come the start of the season and Victor makes another mistake, I mean a man can have all the patience in the world but at some point he'd get fed up.
In case of Ole he's seeking to try something different because I imagine no one can accept such costly mistakes in consecutive games. Hopefully Victor sit some games out and sort himself and get back to his solid level. While he isn't some outstanding defender, the thing going for him was that he was solid and consistent throughout the season last year but toward the end and seemingly right now as well, he seems to have loads of costly mistakes in him which can't always be ignored by his coach.
Problem with Bailly is his fitness record. Ole might be hoping for him to stay fit but that seems almost impossible. Hopefully something changed and Eric miraculously manages to stay fit, if not the whole season, at least even 80% of it would be very helpful to us.
Victor's mistake against Chelsea to allow Giroud to get away from him. That was in a semi final and that was costly. He then made a costly mistake in another cup final(Sevilla game) which was again costly. Mistakes like that leaves a man sour and I can only assume Ole must have been bummed since he felt he had a chance to go on and win both cups but was let down mostly by defensive mistakes and Lindelof featured quite heavily in them. Then come the start of the season and Victor makes another mistake, I mean a man can have all the patience in the world but at some point he'd get fed up.
In case of Ole he's seeking to try something different because I imagine no one can accept such costly mistakes in consecutive games. Hopefully Victor sit some games out and sort himself and get back to his solid level. While he isn't some outstanding defender, the thing going for him was that he was solid and consistent throughout the season last year but toward the end and seemingly right now as well, he seems to have loads of costly mistakes in him which can't always be ignored by his coach.
Problem with Bailly is his fitness record. Ole might be hoping for him to stay fit but that seems almost impossible. Hopefully something changed and Eric miraculously manages to stay fit, if not the whole season, at least even 80% of it would be very helpful to us.
Hope Bailly grabs this chance with both hands, stays fit and keeps consistent.
When he's playing his best he's probably our best all round CB. I think Maguire will be able to concentrate on being the destroyer knowing he has Bailly covering if a ball gets behind.
When he's playing his best he's probably our best all round CB. I think Maguire will be able to concentrate on being the destroyer knowing he has Bailly covering if a ball gets behind.
Bailly has the same problem Jones and Rojo have - the way they defend make them more susceptible to injuries.
Hopefully he stays fit
Hopefully he stays fit
I think that right now we, as a team, need his presence and aggressive approach to defending. I think that it'll make up for the mistakes he is prone to make. With Lindelöf and Maguire we are too passive against physical strikers, and we too often gets pushed backwards. Against smaller sides where we expect to hold a high defensive line, we need to be aggressive when the opposition counterattacks.
Would love to see him get a run of 10-20 games with Maguire. I think it is hard to judge him when he only comes on every 5th game or so. It must be one of the most difficult positions on the field to just slot in from time to time and don't look out of place.
That being said, I don't see him as a long term solution.
Would love to see him get a run of 10-20 games with Maguire. I think it is hard to judge him when he only comes on every 5th game or so. It must be one of the most difficult positions on the field to just slot in from time to time and don't look out of place.
That being said, I don't see him as a long term solution.
This is exactly whats wrong with this club. 4 years and still waiting. Get rid. Im sick of waiting for players to come good.
Exactly. He had been out of the team for nearly two months then featured against Leicester the week before being thrown in as part of a back 3 trying to contain a CL candidate attack. He had a disasterclass that game, but the guy had barely played football at that point. It was a comical managerial decision to be honest, and like you said, most of his errors are greatly exaggerated and will likely disappear with a run in the team.
fecking finally.
This was always the case imo. Ole is not blind, he knows Eric can be class. It's up to him more or less to stay fit and the place in the first 11 is his.
If Ole picks Lindelof ahead of Bailly tomorrow I'm not going to be happy. Bailly has the pace and power that we are badly lacking in defence. Plus he can play a bit too. I don't think he's had a bad game since he played at Stamford Bridge last season, a run in the side is long overdue.
However, despite the fact I rate Bailly and I think he can more than live up to his transfer fee if he stays fit, I do not want a solid run of form leading to a big money new contract. Even if Bailly plays amazingly, lets not go mad and stick him on £100,000+ a week. If he earns a new deal, great. If he earns a pay rise, great. Be sensible about it though.
However, despite the fact I rate Bailly and I think he can more than live up to his transfer fee if he stays fit, I do not want a solid run of form leading to a big money new contract. Even if Bailly plays amazingly, lets not go mad and stick him on £100,000+ a week. If he earns a new deal, great. If he earns a pay rise, great. Be sensible about it though.
Never go full Jose.
Quite a rough burn from Ole given that Lindelof and Maguire had some good runs as well 
But Lindelof has played himself out of the team (or at the very least risk being dropped) and Bailly has had some good performances when given a chance. I'm guessing Lindelof will play tomorrow but this was a good way to motivate Bailly and hopefully get a reaction from Lindelof.
But Lindelof has played himself out of the team (or at the very least risk being dropped) and Bailly has had some good performances when given a chance. I'm guessing Lindelof will play tomorrow but this was a good way to motivate Bailly and hopefully get a reaction from Lindelof.Such a shame about his injuries, development has been really stifled and has lots of ability
Not sure it has, he's capable of playing to a high level. He just needs consistency.
The issue is when he makes errors they're big and brash and obvious, other defenders makes constant little mistakes which the average viewer don't notice until they're pointed out.
For me if Bailly played against Palace the 1st and 3rd goals don't happen.
He had 2 brain farts in the first half against Luton! People see what they want to see.
That is very likely imo. Eric has a history of doing great and then being unavailable for a long time, Lindelof, like Smalling is mister fit. If after last season when Victor was a part of the 3ed best defense in the league you drop him for a player that barely played at all is going to destroy his confidence. This is a big problem because you can end up with a player injured again and the other shot in belief.
We forget that management is more about people then tactics and numbers. SAF was fantastic at this and Moyes was atrocious. Some of our former players talked a lot about how crap Moyes was with the players he was dropping and that destroyed the confidence.
Lindelof is not the best partner for Maguire and not a great center back, but like Smalling before him, he can actually play when his competition no matter how superior, can not. Big decision from Ole in the next game imo.
I don't remember anything significant at all. I do remember him saving a shot on the goal line, cutting out a crucial cut back into the box to stop a goal and a fantastic sprint across the pitch to cut out a good scoring chance.
He did plenty of very good things. I can handle that over a few sloppy passes if that's what you're alluding too.
edit:
So I've just watched this video of every touch against Luton, please tell me where these multiple errors are? I count 1 mistake (header in the first half) that is it, a dominant performance apart from that.
Last edited:
Great tackler, anticipation, his positioning is actually good, very strong & one of the quickest centre back at the moment. World class in his strength but mediocre in his weakness.
His main issue is that his concentration is like 1/10, poor decision making sometime like the Bournemouth handball for example & of course the injury prone. Even if he can stay fit, there is still concern with his lack of concentration ability and his decision making in the game.
Now, Ole has open spot for him and when he gets it, he needs to take it. This could be the season whether Ole thinks he should be moved on or step up and settle in the back four.
His main issue is that his concentration is like 1/10, poor decision making sometime like the Bournemouth handball for example & of course the injury prone. Even if he can stay fit, there is still concern with his lack of concentration ability and his decision making in the game.
Now, Ole has open spot for him and when he gets it, he needs to take it. This could be the season whether Ole thinks he should be moved on or step up and settle in the back four.
Can we find baillys actual injury record going back to maybe his last 2 year's at Villarreal. Be Interesting to see
Was he really fit for the whole of 18/19? He only had 8 starts all season in the league.
When fit I'd pick Bailly over Lindelof every time.
God he's not injury prone at all really is he. Apart from a surgery he's had 1 bad injury.
- Status